WOULD IZZY ADD VALUE TO WESTS TIGERS

larrycorowa
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Re: WOULD IZZY ADD VALUE TO WESTS TIGERS

Post by larrycorowa » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:24 pm

Abraham wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:10 pm
larrycorowa wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 9:58 am
He has criticised the ceo of rugby. The guy has nfi what is going on and is totally disrespectful of his employers. I would be tearing his contract up and saying thx and good luck.
So the CEO can lie about what was said during their highly publicised meeting, and Folau has to just sit back and allow himself to be misrepresented?

Yeah, nah.
I think the ceo was allowing falou to take a position that worked for both parties. He obviously is sharp enough to take the tip. As soon as he affects sponsorship it becomes a very easy decision.


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Post by larrycorowa » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:37 pm

Abraham wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:22 pm
jirskyr wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 12:24 pm
I wonder what anyone who thinks Folau can say whatever he likes and be left alone, I wonder what they think about Joel Monaghan or Pearcey simulating sex with dogs, or Todd Carney pretending to wee in his own mouth? Neither of those things are illegal and yet look at the consequences. What about a man's freedom to pee in his own bloody mouth? How dare you persecute such a freedom of artistic expression?
So just to be clear, in your eyes simulating bestiality and quoting the Bible are the same thing?

While i understand your point about the consequences of freedoms (and agree with the general point), i think you can do better job of illustrating it.

I don't think Folau should be left alone for his comments, to the contrary everyone should be allowed to voice their opinions on every topic they like, without being shut down or shouted down.

Out of curiosity, do you think the opinion of the Qantas CEO is more valid than the opinion of Israel Folau ?
It’s not just that the aru has an inclusion policy and falou, who is an employee of the aru, has publicly aired views that are totally opposed to his employer. It’s an untenable situation.

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Post by Abraham » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:45 pm

larrycorowa wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:24 pm
Abraham wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:10 pm
larrycorowa wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 9:58 am
He has criticised the ceo of rugby. The guy has nfi what is going on and is totally disrespectful of his employers. I would be tearing his contract up and saying thx and good luck.
So the CEO can lie about what was said during their highly publicised meeting, and Folau has to just sit back and allow himself to be misrepresented?

Yeah, nah.
I think the ceo was allowing falou to take a position that worked for both parties. He obviously is sharp enough to take the tip. As soon as he affects sponsorship it becomes a very easy decision.
No, she was taking a position that allowed an out for her with regards to the sponsors. In doing so she misrepresented Folau's position.

Folau has been resolute from the beginning that his views are solid and that he would not bend them for anybody. She disrespected that and he called her out for it.

To criticise a guy for being truthful is absurd.
Last edited by Abraham on Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Abraham » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:47 pm

larrycorowa wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:37 pm
It’s not just that the aru has an inclusion policy and falou, who is an employee of the aru, has publicly aired views that are totally opposed to his employer. It’s an untenable situation.
Seems the inclusion policy excludes Christians.

Maybe if the ARU stuck to managing Rugby Union and stopped being wannabe Social Justice Warriors, they would avoid these situations more easily.

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Post by cqtiger » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:47 pm

Wow poor old Izzy is now lower than Todd Carney, Matt Lodge and Donald Trump just because he is man enough to believe in something.
If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said a faster horse
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Post by AnnandaleTiger » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:51 pm

Didn't hurt early on when Isaac was prepared to use the tigers large $$ pool by placing rumours in the hands on journalists. No proof as such but likely.

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Post by larrycorowa » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:55 pm

Abraham wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:47 pm
larrycorowa wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:37 pm
It’s not just that the aru has an inclusion policy and falou, who is an employee of the aru, has publicly aired views that are totally opposed to his employer. It’s an untenable situation.
Seems the inclusion policy excludes Christians.

