To those who are blaming Cleary

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MacDougall
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Re: To those who are blaming Cleary

Post by MacDougall » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:52 pm

GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:48 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:45 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:38 pm
hobbo wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:35 pm


Cleary hasn’t been given anything ...
He purchased the friggin squad !
This is seems to be the new trend, revisionists attempting to claim he inherited the squad.

Fake news.
Let's see.

Josh Aloiai - SR, LK - Was here before
Luke Brooks - HB - Was here before
Michael Chee Kam - SR, CE - Was here before
Matt Eisenhuth - LK, PR, SR - Was here before
JJ Felise - PR - Was here before
Mahe Fonua - WG, CE - Cleary
Tyson Gamble - FE, HB - Cleary
Heath Gibbs - SR, CE - Cleary I think
Pita Godinet - HK, HB - Cleary
Tim Grant - PR - Was here before
Chris Lawrence (c) - SR, CE - Was here before
Jacob Liddle - HK - Was here before
Tuimoala Lolohea - FB, FE (gk) - Cleary
Benji Marshall (c) - FE, HB (gk) - Cleary
Esan Marsters - CE, SR (gk) - Was here before
Ben Matulino - PR - Was here before
Moses Mbye - FB, HB - Cleary
Matt McIlwrick - HK - Was here before
Sam McIntyre - CE, WG - Cleary
Chris McQueen - SR, LK - Was here before
Thomas Mikaele - PR - Was here before
Kevin Naiqama - CE, WG - Was here before
David Nofoaluma - WG, - Was here before
Russell Packer (c) - PR - Cleary
Josh Reynolds (c) - FE, HK - Cleary
Robbie Rochow - SR, PR - Cleary
Bayley Sironen - LK, FE - Was here before
Dylan Smith - FB - Cleary
Sauaso Sue - PR, LK - Was here before
Elijah Taylor (c) - LK, SR - Was here before
Corey Thompson - FB, WG - Cleary
Alex Twal - PR - Cleary
Malakai Watene-Zelezniak - WG, CE - Cleary

He sure inherited a large chunk of the squad no?

That's not even the point. I am blown away that people want to put it on the coach who has wooden spoon favourites running 10th and competing when he is year one into a rebuild. Support the club! He's only just started!
Besides Lawrence, Sue and Aloiai, he either signed or re-signed every one of those players listed. Meaning after he came on board, he extended the contracts of players off contract
A lot of one year and two year extensions to get us through the rebuild my friend.

Who would you have had him sign that he did not sign exactly? Ponga? Watson? We had a fair crack at Watson and lost. Is that Cleary's fault?

Not to mention Newcastle are in year three of their rebuild, we're in year one and we're beating them on the ladder.

Crazy expectations around here. Pure pants on head.


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Geo.
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Post by Geo. » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:53 pm

MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:50 pm
Geo. wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:36 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:32 pm
Geo. wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:30 pm
Low expectations Wests Tigers fan motto circa 2006..

soon to be followed by the 'next year' posts as we re build onwards and upwards..
We have had good years between 2006 and now.

If you expected Cleary to do better than he has with what he was given then you had irrational expectations in my view.

Cleary recruited or re-signed more than 75% of the current starting 17..Yes I expected him to do better
*Looks at ladder*

*Sees us above Newcastle*

*Laughs*

If that makes you happy..oh boy..
Ivan's Laws

1. You are either on the Bus or you are off..
2. The Star of the Team is the Team
3. Be the player your teammates want to play with..

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Post by GNR4LIFE » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:54 pm

MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:52 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:48 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:45 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:38 pm

This is seems to be the new trend, revisionists attempting to claim he inherited the squad.

Fake news.
Let's see.

