For all the people moaning about signings

gallagher
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Re: For all the people moaning about signings

Post by gallagher » Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:33 pm

2041 wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:29 pm
gallagher wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:19 pm
TigerSJ wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:13 pm
gallagher wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 7:44 pm


Benji is done, he's not even a good back up, its a waste of top 30 spot, develop a junior instead.
We got too many blokes that should be back-ups but will end up as regulars. Huff and puff all you like but our roster and recruitment is not good enough.
I'm with NT and 2041 - Benji was a choice that suits the club for a lot of reasons the least of which is that he was re-signed to be a starting half. I agree and also thought he looked shot over the last few months but we really had little choice other than to play him carrying injuries. As for Farah, he also is there for a reason and I'd expect he will get more game time than Benji.
I actually think that both of them being in the squad will provide something to the rest of the players whilst we go through the upheavel and transition of coaches.
The re-signing of both of them for one more year is certainly not going to be the downfall of the club in 2019 like some seem to be making out!
I dont think it will be our downfall but i dont think its moving us forward or imroving the roster. Wehave Gamble in the top 30, we dont need him and Marshall. Lino from the Warriors would have been a consideration if we need 4 halves in the top 30.Mybe can switch to the halves if injures hitaswell. Thompson looks a better fullback than winger to me anyway.

Farah? I can just see that blowing up when Liddle starts getting more match time.Seggy and Luke were both off contract and both better players this year.

Its just side way moving, not going forward.
Again, though, you're complaining about who the Tigers selected to be their backup hooker and backup half. It's a sideshow. There's not a team in the comp that wouldn't be massively damaged if their first-choice 9 or either of their first-choice halves went down for an extended period.

The problems the Tigers have in the spine are (1) the guy they gave a lot of money to be their starting 5/8 can't get fit, and (2) the guy they've decided is the future in the number 9 jersey also can't get fit. As it happens, I think they got way more out of both Marshall and Farah this year than they had any right to expect. But that's not really the issue - the issue is that half the spine missed 90% of the season.

Tell me how the Storm would have gone without Smith and Munster, or Souths without Cook and Reynolds. The Roosters might have been able to cope but only because Friend is probably the weakest player on their roster, but would they have won the comp if he and Keary had barely got on the park?
So all those teams made the top 4 without an experienced back up halfback/hooker. I dont see how that is proving your point .


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Post by happy tiger » Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:38 pm

The problem is/was our starting point team wise

We have issues at 6 , possible issues in the centres , still a quality backrower and front rower short

Depth is a massive issue across the board , I like us to enquire about using our first option on Drinkwater for 2019/2020

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Post by The Patriot » Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:56 pm

Geo. wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:10 pm
innsaneink wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 5:17 pm
I thought we had completed our squad... So we have two spots left?
It's very complicated these days
It use to be your NRL squad had to be lodged with the NRL by Feb 1 of that season but with the new CBA it changed to allow clubs a bit more flexibilty around finalising squads...

Now ...Under NRL guidelines, clubs are required to confirm a top 24 roster for 2019 with the NRL as of November 1, 2018 — the start of the financial rugby league calendar — with 29 players to be signed on when the regular season commences on the first week of March, 2019.

So basically we have until March to fill spot 29 and June 30 2019 to finalise the Top 30..of course tho that is still fluid and players can be released and or picked up mid season by June 30 of that year...

The big difference is if your not in the NRL top 30 you can't play NRL without an exemption...so the likes of Luke Garner couldn't play NRL earlier this year until he was promoted to the NRL squad..

In the NFL its a system of a 53 man roster and a Practice Squad.

Rather than the exemption you have to remove a player from the main squad by releasing him to promote someone from the practice squad.

Same could work for NRL and State Cup i think. Depending on how the Roosters and the like would use it as a way around the salary cap.

Basic principle though would be to reduce the squad to say 28 then force a club to pay out a contract of a guy they would want to remove to allow the young up and comer to play.

Just a thought.
Its an opinion!

