Ivan Cleary - THREAD..

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Re: Ivan Cleary - THREAD..

Post by TIGERPOWER » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:14 pm

NT Tiger wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:09 pm
I haven't personalised anything. If the shoe fits?

"has, cost us good players" Exaggeration? My understanding is, that the 'Ivan Cleary issue', may have cost us one good player.
.......and so? Oh yes, of course, we'll recruit leftovers!
Now where's them shoes?

Personally, I think the 'fan' buy-in to all the media speculation drives the continued attention and assists in any perceived devaluation of the WT brand.

Justin Pascoe has said; Nothing has changed.
Pascoe also said that his relationship with Ivan Cleary is compromised due to the fact he met with a competitor while employed by us. Or is that a media beat up to.


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Post by GNR4LIFE » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:14 pm

Swordy wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:13 pm
I trust Pascoe and the board to get the best out of this for the club, whatever that may be.

You can hardly blame WT management for some fat headed bee sting head and what he does. It's not their fault.

Trust the management, these aren't the idiots from a few years ago, this a professional board on the improve.
Agree. It seems forgotten that we hold the cards because we have Cleary contracted for 2 more years.

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Post by Swordy » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:15 pm

...And as for the whole coaching issue costing us a good quality signing?...... put up or shut up.

Some numpty claiming it to be true is BS to me. Names and facts or it didn't happen!!!!!!
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Post by GNR4LIFE » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:18 pm

I’ll believe it when it comes from Smoking Gun!

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Post by happy tiger » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:22 pm

Swordy wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:15 pm
...And as for the whole coaching issue costing us a good quality signing?...... put up or shut up.

Some numpty claiming it to be true is BS to me. Names and facts or it didn't happen!!!!!!
Sources tend to clam up if you start spilling their names all over the Forum /planet


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Post by innsaneink » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:40 pm

NT Tiger wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:09 pm
I haven't personalised anything. If the shoe fits?

"has, cost us good players" Exaggeration? My understanding is, that the 'Ivan Cleary issue', may have cost us one good player.
.......and so? Oh yes, of course, we'll recruit leftovers!
Now where's them shoes?

Personally, I think the 'fan' buy-in to all the media speculation drives the continued attention and assists in any perceived devaluation of the WT brand.

Justin Pascoe has said; Nothing has changed.
Aint that the truth... People buying into media speculation... Repeating it ad nauseam, twisting it... Creating lies and bending the truth.... This has been going on here by some and it's very negative and hardly doing anyone any good.
Fox in particular know this.... They keep the pot boiling targeting the speculation loving fan, it attracts clicks and ratings =$$$... Funny the spec loving fan doesn't even know he's being manipulated...

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Post by NT Tiger » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:42 pm

The Patriot wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 6:51 pm
Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 6:41 pm
TigerTiger wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 1:47 pm
The Patriot wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 1:30 pm



Do you think our brand is in as strong a position as it was before this story of Ivan to Panthers broke?

Most good judges had Nathan playing for his dad at the Tigers and this club on a sharp upward spiral.

Now we have uncertainty over the coach and Nathan sticking solid with Penrith. Its not a great outcome and people are going to express that on a public forum.
Add to that rumours put forward by reputable sources (the QUEEN) that this Penrith saga has cost us at least one potential recruit already, and that the WT club are dealing with it quite seriously in that if Ivan is making other long term plans than we are looking at other short term plans.

I'll feel a lot better about all this, when the following few things happen:

1) We re-sign Brooks, (I question the delay?)
2) We sign at least 1 more (preferably 2 or 3) very solid decent first graders
3) Ivan makes clear that he is not going to Penrith in 2021, that he is committed to WT long term. How this exactly happens, I don't precisely know, but it needs to be sorted somehow. Simply saying I don't respond to rumours is not good enough, as the rumours have certainly damaged his integrity (as an unsubstantiated untrue rumour can damage the integrity of a school teacher)
4) Ivan needs to stop NOW saying or implying any innuendo about him coaching his son. Now it implies that he wants to leave, so he cannot make that innuendo anymore. Focus on WT first thank you.
100% agree to all your points.

And Ivan is not just damaging his own integrity- he is damaging our brand, and we certainly don’t need that.

I wonder how everyone would feel if we finish 9th again next year and discover we missed signing 1 or 2 good players because of all this speculation

I dont know about everyone but i know a fair few of the people trying to shut down any criticism of Cleary would be well and truly happy to finish 9th again. Its an achievement to some
Great scoop. Ok who are they??
"Quality Stupidity"

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Post by NT Tiger » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:45 pm

TIGERPOWER wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:14 pm
NT Tiger wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:09 pm
I haven't personalised anything. If the shoe fits?

