Moltzen

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Kickoff: 3pm, Sunday 3 April
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Re: Moltzen

Post by Goose » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 11:22 am

stryker wrote:He still needs time, was about a 5 at best today.

Defense was ordinary, attack starting to get there.

I'd keep him at half though....he isnt defending well enough to play centre.
I cant believe how much everyone is bagging Moltz defence, he missed 1 tackle on SKD, in open play one on one, the hardest tackle to make, on one of the hardest blokes to tackle, he had zero ineffective tackles....do we expect how halfback to tackle like Gareth Ellis and dominate every tackle???

If people had of said he should have kicked better, i'd say sure, but I reckon people are judging the game on precconceived ideas


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Post by 851 » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 11:37 am

MacDougall wrote:Really should have been the other way around. Miller starting, Moltzen there to pick up the pieces if Miller wasn't working.
Exactly,if Sheens run with the team selected it might have been a different result,Daniela wouldn't have made those school boy handling and defensive errors and we might have won.
Go hard or go home

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Post by cktiger » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 11:41 am

Totally agree with you Goose.
Thought he had a pretty good game seeing he's only had little time on the ground this year.
He took a couple of hard knocks and got right back into the action. Like the way he follows the play too.
He'll only get better.

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Post by happy tiger » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 11:51 am

Goose wrote:
stryker wrote:He still needs time, was about a 5 at best today.

Defense was ordinary, attack starting to get there.

I'd keep him at half though....he isnt defending well enough to play centre.
I cant believe how much everyone is bagging Moltz defence, he missed 1 tackle on SKD, in open play one on one, the hardest tackle to make, on one of the hardest blokes to tackle, he had zero ineffective tackles....do we expect how halfback to tackle like Gareth Ellis and dominate every tackle???

If people had of said he should have kicked better, i'd say sure, but I reckon people are judging the game on precconceived ideas
As I said last week Moltzen still isn't Moltzen and it will take a while still it is obvious he still has issues (Phsyical) with his knee . At one stage in 2nd half he had an open line with Rhino outside and he sort of half stopped \stumbled . I think you will find that was knee still . He played ok don't get me wrong But i would of liked to see the team we named to start start .

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Post by prattenpark » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 12:58 pm

Should be battling it out with Brown and Daniella for a spot on the bench or a starting position in the State Cup.
Unfortunately, injuries meant he got a guernsey. Woefully underdone and with 20-20 hindsight a tactical blunder by Sheens to start him at half.
But, you also have to take into account the opposition - last years grand finalists, with one of the best half/five eighth combos who were looking to make a point after criticism of their recent performances - it was always gonna be a huge ask for Tigers yesterday.
Longer term, i'm not sure what to do with Moltzen. Lui is a much better half and Moltzen was never convincing, or looked happy, at fullback. Time will tell whether he can step up and fulfill the potential he has shown - I think he could go either way - be a champ or fall by the wayside.


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Post by Geo. » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 1:36 pm

Chadman's Ghost wrote:Moltzen offers one of the best individual attacking options for the Tigers. He has the ability to create something off his own bat- and given the injury list, this can't be overlooked.

Coming back from a long-term injury, I expect it'll take him a couple of weeks to fully get his rythem. How long would it take for Miller to get comfotrable starting? 6 weeks or more? Then Lui's back...

Best bet is to play Moltz, get him some game time, and let Benji do his thing.
Hoooray....some else sees it too....few more weeks scheming with Benji in combination will see Moltzen at his best.....almost saw it in the 1st and 74th min yesterday....
Ivan's Laws

1. You are either on the Bus or you are off..
2. The Star of the Team is the Team
3. Be the player your teammates want to play with..

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Post by southerntiger » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 1:40 pm

Geo I actually thought he had an okay game. Didnt look much different to how he usually plays at halfback for mine.

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Post by hybrid_tiger » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 1:44 pm

Goose wrote:
stryker wrote:He still needs time, was about a 5 at best today.

Defense was ordinary, attack starting to get there.

I'd keep him at half though....he isnt defending well enough to play centre.
I cant believe how much everyone is bagging Moltz defence, he missed 1 tackle on SKD, in open play one on one, the hardest tackle to make, on one of the hardest blokes to tackle, he had zero ineffective tackles....do we expect how halfback to tackle like Gareth Ellis and dominate every tackle???