Josh Aloiai - SR, LK - Was here before
Luke Brooks - HB - Was here before
Michael Chee Kam - SR, CE - Was here before
Matt Eisenhuth - LK, PR, SR - Was here before
JJ Felise - PR - Was here before
Mahe Fonua - WG, CE - Cleary
Tyson Gamble - FE, HB - Cleary
Heath Gibbs - SR, CE - Cleary I think
Pita Godinet - HK, HB - Cleary
Tim Grant - PR - Was here before
Chris Lawrence (c) - SR, CE - Was here before
Jacob Liddle - HK - Was here before
Tuimoala Lolohea - FB, FE (gk) - Cleary
Benji Marshall (c) - FE, HB (gk) - Cleary
Esan Marsters - CE, SR (gk) - Was here before
Ben Matulino - PR - Was here before
Moses Mbye - FB, HB - Cleary
Matt McIlwrick - HK - Was here before
Sam McIntyre - CE, WG - Cleary
Chris McQueen - SR, LK - Was here before
Thomas Mikaele - PR - Was here before
Kevin Naiqama - CE, WG - Was here before
David Nofoaluma - WG, - Was here before
Russell Packer (c) - PR - Cleary
Josh Reynolds (c) - FE, HK - Cleary
Robbie Rochow - SR, PR - Cleary
Bayley Sironen - LK, FE - Was here before
Dylan Smith - FB - Cleary
Sauaso Sue - PR, LK - Was here before
Elijah Taylor (c) - LK, SR - Was here before
Corey Thompson - FB, WG - Cleary
Alex Twal - PR - Cleary
Malakai Watene-Zelezniak - WG, CE - Cleary

He sure inherited a large chunk of the squad no?

That's not even the point. I am blown away that people want to put it on the coach who has wooden spoon favourites running 10th and competing when he is year one into a rebuild. Support the club! He's only just started!
Besides Lawrence, Sue and Aloiai, he either signed or re-signed every one of those players listed. Meaning after he came on board, he extended the contracts of players off contract
A lot of one year and two year extensions to get us through the rebuild my friend.

Who would you have had him sign that he did not sign exactly? Ponga? Watson? We had a fair crack at Watson and lost. Is that Cleary's fault?

Not to mention Newcastle are in year three of their rebuild, we're in year one and we're beating them on the ladder.

Crazy expectations around here. Pure pants on head.
Mac, I’m not saying we should hang the guy, but he cannot be immune from criticism atm.
Last edited by GNR4LIFE on Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by MacDougall » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:54 pm

Presumably all the superstars he didn't sign are the Newcastle players no?

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Post by MacDougall » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:55 pm

GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:54 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:52 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:48 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:45 pm


Let's see.

Josh Aloiai - SR, LK - Was here before
Luke Brooks - HB - Was here before
Michael Chee Kam - SR, CE - Was here before
Matt Eisenhuth - LK, PR, SR - Was here before
JJ Felise - PR - Was here before
Mahe Fonua - WG, CE - Cleary
Tyson Gamble - FE, HB - Cleary
Heath Gibbs - SR, CE - Cleary I think
Pita Godinet - HK, HB - Cleary
Tim Grant - PR - Was here before
Chris Lawrence (c) - SR, CE - Was here before
Jacob Liddle - HK - Was here before
Tuimoala Lolohea - FB, FE (gk) - Cleary
Benji Marshall (c) - FE, HB (gk) - Cleary
Esan Marsters - CE, SR (gk) - Was here before
Ben Matulino - PR - Was here before
Moses Mbye - FB, HB - Cleary
Matt McIlwrick - HK - Was here before
Sam McIntyre - CE, WG - Cleary
Chris McQueen - SR, LK - Was here before
Thomas Mikaele - PR - Was here before
Kevin Naiqama - CE, WG - Was here before
David Nofoaluma - WG, - Was here before
Russell Packer (c) - PR - Cleary
Josh Reynolds (c) - FE, HK - Cleary
Robbie Rochow - SR, PR - Cleary
Bayley Sironen - LK, FE - Was here before
Dylan Smith - FB - Cleary
Sauaso Sue - PR, LK - Was here before
Elijah Taylor (c) - LK, SR - Was here before
Corey Thompson - FB, WG - Cleary
Alex Twal - PR - Cleary
Malakai Watene-Zelezniak - WG, CE - Cleary

He sure inherited a large chunk of the squad no?