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Post by 2041 » Thu 11 Oct, 2018 10:43 pm

gallagher wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:33 pm
2041 wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:29 pm
gallagher wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:19 pm
TigerSJ wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:13 pm


I'm with NT and 2041 - Benji was a choice that suits the club for a lot of reasons the least of which is that he was re-signed to be a starting half. I agree and also thought he looked shot over the last few months but we really had little choice other than to play him carrying injuries. As for Farah, he also is there for a reason and I'd expect he will get more game time than Benji.
I actually think that both of them being in the squad will provide something to the rest of the players whilst we go through the upheavel and transition of coaches.
The re-signing of both of them for one more year is certainly not going to be the downfall of the club in 2019 like some seem to be making out!
I dont think it will be our downfall but i dont think its moving us forward or imroving the roster. Wehave Gamble in the top 30, we dont need him and Marshall. Lino from the Warriors would have been a consideration if we need 4 halves in the top 30.Mybe can switch to the halves if injures hitaswell. Thompson looks a better fullback than winger to me anyway.

Farah? I can just see that blowing up when Liddle starts getting more match time.Seggy and Luke were both off contract and both better players this year.

Its just side way moving, not going forward.
Again, though, you're complaining about who the Tigers selected to be their backup hooker and backup half. It's a sideshow. There's not a team in the comp that wouldn't be massively damaged if their first-choice 9 or either of their first-choice halves went down for an extended period.

The problems the Tigers have in the spine are (1) the guy they gave a lot of money to be their starting 5/8 can't get fit, and (2) the guy they've decided is the future in the number 9 jersey also can't get fit. As it happens, I think they got way more out of both Marshall and Farah this year than they had any right to expect. But that's not really the issue - the issue is that half the spine missed 90% of the season.

Tell me how the Storm would have gone without Smith and Munster, or Souths without Cook and Reynolds. The Roosters might have been able to cope but only because Friend is probably the weakest player on their roster, but would they have won the comp if he and Keary had barely got on the park?
So all those teams made the top 4 without an experienced back up halfback/hooker. I dont see how that is proving your point .
Everybody has backups. If you need your spine backups to do much more than get you through origin/minor injuries, you have big problems. That's why they're not that important.

Be honest. If the Tigers had signed two anonymous fringe first graders as backup spine players - Brandon Smith and Ryley Jacks, shall we say - you wouldn't give a toss. It's only because you've convinced yourself that someone's trying to sell you Marshall and Farah as marquee signings (which no-one us in fact doing) that you remotely care.

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Post by gallagher » Thu 11 Oct, 2018 10:51 pm

2041 wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 10:43 pm
gallagher wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:33 pm
2041 wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:29 pm
gallagher wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:19 pm


I dont think it will be our downfall but i dont think its moving us forward or imroving the roster. Wehave Gamble in the top 30, we dont need him and Marshall. Lino from the Warriors would have been a consideration if we need 4 halves in the top 30.Mybe can switch to the halves if injures hitaswell. Thompson looks a better fullback than winger to me anyway.

Farah? I can just see that blowing up when Liddle starts getting more match time.Seggy and Luke were both off contract and both better players this year.

Its just side way moving, not going forward.
Again, though, you're complaining about who the Tigers selected to be their backup hooker and backup half. It's a sideshow. There's not a team in the comp that wouldn't be massively damaged if their first-choice 9 or either of their first-choice halves went down for an extended period.

The problems the Tigers have in the spine are (1) the guy they gave a lot of money to be their starting 5/8 can't get fit, and (2) the guy they've decided is the future in the number 9 jersey also can't get fit. As it happens, I think they got way more out of both Marshall and Farah this year than they had any right to expect. But that's not really the issue - the issue is that half the spine missed 90% of the season.

Tell me how the Storm would have gone without Smith and Munster, or Souths without Cook and Reynolds. The Roosters might have been able to cope but only because Friend is probably the weakest player on their roster, but would they have won the comp if he and Keary had barely got on the park?
So all those teams made the top 4 without an experienced back up halfback/hooker. I dont see how that is proving your point .
Everybody has backups. If you need your spine backups to do much more than get you through origin/minor injuries, you have big problems. That's why they're not that important.

Be honest. If the Tigers had signed two anonymous fringe first graders as backup spine players - Brandon Smith and Ryley Jacks, shall we say - you wouldn't give a toss. It's only because you've convinced yourself that someone's trying to sell you Marshall and Farah as marquee signings (which no-one us in fact doing) that you remotely care.
No. I want real first graders. Origin class players. Not Farah, Marshall, Jacks or any other back up you want to name. We're over flowing with back ups!!!!
And i'm sure your gonna tell me none are available, well we let two walk out last year.

