Cronk - Roosters Official..

bathursttiger
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Re: Cronk - Roosters Official..

Post by bathursttiger » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:01 am

It's a pity that the NRL won't allow Harry to pay some TPA's.
You think that HT could squeeze his sub contractors for some TPA's.


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Post by TigerTiger » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:34 am

Spud Murphy wrote:
Tue 31 Oct, 2017 8:45 pm
Tiger Watto wrote:
Tue 31 Oct, 2017 6:58 pm
Spud Murphy wrote:
Tue 31 Oct, 2017 1:32 pm
Tiger Watto wrote:
Mon 30 Oct, 2017 9:47 pm

Judging by there good management of the cap, I wouldnt be surprised if they could fit him in.
Good management my arse! There is a fine line between good management and subtle rorting and with the calibre of players the Roosters have stacked into their team for next season they have crossed that line, imo. It's there for all to see, but they will get away with it because of their high profile backers. God even Melbourne couldn't get away with that!
of course its good management... The NRL wouldnt of approved it if it wasnt legal.
Yeah right...they're probably getting kickbacks! :lol:
The NRL admin doesn't need the Roosters money, they are getting plenty in their pockets from the tv rights deal.

The only person these buggers (NRL and Roosters) would be afraid of is the taxman.
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Post by Cultured Bogan » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:41 am

Geo. wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 7:29 am
Tiger Watto wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 6:46 am
Telltails wrote:
Tue 31 Oct, 2017 11:47 pm
I think you may be right Gallagher. Got to take a leaf out of their book if we want to remain competitive in the Sydney market.
100%... Its like any business. You need to compete or die.

Its time our club got better in this department and started pursuing smarter management of the salary cap!
Wait a second ..then we may rise from mediocrity and that will never do...

Every now and then I hear the voice of Noice in my head...the Man U of the NRL he said...waiting...

The Roosters, Broncos, Storm are the Man City, Chelsea and Tottenhams..We are West Ham...making up the numbers...

Or you can complain and waaaaa about it...
West Ham?

Nah we're more like Stoke. Have a half decent year here or there, but on whole just hanging on.
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Cuando llegue el día, y estoy parado a las puertas del cielo, será Dios pidiendo mi perdón...

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Post by hammertime » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:54 am

bathursttiger wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:01 am
It's a pity that the NRL won't allow Harry to pay some TPA's.
You think that HT could squeeze his sub contractors for some TPA's.
Is that just guesswork or do you know he's been restricted?

The board and management moved him to arms-length from the club so that he could contribute through TPAs.

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Post by Cultured Bogan » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:57 am

hammertime wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:54 am
bathursttiger wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:01 am
It's a pity that the NRL won't allow Harry to pay some TPA's.
You think that HT could squeeze his sub contractors for some TPA's.
Is that just guesswork or do you know he's been restricted?

The board and management moved him to arms-length from the club so that he could contribute through TPAs.
No, he left after Brydens came in as major sponsor. IIRC the final season he sponsored us he only did so as there was no one else available?
"This club means a lot to me and I really love this club, I love playing here, I love playing with all of the boys, it's what I've known for pretty much all of my life and I'm happy to be here." - Luke Brooks.

Cuando llegue el día, y estoy parado a las puertas del cielo, será Dios pidiendo mi perdón...


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Post by hammertime » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 9:14 am

Cultured Bogan wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:57 am
hammertime wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:54 am
bathursttiger wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:01 am
It's a pity that the NRL won't allow Harry to pay some TPA's.
You think that HT could squeeze his sub contractors for some TPA's.
Is that just guesswork or do you know he's been restricted?

The board and management moved him to arms-length from the club so that he could contribute through TPAs.
No, he left after Brydens came in as major sponsor. IIRC the final season he sponsored us he only did so as there was no one else available?
No man, it was a calculated move. Harry even hinted at it on his interview (think it was with 60 minutes)

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Post by hammertime » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 9:18 am

hammertime wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 9:14 am
Cultured Bogan wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:57 am
hammertime wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:54 am
bathursttiger wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:01 am
It's a pity that the NRL won't allow Harry to pay some TPA's.
You think that HT could squeeze his sub contractors for some TPA's.
Is that just guesswork or do you know he's been restricted?