That's not even the point. I am blown away that people want to put it on the coach who has wooden spoon favourites running 10th and competing when he is year one into a rebuild. Support the club! He's only just started!
Besides Lawrence, Sue and Aloiai, he either signed or re-signed every one of those players listed. Meaning after he came on board, he extended the contracts of players off contract
A lot of one year and two year extensions to get us through the rebuild my friend.

Who would you have had him sign that he did not sign exactly? Ponga? Watson? We had a fair crack at Watson and lost. Is that Cleary's fault?

Not to mention Newcastle are in year three of their rebuild, we're in year one and we're beating them on the ladder.

Crazy expectations around here. Pure pants on head.
Mac, I’m not saying we should hang the guy, but he cannot be immune from criticism atm.
Just give me, any of you, any indication of what he should have done that he hasn't?


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Post by hobbo » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:56 pm

MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:50 pm
Geo. wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:36 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:32 pm
Geo. wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:30 pm
Low expectations Wests Tigers fan motto circa 2006..

soon to be followed by the 'next year' posts as we re build onwards and upwards..
We have had good years between 2006 and now.

If you expected Cleary to do better than he has with what he was given then you had irrational expectations in my view.

Cleary recruited or re-signed more than 75% of the current starting 17..Yes I expected him to do better
*Looks at ladder*

*Sees us above Newcastle*

*Laughs*
Awesome ... you must be stoked !
We need mongrel ..
No more plodders !

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Post by GNR4LIFE » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:57 pm

MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:55 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:54 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:52 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:48 pm

Besides Lawrence, Sue and Aloiai, he either signed or re-signed every one of those players listed. Meaning after he came on board, he extended the contracts of players off contract
A lot of one year and two year extensions to get us through the rebuild my friend.

Who would you have had him sign that he did not sign exactly? Ponga? Watson? We had a fair crack at Watson and lost. Is that Cleary's fault?

Not to mention Newcastle are in year three of their rebuild, we're in year one and we're beating them on the ladder.

Crazy expectations around here. Pure pants on head.
Mac, I’m not saying we should hang the guy, but he cannot be immune from criticism atm.
Just give me, any of you, any indication of what he should have done that he hasn't?
Pick a hooker for starters.

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Post by MacDougall » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:57 pm

Clearly I am stoked yes as unlike you I didn't expect us to be doing this well.

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Post by MacDougall » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:59 pm

GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:57 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:55 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:54 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:52 pm


A lot of one year and two year extensions to get us through the rebuild my friend.

Who would you have had him sign that he did not sign exactly? Ponga? Watson? We had a fair crack at Watson and lost. Is that Cleary's fault?

Not to mention Newcastle are in year three of their rebuild, we're in year one and we're beating them on the ladder.

Crazy expectations around here. Pure pants on head.
Mac, I’m not saying we should hang the guy, but he cannot be immune from criticism atm.
Just give me, any of you, any indication of what he should have done that he hasn't?
Pick a hooker for starters.
So he didn't start the game with McIlwrick today?

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Post by Glennb » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 9:00 pm

GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:51 pm
Eddie wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:47 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:38 pm
hobbo wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:35 pm


Cleary hasn’t been given anything ...
He purchased the friggin squad !
This is seems to be the new trend, revisionists attempting to claim he inherited the squad.

Fake news.
I think it is fair to question some of the signings.

However lets remember the place was a complete train wreak on and off the field.

Its not like people were lining up and Ivan had great choices.

Thats not to say I was thrilled with the length and age of some of the signings.
The day he signed everyone was over the moon (rightly so) believing that the big 4 would automatically re-sign and we could finally attract marque players. Well, 3 of the big 4 still left, and the players he signed aren’t proving to be popular among the supporters.
The three had already signed elsewhere when Cleary signed (not re-signed) with us. Woods has admitted this since and said he regretted it. Even Moses had committted to the Eels which is why Cleary called his bluff and took his deal off the table.

For mine Cleary is the best coach the WT have had.

