Ivan Cleary - THREAD..

TYGA
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Re: Ivan Cleary - THREAD..

Post by TYGA » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:26 pm

goldcoast tiger wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:10 pm
How does those who say that he has to sign an extension (or not be the Coach )get around the legality bits , such as he CANNOT be forced to sign an extension , and especially under duress, which involve threats of removing him from coaching,

Where is the hard evidence of any wrongdoing.
If he wants to continue to Coach here next year There’s not much that the club can do, which is maybe the reason that they’ve been remarkably quite.
It’s a very simple discussion.

Would you entertain extending your deal for 3 years from 2020 we can improve your deal as we value what you bring to the table. The Answer will be NO.

Do you want to be released from your contract now to go and coach your son? Answer would be yes.

Speak to Gus we will do it now for 1.5m and we need a few players that don’t fit your style.

If not we will let you go in 2020 and we will announce it now so there are no ongoing issues.


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Post by bathursttiger » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:29 pm

goldcoast tiger wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:10 pm
How does those who say that he has to sign an extension (or not be the Coach )get around the legality bits , such as he CANNOT be forced to sign an extension , and especially under duress, which involve threats of removing him from coaching,

Where is the hard evidence of any wrongdoing.
If he wants to continue to Coach here next year There’s not much that the club can do, which is maybe the reason that they’ve been remarkably quite.

From Law Depot.


Contracts need to be executed properly in order to be legally binding. Below you can find information about the key elements that make up a valid agreement, when a contract is considered void or reasons it can become voidable, and the steps you can take to make sure your contract is carried out correctly.

The Basic Elements of a Valid Contract

A valid contract is enforceable under state and federal laws, and contains all the required elements.

Offer and Acceptance

The two basic elements of a valid contract are “offer” and “acceptance”.

One party makes an offer (outlines what is provided), and the other party accepts the terms of the offer (usually in writing). Acceptance can take time, whereby the negotiation process takes place until an agreement is reached.

Legal Object and Capacity of Parties

The subject matter of the agreement must be legal and both parties must:
◾Freely agree to the terms
◾Be over the age of consent
◾Be able to mentally carry out the agreement

Consideration

A valid contract must have the element of consideration (a price or value) exchanged in the agreement. Consideration is not limited to money, and can include a right, interest, or benefit. Both parties must benefit in some form.

For instance, when one party sells their vehicle to another party, the seller receives money, and in exchange, the buyer receives the vehicle.

Written and Verbal

There are oral agreements that can be enforced, but some contracts are not valid unless they are in writing. Usually those that involve a large amount of consideration or debts, real property, or contracts that won’t be carried out for quite some time (e.g. a Last Will and Testament), need to be in written form.

In summary, a contract is valid if the agreement is consensual, legal, backed up with a promise of consideration, and it is executed by two adult parties who are in sound mind—both of which intend to hold up their end of the bargain.

What is the Difference Between “Void” and “Voidable” Contracts?

When a contract is void, it is not valid. It can never be enforced under state or federal laws. A void contract is null from the moment it was created and neither party is bound by the terms. Think of it as one that a court would never recognize or enforce because there are missing elements.

A contract can be void for the following reasons:
◾The terms of the agreement are illegal or against public policy (unlawful consideration or object)
◾A party was not of sound mind while signing the agreement
◾A party was under the age of consent
◾The terms are impossible
◾The contract restricts the rights of a party

Example: If an individual is hired by an employer and the terms of the employment agreement list illegal job responsibilities, this contract is void because it is against the law and does not adhere to valid contract elements.

Alternatively, a voidable contract is valid and may be enforceable in certain situations if both parties agree to move forward. One party is bound to the terms of the contract, whereas the other party can oppose the contract for legal reasons if they so choose. Therefore if the unbound party rejects the contract, it becomes voidable.

A contract can become voidable under the following circumstances:
◾A party was coerced or threatened into signing the agreement
◾A party was under undue influence (one party is able to dominate the will of another)
◾A party is not of sound mind or mentally competent (minor or mentally ill)
◾The terms of the contract were breached
◾Mutual mistakes on behalf of both parties
◾The contract is fraudulent (omitting or falsifying facts or information, or the intention to not carry out the promise in the contract)
◾Misrepresentation occurs (a false statement of fact)

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Post by jadtiger » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:30 pm

willow wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 7:53 pm
Last chance to keep this thread open guys - I've had enough crap going on between some of you - you know who you are so stop it or this thread gets locked until something official is released from the Tigers.
Agreed some of the comments are disgraceful

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Post by goldcoast tiger » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:33 pm

The trouble is we can’t win

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Post by innsaneink » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:36 pm

TYGA wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:26 pm
goldcoast tiger wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:10 pm
How does those who say that he has to sign an extension (or not be the Coach )get around the legality bits , such as he CANNOT be forced to sign an extension , and especially under duress, which involve threats of removing him from coaching,

Where is the hard evidence of any wrongdoing.
If he wants to continue to Coach here next year There’s not much that the club can do, which is maybe the reason that they’ve been remarkably quite.
It’s a very simple discussion.