We're not gonna agree here, I believe it's a very poor roster, the cap was the excuse for years but we're no better.


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Post by happy tiger » Thu 11 Oct, 2018 10:54 pm

No back ups in the Top 4 sides in the halves hooker

Storm had Brandon Smith , best hooker coming through , better than Liddle

Roosters had Radley if needed , again top young player

Rabbits had Farah until he came to us

Sharks had Segeyaro

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Post by Balmainian » Thu 11 Oct, 2018 11:45 pm

Good sign to see the club showing patcience for a change.
It’s always bang bang bang let’s get him, let’s boot him or we’re missing out.
But Mbye would almost have to be the best mid season arrival of the year.
Matterson has 60 odd games from a club who couldn’t keep him and Momi is a bit of a dark horse. I hope he goes well.
But I’d rather sign no one than Aquire another problem.
A really good player can pop up at anytime through the year, it happens!!!
What’s the worse that happens we miss out on guys like Javid Bowen or segeyaro. That’s not that bad in my opinion.

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Post by 2041 » Fri 12 Oct, 2018 12:26 am

gallagher wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 10:51 pm
2041 wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 10:43 pm
gallagher wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:33 pm
2041 wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:29 pm


Again, though, you're complaining about who the Tigers selected to be their backup hooker and backup half. It's a sideshow. There's not a team in the comp that wouldn't be massively damaged if their first-choice 9 or either of their first-choice halves went down for an extended period.

The problems the Tigers have in the spine are (1) the guy they gave a lot of money to be their starting 5/8 can't get fit, and (2) the guy they've decided is the future in the number 9 jersey also can't get fit. As it happens, I think they got way more out of both Marshall and Farah this year than they had any right to expect. But that's not really the issue - the issue is that half the spine missed 90% of the season.

Tell me how the Storm would have gone without Smith and Munster, or Souths without Cook and Reynolds. The Roosters might have been able to cope but only because Friend is probably the weakest player on their roster, but would they have won the comp if he and Keary had barely got on the park?
So all those teams made the top 4 without an experienced back up halfback/hooker. I dont see how that is proving your point .
Everybody has backups. If you need your spine backups to do much more than get you through origin/minor injuries, you have big problems. That's why they're not that important.

Be honest. If the Tigers had signed two anonymous fringe first graders as backup spine players - Brandon Smith and Ryley Jacks, shall we say - you wouldn't give a toss. It's only because you've convinced yourself that someone's trying to sell you Marshall and Farah as marquee signings (which no-one us in fact doing) that you remotely care.
No. I want real first graders. Origin class players. Not Farah, Marshall, Jacks or any other back up you want to name. We're over flowing with back ups!!!!
And i'm sure your gonna tell me none are available, well we let two walk out last year.

We're not gonna agree here, I believe it's a very poor roster, the cap was the excuse for years but we're no better.
Name another club with more than two origin class halves or more than one origin class hooker. You can't. They all have backups.

The Tigers' starters are Liddle, Brooks and Reynolds. You're asking them to sign origin class hookers and halves as well as these three. It's insane. No-one does this.

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Post by jadtiger » Fri 12 Oct, 2018 12:30 am

2041 wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 12:26 am
gallagher wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 10:51 pm
2041 wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 10:43 pm
gallagher wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:33 pm


So all those teams made the top 4 without an experienced back up halfback/hooker. I dont see how that is proving your point .
Everybody has backups. If you need your spine backups to do much more than get you through origin/minor injuries, you have big problems. That's why they're not that important.

Be honest. If the Tigers had signed two anonymous fringe first graders as backup spine players - Brandon Smith and Ryley Jacks, shall we say - you wouldn't give a toss. It's only because you've convinced yourself that someone's trying to sell you Marshall and Farah as marquee signings (which no-one us in fact doing) that you remotely care.
No. I want real first graders. Origin class players. Not Farah, Marshall, Jacks or any other back up you want to name. We're over flowing with back ups!!!!
And i'm sure your gonna tell me none are available, well we let two walk out last year.

We're not gonna agree here, I believe it's a very poor roster, the cap was the excuse for years but we're no better.
Name another club with more than two origin class halves or more than one origin class hooker. You can't. They all have backups.