If people had of said he should have kicked better, i'd say sure, but I reckon people are judging the game on precconceived ideas
Who said they want him to tackle like Ellis? :crazy

My main point of this thread was that he was underdone and that people at the start of the year calling for him to play halfback and fullback were deluded, which they are. Yesterday proved he is way off the pace and he should not even be mentioned for any key position.

I didn't expect him to play well, because he is still not match fit and realistically it will take him at least half the season to get into his stride. IMO he is a good player with excellent potential, but the way people talk about him around here its as if he is a superstar. He is not.

McKinnon and Brown are far superior options at fullback, and Lui and Miller should be picked at half before Moltzen is. When he is fully fit and confident, then we can see what position he should full, but I suspect it should be none of the above.

Personally I think he's best off at centre, but he would never make a full strength side given we have Ayshford and Lawrence available. So perhaps his best spot now is replacing Lawrence.

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Post by magpiecol » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 2:09 pm

hybrid_tiger wrote:
tiger05 wrote:
hybrid_tiger wrote:People wanted him at half instead of Lui, or at fullback instead of McKinnon. That is laughable, that's my point. The guy is not even match fit yet and some people want him starting in a key position.
I still want him at fullback instead of McKinnon however I can see your point but only because McKinnon has stepped it up recently. McKinnon lacks speed. He is a true fullback but he lacks the speed to really give the opposition problems. Moltzen could cause the opposition problems the issue with playing him at 1 is that defensively he doesn't seem up to it at the moment.
McKinnon may lack pace but he is the only fullback we have who's support play is top notch. Moltzen could never offer the same from fullback and his defense is terrible.

Who was there to take the offload in the first set when we almost scored? Who was constantly sniffing around the ruck looking for offloads all afternoon? Who made over 200 meters? McKinnon.

He may be slow but the bagging he has copped this year is pretty pathetic. The only thing he lacks is speed, which is understandable given his age and previous injuries. McKinnon has every attribute you want in a fullback.

As for Moltzen, I am not bagging him, I am bagging the people who want him playing a key position like halfback or fullback. Today showed he is way off the pace and should not even be mentioned for either of those positions. Lui is our first choice halfback, Miller should be second choice. And I would play Brown at fullback before Moltzen if McKinnon was not available for whatever reason.
McKinnon played great. You obviously have not seen Mullaney play. He is the best sniffer of a try in the club and has been for some time. He also has pace and can kick goals.

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Post by tigerbenji » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 3:00 pm

I agree with goose i thought moltzen played o.k yesterday & the further the game went the better he went, we couldnt hold the ball for six tackles, & our forwards looked sluggish. we still had our chances in the second half & were still in the game with 10 to 15 minutes to go WUT WE COULDNT HOLD THE BLOODY BALL. so lets go out on friday night & ride the tigers home to a win. also if we score the first try things could of been different.

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Post by hammertime » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 3:06 pm

magpiecol wrote:
hybrid_tiger wrote:
tiger05 wrote:
hybrid_tiger wrote:People wanted him at half instead of Lui, or at fullback instead of McKinnon. That is laughable, that's my point. The guy is not even match fit yet and some people want him starting in a key position.
I still want him at fullback instead of McKinnon however I can see your point but only because McKinnon has stepped it up recently. McKinnon lacks speed. He is a true fullback but he lacks the speed to really give the opposition problems. Moltzen could cause the opposition problems the issue with playing him at 1 is that defensively he doesn't seem up to it at the moment.
McKinnon may lack pace but he is the only fullback we have who's support play is top notch. Moltzen could never offer the same from fullback and his defense is terrible.

Who was there to take the offload in the first set when we almost scored? Who was constantly sniffing around the ruck looking for offloads all afternoon? Who made over 200 meters? McKinnon.

He may be slow but the bagging he has copped this year is pretty pathetic. The only thing he lacks is speed, which is understandable given his age and previous injuries. McKinnon has every attribute you want in a fullback.

As for Moltzen, I am not bagging him, I am bagging the people who want him playing a key position like halfback or fullback. Today showed he is way off the pace and should not even be mentioned for either of those positions. Lui is our first choice halfback, Miller should be second choice. And I would play Brown at fullback before Moltzen if McKinnon was not available for whatever reason.
McKinnon played great. You obviously have not seen Mullaney play. He is the best sniffer of a try in the club and has been for some time. He also has pace and can kick goals.
After last game, I've been thinking that we really could use Mullaney in the squad right now to give us some attack. Lets face it, McKinnon is no amazing defender and that's the main concern with Mullany. I really would like to see him on the bench this week to come in for 20-30 minutes and add some spark.