Would you entertain extending your deal for 3 years from 2020 we can improve your deal as we value what you bring to the table. The Answer will be NO.

Do you want to be released from your contract now to go and coach your son? Answer would be yes.

Speak to Gus we will do it now for 1.5m and we need a few players that don’t fit your style.

If not we will let you go in 2020 and we will announce it now so there are no ongoing issues.
Only problem is Gus has said Ciraldo is coaching penrith next year


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Post by vlad » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:54 pm

TYGA wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:26 pm
goldcoast tiger wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:10 pm
How does those who say that he has to sign an extension (or not be the Coach )get around the legality bits , such as he CANNOT be forced to sign an extension , and especially under duress, which involve threats of removing him from coaching,

Where is the hard evidence of any wrongdoing.
If he wants to continue to Coach here next year There’s not much that the club can do, which is maybe the reason that they’ve been remarkably quite.
It’s a very simple discussion.

Would you entertain extending your deal for 3 years from 2020 we can improve your deal as we value what you bring to the table. The Answer will be NO.

Do you want to be released from your contract now to go and coach your son? Answer would be yes.

Speak to Gus we will do it now for 1.5m and we need a few players that don’t fit your style.
So we’d get Tim Grant & MWZ back :lol:

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Post by Nucky Thompson » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:59 pm

TIGERPOWER wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 7:49 pm
Nucky Thompson wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 7:26 pm
Ivan cleary quote.

"You need everybody aligned that its gonna be you are in for the long haul you are trying to give the fans hope that they know what they are going to get that are happy to be on the bus"
“ in for the long haul”

You still in it for the long haul Ivan? Or did you forget we brought you back from the coaching wilderness the your old friend Gus sent you to.
You really have to be careful who you listen to. What gets me the most is I believed the bloke.

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Post by Nucky Thompson » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:01 pm

bathursttiger wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:29 pm
goldcoast tiger wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:10 pm
How does those who say that he has to sign an extension (or not be the Coach )get around the legality bits , such as he CANNOT be forced to sign an extension , and especially under duress, which involve threats of removing him from coaching,

Where is the hard evidence of any wrongdoing.
If he wants to continue to Coach here next year There’s not much that the club can do, which is maybe the reason that they’ve been remarkably quite.

From Law Depot.


Contracts need to be executed properly in order to be legally binding. Below you can find information about the key elements that make up a valid agreement, when a contract is considered void or reasons it can become voidable, and the steps you can take to make sure your contract is carried out correctly.

The Basic Elements of a Valid Contract

A valid contract is enforceable under state and federal laws, and contains all the required elements.

Offer and Acceptance

The two basic elements of a valid contract are “offer” and “acceptance”.

One party makes an offer (outlines what is provided), and the other party accepts the terms of the offer (usually in writing). Acceptance can take time, whereby the negotiation process takes place until an agreement is reached.

Legal Object and Capacity of Parties

The subject matter of the agreement must be legal and both parties must:
◾Freely agree to the terms
◾Be over the age of consent
◾Be able to mentally carry out the agreement

Consideration

A valid contract must have the element of consideration (a price or value) exchanged in the agreement. Consideration is not limited to money, and can include a right, interest, or benefit. Both parties must benefit in some form.

For instance, when one party sells their vehicle to another party, the seller receives money, and in exchange, the buyer receives the vehicle.

Written and Verbal

There are oral agreements that can be enforced, but some contracts are not valid unless they are in writing. Usually those that involve a large amount of consideration or debts, real property, or contracts that won’t be carried out for quite some time (e.g. a Last Will and Testament), need to be in written form.

In summary, a contract is valid if the agreement is consensual, legal, backed up with a promise of consideration, and it is executed by two adult parties who are in sound mind—both of which intend to hold up their end of the bargain.

What is the Difference Between “Void” and “Voidable” Contracts?

When a contract is void, it is not valid. It can never be enforced under state or federal laws. A void contract is null from the moment it was created and neither party is bound by the terms. Think of it as one that a court would never recognize or enforce because there are missing elements.