The Tigers' starters are Liddle, Brooks and Reynolds. You're asking them to sign origin class hookers and halves as well as these three. It's insane. No-one does this.
Correct

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Post by gallagher » Fri 12 Oct, 2018 12:42 am

2041 wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 12:26 am
gallagher wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 10:51 pm
2041 wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 10:43 pm
gallagher wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 8:33 pm


So all those teams made the top 4 without an experienced back up halfback/hooker. I dont see how that is proving your point .
Everybody has backups. If you need your spine backups to do much more than get you through origin/minor injuries, you have big problems. That's why they're not that important.

Be honest. If the Tigers had signed two anonymous fringe first graders as backup spine players - Brandon Smith and Ryley Jacks, shall we say - you wouldn't give a toss. It's only because you've convinced yourself that someone's trying to sell you Marshall and Farah as marquee signings (which no-one us in fact doing) that you remotely care.
No. I want real first graders. Origin class players. Not Farah, Marshall, Jacks or any other back up you want to name. We're over flowing with back ups!!!!
And i'm sure your gonna tell me none are available, well we let two walk out last year.

We're not gonna agree here, I believe it's a very poor roster, the cap was the excuse for years but we're no better.
Name another club with more than two origin class halves or more than one origin class hooker. You can't. They all have backups.

The Tigers' starters are Liddle, Brooks and Reynolds. You're asking them to sign origin class hookers and halves as well as these three. It's insane. No-one does this.
Im not asking for origin class backups. You're putting words into my mouth.
Cya

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Post by 2041 » Fri 12 Oct, 2018 11:32 am

gallagher wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 12:42 am
2041 wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 12:26 am
gallagher wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 10:51 pm
2041 wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 10:43 pm


Everybody has backups. If you need your spine backups to do much more than get you through origin/minor injuries, you have big problems. That's why they're not that important.

Be honest. If the Tigers had signed two anonymous fringe first graders as backup spine players - Brandon Smith and Ryley Jacks, shall we say - you wouldn't give a toss. It's only because you've convinced yourself that someone's trying to sell you Marshall and Farah as marquee signings (which no-one us in fact doing) that you remotely care.
No. I want real first graders. Origin class players. Not Farah, Marshall, Jacks or any other back up you want to name. We're over flowing with back ups!!!!
And i'm sure your gonna tell me none are available, well we let two walk out last year.

We're not gonna agree here, I believe it's a very poor roster, the cap was the excuse for years but we're no better.
Name another club with more than two origin class halves or more than one origin class hooker. You can't. They all have backups.

The Tigers' starters are Liddle, Brooks and Reynolds. You're asking them to sign origin class hookers and halves as well as these three. It's insane. No-one does this.
Im not asking for origin class backups. You're putting words into my mouth.
Cya
I mean, it's literally what you said but you keep at it, champ.

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Post by Spartan117 » Fri 12 Oct, 2018 1:22 pm

Agree Good OP


there aint many in that list that I feel that we really missed out on...

Note that we will have a few more spots to fill for 2020- Self control and keep building.

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Post by Seantice » Fri 12 Oct, 2018 2:11 pm

Spartan117 wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 1:22 pm
Agree Good OP


there aint many in that list that I feel that we really missed out on...

Note that we will have a few more spots to fill for 2020- Self control and keep building.
2019 will be the year where a high amount if quality players cone off contract. Wait til then hopefully with a new coach.

I hope Marshall doesn't play much next year. My god he went off the Boyle. Game management ceased to exist after round 6

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Post by gallagher » Fri 12 Oct, 2018 2:56 pm

2041 wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 11:32 am
gallagher wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 12:42 am
2041 wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 12:26 am
gallagher wrote:
Thu 11 Oct, 2018 10:51 pm

No. I want real first graders. Origin class players. Not Farah, Marshall, Jacks or any other back up you want to name. We're over flowing with back ups!!!!
And i'm sure your gonna tell me none are available, well we let two walk out last year.

We're not gonna agree here, I believe it's a very poor roster, the cap was the excuse for years but we're no better.
Name another club with more than two origin class halves or more than one origin class hooker. You can't. They all have backups.