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Post by hybrid_tiger » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 3:28 pm

magpiecol wrote:
hybrid_tiger wrote:
tiger05 wrote:
hybrid_tiger wrote:People wanted him at half instead of Lui, or at fullback instead of McKinnon. That is laughable, that's my point. The guy is not even match fit yet and some people want him starting in a key position.
I still want him at fullback instead of McKinnon however I can see your point but only because McKinnon has stepped it up recently. McKinnon lacks speed. He is a true fullback but he lacks the speed to really give the opposition problems. Moltzen could cause the opposition problems the issue with playing him at 1 is that defensively he doesn't seem up to it at the moment.
McKinnon may lack pace but he is the only fullback we have who's support play is top notch. Moltzen could never offer the same from fullback and his defense is terrible.

Who was there to take the offload in the first set when we almost scored? Who was constantly sniffing around the ruck looking for offloads all afternoon? Who made over 200 meters? McKinnon.

He may be slow but the bagging he has copped this year is pretty pathetic. The only thing he lacks is speed, which is understandable given his age and previous injuries. McKinnon has every attribute you want in a fullback.

As for Moltzen, I am not bagging him, I am bagging the people who want him playing a key position like halfback or fullback. Today showed he is way off the pace and should not even be mentioned for either of those positions. Lui is our first choice halfback, Miller should be second choice. And I would play Brown at fullback before Moltzen if McKinnon was not available for whatever reason.
McKinnon played great. You obviously have not seen Mullaney play. He is the best sniffer of a try in the club and has been for some time. He also has pace and can kick goals.
I have seen Mullaney play, and there is a good reason why he hasn't played FG yet.

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Post by cktiger » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 3:32 pm

If they put Mullaney in we will have both him and Miller as better kickers than Benji.
Anyone think they will be first choice kickers?
People have short memories - you could see glimpses of Moltzen's class yesterday.
Our main problem yesterday was stupid mistakes ( and a few dumb decisions by refs didn't help)

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Post by Chadman's Ghost » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 4:45 pm

Now, I'll admit I have no experience with Miller outside of what I saw on Sunday...but...

One thing I think we are overlooking when evaluating who should start at Half is this- we are down a MASSIVE amount of troops.

If you put in an 'organiser' like what Miller seems to be, you have to surround him with players that can take advantage of that. Right now- I'm not sure we have those troops.

If Moltzen plays- he offers a different type of style- more individual. He is more likely to create something himself & not rely on his support cast so much.

Add to this- Farah is a passenger & is now pretty much relegated to organiser as he can't do much himself.

Given the injury list, given the amount of inexperience on the field, Moltzen, for mine, simply offers the best chance at winning.

If we had most of our forwards back & Lui was the only significant injury- I'd be more tempted to play Miller.

but right now- this team doesn't need an inexperienced organiser in order to win games.

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Post by angeman » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 7:21 pm

unfortunately moltzen is lacking confidence at it clouds his decisions in defence.

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Post by mtd » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 7:28 pm

apart from the lack of involvement he had, i think people are being quite harsh.. he looks dangerous with the ball, did a few good kicks and got himself in positions to set up other players (the other players just weren't there)...

i do however agree that there was no point playing miller there for 20 mins.. shoulda been 80 mins or nothing...

personally, i'd like to see moltz in the halves again next week.

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Post by mtd » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 7:36 pm

hybrid_tiger wrote:My main point of this thread was that he was underdone and that people at the start of the year calling for him to play halfback and fullback were deluded, which they are. Yesterday proved he is way off the pace and he should not even be mentioned for any key position.
moltz is a superstar in the making... the only ones delusional are the ones who can't see it.

for you to 'claim' that yesterday proved he shouldn't be mentioned for a key position is laughable. it was his first game starting in the halves in god knows how long. to expect him to come in and work his magic is, once again, laughable.

if we play him for the 6 weeks lui is out and i guarentee lui wont have his spot back.

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Post by Suzie-Q » Mon 04 Apr, 2011 7:55 pm

851 wrote:Sheens talked up Miller,and he should have started,Moltzen"s defence is woefull,he needs to go back to reggies(with Daniela) and get some match practice.
I agree Miller should have started. He's a halfback. Let him do his job.

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