Bagging Ivan

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hobbo
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Re: Bagging Ivan

Post by hobbo » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 6:39 pm

It doesn’t matter who you are and how good you think you are at your chosen profession , everyone needs a bit of constructive criticism from time to time !


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Geo.
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Post by Geo. » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 6:55 pm

hobbo wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 6:39 pm
It doesn’t matter who you are and how good you think you are at your chosen profession , everyone needs a bit of constructive criticism from time to time !
+ a never ending supply of slippers.. :lol:
Ivan's Laws

1. You are either on the Bus or you are off..
2. The Star of the Team is the Team
3. Be the player your teammates want to play with..
happy tiger wrote:
Mon 11 Jun, 2018 10:03 pm


Sorry FT , you know I'm not the brightest match in the pile

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Post by hobbo » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:00 pm

Geo. wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 6:55 pm
hobbo wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 6:39 pm
It doesn’t matter who you are and how good you think you are at your chosen profession , everyone needs a bit of constructive criticism from time to time !
+ a never ending supply of slippers.. :lol:
Ugg boots !

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Doc Tiger
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Post by Doc Tiger » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:03 pm

GNR4LIFE wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 6:34 pm
krayola wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 5:54 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 4:30 pm
Did the OP really suggest the only other coach who could get more out of this squad is Barrett? Has to be a typo.
I’m not saying he’s above criticism but more so that the criticism he’s receiving seems unjust.

He’s assembled quite a bit of the squad, sure, but he certainly had hands tied in regards to our cap situation, signings made prior to his arrival and the club’s standing in the competition at that time.

Not a typo. For a relatively inexperienced coach I think he’s done a good job with Manly despite the stuff going on around the club and the injuries they’ve suffered.
That is incorrect, as I pointed out in my last post. He didn’t inherit this squad. 95% of it was signed by him. He was blessed to have the cap space he had the day he started. Most coaches have to wait at least a season. I’m sure Dean Pay wouldn’t mind being in Ivan’s shoes. And don’t get me wrong, I’m not criticising him for this, but there are a lot of revisionists atm who are wrongly trying to claim he inherited a weak squad. Wrong.
GNR, you make a lot of sense a lot of the time, but really, imo you're so far off the mark on this it's ridiculous. It's one thing to sign or re-sign players, but you can only do this with what's available. There was very little available in terms of quality and therefore, to a large degree his hands were tied. Of those he did sign, I'd love to hear who, in your opinion, would have been a better option for him than those that were at his disposal.

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Post by GNR4LIFE » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:06 pm

Doc Tiger wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:03 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 6:34 pm
krayola wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 5:54 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 4:30 pm
Did the OP really suggest the only other coach who could get more out of this squad is Barrett? Has to be a typo.
I’m not saying he’s above criticism but more so that the criticism he’s receiving seems unjust.

He’s assembled quite a bit of the squad, sure, but he certainly had hands tied in regards to our cap situation, signings made prior to his arrival and the club’s standing in the competition at that time.

Not a typo. For a relatively inexperienced coach I think he’s done a good job with Manly despite the stuff going on around the club and the injuries they’ve suffered.
That is incorrect, as I pointed out in my last post. He didn’t inherit this squad. 95% of it was signed by him. He was blessed to have the cap space he had the day he started. Most coaches have to wait at least a season. I’m sure Dean Pay wouldn’t mind being in Ivan’s shoes. And don’t get me wrong, I’m not criticising him for this, but there are a lot of revisionists atm who are wrongly trying to claim he inherited a weak squad. Wrong.
GNR, you make a lot of sense a lot of the time, but really, imo you're so far off the mark on this it's ridiculous. It's one thing to sign or re-sign players, but you can only do this with what's available. There was very little available in terms of quality and therefore, to a large degree his hands were tied. Of those he did sign, I'd love to hear who, in your opinion, would have been a better option for him than those that were at his disposal.
I’m not criticising the squad, I think it’s better than a lot of people give it credit for.


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Post by Cultured Bogan » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:13 pm

Despite the trend down in form, we are still infinitely better than every year gone at this point of the year. We are in all but one game, competed for 80 minutes.

Some selections baffle me and probably contribute to losses, but the attitude of the squad alone and their refusal to concede cheap points every game is something of legend for this club.