The Tigers' starters are Liddle, Brooks and Reynolds. You're asking them to sign origin class hookers and halves as well as these three. It's insane. No-one does this.
Im not asking for origin class backups. You're putting words into my mouth.
Cya
I mean, it's literally what you said but you keep at it, champ.
Yeah. I said i want origin class players, not back up players. Never said I want origin class back up halves ir hookers.
But your not after a discussion, just an argument.

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Post by 2041 » Fri 12 Oct, 2018 4:14 pm

gallagher wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 2:56 pm
2041 wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 11:32 am
gallagher wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 12:42 am
2041 wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 12:26 am


Name another club with more than two origin class halves or more than one origin class hooker. You can't. They all have backups.

The Tigers' starters are Liddle, Brooks and Reynolds. You're asking them to sign origin class hookers and halves as well as these three. It's insane. No-one does this.
Im not asking for origin class backups. You're putting words into my mouth.
Cya
I mean, it's literally what you said but you keep at it, champ.
Yeah. I said i want origin class players, not back up players. Never said I want origin class back up halves ir hookers.
But your not after a discussion, just an argument.
I'm really not, I'm just trying to explain why what you're saying doesn't make any sense.

You want origin class players. Of course you do. So do I.

You don't want backups. Well, maybe. This is where you stop making sense. Every team has backups. No team in the comp has origin class players ready to come in and play when the starters get injured unless they happen to have a kid coming through who just happens to be ready to step up at an opportune moment.

You can make two legitimate arguments about the Tigers spine recruitment:
1) Marshall and Farah aren't even good enough to be the backup players. That's a legit view, but you've then got to compare them to what else might be available, at a price that makes sense, to play reserve grade or wait for an injury. So: McIlwrick, Tyrone Roberts, Littlejohn etc etc And really, the difference between any of those is next to nothing. Sub in your favourite, see how much better we get.
2) Any or all of Liddle, Brooks or Reynolds shouldn't be first choice and we should be looking to spend big on a new, "origin class" spine player. This would be a totally different argument and it's nothing to do with Farah or Marshall, because neither of those have been signed to take starting slots.

Personally, I wish we hadn't signed Reynolds and I'd be astonished if he's ever properly fit again. But we can't have a do over on that and go out and spend another $750,000 on a five-eighth (not to mention there hasn't been a good one available). The club has to hope he's fit because they can't spend the money again, and either way the next half in line has to be cheap.

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Post by gallagher » Fri 12 Oct, 2018 5:03 pm

2041 wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 4:14 pm
gallagher wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 2:56 pm
2041 wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 11:32 am
gallagher wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 12:42 am

Im not asking for origin class backups. You're putting words into my mouth.
Cya
I mean, it's literally what you said but you keep at it, champ.
Yeah. I said i want origin class players, not back up players. Never said I want origin class back up halves ir hookers.
But your not after a discussion, just an argument.
I'm really not, I'm just trying to explain why what you're saying doesn't make any sense.

You want origin class players. Of course you do. So do I.

You don't want backups. Well, maybe. This is where you stop making sense. Every team has backups. No team in the comp has origin class players ready to come in and play when the starters get injured unless they happen to have a kid coming through who just happens to be ready to step up at an opportune moment.

You can make two legitimate arguments about the Tigers spine recruitment:
1) Marshall and Farah aren't even good enough to be the backup players. That's a legit view, but you've then got to compare them to what else might be available, at a price that makes sense, to play reserve grade or wait for an injury. So: McIlwrick, Tyrone Roberts, Littlejohn etc etc And really, the difference between any of those is next to nothing. Sub in your favourite, see how much better we get.
2) Any or all of Liddle, Brooks or Reynolds shouldn't be first choice and we should be looking to spend big on a new, "origin class" spine player. This would be a totally different argument and it's nothing to do with Farah or Marshall, because neither of those have been signed to take starting slots.

Personally, I wish we hadn't signed Reynolds and I'd be astonished if he's ever properly fit again. But we can't have a do over on that and go out and spend another $750,000 on a five-eighth (not to mention there hasn't been a good one available). The club has to hope he's fit because they can't spend the money again, and either way the next half in line has to be cheap.
Again. Im not saying we should be looking at origin class fullback or halves. Im happy with those positions. Mbye and Thomson cover fullback and Brooks, Reynolds, Gamble and Mybe cover the halves. I see no need for Marshall or any other back up half in our squad at all. its a wasted spot. Id rathet have given that spot to someone like Morris for probably the same sort of money.
Seggy or Luke would have been better options to Farah.
That doesn't make any sense at all?