The board and management moved him to arms-length from the club so that he could contribute through TPAs.
No, he left after Brydens came in as major sponsor. IIRC the final season he sponsored us he only did so as there was no one else available?
No man, it was a calculated move. Harry even hinted at it on his interview (think it was with 60 minutes)
Here's an exert

"I spoke with them, (West Tigers management)" said Triguboff, the founder and managing director of Meriton Apartments. "They wanted money to buy four good players and I told them I would help"
"Then we can win a comp. That is what I am interested in. They (management) came to see me about (Aaron) Woods, he is a nice person"
Asked how much the club was seeking, he said "I can't remember , $500,000, $600,000."

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Post by Cultured Bogan » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 9:24 am

I thought that happened prior to his final year sponsoring us?

My chronology on the events is fuzzy so I'll take your word for it.
"This club means a lot to me and I really love this club, I love playing here, I love playing with all of the boys, it's what I've known for pretty much all of my life and I'm happy to be here." - Luke Brooks.

Cuando llegue el día, y estoy parado a las puertas del cielo, será Dios pidiendo mi perdón...

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Post by Curly Tiger » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 9:25 am

Can anyone confirm what the 2018 Salary Cap is? Is it $9.4m? Plus what was it in 2017? I'm trying to do the sums on the Rorters and want to see if it in any way adds up to the increase in the salary cap from 2017 to 2018. I'll share it with you once I've got these two numbers

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Post by TigerTiger » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 9:32 am

Not 100% certain, but fairly certain, the cap in 2017 was $7m.

In 2018, it's $9.4m, plus 6 development players, plus a couple of other allowed payments (like car etc) totalling about $200k or $300k.

Still not finalised though, the Players Association won't sign off on it, they want more, it may end up at $9.6m.

And interesting to see what your figures show mate.
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Post by Curly Tiger » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 11:24 am

This isn’t in any way official in terms of numbers but I’ve approached it from a common sense approach to see if the Roosters ups and downs make sense in light of the increase in the salary cap

Let’s start by assuming that the Roosters were in line with the cap in 2017. If the 2017 Cap was $7.0m and lifts to $9.4m in 2018, everyone has an extra $2.4m to spend which allows for a lot. Those 2017 and 2018 Cap numbers are the key as $2.4m on $7m is a 34% increase. It’s unbelievably difficult to get the 2017 Cap number but maybe that helps create an information gap which allows for some confusion

Roosters have added Cronk and Tedesco, so conservatively +$2.2m, potentially more

Roosters have lost Carter (say only $150k), Evans ($250k), Guerra ($300k), Kenny-Dowall ($250k), Knight ($100k), Watson ($150k), so they save -$1.2m (I’ve guessed these salaries)

But they have to replace four of these (Cronk and Tedesco cover two) so let’s say $200k each +$0.8m

They have resigned the following x10 in the last twelve months: Mitch Cornish (2018), Blake Ferguson (2018), Michael Gordon (2018), Ryan Matterson (2019), Dylan Napa (2019), Mitchell Pearce (2019), Victor Radley (2019), Chris Smith (2018), Daniel Tupou (2021), Sitili Tupouniua (2019)
Unlikely they signed for less, Ferguson aside, so let’s say $50k extra each, some would be more, some less, so that’s an extra +$0.5m

Add all that together and it’s an increase of $2.3m and I reckon I’ve been kind to them but it does fit into the (maybe) cap increase of $2.4m. However, is it really possible that everyone other than the two new big earners are going to accept no increase in an environment where the Cap has increased by 34% (assuming 2017 $7m and 2018 $9.4m is correct). Managers aren’t going to let that happen