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Post by GNR4LIFE » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 9:02 pm

MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:59 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:57 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:55 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:54 pm

Mac, I’m not saying we should hang the guy, but he cannot be immune from criticism atm.
Just give me, any of you, any indication of what he should have done that he hasn't?
Pick a hooker for starters.
So he didn't start the game with McIlwrick today?
He did. 6 weeks too late

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Post by tiger05premier » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 9:02 pm

GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:48 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:45 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:38 pm
hobbo wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:35 pm


Cleary hasn’t been given anything ...
He purchased the friggin squad !
This is seems to be the new trend, revisionists attempting to claim he inherited the squad.

Fake news.
Let's see.

Josh Aloiai - SR, LK - Was here before
Luke Brooks - HB - Was here before
Michael Chee Kam - SR, CE - Was here before
Matt Eisenhuth - LK, PR, SR - Was here before
JJ Felise - PR - Was here before
Mahe Fonua - WG, CE - Cleary
Tyson Gamble - FE, HB - Cleary
Heath Gibbs - SR, CE - Cleary I think
Pita Godinet - HK, HB - Cleary
Tim Grant - PR - Was here before
Chris Lawrence (c) - SR, CE - Was here before
Jacob Liddle - HK - Was here before
Tuimoala Lolohea - FB, FE (gk) - Cleary
Benji Marshall (c) - FE, HB (gk) - Cleary
Esan Marsters - CE, SR (gk) - Was here before
Ben Matulino - PR - Was here before
Moses Mbye - FB, HB - Cleary
Matt McIlwrick - HK - Was here before
Sam McIntyre - CE, WG - Cleary
Chris McQueen - SR, LK - Was here before
Thomas Mikaele - PR - Was here before
Kevin Naiqama - CE, WG - Was here before
David Nofoaluma - WG, - Was here before
Russell Packer (c) - PR - Cleary
Josh Reynolds (c) - FE, HK - Cleary
Robbie Rochow - SR, PR - Cleary
Bayley Sironen - LK, FE - Was here before
Dylan Smith - FB - Cleary
Sauaso Sue - PR, LK - Was here before
Elijah Taylor (c) - LK, SR - Was here before
Corey Thompson - FB, WG - Cleary
Alex Twal - PR - Cleary
Malakai Watene-Zelezniak - WG, CE - Cleary

He sure inherited a large chunk of the squad no?

That's not even the point. I am blown away that people want to put it on the coach who has wooden spoon favourites running 10th and competing when he is year one into a rebuild. Support the club! He's only just started!
Besides Lawrence, Sue and Aloiai, he either signed or re-signed every one of those players listed. Meaning after he came on board, he extended the contracts of players off contract
Yeah IC singed nearly all of our squad but he had to sign someone didn't he

Our best player's were leaving and it's not like you can force players to come in and replace them

He had to put offers to whoever was available and hope they would accept his offer

Plenty of players said no

He pretty much got the best side he could put together at the time and no its not a great side but apart from today they have been competing

Also some player's got longer deals on bigger money than most people would agree with but he probably had to offer that to get a half decent side together to be competitive in the 1st right

And let's face it they have already over achieved according to some people

Yes as supporters we are sickof all this rebuilding crap but like MacDougall i think we are on the right track with IC

Unfortunately there is going to be a lot more pain on the way to getting where we want to be

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Post by MacDougall » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 9:03 pm

We have had a premiership winning coach that took us to three finals series so maybe pump the breaks there but he certainly has potential.

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Post by MacDougall » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 9:06 pm

GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 9:02 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:59 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:57 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:55 pm


Just give me, any of you, any indication of what he should have done that he hasn't?
Pick a hooker for starters.
So he didn't start the game with McIlwrick today?
He did. 6 weeks too late
He has been rotating the other four through there the entire time.

McIlwrick is not the reason we aren't running in the top 4. The dude played himself out the side early in the year by sucking.

Do you think Cleary wants to play Taylor at 9? He doesn't know what to do with the hooker problem. Nobody does. Picking McIlwrick is not the answer and never was.

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Post by jadtiger » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 9:07 pm

tiger05premier wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 9:02 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:48 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:45 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:38 pm

This is seems to be the new trend, revisionists attempting to claim he inherited the squad.