"has, cost us good players" Exaggeration? My understanding is, that the 'Ivan Cleary issue', may have cost us one good player.
.......and so? Oh yes, of course, we'll recruit leftovers!
Now where's them shoes?

Personally, I think the 'fan' buy-in to all the media speculation drives the continued attention and assists in any perceived devaluation of the WT brand.

Justin Pascoe has said; Nothing has changed.
Pascoe also said that his relationship with Ivan Cleary is compromised due to the fact he met with a competitor while employed by us. Or is that a media beat up to.
Not a media beat up, just old news.
Next!
"Quality Stupidity"

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Post by Furious1 » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:48 pm

happy tiger wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:22 pm
Swordy wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:15 pm
...And as for the whole coaching issue costing us a good quality signing?...... put up or shut up.

Some numpty claiming it to be true is BS to me. Names and facts or it didn't happen!!!!!!
Sources tend to clam up if you start spilling their names all over the Forum /planet
Exactly.

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Post by The Patriot » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:50 pm

NT Tiger wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:42 pm
The Patriot wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 6:51 pm
Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 6:41 pm
TigerTiger wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 1:47 pm


Add to that rumours put forward by reputable sources (the QUEEN) that this Penrith saga has cost us at least one potential recruit already, and that the WT club are dealing with it quite seriously in that if Ivan is making other long term plans than we are looking at other short term plans.

I'll feel a lot better about all this, when the following few things happen:

1) We re-sign Brooks, (I question the delay?)
2) We sign at least 1 more (preferably 2 or 3) very solid decent first graders
3) Ivan makes clear that he is not going to Penrith in 2021, that he is committed to WT long term. How this exactly happens, I don't precisely know, but it needs to be sorted somehow. Simply saying I don't respond to rumours is not good enough, as the rumours have certainly damaged his integrity (as an unsubstantiated untrue rumour can damage the integrity of a school teacher)
4) Ivan needs to stop NOW saying or implying any innuendo about him coaching his son. Now it implies that he wants to leave, so he cannot make that innuendo anymore. Focus on WT first thank you.
100% agree to all your points.

And Ivan is not just damaging his own integrity- he is damaging our brand, and we certainly don’t need that.

I wonder how everyone would feel if we finish 9th again next year and discover we missed signing 1 or 2 good players because of all this speculation

I dont know about everyone but i know a fair few of the people trying to shut down any criticism of Cleary would be well and truly happy to finish 9th again. Its an achievement to some
Great scoop. Ok who are they??
Mate youve already had Tiger Steve rightly accuse you of trying to personalise this debate. You and others have quoted and commented negatively to most people who are trying to point out the issues here.

Now you are upset someone had a little dig back.

Calm the farm.
Its an opinion!

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Post by Tiger Steve » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 8:17 pm

GNR4LIFE wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:11 pm
Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 6:55 pm
NT Tiger wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 6:50 pm
Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 6:41 pm

100% agree to all your points.

And Ivan is not just damaging his own integrity- he is damaging our brand, and we certainly don’t need that.

I wonder how everyone would feel if we finish 9th again next year and discover we missed signing 1 or 2 good players because of all this speculation
Of course an alternative, and far more positive, perspective is that the perceived damage to Ivan's integrity will give Ivan a lot of incentive to prove the doubters wrong.
Oh never mind. Give up now. 2019 is a write off. Oh woe is me.
Why do you have to personalise the debate? I’m not saying we’re giving up. I’m saying this upheaval (yes another one) could be and possibly has, cost us good players. But hey, the usual leftovers will still be there for us to recruit!
Yeah, like 2 players playing in a grand final this weekend. Leftovers lol.
Not sure where you are heading here. Yes we had some good players but we couldn’t keep them and they left. We also didn’t play finals football again. Why? Because we can’t retain or recruit top class players. And this current circus is certainly not helping.
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Post by GNR4LIFE » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 8:27 pm

Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 8:17 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:11 pm
Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 6:55 pm
NT Tiger wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 6:50 pm


Of course an alternative, and far more positive, perspective is that the perceived damage to Ivan's integrity will give Ivan a lot of incentive to prove the doubters wrong.
Oh never mind. Give up now. 2019 is a write off. Oh woe is me.
Why do you have to personalise the debate? I’m not saying we’re giving up. I’m saying this upheaval (yes another one) could be and possibly has, cost us good players. But hey, the usual leftovers will still be there for us to recruit!
Yeah, like 2 players playing in a grand final this weekend. Leftovers lol.
Not sure where you are heading here. Yes we had some good players but we couldn’t keep them and they left. We also didn’t play finals football again. Why? Because we can’t retain or recruit top class players. And this current circus is certainly not helping.
We didn’t play finals with those good players, so what’s been lost?

