Keebra Park - Is it worth it ?

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Re: Keebra Park - Is it worth it ?

Unread post by LCA » Tue 25 Feb, 2014 8:29 pm

Irvine wrote:When you mention Keebra Park Benji always pops up but besides Benji who has really been worth the time and money over the last 10 years or so.

Having a look at BMM on the weekend got me thinking about Keebra Park and how much we are always promised from Keebra but in reality we never really get very much...?
Do you have an alternative to Keebra Park?


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Unread post by happy tiger » Tue 25 Feb, 2014 8:40 pm

I think any money spent on scholarships is cap free also

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Unread post by joebob » Tue 25 Feb, 2014 9:46 pm

Just found some 2013 highlights of Keebra Park on YouTube. Good to see the 3, 6 and 11 all signed for NYC, plus a heap of others.


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Unread post by Goose » Tue 25 Feb, 2014 10:08 pm

Tiger Watto wrote:The step from Schoolboy to Grade is a big task and I don't think it is that high for many of the RL Schools. Palm Beach Currumbin is pretty much on level pegging with Keebra Park and St Brendans in Queensland.

I may be wrong, but the standout in NSW appears to be Endeavour Sports High? Outside of Holy Cross and St Gregs, which other schools are classed as Top Tier down there?
St Pats is probably the best school in the country at the moment.

As to the original post we should definitely stick with Keebra.
Greg Lenton is the best judge of untapped talent I've ever seen, he sees stuff in players no one else can.
They have sent us a number of very promising players each year.
They have made our NYC side consistently strong.
Players you get as juniors cost you much less than average as in general all other things being equal, if the money is the same or close enough players stay, you have to pay more to move some one (unless other factors are relevant)
We need to have a number of pathways to the club, the 2 junior districts (and attached schools) plus Keebra gives ud our funnel, and it is a good one.

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Unread post by Goose » Tue 25 Feb, 2014 10:13 pm

happy tiger wrote:I think any money spent on scholarships is cap free also
correct and encouraged


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Unread post by Irvine » Wed 26 Feb, 2014 12:49 am

LCA wrote:
Irvine wrote:When you mention Keebra Park Benji always pops up but besides Benji who has really been worth the time and money over the last 10 years or so.

Having a look at BMM on the weekend got me thinking about Keebra Park and how much we are always promised from Keebra but in reality we never really get very much...?
Do you have an alternative to Keebra Park?
I don't think the actual school is the problem... I am talking about Wests Tigers recruitment from NZ who are sent to Keebra on scholarships.
Besides Benji who in actual fact was sent to Keebra by Canberra not Wests Tigers. Canberra then had a change and decided that Souths Logan was where they were going to try...and so we took over Keebra.
Unfortunately Canberra also took their recruitment scouts with them as well.

For all the talk about Keebra every year.....this years crop is the best etc etc...It would appear very few actually make it to the Wests Tigers NRL team. Looking at BMM on the weekend got me thinking>>Why don't we have better from Keebra at Wests Tigers.

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Unread post by turnstyle » Wed 26 Feb, 2014 5:38 am

i dont profess to knowing much about the keebra park programme, but gather it is a scholarship one for nz kids?
why cant/isnt it for australian kids as well?

anyway, as i say, dont know much about and so wont comment too far other than to say that i dont think 10 years is an ample sample pool to judge from.

who knows? in 2, 6, 9 years time we could all be praising the benefits?
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Unread post by Phantomlock » Wed 26 Feb, 2014 5:52 am

A fair few are Kiwi kids from NZ but definitely not all.

It gives NZ kids opportunities to play NRL/NYC due to the very limited prospects in NZ, i.e., one team here compared to fifteen there.

Having said that we know lots of the clubs scout here throughout the year... league AND union nurseries too I should add.

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Unread post by happy tiger » Wed 26 Feb, 2014 7:11 am

Goose wrote:
Tiger Watto wrote:The step from Schoolboy to Grade is a big task and I don't think it is that high for many of the RL Schools. Palm Beach Currumbin is pretty much on level pegging with Keebra Park and St Brendans in Queensland.

I may be wrong, but the standout in NSW appears to be Endeavour Sports High? Outside of Holy Cross and St Gregs, which other schools are classed as Top Tier down there?
St Pats is probably the best school in the country at the moment.