A contract can be void for the following reasons:
◾The terms of the agreement are illegal or against public policy (unlawful consideration or object)
◾A party was not of sound mind while signing the agreement
◾A party was under the age of consent
◾The terms are impossible
◾The contract restricts the rights of a party

Example: If an individual is hired by an employer and the terms of the employment agreement list illegal job responsibilities, this contract is void because it is against the law and does not adhere to valid contract elements.

Alternatively, a voidable contract is valid and may be enforceable in certain situations if both parties agree to move forward. One party is bound to the terms of the contract, whereas the other party can oppose the contract for legal reasons if they so choose. Therefore if the unbound party rejects the contract, it becomes voidable.

A contract can become voidable under the following circumstances:
◾A party was coerced or threatened into signing the agreement
◾A party was under undue influence (one party is able to dominate the will of another)
◾A party is not of sound mind or mentally competent (minor or mentally ill)
◾The terms of the contract were breached
◾Mutual mistakes on behalf of both parties
◾The contract is fraudulent (omitting or falsifying facts or information, or the intention to not carry out the promise in the contract)
◾Misrepresentation occurs (a false statement of fact)

Źźzzzzzzzzzzzzzxzz

Thanks qc

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Post by diedpretty » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:13 pm

There are so many ifs and buts in this whole mess. Why would Penrith sign Ivan from 2021 now that NC has re signed with them. They can now sit back and see how Ciraldo goes with a full off season and a playing season before they even need to consider who might coach them in 2020 let alone 2021. And if Ciraldo fails miserably why chase Ivan. There are far better coaches coming off contract over the next 2 years than Cleary - so why throw everything at him now that they have signed NC. Makes no sense to me.

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Post by jirskyr » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:15 pm

Wow the thread's gone up 7 pages in 24 hours, something must have happened.

Nope

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Post by GNR4LIFE » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:17 pm

diedpretty wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:13 pm
There are so many ifs and buts in this whole mess. Why would Penrith sign Ivan from 2021 now that NC has re signed with them. They can now sit back and see how Ciraldo goes with a full off season and a playing season before they even need to consider who might coach them in 2020 let alone 2021. And if Ciraldo fails miserably why chase Ivan. There are far better coaches coming off contract over the next 2 years than Cleary - so why throw everything at him now that they have signed NC. Makes no sense to me.
That’s what I said earlier. Now Nathan is wrapped up, doesn’t make sense to try and get Ivan for next year. Far too messy with his contract. If they want him that bad, better off waiting.

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Post by happy tiger » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:21 pm

formerguest wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 7:40 pm
happy tiger wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 7:12 pm
Tiger Steve wrote:
Thu 20 Sep, 2018 9:55 pm
THE POM wrote:
Thu 20 Sep, 2018 12:20 pm
Simply if Ivan does not agree to extend his current deal with the club he WILL NOT be the head coach for 2019. Everything should be finalized one way or the other prior to pre-season, but this is affecting recruitment big time & has already cost us one signing.
Thanks Pom.

This is exactly the reason I posted my strong post yesterday but people wanted to tell me I’m delusional. Ivan must extend or go. Far out! We need experienced players and it sounds like mr “on the bus” has cost us one, I’m so sick of mediocrity in all its forms. We finally look to be moving forward and this grub (Cleary) throws crud in our face.
Does he have a timeframe Pom by when he needs to extend his contract by (or jump back on the bus ) ??
From one technotard to another Hap, it might help in getting an answer if you quote POM rather than Steve.
FG as I said in my thread I just started I've now heard basically what the Pom has said from 3 reliable sources including his

Basically it comes down to us finding one of the two top prospects coachwise if Ivan says yeah ...naaahhh

If not he will coach for a season until we can get who we may want

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Post by willow » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:34 pm

Nucky Thompson wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:01 pm
bathursttiger wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:29 pm
goldcoast tiger wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:10 pm
How does those who say that he has to sign an extension (or not be the Coach )get around the legality bits , such as he CANNOT be forced to sign an extension , and especially under duress, which involve threats of removing him from coaching,

Where is the hard evidence of any wrongdoing.
If he wants to continue to Coach here next year There’s not much that the club can do, which is maybe the reason that they’ve been remarkably quite.

From Law Depot.


Contracts need to be executed properly in order to be legally binding. Below you can find information about the key elements that make up a valid agreement, when a contract is considered void or reasons it can become voidable, and the steps you can take to make sure your contract is carried out correctly.