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Post by happy tiger » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 8:35 pm

Swordy wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 8:07 pm
happy tiger wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:22 pm
Swordy wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:15 pm
...And as for the whole coaching issue costing us a good quality signing?...... put up or shut up.

Some numpty claiming it to be true is BS to me. Names and facts or it didn't happen!!!!!!
Sources tend to clam up if you start spilling their names all over the Forum /planet
Convenient. So whats the difference between someone knowing facts and someone making up BS? Whats the point of saying anything at all?
You trust who you know who seems to be on the mark more often than not

I was told by someone on the Forum in a PM 6 weeks before Ballin signed he was coming and I made fun of him for weeks

As I said I have been told exactly what the Pom said about Ivan Cleary 3 times now including Pom's comments

I'd be backing that Swordy , if you believe that or not is up to you

But yeah when you start posting stuff you cop it , a certain Forum member wanted me banned for saying that Grant Mayer told a WT's official he couldn't see the hype in Tedesco when it got back to the Tedesco family

Or when I posted the figures given to me about the contract offered to Tedesco when he signed with the Raiders

Again it is up to the Forum whether they believe it or not , won't change my world either way

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Post by happy tiger » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 8:38 pm

innsaneink wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:40 pm
NT Tiger wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:09 pm
I haven't personalised anything. If the shoe fits?

"has, cost us good players" Exaggeration? My understanding is, that the 'Ivan Cleary issue', may have cost us one good player.
.......and so? Oh yes, of course, we'll recruit leftovers!
Now where's them shoes?

Personally, I think the 'fan' buy-in to all the media speculation drives the continued attention and assists in any perceived devaluation of the WT brand.

Justin Pascoe has said; Nothing has changed.
Aint that the truth... People buying into media speculation... Repeating it ad nauseam, twisting it... Creating lies and bending the truth.... This has been going on here by some and it's very negative and hardly doing anyone any good.
Fox in particular know this.... They keep the pot boiling targeting the speculation loving fan, it attracts clicks and ratings =$$$... Funny the spec loving fan doesn't even know he's being manipulated...
That came from the Pom

Can't remember him being off the mark , but SG predictions ....... never mind

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Post by Needaname » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 8:46 pm

GNR4LIFE wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 8:27 pm
Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 8:17 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:11 pm
Tiger Steve wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 6:55 pm

Why do you have to personalise the debate? I’m not saying we’re giving up. I’m saying this upheaval (yes another one) could be and possibly has, cost us good players. But hey, the usual leftovers will still be there for us to recruit!
Yeah, like 2 players playing in a grand final this weekend. Leftovers lol.
Not sure where you are heading here. Yes we had some good players but we couldn’t keep them and they left. We also didn’t play finals football again. Why? Because we can’t retain or recruit top class players. And this current circus is certainly not helping.
We didn’t play finals with those good players, so what’s been lost?
Were you not Indicating the two players that we just recruited are playing in a grand final?

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Post by Geo. » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 9:01 pm

Swordy wrote:
Tue 25 Sep, 2018 7:15 pm
...And as for the whole coaching issue costing us a good quality signing?...... put up or shut up.

Some numpty claiming it to be true is BS to me. Names and facts or it didn't happen!!!!!!
Curtis Rona on the 1st of the 4th 2016 2017 20!8 and again in 2019..
Wests Tigers don't need a Coach.. The playing group has taken over..

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Post by innsaneink » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 9:25 pm

Luke Lewis was asked on 360 tonight if hed have a problem if he were a WTs player and Ivan was off to Penrith.
He said it wouldnt concern him one bit..hed give 100%!
So those suggesting this could be some obstacle to recruitment Id say are barking up the wrong tree.

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Post by GNR4LIFE » Tue 25 Sep, 2018 9:31 pm

It’s a poor argument to say players won’t come because he might be gone in 2021. Indeed he might be. Maybe because we choose not to re-sign because results don’t warrant it. Most clubs will struggle with recruitment if players are thinking who the coach might be years down the line. The Broncos announced today Bennett would finish up at the end of 2019. Don’t see anyone suggesting they will struggle to recruit.

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