Fake news.
Let's see.

Josh Aloiai - SR, LK - Was here before
Luke Brooks - HB - Was here before
Michael Chee Kam - SR, CE - Was here before
Matt Eisenhuth - LK, PR, SR - Was here before
JJ Felise - PR - Was here before
Mahe Fonua - WG, CE - Cleary
Tyson Gamble - FE, HB - Cleary
Heath Gibbs - SR, CE - Cleary I think
Pita Godinet - HK, HB - Cleary
Tim Grant - PR - Was here before
Chris Lawrence (c) - SR, CE - Was here before
Jacob Liddle - HK - Was here before
Tuimoala Lolohea - FB, FE (gk) - Cleary
Benji Marshall (c) - FE, HB (gk) - Cleary
Esan Marsters - CE, SR (gk) - Was here before
Ben Matulino - PR - Was here before
Moses Mbye - FB, HB - Cleary
Matt McIlwrick - HK - Was here before
Sam McIntyre - CE, WG - Cleary
Chris McQueen - SR, LK - Was here before
Thomas Mikaele - PR - Was here before
Kevin Naiqama - CE, WG - Was here before
David Nofoaluma - WG, - Was here before
Russell Packer (c) - PR - Cleary
Josh Reynolds (c) - FE, HK - Cleary
Robbie Rochow - SR, PR - Cleary
Bayley Sironen - LK, FE - Was here before
Dylan Smith - FB - Cleary
Sauaso Sue - PR, LK - Was here before
Elijah Taylor (c) - LK, SR - Was here before
Corey Thompson - FB, WG - Cleary
Alex Twal - PR - Cleary
Malakai Watene-Zelezniak - WG, CE - Cleary

He sure inherited a large chunk of the squad no?

That's not even the point. I am blown away that people want to put it on the coach who has wooden spoon favourites running 10th and competing when he is year one into a rebuild. Support the club! He's only just started!
Besides Lawrence, Sue and Aloiai, he either signed or re-signed every one of those players listed. Meaning after he came on board, he extended the contracts of players off contract
Yeah IC singed nearly all of our squad but he had to sign someone didn't he

Our best player's were leaving and it's not like you can force players to come in and replace them

He had to put offers to whoever was available and hope they would accept his offer

Plenty of players said no

He pretty much got the best side he could put together at the time and no its not a great side but apart from today they have been competing

Also some player's got longer deals on bigger money than most people would agree with but he probably had to offer that to get a half decent side together to be competitive in the 1st right

And let's face it they have already over achieved according to some people

Yes as supporters we are sickof all this rebuilding crap but like MacDougall i think we are on the right track with IC

Unfortunately there is going to be a lot more pain on the way to getting where we want to be
x2 but the problem is many people demand instant success. The problem is there are 15 other clubs some with many advantages we dont have trying to do the same.

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Post by GNR4LIFE » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 9:08 pm

MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 9:06 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 9:02 pm
MacDougall wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:59 pm
GNR4LIFE wrote:
Sun 17 Jun, 2018 8:57 pm

Pick a hooker for starters.
So he didn't start the game with McIlwrick today?
He did. 6 weeks too late
He has been rotating the other four through there the entire time.

McIlwrick is not the reason we aren't running in the top 4. The dude played himself out the side early in the year by sucking.

Do you think Cleary wants to play Taylor at 9? He doesn't know what to do with the hooker problem. Nobody does. Picking McIlwrick is not the answer and never was.
Outside Liddle, he’s the best answer we have.

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Post by Geo. » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 9:09 pm

Liddle got through the full 80 in ISP today .. up there with our best in a scrapfest..so that's a positive..
Ivan's Laws

1. You are either on the Bus or you are off..
2. The Star of the Team is the Team
3. Be the player your teammates want to play with..

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Post by MacDougall » Sun 17 Jun, 2018 9:10 pm

Agreed. Personally I would say Liddle just needs to be picked if he's healthy from now on. Even if he has bad days. He just needs to develop in first grade.

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