The Basic Elements of a Valid Contract

A valid contract is enforceable under state and federal laws, and contains all the required elements.

Offer and Acceptance

The two basic elements of a valid contract are “offer” and “acceptance”.

One party makes an offer (outlines what is provided), and the other party accepts the terms of the offer (usually in writing). Acceptance can take time, whereby the negotiation process takes place until an agreement is reached.

Legal Object and Capacity of Parties

The subject matter of the agreement must be legal and both parties must:
◾Freely agree to the terms
◾Be over the age of consent
◾Be able to mentally carry out the agreement

Consideration

A valid contract must have the element of consideration (a price or value) exchanged in the agreement. Consideration is not limited to money, and can include a right, interest, or benefit. Both parties must benefit in some form.

For instance, when one party sells their vehicle to another party, the seller receives money, and in exchange, the buyer receives the vehicle.

Written and Verbal

There are oral agreements that can be enforced, but some contracts are not valid unless they are in writing. Usually those that involve a large amount of consideration or debts, real property, or contracts that won’t be carried out for quite some time (e.g. a Last Will and Testament), need to be in written form.

In summary, a contract is valid if the agreement is consensual, legal, backed up with a promise of consideration, and it is executed by two adult parties who are in sound mind—both of which intend to hold up their end of the bargain.

What is the Difference Between “Void” and “Voidable” Contracts?

When a contract is void, it is not valid. It can never be enforced under state or federal laws. A void contract is null from the moment it was created and neither party is bound by the terms. Think of it as one that a court would never recognize or enforce because there are missing elements.

A contract can be void for the following reasons:
◾The terms of the agreement are illegal or against public policy (unlawful consideration or object)
◾A party was not of sound mind while signing the agreement
◾A party was under the age of consent
◾The terms are impossible
◾The contract restricts the rights of a party

Example: If an individual is hired by an employer and the terms of the employment agreement list illegal job responsibilities, this contract is void because it is against the law and does not adhere to valid contract elements.

Alternatively, a voidable contract is valid and may be enforceable in certain situations if both parties agree to move forward. One party is bound to the terms of the contract, whereas the other party can oppose the contract for legal reasons if they so choose. Therefore if the unbound party rejects the contract, it becomes voidable.

A contract can become voidable under the following circumstances:
◾A party was coerced or threatened into signing the agreement
◾A party was under undue influence (one party is able to dominate the will of another)
◾A party is not of sound mind or mentally competent (minor or mentally ill)
◾The terms of the contract were breached
◾Mutual mistakes on behalf of both parties
◾The contract is fraudulent (omitting or falsifying facts or information, or the intention to not carry out the promise in the contract)
◾Misrepresentation occurs (a false statement of fact)

Źźzzzzzzzzzzzzzxzz

Thanks qc
It's posts like yours that will end this thread so if you're not going add something constructive - don't post.

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Post by mtd » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:46 pm

OMG breaking news. Anyone got more info on the latest scoop?

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Post by helmesy » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:46 pm

I just hope that whatever happens the good guys in all this, those who have acted with honour, come out on top. Sadly though that might not be the case.

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Post by WT2K » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:48 pm

happy tiger wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:21 pm
formerguest wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 7:40 pm
happy tiger wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 7:12 pm
Tiger Steve wrote:
Thu 20 Sep, 2018 9:55 pm


Thanks Pom.

This is exactly the reason I posted my strong post yesterday but people wanted to tell me I’m delusional. Ivan must extend or go. Far out! We need experienced players and it sounds like mr “on the bus” has cost us one, I’m so sick of mediocrity in all its forms. We finally look to be moving forward and this grub (Cleary) throws crud in our face.
Does he have a timeframe Pom by when he needs to extend his contract by (or jump back on the bus ) ??
From one technotard to another Hap, it might help in getting an answer if you quote POM rather than Steve.
FG as I said in my thread I just started I've now heard basically what the Pom has said from 3 reliable sources including his

Basically it comes down to us finding one of the two top prospects coachwise if Ivan says yeah ...naaahhh

If not he will coach for a season until we can get who we may want
Obviously no info but basically what I think is playing out behind closed doors, happy.
Time will reveal all as they say but it has made for an interesting off-season in tiger land.
No more plodders!
:sign:

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Post by happy tiger » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:52 pm

willow wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:34 pm
Nucky Thompson wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 9:01 pm
bathursttiger wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:29 pm
goldcoast tiger wrote:
Mon 24 Sep, 2018 8:10 pm
How does those who say that he has to sign an extension (or not be the Coach )get around the legality bits , such as he CANNOT be forced to sign an extension , and especially under duress, which involve threats of removing him from coaching,

Where is the hard evidence of any wrongdoing.
If he wants to continue to Coach here next year There’s not much that the club can do, which is maybe the reason that they’ve been remarkably quite.