If we believe the numbers there are already so many good players under $290k at the Roosters: Matterson $200k Daniel Tupou $220k, Mitchell Aubusson $280k, Isaac Liu $200k, Zane Tetevano $120k, Sio Siua Taukeiaho $150k, Joseph Manu $150k, Nat Butcher $200k, Victor Radley $120k. Surely they’d all be looking for increases or if they resigned lately, surely they already got one which would further eat into the available $

Not sure I’ve solved anything but maybe it’s a start for others to add to

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Post by NT Tiger » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 11:51 am

Curly Tiger wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 11:24 am
This isn’t in any way official in terms of numbers but I’ve approached it from a common sense approach to see if the Roosters ups and downs make sense in light of the increase in the salary cap

Let’s start by assuming that the Roosters were in line with the cap in 2017. If the 2017 Cap was $7.0m and lifts to $9.4m in 2018, everyone has an extra $2.4m to spend which allows for a lot. Those 2017 and 2018 Cap numbers are the key as $2.4m on $7m is a 34% increase. It’s unbelievably difficult to get the 2017 Cap number but maybe that helps create an information gap which allows for some confusion

Roosters have added Cronk and Tedesco, so conservatively +$2.2m, potentially more

Roosters have lost Carter (say only $150k), Evans ($250k), Guerra ($300k), Kenny-Dowall ($250k), Knight ($100k), Watson ($150k), so they save -$1.2m (I’ve guessed these salaries)

But they have to replace four of these (Cronk and Tedesco cover two) so let’s say $200k each +$0.8m

They have resigned the following x10 in the last twelve months: Mitch Cornish (2018), Blake Ferguson (2018), Michael Gordon (2018), Ryan Matterson (2019), Dylan Napa (2019), Mitchell Pearce (2019), Victor Radley (2019), Chris Smith (2018), Daniel Tupou (2021), Sitili Tupouniua (2019)
Unlikely they signed for less, Ferguson aside, so let’s say $50k extra each, some would be more, some less, so that’s an extra +$0.5m

Add all that together and it’s an increase of $2.3m and I reckon I’ve been kind to them but it does fit into the (maybe) cap increase of $2.4m. However, is it really possible that everyone other than the two new big earners are going to accept no increase in an environment where the Cap has increased by 34% (assuming 2017 $7m and 2018 $9.4m is correct). Managers aren’t going to let that happen

If we believe the numbers there are already so many good players under $290k at the Roosters: Matterson $200k Daniel Tupou $220k, Mitchell Aubusson $280k, Isaac Liu $200k, Zane Tetevano $120k, Sio Siua Taukeiaho $150k, Joseph Manu $150k, Nat Butcher $200k, Victor Radley $120k. Surely they’d all be looking for increases or if they resigned lately, surely they already got one which would further eat into the available $

Not sure I’ve solved anything but maybe it’s a start for others to add to
What that really does is highlight the importance of TPA's to the Roosters recruitment. As others have said they may be within the cap, but.....
"Quality Stupidity"

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Post by bathursttiger » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 1:16 pm

hammertime wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:54 am
bathursttiger wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:01 am
It's a pity that the NRL won't allow Harry to pay some TPA's.
You think that HT could squeeze his sub contractors for some TPA's.
Is that just guesswork or do you know he's been restricted?

The board and management moved him to arms-length from the club so that he could contribute through TPAs.
I'm sure that I read somewhere that Greenberg refused Meriton permission for TPA's as their association was too close to the club.
I could be wrong, someone closer to the club might be able to confirm or deny this.

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Post by bathursttiger » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 1:22 pm

hammertime wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 9:18 am
hammertime wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 9:14 am
Cultured Bogan wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:57 am
hammertime wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:54 am


Is that just guesswork or do you know he's been restricted?

