Signing Suggestions & Rumours THREAD..

jadtiger
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Re: Signing Suggestions & Rumours THREAD..

Post by jadtiger » Tue 20 Feb, 2018 5:37 pm

Tiger Watto wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 5:29 pm
Its a relevant debate about the saturation within the Sydney marketplace. I dont necessary think it is a population debate, but Brisbane has 40% the population of Sydney with 1 team compared to Sydney with 8. The ethnicity of the greater Sydney population is a greater concern in relation to the traditional orientation of RL followers.

Either way, the real numbers are the economy within both regions. The numbers dont really change with Brisbane having a $150b economy compared to Sydneys $330b. This highlights to me that Sydney is an over saturated marketplace within the national rugby league landscape and something needs to change.

Commercially, I'd be looking at new marketplaces to take my business to. But, personally the Wests Tigers have already made their sacrifice within the Sydney landscape and its up to other franchises to do the heavy lifting!


I would argue that Brisbane is woefully underutilised it needs 1 -2 more clubs in its city but the donkeys will never agree to an equal playing field.No Sydney club would voluntarily leave Sydney and nor should they


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Post by jirskyr » Tue 20 Feb, 2018 6:24 pm

supercoach wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 2:49 pm
Tiger Watto wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 2:38 pm
The problem with both the comparisons of TPA's is it only factors in the NRL approved ones.

The RLPA is zero chance of agreeing to access to players financials.

The only way to develop system is a points system... While money is involved, there will ALWAYS be corruption!
100% agreed.....There are a 101 ways you can pay a player extra without attracting the salary cap auditor. The only system that will work is a point system. Doubt we will ever see it because it would appear powerful people do not want a level playing field
I don't agree, a points system is flawed and could potentially subject to legal action. NRL cannot restrain trade, that is why TPAs exist. If NRL was to arbitrarily assign points to players, it would directly influence the relative value of players and hence their potential earnings, and would be challenged.

The system of how you might determine player points would be subject to constant argument, just like how fantasy football works, where you assign X points for something you (or a committee) feels is relevant.

Do you assign points only or also cap the salary? Because you'd end up in the same place, where Roosters can afford the "best" 10s, the best 9s, the best 8s etc. and would not be subject to financial restrictions. Also, often the "value" of a player is dependent on the club, not what a centralised body might decide is the relative value.

Can anyone show me any professional sport anywhere in the world where a centralised points system is applied to teams, rather than a salary cap?

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Post by Cairnstigers » Tue 20 Feb, 2018 6:50 pm

Why doesn't the ATO do an audit on the top players incomes

Look at there contracts
Look at any 3rd party payments
Make sure all taxes are paid
Even taxes on the brown paper bags they recieve
Taxes on gifts they receive
If they are receiving payments from 3rd parties it must be reported as income
If they are married or in a defacto relationship and thier spouse receives partial payment it should also be reported to the ATO along with who made the payment

Surely the NRL has a right to some of this information if in fact players and club's are breaking the cap rules

Has the Nrl ever given consideration that the salary cap rorting may be just one of the reasons many people have stopped going to the game
We are all getting fed up and want an even playing field on and off the field

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Post by Cairnstigers » Tue 20 Feb, 2018 6:52 pm

Is it possible that some clubs are paying managers fees direct so players receive the full contract amount

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Post by Tiger Watto » Tue 20 Feb, 2018 6:53 pm

the ATO already does audits, but the NRL has no rights to the information
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Post by happy tiger » Tue 20 Feb, 2018 7:37 pm

cochise wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 8:51 am
happy tiger wrote:
Mon 19 Feb, 2018 11:42 pm
innsaneink wrote:
Mon 19 Feb, 2018 11:36 am
Teo has nothing on.moses or moltzen
Nick Graham deserves a honourable mention , stepping out of the way of Piggy Riddell when the Saints put 50 on us for the last try , trying to recall , did Easts put 50 on us the week before or after

Was the Saints game the one at Kogarah when it was pouring rain?
If so that was one of my worst experiences at a footy game, sitting on the hill in pouring rain, getting flogged, couldn't leave as I was still alive in the doubles with Jason Moody as my second try scorer. He almost scored twice, what a horrible day.
It was raining tries , not sure about rain , didn't think so

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Post by bathursttiger » Tue 20 Feb, 2018 8:04 pm

jirskyr wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 6:24 pm
supercoach wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 2:49 pm
Tiger Watto wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 2:38 pm
The problem with both the comparisons of TPA's is it only factors in the NRL approved ones.

The RLPA is zero chance of agreeing to access to players financials.

The only way to develop system is a points system... While money is involved, there will ALWAYS be corruption!
100% agreed.....There are a 101 ways you can pay a player extra without attracting the salary cap auditor. The only system that will work is a point system. Doubt we will ever see it because it would appear powerful people do not want a level playing field
I don't agree, a points system is flawed and could potentially subject to legal action. NRL cannot restrain trade, that is why TPAs exist. If NRL was to arbitrarily assign points to players, it would directly influence the relative value of players and hence their potential earnings, and would be challenged.