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Post by 2041 » Fri 12 Oct, 2018 5:30 pm

gallagher wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 5:03 pm
2041 wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 4:14 pm
gallagher wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 2:56 pm
2041 wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 11:32 am


I mean, it's literally what you said but you keep at it, champ.
Yeah. I said i want origin class players, not back up players. Never said I want origin class back up halves ir hookers.
But your not after a discussion, just an argument.
I'm really not, I'm just trying to explain why what you're saying doesn't make any sense.

You want origin class players. Of course you do. So do I.

You don't want backups. Well, maybe. This is where you stop making sense. Every team has backups. No team in the comp has origin class players ready to come in and play when the starters get injured unless they happen to have a kid coming through who just happens to be ready to step up at an opportune moment.

You can make two legitimate arguments about the Tigers spine recruitment:
1) Marshall and Farah aren't even good enough to be the backup players. That's a legit view, but you've then got to compare them to what else might be available, at a price that makes sense, to play reserve grade or wait for an injury. So: McIlwrick, Tyrone Roberts, Littlejohn etc etc And really, the difference between any of those is next to nothing. Sub in your favourite, see how much better we get.
2) Any or all of Liddle, Brooks or Reynolds shouldn't be first choice and we should be looking to spend big on a new, "origin class" spine player. This would be a totally different argument and it's nothing to do with Farah or Marshall, because neither of those have been signed to take starting slots.

Personally, I wish we hadn't signed Reynolds and I'd be astonished if he's ever properly fit again. But we can't have a do over on that and go out and spend another $750,000 on a five-eighth (not to mention there hasn't been a good one available). The club has to hope he's fit because they can't spend the money again, and either way the next half in line has to be cheap.
Again. Im not saying we should be looking at origin class fullback or halves. Im happy with those positions. Mbye and Thomson cover fullback and Brooks, Reynolds, Gamble and Mybe cover the halves. I see no need for Marshall or any other back up half in our squad at all. its a wasted spot. Id rathet have given that spot to someone like Morris for probably the same sort of money.
Seggy or Luke would have been better options to Farah.
That doesn't make any sense at all?
It's closer to being a logical point, yes. But there are still some pretty massive problems. With Reynolds' injuries over the last couple of years we clearly need some halves cover. Again, we're paying for the bad signing of Reynolds but we really can't go into the season either relying on Reynolds' fitness or assuming the only cover we'll need for him is our starting fullback (who has a pretty horrible track record in the halves) or a young guy who really hasn't looked any good at all so far. TBH I'm relatively surprised that Gamble has been given another year, though equally I'd be absolutely delighted if he jumps ahead of Marshall in the pecking order at some stage.

As for Farah, there is absolutely no way, zero, nada that Isaac Luke isn't on significantly more money. Luke was starting hooker for a finals team this season and probably had his best form since 2014. He'll be on $400k, minimum. Segeyaro is a fair call, and I assume the idea is that he's probably best nowadays in a complementary role, doing 25-40 minutes rather than being a first-choice hooker. That would be great if he can be used off the bench but, again, the Tigers' first choice hooker is yet to prove he can stand up to the physical rigour of week-in, week-out first grade. I'm guessing the call is that Farah is more able to play 60 minutes for eight weeks straight if necessary.

There's also the suggestion that we might have got Segeyaro were it not for the Cleary saga. IDK if that's true or not, but if it is you sort of have to give the club a pass - not much they could do about Cleary dumping them in the doo doo.

This is sort of my point, though. The difference between Farah and Segeyaro as second choice hooker isn't going to make us a premiership contender. The club is fighting back from years and years of poor cap management, poor recruitment and poor retention. Purely on the basis of the last few months, the recruitment side has pretty clearly improved: they've signed among the best players that have been available, in some cases (Mbye) because they had cap room spare when others had used all theirs. Going out now and blowing the one advantage they have on dumb deals for the likes of the Morris twins would put them right back where they were.