Maybe if the ARU stuck to managing Rugby Union and stopped being wannabe Social Justice Warriors, they would avoid these situations more easily.
No one said christians are going to Hell. It’s about tolerance. Would you be happy if he was spouting racist comments?

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Post by larrycorowa » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:56 pm

larrycorowa wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:55 pm
Abraham wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:47 pm
larrycorowa wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:37 pm
It’s not just that the aru has an inclusion policy and falou, who is an employee of the aru, has publicly aired views that are totally opposed to his employer. It’s an untenable situation.
Seems the inclusion policy excludes Christians.

Maybe if the ARU stuck to managing Rugby Union and stopped being wannabe Social Justice Warriors, they would avoid these situations more easily.
No one said christians are going to Hell. It’s about tolerance. Would you be happy if he was spouting racist comments?
Maybe if Izzy concentrated on playing rugby that the aru pays him to do then there is no problem.

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Post by Abraham » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 4:11 pm

larrycorowa wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:55 pm
Abraham wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:47 pm
larrycorowa wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:37 pm
It’s not just that the aru has an inclusion policy and falou, who is an employee of the aru, has publicly aired views that are totally opposed to his employer. It’s an untenable situation.
Seems the inclusion policy excludes Christians.

Maybe if the ARU stuck to managing Rugby Union and stopped being wannabe Social Justice Warriors, they would avoid these situations more easily.
No one said christians are going to Hell. It’s about tolerance. Would you be happy if he was spouting racist comments?
Is saying that Christians cannot publicly speak about their religion a show of tolerance?

See the problem you have when you jump on the SJW bandwagon... everything you say can be turned back against you.

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Post by NT Tiger » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 4:25 pm

This looks like a worthwhile discussion.
"Quality Stupidity"

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Post by larrycorowa » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 4:29 pm

Yeah we are not really getting anywhere. I guess we just see where it ends up.

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Post by Abraham » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 4:45 pm

NT Tiger wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 4:25 pm
This looks like a worthwhile discussion.
It wasn't, until you showed up and made it worthwhile.

Sincerely, thank you.

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Post by Abraham » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 4:48 pm

larrycorowa wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 4:29 pm
Yeah we are not really getting anywhere. I guess we just see where it ends up.
We are only going around in circles because your arguments about 'tolerance' and 'inclusion' are only buzzwords designed to shut people up.

When they are turned back on you, those same arguments implode.

The obvious answer is don't shut people up, and either beat them with a superior argument, or avert your gaze.

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Post by NT Tiger » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 4:58 pm

Abraham wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 4:45 pm
NT Tiger wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 4:25 pm
This looks like a worthwhile discussion.
It wasn't, until you showed up and made it worthwhile.

Sincerely, thank you.
Cheers. Thanks for your sincere recognition. I needed the affirmation.
"Quality Stupidity"

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Post by larrycorowa » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 5:19 pm

Abraham wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 4:48 pm
larrycorowa wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 4:29 pm
Yeah we are not really getting anywhere. I guess we just see where it ends up.
We are only going around in circles because your arguments about 'tolerance' and 'inclusion' are only buzzwords designed to shut people up.

When they are turned back on you, those same arguments implode.

The obvious answer is don't shut people up, and either beat them with a superior argument, or avert your gaze.
Really.,,,,it’s obvious you can’t really have a mature debate on the issue. I should have looked at your username before I tried logic.

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Post by Cultured Bogan » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 5:33 pm

Last time, can the religious semantics, discuss the topic.

Fair enough if you think his comments are (not) worthy of signing him on a PR level,but we don't need 50 pages of interpretation of Christian dogma and how that applies to signing Izzy. Such discussions are cyclic and better left to stink up it's own thread.
#penaltyTigers

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Post by jirskyr » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 5:37 pm

Abraham wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 3:22 pm
jirskyr wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 12:24 pm
I wonder what anyone who thinks Folau can say whatever he likes and be left alone, I wonder what they think about Joel Monaghan or Pearcey simulating sex with dogs, or Todd Carney pretending to wee in his own mouth? Neither of those things are illegal and yet look at the consequences. What about a man's freedom to pee in his own bloody mouth? How dare you persecute such a freedom of artistic expression?
So just to be clear, in your eyes simulating bestiality and quoting the Bible are the same thing?