The system of how you might determine player points would be subject to constant argument, just like how fantasy football works, where you assign X points for something you (or a committee) feels is relevant.

Do you assign points only or also cap the salary? Because you'd end up in the same place, where Roosters can afford the "best" 10s, the best 9s, the best 8s etc. and would not be subject to financial restrictions. Also, often the "value" of a player is dependent on the club, not what a centralised body might decide is the relative value.

Can anyone show me any professional sport anywhere in the world where a centralised points system is applied to teams, rather than a salary cap?
The NRL can set or change any rule they want to, if a certain club doesn't like it then they can hand in the Franchise licence.
While ever you have a cap and Brown paper bags there is never going to be a level playing field.

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Post by coivtny » Tue 20 Feb, 2018 8:14 pm

Tiger Watto wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 6:53 pm
the ATO already does audits, but the NRL has no rights to the information
Spot on. The secrecy provisions of the Taxation Administration Act prohibit the ATO from disclosing information to third parties unless the Act specifically allows disclosure (e.g to the Australian Federal Police) or the third party themselves authorise disclosure.

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Post by Bob » Tue 20 Feb, 2018 10:08 pm

I don’t have a problem with successful clubs being successful. I take issue with some clubs flaunting the rules and not others.

Have a salary cap that each team must stick to that is covered by the NRL.

Have unlimited TPA’s a player can receive regardless of who organises it.

Each player must be paid a minimum out of the cap that co incides with their resume.

The part I hate is that clubs flaunt the rules without being reprimanded some stick to the rules and others get penalised.. why?

I am sure there is no limit to TPA’s that could be organised for good players.

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Post by happy tiger » Tue 20 Feb, 2018 10:21 pm

jadtiger wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 5:37 pm
Tiger Watto wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 5:29 pm
Its a relevant debate about the saturation within the Sydney marketplace. I dont necessary think it is a population debate, but Brisbane has 40% the population of Sydney with 1 team compared to Sydney with 8. The ethnicity of the greater Sydney population is a greater concern in relation to the traditional orientation of RL followers.

Either way, the real numbers are the economy within both regions. The numbers dont really change with Brisbane having a $150b economy compared to Sydneys $330b. This highlights to me that Sydney is an over saturated marketplace within the national rugby league landscape and something needs to change.

Commercially, I'd be looking at new marketplaces to take my business to. But, personally the Wests Tigers have already made their sacrifice within the Sydney landscape and its up to other franchises to do the heavy lifting!


I would argue that Brisbane is woefully underutilised it needs 1 -2 more clubs in its city but the donkeys will never agree to an equal playing field.No Sydney club would voluntarily leave Sydney and nor should they


And yet Brisbane can't take real advantage of this

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Post by bellyboy05 » Tue 20 Feb, 2018 10:33 pm

Hey everybody, i am new to this forum i have been reading for a couple of months now and absolutely LOVE IT!! Just wanted to say i am good friends with Lyall Gorman so if there is any news out of Manly i will keep you guys posted in a heartbeat.

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Post by tigerap » Tue 20 Feb, 2018 10:54 pm

bellyboy05 wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 10:33 pm
Hey everybody, i am new to this forum i have been reading for a couple of months now and absolutely LOVE IT!! Just wanted to say i am good friends with Lyall Gorman so if there is any news out of Manly i will keep you guys posted in a heartbeat.
Welcome to the Forum...are you sure you have signed up to the correct one?....most on here don’t give a hoot what’s up with Manly... :sign:

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Post by formerguest » Tue 20 Feb, 2018 10:59 pm

bellyboy05 wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 10:33 pm
Hey everybody, i am new to this forum i have been reading for a couple of months now and absolutely LOVE IT!! Just wanted to say i am good friends with Lyall Gorman so if there is any news out of Manly i will keep you guys posted in a heartbeat.
Welcome, but never give up your source. Whoops, too late.

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Post by innsaneink » Tue 20 Feb, 2018 11:49 pm

underdog wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 4:33 pm
colmcd wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 11:19 am
innsaneink wrote:
Mon 19 Feb, 2018 11:36 am
Teo has nothing on.moses or moltzen
Why mention Moses and Moltzen together?

For all Moltzen did wrong, we dropped him for Robert Lui (which was a good decision till he bashed his wife..*sigh*)
Then he came back to us for a season or two and I think we dropped him fast. He went from talent to nothing and I think it was because of injuries.

I'm sure there were hassles fitting him in and buying him back from St George. But that's very different to Moses gathering 3 team mates and saying it's all or nothing.
Moltzen's comeback brought back a shell of the same person.... whether thats club management of his psyche, or his own man management remains to be seen, however he'd clearly left plenty of courage in the recovery group sheds.

We had a period of time where almost every bomb directed his way was allowed to bounce, every hard tackle was an arm grab, every facial expression resembled Greg Bird, and every drop ball by a teammate was met with derision, and venom. I went from loving the guy, to not wanting him to have anything to do with our team in the space of 18 months.