In fact, I think I agree with you: we need to sign origin class players. But the only way we're going to do that is by being in a good position to contend for them when they become available. If we used the whole cap now on minor upgrades all we'd be is a team that might come eighth and would then be mired in cap hell for another three years.

gallagher
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Post by gallagher » Fri 12 Oct, 2018 7:12 pm

2041 wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 5:30 pm
gallagher wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 5:03 pm
2041 wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 4:14 pm
gallagher wrote:
Fri 12 Oct, 2018 2:56 pm

Yeah. I said i want origin class players, not back up players. Never said I want origin class back up halves ir hookers.
But your not after a discussion, just an argument.
I'm really not, I'm just trying to explain why what you're saying doesn't make any sense.

You want origin class players. Of course you do. So do I.

You don't want backups. Well, maybe. This is where you stop making sense. Every team has backups. No team in the comp has origin class players ready to come in and play when the starters get injured unless they happen to have a kid coming through who just happens to be ready to step up at an opportune moment.

You can make two legitimate arguments about the Tigers spine recruitment:
1) Marshall and Farah aren't even good enough to be the backup players. That's a legit view, but you've then got to compare them to what else might be available, at a price that makes sense, to play reserve grade or wait for an injury. So: McIlwrick, Tyrone Roberts, Littlejohn etc etc And really, the difference between any of those is next to nothing. Sub in your favourite, see how much better we get.
2) Any or all of Liddle, Brooks or Reynolds shouldn't be first choice and we should be looking to spend big on a new, "origin class" spine player. This would be a totally different argument and it's nothing to do with Farah or Marshall, because neither of those have been signed to take starting slots.

Personally, I wish we hadn't signed Reynolds and I'd be astonished if he's ever properly fit again. But we can't have a do over on that and go out and spend another $750,000 on a five-eighth (not to mention there hasn't been a good one available). The club has to hope he's fit because they can't spend the money again, and either way the next half in line has to be cheap.
Again. Im not saying we should be looking at origin class fullback or halves. Im happy with those positions. Mbye and Thomson cover fullback and Brooks, Reynolds, Gamble and Mybe cover the halves. I see no need for Marshall or any other back up half in our squad at all. its a wasted spot. Id rathet have given that spot to someone like Morris for probably the same sort of money.
Seggy or Luke would have been better options to Farah.
That doesn't make any sense at all?
It's closer to being a logical point, yes. But there are still some pretty massive problems. With Reynolds' injuries over the last couple of years we clearly need some halves cover. Again, we're paying for the bad signing of Reynolds but we really can't go into the season either relying on Reynolds' fitness or assuming the only cover we'll need for him is our starting fullback (who has a pretty horrible track record in the halves) or a young guy who really hasn't looked any good at all so far. TBH I'm relatively surprised that Gamble has been given another year, though equally I'd be absolutely delighted if he jumps ahead of Marshall in the pecking order at some stage.

As for Farah, there is absolutely no way, zero, nada that Isaac Luke isn't on significantly more money. Luke was starting hooker for a finals team this season and probably had his best form since 2014. He'll be on $400k, minimum. Segeyaro is a fair call, and I assume the idea is that he's probably best nowadays in a complementary role, doing 25-40 minutes rather than being a first-choice hooker. That would be great if he can be used off the bench but, again, the Tigers' first choice hooker is yet to prove he can stand up to the physical rigour of week-in, week-out first grade. I'm guessing the call is that Farah is more able to play 60 minutes for eight weeks straight if necessary.

There's also the suggestion that we might have got Segeyaro were it not for the Cleary saga. IDK if that's true or not, but if it is you sort of have to give the club a pass - not much they could do about Cleary dumping them in the doo doo.

This is sort of my point, though. The difference between Farah and Segeyaro as second choice hooker isn't going to make us a premiership contender. The club is fighting back from years and years of poor cap management, poor recruitment and poor retention. Purely on the basis of the last few months, the recruitment side has pretty clearly improved: they've signed among the best players that have been available, in some cases (Mbye) because they had cap room spare when others had used all theirs. Going out now and blowing the one advantage they have on dumb deals for the likes of the Morris twins would put them right back where they were.

In fact, I think I agree with you: we need to sign origin class players. But the only way we're going to do that is by being in a good position to contend for them when they become available. If we used the whole cap now on minor upgrades all we'd be is a team that might come eighth and would then be mired in cap hell for another three years.
Unless we are totally mismanaging the cap, one of the Morris boys would not have mired us in cap hell for three years. More experience in the 3/4 line is more important than Benji.

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