As to the original post we should definitely stick with Keebra.
Greg Lenton is the best judge of untapped talent I've ever seen, he sees stuff in players no one else can.
They have sent us a number of very promising players each year.
They have made our NYC side consistently strong.
Players you get as juniors cost you much less than average as in general all other things being equal, if the money is the same or close enough players stay, you have to pay more to move some one (unless other factors are relevant)
We need to have a number of pathways to the club, the 2 junior districts (and attached schools) plus Keebra gives ud our funnel, and it is a good one.
Add to that players we can keep in the system are also eligible to a 200 k long player entitlement in the cap
Just thinking Rowdy will receive that entitlement this season as well

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Unread post by Goose » Wed 26 Feb, 2014 2:16 pm

turnstyle wrote:i dont profess to knowing much about the keebra park programme, but gather it is a scholarship one for nz kids?
why cant/isnt it for australian kids as well?

anyway, as i say, dont know much about and so wont comment too far other than to say that i dont think 10 years is an ample sample pool to judge from.

who knows? in 2, 6, 9 years time we could all be praising the benefits?
the program is not just for Kiwis, but they run open and invite only trials in NZ which results in a number ending up there.

As for Canberra taking their recruitment with them, this is not true, Keebra run their own program, including recruitment, we offer funding for it. (i dont know how much), but im guessing it would be cheaper than funding a junior district, and Keebra, seem to have a similar output to a junior district overall.

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Unread post by The Hill » Wed 26 Feb, 2014 2:49 pm

What a ridiculous thread. A single school produces the likes of Benji and Ben Teo, amongst a host of others previously mentioned and you question the value of the arrangement?

When you compare how much our investment likely is, and the output we receive its sensational value! The quality will vary but when you think generally a third of our nyc squads are Keebra boys that's pretty good for a single school. Holy Cross has rarely provided us with this many juniors, although they have had a bit of a golden generation of rhinos coming through in the past year or two.

The current nyc team will go very close to winning the comp this year, and then there's also JJ Felis who'll join us next year who's definitely got the makings of the next Fifita - big, yet highly agile and skillful.

The question should be, why isn't there a school in Western Sydney which is regularly provided us with quality juniors to fill our nyc squad?

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Unread post by Irvine » Wed 26 Feb, 2014 2:50 pm

Ok Thanks Goose....How does it work ? Are the Keebra recruited NZ players just solely for Wests Tigers ?
Does Keebra recruit for other NRL teams and we get allocated players ? Do we have any say in the players recruited ?

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Unread post by Irvine » Wed 26 Feb, 2014 3:06 pm

The Hill wrote:What a ridiculous thread. A single school produces the likes of Benji and Ben Teo, amongst a host of others previously mentioned and you question the value of the arrangement?

When you compare how much our investment likely is, and the output we receive its sensational value! The quality will vary but when you think generally a third of our nyc squads are Keebra boys that's pretty good for a single school. Holy Cross has rarely provided us with this many juniors, although they have had a bit of a golden generation of rhinos coming through in the past year or two.

The current nyc team will go very close to winning the comp this year, and then there's also JJ Felis who'll join us next year who's definitely got the makings of the next Fifita - big, yet highly agile and skillful.

The question should be, why isn't there a school in Western Sydney which is regularly provided us with quality juniors to fill our nyc squad?
Exactly Thank you.... a third playing in NYC are from Keebra...then why are there not more in our NRL team ???????????

:lol: the next Slater..Fifita...more likely the next Matt Hyland,Junior Roqica Jake Mullaney, Joel Wisbey, Matt Groat or Neil Begovich.

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Unread post by southerntiger » Wed 26 Feb, 2014 3:15 pm

Irvine wrote:
The Hill wrote:What a ridiculous thread. A single school produces the likes of Benji and Ben Teo, amongst a host of others previously mentioned and you question the value of the arrangement?

When you compare how much our investment likely is, and the output we receive its sensational value! The quality will vary but when you think generally a third of our nyc squads are Keebra boys that's pretty good for a single school. Holy Cross has rarely provided us with this many juniors, although they have had a bit of a golden generation of rhinos coming through in the past year or two.

The current nyc team will go very close to winning the comp this year, and then there's also JJ Felis who'll join us next year who's definitely got the makings of the next Fifita - big, yet highly agile and skillful.

The question should be, why isn't there a school in Western Sydney which is regularly provided us with quality juniors to fill our nyc squad?
Exactly Thank you.... a third playing in NYC are from Keebra...then why are there not more in our NRL team ???????????

:lol: the next Slater..Fifita...more likely the next Matt Hyland,Junior Roqica Jake Mullaney, Joel Wisbey, Matt Groat or Neil Begovich.
Teo, Lui, Moa, Mosese and Marshall. If you added those it would be a third easily. Blame retention not Keebra Park.