From Law Depot.


Contracts need to be executed properly in order to be legally binding. Below you can find information about the key elements that make up a valid agreement, when a contract is considered void or reasons it can become voidable, and the steps you can take to make sure your contract is carried out correctly.

The Basic Elements of a Valid Contract

A valid contract is enforceable under state and federal laws, and contains all the required elements.

Offer and Acceptance

The two basic elements of a valid contract are “offer” and “acceptance”.

One party makes an offer (outlines what is provided), and the other party accepts the terms of the offer (usually in writing). Acceptance can take time, whereby the negotiation process takes place until an agreement is reached.

Legal Object and Capacity of Parties

The subject matter of the agreement must be legal and both parties must:
◾Freely agree to the terms
◾Be over the age of consent
◾Be able to mentally carry out the agreement

Consideration

A valid contract must have the element of consideration (a price or value) exchanged in the agreement. Consideration is not limited to money, and can include a right, interest, or benefit. Both parties must benefit in some form.

For instance, when one party sells their vehicle to another party, the seller receives money, and in exchange, the buyer receives the vehicle.

Written and Verbal

There are oral agreements that can be enforced, but some contracts are not valid unless they are in writing. Usually those that involve a large amount of consideration or debts, real property, or contracts that won’t be carried out for quite some time (e.g. a Last Will and Testament), need to be in written form.

In summary, a contract is valid if the agreement is consensual, legal, backed up with a promise of consideration, and it is executed by two adult parties who are in sound mind—both of which intend to hold up their end of the bargain.

What is the Difference Between “Void” and “Voidable” Contracts?

When a contract is void, it is not valid. It can never be enforced under state or federal laws. A void contract is null from the moment it was created and neither party is bound by the terms. Think of it as one that a court would never recognize or enforce because there are missing elements.

A contract can be void for the following reasons:
◾The terms of the agreement are illegal or against public policy (unlawful consideration or object)
◾A party was not of sound mind while signing the agreement
◾A party was under the age of consent
◾The terms are impossible
◾The contract restricts the rights of a party

Example: If an individual is hired by an employer and the terms of the employment agreement list illegal job responsibilities, this contract is void because it is against the law and does not adhere to valid contract elements.

Alternatively, a voidable contract is valid and may be enforceable in certain situations if both parties agree to move forward. One party is bound to the terms of the contract, whereas the other party can oppose the contract for legal reasons if they so choose. Therefore if the unbound party rejects the contract, it becomes voidable.

A contract can become voidable under the following circumstances:
◾A party was coerced or threatened into signing the agreement
◾A party was under undue influence (one party is able to dominate the will of another)
◾A party is not of sound mind or mentally competent (minor or mentally ill)
◾The terms of the contract were breached
◾Mutual mistakes on behalf of both parties
◾The contract is fraudulent (omitting or falsifying facts or information, or the intention to not carry out the promise in the contract)
◾Misrepresentation occurs (a false statement of fact)

Źźzzzzzzzzzzzzzxzz

Thanks qc
It's posts like yours that will end this thread so if you're not going add something constructive - don't post.
Can I say this , and I mentioned it far earlier in this discussion we could end all this by making any player /coach wanting to break a contract having 6 or 12 month NRL ban as you would be aiding a direct competitor in your direct market place and from the clubs point of view all contracts MUST be paid out in full for any player who hasn't fallen foul of breaching your club's 3 strike policies or instant termination

Why is it the NRL just complicate the crap out of everything

I know the answer don't worry ......to fearful of reigniting Super League talks/actions :brick: :brick: :brick:

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Post by TigerTiger » Mon 24 Sep, 2018 10:05 pm

Frankly I'm worried that potential players would question Ivan's motives in coaching at the Tigers.
The man's own son wants to play elsewhere.
Ivan has publicly said that he wants to coach his son, and that son just signed for five years elsewhere.
So for Ivan to do what he wants to do, it will have to involve him leaving the club.

Sounds untenable to me.
I don't see a way out of this anymore, did we just get screwed over by Ivan and his son getting Nathan the best contract they could at the expense of everyone else?

I would so love to be wrong, to have made mountains out of molehills. Fingers crossed we get another big signing or two.
A one eyed supporter, mostly :crazy, always :sign:

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