It still hurts to lose but at least I'm finding that I am often saying that they didn't stop trying.
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old man tiger
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Post by old man tiger » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:14 pm

Geo. wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 3:46 pm
old man tiger wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 3:42 pm
Geo. wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 3:11 pm
Look out next year...
Geo, I can't read you mate. You post comments like this in so many threads, and then defend the club in others.

I feel something broke in you when Marty left, and I understand. I'm here if you need me.

That's not bagging..the trend is up...
Ignore my broken sarcasm meter then, I'm detecting it when it isn't there.

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Post by Doc Tiger » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:21 pm

GNR4LIFE wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:06 pm
Doc Tiger wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:03 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 6:34 pm
krayola wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 5:54 pm


I’m not saying he’s above criticism but more so that the criticism he’s receiving seems unjust.

He’s assembled quite a bit of the squad, sure, but he certainly had hands tied in regards to our cap situation, signings made prior to his arrival and the club’s standing in the competition at that time.

Not a typo. For a relatively inexperienced coach I think he’s done a good job with Manly despite the stuff going on around the club and the injuries they’ve suffered.
That is incorrect, as I pointed out in my last post. He didn’t inherit this squad. 95% of it was signed by him. He was blessed to have the cap space he had the day he started. Most coaches have to wait at least a season. I’m sure Dean Pay wouldn’t mind being in Ivan’s shoes. And don’t get me wrong, I’m not criticising him for this, but there are a lot of revisionists atm who are wrongly trying to claim he inherited a weak squad. Wrong.
GNR, you make a lot of sense a lot of the time, but really, imo you're so far off the mark on this it's ridiculous. It's one thing to sign or re-sign players, but you can only do this with what's available. There was very little available in terms of quality and therefore, to a large degree his hands were tied. Of those he did sign, I'd love to hear who, in your opinion, would have been a better option for him than those that were at his disposal.
I’m not criticising the squad, I think it’s better than a lot of people give it credit for.
I'm not saying you're criticising the squad, but you're criticising the coaches selections and suggesting he made his bed & now he has to lay in it.
The fact is team is average and his team selections are restricted. Our average team is in the middle of the ladder. Seems ok. We've all said for years that we just want to be competetive. We are now. Next step is to be a threat. I'm sure we're heading in that direction. It's not an over night thing though.

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Post by Geo. » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:24 pm

old man tiger wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:14 pm
Geo. wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 3:46 pm
old man tiger wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 3:42 pm
Geo. wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 3:11 pm
Look out next year...
Geo, I can't read you mate. You post comments like this in so many threads, and then defend the club in others.

I feel something broke in you when Marty left, and I understand. I'm here if you need me.

That's not bagging..the trend is up...
Ignore my broken sarcasm meter then, I'm detecting it when it isn't there.

Could be when posters bang on about re-building years ..that is not a criticism of Ivan tho more had enough of the always next year syndrome ..
Ivan's Laws

1. You are either on the Bus or you are off..
2. The Star of the Team is the Team
3. Be the player your teammates want to play with..
happy tiger wrote:
Mon 11 Jun, 2018 10:03 pm


Sorry FT , you know I'm not the brightest match in the pile

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old man tiger
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Post by old man tiger » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:30 pm

Geo. wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:24 pm
old man tiger wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:14 pm
Geo. wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 3:46 pm
old man tiger wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 3:42 pm


Geo, I can't read you mate. You post comments like this in so many threads, and then defend the club in others.

I feel something broke in you when Marty left, and I understand. I'm here if you need me.

That's not bagging..the trend is up...
Ignore my broken sarcasm meter then, I'm detecting it when it isn't there.

Could be when posters bang on about re-building years ..that is not a criticism of Ivan tho more had enough of the always next year syndrome ..
I'm sick of the word rebuilding too. Surely the house is finished and now we just need the turf laid.

The trajectory is heading in the right direction for a change and I'm happy to enjoy the ride as it is a nice change following a mentally tougher team. The biggest thing he promised was a return to the traditional gritty mentality of our foundation clubs, and he has achieved more than any of our coaches in that sense.

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Post by Snake » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:39 pm

Do not Bag Ivan :roll every coaches dream!

