Nathan Cleary

upthetigers
Member
Member
Posts: 898
Joined: Sun 24 Jul, 2016 10:41 pm

Re: Nathan Cleary

Post by upthetigers » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 3:50 pm

jirskyr wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 3:38 pm
Wa Mag/Tig wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 3:02 pm
All the stories i have read today on Nathan Cleary staying at panthers have seemed to have been pulled. Not one story on any media outlet i read. Seems unusual for such breaking news.
It's still on nrl.com?

What I personally want to know is exactly how much Penrith are forking out to retain NC. He's a good kid but this could also be an epic mistake, I'm not convinced that he's a career top player.

Not to say he would not have been a good signing for Tigers, but the decision appears to have been taken out of our hands, and I'm ok with that. That $1M could possibly be better spent elsewhere. Look at the Sharks model for example - one attacking half, one organiser and then bury the rest of your money in an arse-kicking forward pack.
Cleary would do nothing behind our pack.


User avatar
Harvey
Member
Member
Posts: 3706
Joined: Mon 22 Jun, 2015 10:01 pm
Location: Leumeah

Post by Harvey » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 5:21 pm

Does Ivan not trust anyone to coach his son, or thinks only he can get the best out of him.

Is he the league equivalent of John Tomic and Damir Dokic

NT Tiger
Member
Member
Posts: 3041
Joined: Sun 28 Apr, 2013 9:00 am
Location: Sitting in front of the computer (again)

Post by NT Tiger » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 5:41 pm

Harvey wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 5:21 pm
Does Ivan not trust anyone to coach his son, or thinks only he can get the best out of him.

Is he the league equivalent of John Tomic and Damir Dokic
He (and his wife) don't like the idea of, as an opposing coach, directing forwards traffic at him in game planning to stifle his effectiveness.
"Quality Stupidity"

rex2ce
Member
Member
Posts: 599
Joined: Tue 25 Mar, 2014 9:43 am
Location: Newcastle

Post by rex2ce » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 6:04 pm

Last time I looked, Ivan was coaching an opposing team to Nathan’s and it’s his job to nullify him, Brooks mother probs doesn’t like opposing forwards running at her son either

TonyTiger
Member
Member
Posts: 334
Joined: Mon 04 Dec, 2017 12:41 pm

Post by TonyTiger » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 6:16 pm

avocadoontoast wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 1:21 pm
TigerTiger wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 1:16 pm
If Nathan signs with Gus and the Panthers after all they put his father through, then my opinion of the kid is so low he may as well be playing for the Roosters.
Unless Ivan ends up back at the Panthers..
Next marker will be how the panthers approach the next 2 years coaching role. If they appoint someone for more than 2 years then Ivan is out of the interim equation, however I’m assuming Nathan has agreed long term there with assurances that Ivan will be fast tracked over there, so interim coach most likely - seems Nathan is calling the shots. In any case who cares, this whole Nathan/Ivan has been a big distraction for us. Time to move on.


Red88 Tiger
Member
Member
Posts: 167
Joined: Fri 08 Dec, 2017 5:37 pm

Post by Red88 Tiger » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 6:33 pm

TonyTiger wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 6:16 pm
avocadoontoast wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 1:21 pm
TigerTiger wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 1:16 pm
If Nathan signs with Gus and the Panthers after all they put his father through, then my opinion of the kid is so low he may as well be playing for the Roosters.
Unless Ivan ends up back at the Panthers..
Next marker will be how the panthers approach the next 2 years coaching role. If they appoint someone for more than 2 years then Ivan is out of the interim equation, however I’m assuming Nathan has agreed long term there with assurances that Ivan will be fast tracked over there, so interim coach most likely - seems Nathan is calling the shots. In any case who cares, this whole Nathan/Ivan has been a big distraction for us. Time to move on.
I really can't see panthers sitting on their hands with the squad they have. It would work out like this year imo.
Imagine if they give it to ciraldo and they have a poor start next year. Fans would be after blood

Nelson
Member
Member
Posts: 3311
Joined: Sat 31 Oct, 2015 11:17 am

Post by Nelson » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 6:48 pm

jirskyr wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 3:38 pm
Look at the Sharks model for example - one attacking half, one organiser and then bury the rest of your money in an arse-kicking forward pack.
Except for the other $1.4 million spent on Val Holmes and Josh Dugan...

User avatar
jirskyr
Member
Member
Posts: 6053
Joined: Mon 13 Jul, 2009 12:00 pm

Post by jirskyr » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 6:52 pm

Nelson wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 6:48 pm
jirskyr wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 3:38 pm
Look at the Sharks model for example - one attacking half, one organiser and then bury the rest of your money in an arse-kicking forward pack.
Except for the other $1.4 million spent on Val Holmes and Josh Dugan...
Better than spending $1.2M on Nathan Cleary or $1.1M on James Tedesco TBH.