While i understand your point about the consequences of freedoms (and agree with the general point), i think you can do better job of illustrating it.

I don't think Folau should be left alone for his comments, to the contrary everyone should be allowed to voice their opinions on every topic they like, without being shut down or shouted down.

Out of curiosity, do you think the opinion of the Qantas CEO is more valid than the opinion of Israel Folau ?
Equally valid comments. Except one guy's money eventually lines the other guy's pockets.

Ill say it for perhaps the last time, I'm not shouting the guy down for his comments. I just don't think its smart operations to be so public and unrelenting in your negative views towards the lifestyle of a quite large section of society.

Believe what you want, say what you want, just don't get upset if not everyone wants or values your opinion.

And yes being extreme, simulating bestiality and quoting the bible are both non-illegal forms of expression. Obviously one is probably socially more extreme than the other, but how extreme that is really depends on your POV. Some ppl dont find what Carney or Pearce did as particularly troublesome. Some people are more offended by Izzy's comments.

Ask members of the gay community are they more troubled by a famous bible-quoter or an equally famous dog cuddler?

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Post by trumper » Wed 18 Apr, 2018 6:01 pm

Pawsandclaws wrote:
Wed 18 Apr, 2018 1:25 pm
jirskyr wrote:
Tue 17 Apr, 2018 11:04 pm
trumper wrote:
Tue 17 Apr, 2018 10:17 pm
Personally I couldn't care less which god he believes in.

Considering the public stance of the ARU towards being inclusive of homosexuals, the fact that the CEO of the major sponsor of the Wallabies is an open homosexual, and also the clear desire of the ailing ARU not to upset him; Folau has revealed that he is either too stupid, too stubborn or too convinced of his own importance to follow the game plan.

For me that is enough not to want him anywhere near my football team - a team which has, despite the sidelining of their highest-paid and most famous player, continued to succeed with the attitude that if a man falls in the front line, there is a willing and able man there to replace him.

Look at how Hayne derailed not only the Gold Coast but also Neil Henry in 2017.
Perfectly said.

All gays are going to hell and the CEO of your major sponsor is one of them. What a clever thing to say. Wait - "God made me do it".
The link between Qantas and Emirates makes the stance by the former against Folau to be not a good look. And the ARU inclusiveness provision not only applies to sexual orientation but also religious beliefs.

Ch9 reported this is the hot topic among fellow church members in the Eels' dressing sheds. Gallen's criticism of Folau on Ch9 last Sunday perhaps would not have gone down well with team mates who are members of the same Church (huge church).
Shouldn't the Eels be talking more about other things, like how to win a game? Nobody pays to watch people genuflecting on the first Sunday of September. If Folau has that effect on the hopeless Eels from such a distance, I'm going to double down on no thanks.

As to the whole mess with Qantas, Emirates, the ARU and Israel Folau, the observer will notice that the perversity of the Abrahamic cults of monotheism and the shrill railing against homophobia both count for nothing against a stack of printed plastic - so there's no need to really take any of that seriously.

Nobody is arguing that Folau should face exclusion because of his beliefs - well I'm not. I'd exclude him because our team, the Wests Tigers, is doing so well at the moment precisely because we don't have any such divisive characters on our roster - whether they draw the lines of division using religion, sexuality, skin colour or knock-ons per match is irrelevant, as the opposite to division is inclusion, and thats what a team is, inclusive.

Surely someone can see the criminal irony in the actions of both sides; the ARU's "Israel, you have no right to voice that opinion, we're inclusive' stance, and Folau's 'I have a right to be included because I belong to a group of people who believe in the right to exclude'.

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