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Post by bathursttiger » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 8:08 pm

Tweed Tiger wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 6:11 pm
Ivan is doing well, I wish I could get a sneak peak at the Ladder over the next 3 seasons.

He has turned around a club that had the reputation for the softest defence in the NRL (Sorry Robbie but it was true). This was somehow achieved in 12 months and you could see the progress of it last year and continued through a huge clean out of players. Even Belly ache said last year that the Tigers defensive efforts were impressive towards the end of 2017. Now in 2018 our reputation is having one of the best defences in the competition.

We definitely have issues and I am sure if we can see them Ivan can also. The signings over the next 2 seasons are very important and I am confident Ivan can make them.
You need to turn into Michael J Fox, and go "Back to the Future"

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Post by rex2ce » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 8:23 pm

The whole club is in good hands, nothing more to say really

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Post by Tweed Tiger » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 8:31 pm

bathursttiger wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 8:08 pm
Tweed Tiger wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 6:11 pm
Ivan is doing well, I wish I could get a sneak peak at the Ladder over the next 3 seasons.

He has turned around a club that had the reputation for the softest defence in the NRL (Sorry Robbie but it was true). This was somehow achieved in 12 months and you could see the progress of it last year and continued through a huge clean out of players. Even Belly ache said last year that the Tigers defensive efforts were impressive towards the end of 2017. Now in 2018 our reputation is having one of the best defences in the competition.

We definitely have issues and I am sure if we can see them Ivan can also. The signings over the next 2 seasons are very important and I am confident Ivan can make them.
You need to turn into Michael J Fox, and go "Back to the Future"
Image

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Post by The Patriot » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 8:51 pm

rex2ce wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 8:23 pm
The whole club is in good hands, nothing more to say really
Best post :!:
Its an opinion!

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Post by TIGERPOWER » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 9:25 pm

Doc Tiger wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:21 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:06 pm
Doc Tiger wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 7:03 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Thu 07 Jun, 2018 6:34 pm

That is incorrect, as I pointed out in my last post. He didn’t inherit this squad. 95% of it was signed by him. He was blessed to have the cap space he had the day he started. Most coaches have to wait at least a season. I’m sure Dean Pay wouldn’t mind being in Ivan’s shoes. And don’t get me wrong, I’m not criticising him for this, but there are a lot of revisionists atm who are wrongly trying to claim he inherited a weak squad. Wrong.
GNR, you make a lot of sense a lot of the time, but really, imo you're so far off the mark on this it's ridiculous. It's one thing to sign or re-sign players, but you can only do this with what's available. There was very little available in terms of quality and therefore, to a large degree his hands were tied. Of those he did sign, I'd love to hear who, in your opinion, would have been a better option for him than those that were at his disposal.
I’m not criticising the squad, I think it’s better than a lot of people give it credit for.
I'm not saying you're criticising the squad, but you're criticising the coaches selections and suggesting he made his bed & now he has to lay in it.
The fact is team is average and his team selections are restricted. Our average team is in the middle of the ladder. Seems ok. We've all said for years that we just want to be competetive. We are now. Next step is to be a threat. I'm sure we're heading in that direction. It's not an over night thing though.
Don’t mind GNR he just really misses JT and can’t handle that we have already won more games than last year and that defensively we are the best we have been in a long time despite the ex coach never being able to improve it.

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Post by happy tiger » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 10:17 pm

Ivan said himself we will have good times and some lean times during the rebuild

Welcome to the lean times

Lot of games left this season , lets see where we end up first before we put the slipper in

Despite a few losses ,which in reality could of gone either way , we have overachieved

Probably only concern is the 9 jersey , but when you look at the success stories across the park in many other positions we look better than I thought we ever would

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Post by TYGA » Thu 07 Jun, 2018 10:30 pm

Ivan brings credibility which we have not had since Sheens. Patience is required with a rebuild it won’t happen in the first year. We have some serious gaps in the roster hooker, fullback, edge back row. 3-4 solid first graders will take us to the finals.

The key is who can Ivan attract now that WT are a solid squad. Star players may now look at us and think if I join them we will make the finals.

Ivan should not be immune to criticism some of his selections are highly questionable ET at hooker, Goodinet, Rochow, Tui @ fullback.
That said we don’t have the quality in some positions.

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