Flogging a dead horse, but Right side defence again

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Flogging a dead horse, but Right side defence again

Post by Goose » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 4:04 pm

Not giving away any secrets, but the right side defense again copped a bath.

We seemed committed to playing a big up and in defense, but copped it again out wide.

Normally it seems mostly Kevvie and Noffa that struggle with the structure, I think that Moses seemed to be the main culprit

I probably could just copy and paste the same comment every week.

The thing is Im not sure dropping them is the answer, they offer a bit in other areas.....


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Post by Love the WestsTigers » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 4:07 pm

I saw Lovett defending on that side for a little while in the 2nd half
Honestly not a bad option but if he misses the tackle then there is no hope for him to run down anyone with his pace.

I dont how a lock can go down that far wide but i'd like to see ET help out on that edge.
He makes a lot of tackles in the middle which isnt as bad as our RHS D

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Post by Love the WestsTigers » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 4:14 pm

Goose wrote:The thing is Im not sure dropping them is the answer, they offer a bit in other areas.....
Contrary to what most will say i think both these have a lot to offer outside their defensive flaws.

Naiqama hits people hard front on (struggles laterally), runs hard and is surprisingly quick
Nofo skips, hops, from dummy half to get a lot of line breaks and tackle busts.

Its a shame their defence is so poor collectively at this stage though.
I saw Naiqama jam in so many times and Nofo just held back.

They are +-, doing opposites to one another.. More like Tag Team
Have a look at their Stats so far from
https://www.totalfootystats.com.au/nrl- ... 4M5xuh96Uk

Sorry couldnt make it any better but Hold Down CTRL on the Keyboard and use the wheel on the Mouse to Scroll and Zoom in
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Post by ricksen » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 4:40 pm

It's the whole edge in unison. They don't get much support from the second rower on that side (Aloiai or particularly Lovett) in terms of lateral movement, so they panic and jam in far too regularly.

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Post by Bones » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 5:22 pm

I'm starting to wonder about Aloiai being on that edge. I honestly don't think at this stage he is up to it and long term i don't think he has the speed or lateral movement to be an edge player.

I know it isn't his fault but we really need an edge back rower who can help make that side stronger rather than adding to the problem and Josh should go back to the bench as a middle forward.

Dare i say that edge was working better defensively when Sirro was there.

Obviously longer term i think the solution is a better defensive centre.


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Post by formerguest » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 5:34 pm

Yeah, pros and cons, but something has changed and the edge seems much weaker lately than it was earlier in the season.

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Post by supercoach » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 5:41 pm

From what I have seen there are players flying out of the line all over the place, Moses,Kev,Simona,Brooks and Nofa have all been guilty. So I guess it is all part of Kidwell's defence plan. Its great when it comes off but any team that is patient and has a 6 or 7 with a good passing game will have a field day as has been highlighted this year.

Its funny, I think our defence has really improved this year, but the stats tell you a different story. We could become one hell of a side if we could just bring the points we concede a game back by 10 a game.

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Post by innsaneink » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 5:49 pm

Our attitudes improved, & our hustle and scramble...we still cant wrestle, does my head in seeing two tacklers still getting off the deck as the opp dummy half takes off
The attitude is there, they just dont know how to execute defense and put a strong structure into place (coaches and players)

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Post by Love the WestsTigers » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 6:00 pm

formerguest wrote:Yeah, pros and cons, but something has changed and the edge seems much weaker lately than it was earlier in the season.
RATE button is missing so i have to do it the ol fashioned way

I like this post . right now i can say its lack of confidence but it will be interesting to find out if its definately related to personnel changes

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Post by larrycorowa » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 6:21 pm

These boys have got to sort it out themselves....and our opposition will give them plenty of practice. Unless they get better it could spell the end of some careers. I suspect it has plenty to do with what's going on inside of Kev.

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Post by stevetiger » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 6:37 pm

Goose wrote:Not giving away any secrets, but the right side defense again copped a bath.

We seemed committed to playing a big up and in defense, but copped it again out wide.

Normally it seems mostly Kevvie and Noffa that struggle with the structure, I think that Moses seemed to be the main culprit

I probably could just copy and paste the same comment every week.

The thing is Im not sure dropping them is the answer, they offer a bit in other areas.....
I don't think that many people are getting it but it's a coaching decision to play this defensive structure. To add to that all the players mentioned have defensive flaws when it comes to making defensive decisions and in Moses case also making the tackle.

I couldn't drop any of them because they are great in other areas and improving. I'm also not sure if changing the defensive structure is the way to go.

Is this just an issue that we have to accept and hope they get it right or better put the balance between the positive aspect of playing this style with these players compared to the negative aspect over the course of the season will work out in our favour.

I think it's a conscious decision that has been made to protect Moses and not get busted up the middle.

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Post by Tigerdon » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 6:39 pm

If you try to fix the problem by bringing in stronger defensive players then you create different problems elsewhere.
The current backline is a good attacking unit.
If you brought MKC into centre and Sirro playing 2nd row on that edge then you minus the strength of Alioia and the speed of Kev. Plus you get Sirro's overall minimal workrate. So there are no easy solutions.
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Post by stevetiger » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 7:37 pm

Tigerdon wrote:If you try to fix the problem by bringing in stronger defensive players then you create different problems elsewhere.
Exactly. We could change our defensive structures but I think we would get caught out in other ways.

There is no easy solution. I personally think at this point the best solution is to stick with what we have and hopefully it starts working better.

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Post by Love the WestsTigers » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 7:46 pm

stevetiger wrote:
Tigerdon wrote:If you try to fix the problem by bringing in stronger defensive players then you create different problems elsewhere.
Exactly. We could change our defensive structures but I think we would get caught out in other ways.

There is no easy solution. I personally think at this point the best solution is to stick with what we have and hopefully it starts working better.
Even better solution. Just score more points than we leak.
who cares if opposition puts 20 points via the right edge, as long as we outscore them.
2 points after each round is all that matters right ?


Its a game of chess, you could be strategic and plan your long term moves or go piece for piece.

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Post by 851 » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 7:49 pm

Bones wrote:I'm starting to wonder about Aloiai being on that edge. I honestly don't think at this stage he is up to it and long term i don't think he has the speed or lateral movement to be an edge player.

I know it isn't his fault but we really need an edge back rower who can help make that side stronger rather than adding to the problem and Josh should go back to the bench as a middle forward.

Dare i say that edge was working better defensively when Sirro was there.

Obviously longer term i think the solution is a better defensive centre.
I am not sold on Aloiai either, he doesn't seem to offer much, maybe this is where the change needs to be made, maybe Sue,but he is going good where he is.
Go hard or go home

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Post by Harvey » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 7:59 pm

There is no co-ordination in this defence. You can play up & in, but you need to comunicate so that those around you are on the same page. Kev is a special for racing up, but Mitch Moses is also defending on te same side and is just as bad.
Once again, who is the defence coach? How long has he been there? What has he achieved?
The answer to these questions produce the next one, why is he still there? Kidwell should have been sacked 2 coaches ago, but is still floating around.

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Post by Geo. » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 8:05 pm

:deadhorse:
Ivan's Laws

1. You are either on the Bus or you are off..
2. The Star of the Team is the Team
3. Be the player your teammates want to play with..

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Post by Chevy » Mon 11 Jul, 2016 8:11 pm

Defence issues aside but is there another team in the comp that butchers tries the way the WT do,with our dodgey defence we cant afford to keep doing it.

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