Quite the pea heart - I remember him hiding behind Blake Ayshford (who despite best efforts was wrong footed) when of all players JAKE FN MULLANEY Strolled through for a try - (Jake weighed about 75 keggs soaking wet) the game Parra tore us apart in the first half back, and we shredded them in the second half - Koroibetes 4 try game.
Well said.
Made me sick again reading that.
He often would look for his winger fielding downtown kicks....running crossfield putting the start of our set under pressure looking for his winger to do his work.
Couldnt stand him

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Post by happy tiger » Wed 21 Feb, 2018 1:05 am

innsaneink wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 11:49 pm
underdog wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 4:33 pm
colmcd wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 11:19 am
innsaneink wrote:
Mon 19 Feb, 2018 11:36 am
Teo has nothing on.moses or moltzen
Why mention Moses and Moltzen together?

For all Moltzen did wrong, we dropped him for Robert Lui (which was a good decision till he bashed his wife..*sigh*)
Then he came back to us for a season or two and I think we dropped him fast. He went from talent to nothing and I think it was because of injuries.

I'm sure there were hassles fitting him in and buying him back from St George. But that's very different to Moses gathering 3 team mates and saying it's all or nothing.
Moltzen's comeback brought back a shell of the same person.... whether thats club management of his psyche, or his own man management remains to be seen, however he'd clearly left plenty of courage in the recovery group sheds.

We had a period of time where almost every bomb directed his way was allowed to bounce, every hard tackle was an arm grab, every facial expression resembled Greg Bird, and every drop ball by a teammate was met with derision, and venom. I went from loving the guy, to not wanting him to have anything to do with our team in the space of 18 months.

Quite the pea heart - I remember him hiding behind Blake Ayshford (who despite best efforts was wrong footed) when of all players JAKE FN MULLANEY Strolled through for a try - (Jake weighed about 75 keggs soaking wet) the game Parra tore us apart in the first half back, and we shredded them in the second half - Koroibetes 4 try game.
Well said.
Made me sick again reading that.
He often would look for his winger fielding downtown kicks....running crossfield putting the start of our set under pressure looking for his winger to do his work.
Couldnt stand him
Yeah his psyche after the knee wasn't good , but I often wonder whether the fractured skull he suffered affected him more

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Post by supercoach » Wed 21 Feb, 2018 7:52 am

bellyboy05 wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 10:33 pm
Hey everybody, i am new to this forum i have been reading for a couple of months now and absolutely LOVE IT!! Just wanted to say i am good friends with Lyall Gorman so if there is any news out of Manly i will keep you guys posted in a heartbeat.
He will not be at Manly long, CEO’s last about six months on average at Manly.The Penn family love you one minute and hate you the next

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Post by Tiger Watto » Wed 21 Feb, 2018 9:00 am

Bob wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 10:08 pm
I don’t have a problem with successful clubs being successful. I take issue with some clubs flaunting the rules and not others.

Have a salary cap that each team must stick to that is covered by the NRL.

Have unlimited TPA’s a player can receive regardless of who organises it.

Each player must be paid a minimum out of the cap that co incides with their resume.

The part I hate is that clubs flaunt the rules without being reprimanded some stick to the rules and others get penalised.. why?

I am sure there is no limit to TPA’s that could be organised for good players.
I mentioned this a week or so ago, but I doubt many clubs are breaking the rules.

There will be clubs who follow the rules as outlined, and there will be clubs who do things that dont break the rules.

Two seperate approaches with both being right.

The catalyst is money. Some clubs have access to more money from external factors than others. If Michael Morgan gets a house built for him because he is a great bloke, and the builder has no affiliations to the club, what can the NRL do?
"Did someone buy you the internet hero play book for Christmas and you've only just started reading it?" - Nelson 21/04/2017

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Post by TigerSkins » Wed 21 Feb, 2018 9:32 am

Tiger Watto wrote:
Wed 21 Feb, 2018 9:00 am
Bob wrote:
Tue 20 Feb, 2018 10:08 pm
I don’t have a problem with successful clubs being successful. I take issue with some clubs flaunting the rules and not others.

Have a salary cap that each team must stick to that is covered by the NRL.

Have unlimited TPA’s a player can receive regardless of who organises it.

Each player must be paid a minimum out of the cap that co incides with their resume.

The part I hate is that clubs flaunt the rules without being reprimanded some stick to the rules and others get penalised.. why?

I am sure there is no limit to TPA’s that could be organised for good players.
I mentioned this a week or so ago, but I doubt many clubs are breaking the rules.

There will be clubs who follow the rules as outlined, and there will be clubs who do things that dont break the rules.

Two seperate approaches with both being right.

The catalyst is money. Some clubs have access to more money from external factors than others. If Michael Morgan gets a house built for him because he is a great bloke, and the builder has no affiliations to the club, what can the NRL do?
Most of the Cows players have had a house given ... oops I meant built for them cause they great blokes .. !! It happens on the Gold Coast as well .. a certain player up there, "next in line to be a King" had a house built for him cause he was a great bloke .. it was a magnificent house .. but at the end of his career he sold up and got over a handy 3.5 mil for the house he lived in for 2 years ..!! So the question here is are these houses part of their salary or TPA's or are they just freebies .. ??

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