Posted using RoarFEED 2013

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Unread post by happy tiger » Wed 26 Feb, 2014 3:31 pm

Irvine wrote:Ok Thanks Goose....How does it work ? Are the Keebra recruited NZ players just solely for Wests Tigers ?
Does Keebra recruit for other NRL teams and we get allocated players ? Do we have any say in the players recruited ?
The students have to apply for rugby league scholarships through the school

I imagine we would see a youngster recruit him and then apply for the scholarship and they don't have to be islanders Marion Seve is from Ipswich in Qld for example

But no one school solely is represented by one club Kids can apply without having NRL club backing and then would get picked up by a club during carnivals ,Arrive Alive Cup etc

Friend of the family has been at St Brendans ,Yeppoon (CQ) on scholarship and the kids are literally approached at Carnivals by club recruitment officers if they aren't already signed or aligned with a club

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Unread post by The Hill » Wed 26 Feb, 2014 3:56 pm

Irvine wrote:
The Hill wrote:What a ridiculous thread. A single school produces the likes of Benji and Ben Teo, amongst a host of others previously mentioned and you question the value of the arrangement?

When you compare how much our investment likely is, and the output we receive its sensational value! The quality will vary but when you think generally a third of our nyc squads are Keebra boys that's pretty good for a single school. Holy Cross has rarely provided us with this many juniors, although they have had a bit of a golden generation of rhinos coming through in the past year or two.

The current nyc team will go very close to winning the comp this year, and then there's also JJ Felis who'll join us next year who's definitely got the makings of the next Fifita - big, yet highly agile and skillful.

The question should be, why isn't there a school in Western Sydney which is regularly provided us with quality juniors to fill our nyc squad?
Exactly Thank you.... a third playing in NYC are from Keebra...then why are there not more in our NRL team ???????????

:lol: the next Slater..Fifita...more likely the next Matt Hyland,Junior Roqica Jake Mullaney, Joel Wisbey, Matt Groat or Neil Begovich.

Do you know the percentage of high school players that go on to become NRL professionals? It's pretty small. A lot don't make the cut...! :crazy

Keebra's job is to supply us boys for NYC. That's it. From there it's up to the individual, the club etc.

Some players might get homesick about living in Sydney - this is one of the main issues with a feeder school from outside of Sydney. If we can retain the majority of the current boys we'll do very well.

In the past we've often contracted one standout player (Teo, Chase, Lui, BMM, Kahu etc) and a few other decent squaddies. If we enable the standouts to develop into star players and retain them (only one of the above still plays with us) our quad will be all the stronger.

Sure at this stage it's all crystal ball stuff, but looking at previous national schoolboy champ sides it suggests that several players will go on to play first grade and even rep footy within a few years. We've got the cream of their crop. Seve, Liolevave, Martin, Masila, Alofi etc. If we eventually get three solid NRL players out of one school in one year that's a great return! If one or two of them become rep stars it's even more incredible!

Especially considering we're most likely not paying Keebra big bucks either.

And there's likely going to be 2 Keebra boys in our 17 come round 1. Which is probably more than any other high school (although this is admittedly a guess).

The other question we need to ask is given our affiliation how come some players from the school are contracted to other clubs. Did we pass up the option to sign these players, or do we simply have to offer WT contracts early on, before other clubs can watch them play, to those we think will step up?

And if you were going to name players, at least name some of the Keebra Boys who haven't cut it!

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Unread post by Goose » Wed 26 Feb, 2014 4:29 pm

Irvine wrote:Ok Thanks Goose....How does it work ? Are the Keebra recruited NZ players just solely for Wests Tigers ?
Does Keebra recruit for other NRL teams and we get allocated players ? Do we have any say in the players recruited ?
Im not sure how the players end up assigned to us.

I think that some of the players are on scholarship through the club, which links them to us, but not all players fit that bill. Im not sure on the logistics.

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Unread post by turnstyle » Wed 26 Feb, 2014 4:58 pm

The Hill wrote: Do you know the percentage of high school players that go on to become NRL professionals? It's pretty small. A lot don't make the cut...! :crazy

Keebra's job is to supply us boys for NYC. That's it. From there it's up to the individual, the club etc.
exactly this.
growing up in perth i played aussie rules as a kid. we had rep teams, state schoolboys, then the u/17s state teams that got comprised of the kids who had made it to the state league teams colts teams (eg; NYC teams).

different sport, yes, but i imagine my experience is exactly the same. i am the same age as glen jakovich (west coast eagles) and played colts (u/19s) with matthew burton (freo, north melbourne), if you remember them.

for every one of those two guys, there are hundreds of "me"s (not that i could honestly say "i cooda been a contenda!!") who never made it to the big leagues. 2 kids who played for my club won the district fairest and best every year they played and for all their talent neither of those guys made it anywhere near AFL, for one reason or another.

the point is that from age 15-18 or so, many many of the most talented kids dont make the progression to where people think they should. when you get to that age, talent alone is not enough - you have to work hard and really want to make it: no talent spotting and scholarship programme will get you there if you just dont have all the ingredients.
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