Spud Murphy
Member
Member
Posts: 2358
Joined: Sat 13 May, 2017 5:04 pm
Location: Third Heaven

Post by Spud Murphy » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 7:11 pm

supercoach wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 11:08 am
Glad he has shown loyalty to Penrith and IMO a move to the Tigers was never a option.. Let’s hope the Monopoly money earmarked for Nathan can be directed towards fixing some real holes in our roster and of course extending Brooks
A thousand times yes! We've got a good halfback already, sign some bloody forwards Ivan!

User avatar
Tiger Steve
Member
Member
Posts: 1896
Joined: Wed 29 Mar, 2017 5:30 pm
Location: Chatswood West

Post by Tiger Steve » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:32 pm

I’m so over this s***. We have an awesome halfback - re-sign him to a long deal. Fix the roster and get some decent bloody players. Extend Ivan or piss him off. One or the other. Oh and Justin, don’t go on holidays until this is all done!
“Peanuts! Get ya peanuts - in the shell or sugar coated!” Leichhardt memories.

User avatar
innsaneink
Member
Member
Posts: 29305
Joined: Fri 10 Jul, 2009 9:49 pm
Location: ...ahead of you....

Post by innsaneink » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:36 pm

Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:32 pm
I’m so over this s***. We have an awesome halfback - re-sign him to a long deal. Fix the roster and get some decent bloody players. Extend Ivan or piss him off. One or the other. Oh and Justin, don’t go on holidays until this is all done!
I dont get this mindset...I know all the talk and theories around it, players wont come, his heart wont be in it blah blah...i think thats rubbish myself, he will go eventually one way or the other just let him continue to do what hes building.
he doesnt deserve an extension (that hes unlikley to agree to anyway) yet and he doesnt deserve the arse

User avatar
Tiger Steve
Member
Member
Posts: 1896
Joined: Wed 29 Mar, 2017 5:30 pm
Location: Chatswood West

Post by Tiger Steve » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:41 pm

innsaneink wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:36 pm
Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:32 pm
I’m so over this s***. We have an awesome halfback - re-sign him to a long deal. Fix the roster and get some decent bloody players. Extend Ivan or piss him off. One or the other. Oh and Justin, don’t go on holidays until this is all done!
I dont get this mindset...I know all the talk and theories around it, players wont come, his heart wont be in it blah blah...i think thats rubbish myself, he will go eventually one way or the other just let him continue to do what hes building.
he doesnt deserve an extension (that hes unlikley to agree to anyway) yet and he doesnt deserve the arse
Mate I’ve had a few beers!!

BUT I think we need long term commitment to encourage good players and build our squad. If Ivan is going to Penrith in 2021, Go now. Find a coach who will not just talk about being on the bus but will actually do it. I’d prefer Ican to be that man, so extend him. If he won’t commit- bye bye!
“Peanuts! Get ya peanuts - in the shell or sugar coated!” Leichhardt memories.

Nucky Thompson
Member
Member
Posts: 1406
Joined: Sun 09 Oct, 2016 8:08 pm

Post by Nucky Thompson » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:42 pm

innsaneink wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:36 pm
Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:32 pm
I’m so over this s***. We have an awesome halfback - re-sign him to a long deal. Fix the roster and get some decent bloody players. Extend Ivan or piss him off. One or the other. Oh and Justin, don’t go on holidays until this is all done!
I dont get this mindset...I know all the talk and theories around it, players wont come, his heart wont be in it blah blah...i think thats rubbish myself, he will go eventually one way or the other just let him continue to do what hes building.
he doesnt deserve an extension (that hes unlikley to agree to anyway) yet and he doesnt deserve the arse

It's not ivan deserves the arse ivan wants to leave to coach the golden child. It's clear the team/bus thing is bull when it comes to nathan.

We picked another dud which is hard to accept, we did not forsee this happening to us given gould sacked him at his last coaching job but here we are.

I get the mindset.

Nucky Thompson
Member
Member
Posts: 1406
Joined: Sun 09 Oct, 2016 8:08 pm

Post by Nucky Thompson » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:45 pm

Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:41 pm
innsaneink wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:36 pm
Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:32 pm
I’m so over this s***. We have an awesome halfback - re-sign him to a long deal. Fix the roster and get some decent bloody players. Extend Ivan or piss him off. One or the other. Oh and Justin, don’t go on holidays until this is all done!
I dont get this mindset...I know all the talk and theories around it, players wont come, his heart wont be in it blah blah...i think thats rubbish myself, he will go eventually one way or the other just let him continue to do what hes building.
he doesnt deserve an extension (that hes unlikley to agree to anyway) yet and he doesnt deserve the arse
Mate I’ve had a few beers!!