The board and management moved him to arms-length from the club so that he could contribute through TPAs.
No, he left after Brydens came in as major sponsor. IIRC the final season he sponsored us he only did so as there was no one else available?
No man, it was a calculated move. Harry even hinted at it on his interview (think it was with 60 minutes)
Here's an exert

"I spoke with them, (West Tigers management)" said Triguboff, the founder and managing director of Meriton Apartments. "They wanted money to buy four good players and I told them I would help"
"Then we can win a comp. That is what I am interested in. They (management) came to see me about (Aaron) Woods, he is a nice person"
Asked how much the club was seeking, he said "I can't remember , $500,000, $600,000."
Harry's interview on 1 on 1 was on 07/07/2015
It's on YouTube

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Post by jirskyr » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 5:03 pm

bathursttiger wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 1:16 pm
hammertime wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:54 am
bathursttiger wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:01 am
It's a pity that the NRL won't allow Harry to pay some TPA's.
You think that HT could squeeze his sub contractors for some TPA's.
Is that just guesswork or do you know he's been restricted?

The board and management moved him to arms-length from the club so that he could contribute through TPAs.
I'm sure that I read somewhere that Greenberg refused Meriton permission for TPA's as their association was too close to the club.
I could be wrong, someone closer to the club might be able to confirm or deny this.
So Harry T might be too close to the club, but all Nick Politis' high-profile mates like Bouris are at arm's length of course? Nevermind the fact that they are high profile and regular contributors to Bondi coffers.

I wonder if Harry T has kids who follow the Tigers, maybe they are distant enough. But he probably doesn't give them much cash, if his public persona is true.

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Post by kiwitiger » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 5:38 pm

jirskyr wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 5:03 pm
bathursttiger wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 1:16 pm
hammertime wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:54 am
bathursttiger wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:01 am
It's a pity that the NRL won't allow Harry to pay some TPA's.
You think that HT could squeeze his sub contractors for some TPA's.
Is that just guesswork or do you know he's been restricted?

The board and management moved him to arms-length from the club so that he could contribute through TPAs.
I'm sure that I read somewhere that Greenberg refused Meriton permission for TPA's as their association was too close to the club.
I could be wrong, someone closer to the club might be able to confirm or deny this.
So Harry T might be too close to the club, but all Nick Politis' high-profile mates like Bouris are at arm's length of course? Nevermind the fact that they are high profile and regular contributors to Bondi coffers.

I wonder if Harry T has kids who follow the Tigers, maybe they are distant enough. But he probably doesn't give them much cash, if his public persona is true.
Or else Nick does not go to the media saying how he/his mates are going to do TPAs, like above from Hammertime. Pulling out as major sponsor saying this is your new role is a little silly. Just do it, say nothing! Really all you are asking is to be made an example of...

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Post by Spud Murphy » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 9:27 pm

TigerTiger wrote:
Wed 01 Nov, 2017 8:34 am
Spud Murphy wrote:
Tue 31 Oct, 2017 8:45 pm
Tiger Watto wrote:
Tue 31 Oct, 2017 6:58 pm
Spud Murphy wrote:
Tue 31 Oct, 2017 1:32 pm


Good management my arse! There is a fine line between good management and subtle rorting and with the calibre of players the Roosters have stacked into their team for next season they have crossed that line, imo. It's there for all to see, but they will get away with it because of their high profile backers. God even Melbourne couldn't get away with that!
of course its good management... The NRL wouldnt of approved it if it wasnt legal.
Yeah right...they're probably getting kickbacks! :lol:
The NRL admin doesn't need the Roosters money, they are getting plenty in their pockets from the tv rights deal.

The only person these buggers (NRL and Roosters) would be afraid of is the taxman.
Don't worry, the ATO is probably paid off also :lol:

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Post by Elderslie Tiger » Wed 01 Nov, 2017 9:46 pm

Here would be an interesting exercise when details of Super Coach comes out for 2018 try and fit the Roosters Storm Broncos under the Super Coach salary cap there would be no way you could.Maybe the NRL could look at putting values on all players and at those values would have to fit the salary cap.Clubs could pay those who fit under the salary cap what ever they like it would provide a fairer spread of talent and stop the rorting thats happening now.Thoughts?

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