BUT I think we need long term commitment to encourage good players and build our squad. If Ivan is going to Penrith in 2021, Go now. Find a coach who will not just talk about being on the bus but will actually do it. I’d prefer Ican to be that man, so extend him. If he won’t commit- bye bye!
Totally agree

Nucky Thompson
Member
Member
Posts: 1406
Joined: Sun 09 Oct, 2016 8:08 pm

Post by Nucky Thompson » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:46 pm

Spud Murphy wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 7:11 pm
supercoach wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 11:08 am
Glad he has shown loyalty to Penrith and IMO a move to the Tigers was never a option.. Let’s hope the Monopoly money earmarked for Nathan can be directed towards fixing some real holes in our roster and of course extending Brooks
A thousand times yes! We've got a good halfback already, sign some bloody forwards Ivan!
Still leaves a coaching issue for us.

User avatar
jirskyr
Member
Member
Posts: 6053
Joined: Mon 13 Jul, 2009 12:00 pm

Post by jirskyr » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:52 pm

Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:41 pm
innsaneink wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:36 pm
Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:32 pm
I’m so over this s***. We have an awesome halfback - re-sign him to a long deal. Fix the roster and get some decent bloody players. Extend Ivan or piss him off. One or the other. Oh and Justin, don’t go on holidays until this is all done!
I dont get this mindset...I know all the talk and theories around it, players wont come, his heart wont be in it blah blah...i think thats rubbish myself, he will go eventually one way or the other just let him continue to do what hes building.
he doesnt deserve an extension (that hes unlikley to agree to anyway) yet and he doesnt deserve the arse
Mate I’ve had a few beers!!

BUT I think we need long term commitment to encourage good players and build our squad. If Ivan is going to Penrith in 2021, Go now. Find a coach who will not just talk about being on the bus but will actually do it. I’d prefer Ican to be that man, so extend him. If he won’t commit- bye bye!
Honestly don't think you've given this much thought.

Cleary has 2 full seasons to run on his contract, to end 2020. We are all aware. Is that not enough to entice new players over? Some might only be signed for 2 seasons anyway, and there's currently no guarantee that Ivan stays or goes in 2021. Does anyone really think Penrith will for sure sign Ivan now for 2021 if Tigers continue to fail to make any impact on the finals the next 2 years? They gave him the flick once and he hasn't got a team to the finals since - hardly a stellar track record, and they gave him the flick for a reason.

But above all this, how many coaches are actually contracted beyond 2020, i.e. how many of the other 15 head coaches have a deal with more surety than Ivan, for their players to mull on?

The answer is 3 coaches! Bellamy just extended to end 2021, Green to end 2021 and Robinson to end 2022, and those are all extensions from this season. So if you are a player wanting assurances of the coach beyond 2020, you currently have 3 choices.

How many coaches with even contracts as long as Ivans, to end of 2020? Just another 4 - Barrett (and he's leaving apparently), Garth Brennan, Brownie, Sticky. Hardly a list of success-guaranteed clubs.

All the other coaches unsigned beyond 2019 - Brad Arthur, Ciraldo, Bennett, Flanagan, Kearney, Mary, Dean Pay, Seibold.

In summary - Ivan has a contract length equal to or better than 12/15 = 80%.

User avatar
851
Member
Member
Posts: 6369
Joined: Sun 12 Jul, 2009 6:38 pm

Post by 851 » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:54 pm

Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:41 pm
innsaneink wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:36 pm
Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:32 pm
I’m so over this s***. We have an awesome halfback - re-sign him to a long deal. Fix the roster and get some decent bloody players. Extend Ivan or piss him off. One or the other. Oh and Justin, don’t go on holidays until this is all done!
I dont get this mindset...I know all the talk and theories around it, players wont come, his heart wont be in it blah blah...i think thats rubbish myself, he will go eventually one way or the other just let him continue to do what hes building.
he doesnt deserve an extension (that hes unlikley to agree to anyway) yet and he doesnt deserve the arse
Mate I’ve had a few beers!!

BUT I think we need long term commitment to encourage good players and build our squad. If Ivan is going to Penrith in 2021, Go now. Find a coach who will not just talk about being on the bus but will actually do it. I’d prefer Ican to be that man, so extend him. If he won’t commit- bye bye!
They talked about this on NRL 360, more or less said the same thing, the club needs to go straight to Ivan and ask him to extend, if he declines, work out a settlement, because we will in affect have an interim coach.
Go hard or go home

Spud Murphy
Member
Member
Posts: 2358
Joined: Sat 13 May, 2017 5:04 pm
Location: Third Heaven

Post by Spud Murphy » Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:56 pm

Nucky Thompson wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 8:46 pm
Spud Murphy wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 7:11 pm
supercoach wrote:
Tue 18 Sep, 2018 11:08 am
Glad he has shown loyalty to Penrith and IMO a move to the Tigers was never a option.. Let’s hope the Monopoly money earmarked for Nathan can be directed towards fixing some real holes in our roster and of course extending Brooks
A thousand times yes! We've got a good halfback already, sign some bloody forwards Ivan!
Still leaves a coaching issue for us.
Not for a couple of years, I think Penrith will stick with Ciraldo.

Locked