I Will Finally Call It!

All First Grade related topics in regards to the off-season through to Season 2012
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Chris
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I Will Finally Call It!

Post by Chris » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 12:08 am

For 7 long hard years, I have argued with, belittled, lost my cool and finally begged members on here about keeping Tim as our head coach. I have found every excuse in the book to defend Tim Sheens but now the time has come for it to end. He has assembled, arguably, the best playing roster in the NRL. Our club has never looked any better on and off the field than what it does at the moment. Barring any major off field incident, if we don't make the grand final in 2012, I will be calling for a new head coach.

We arguably have the best pack of forwards and potentially, the most explosive backline in the NRL. We bragged about our depth in 2011, I think our depth is even deeper in 2012 so this should quite easily account for any injuries that we may incur. That includes any injuries to players like Ellis, Farah and Benji. We have the cattle and we have finals footy experience.

Either we make the 2012 Grand Final or Tim needs to step aside and possibly be our Coaching Director and let someone like Steve Georgallis have a crack.


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Post by happy tiger » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 12:13 am

I agree Chris with what you are saying but will depend on how we fare in the 7 jersey
If the new 7 steps up we will be the scariest side in the competition
If he doesn't could be a completely different story

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Post by GNR4LIFE » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 12:17 am

As long as we find the right balance at 1 and 7, i'll say we'll have no excuses. Don't want to get too far ahead of myself, but if we have a similar year in 2012 to what we had in '10 and '11 and get eliminated in the finals, does the question of wether or not Sheens can take us that extra step deserve to be asked?

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Post by Brisbane Tiger » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 12:42 am

No. I disagree. We will make the finals and that is thanks to tim. If we go further that's up to the team on the day. Don't forget we have the team we have now thanks to tim.
And lastly, sorry but Marshall is not replaceable , if we lose him for any long period we are gone.
My 2 cents.


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Post by one-eyed-tiger » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 12:47 am

This is exactly my fear. Everyone expects a premiership to fall in our laps. But these things are incredibly difficult. You need a great team and a LOT of luck. I hope for the best too - and i DREAM of celebrating our team lifting a trophy on GF day (which happens to coincide with my birthday in 2012) (as stressful and emotional as that will be!) but we can't call for heads to roll if all the pieces don't magically fall into place. Support the Tigers 4 life!!!


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Post by stryker » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 1:26 am

Do we have the team to win in 2012? - Yes. We will field the strongest Wests Tigers side ever.

Mentally can the players do it? - Yes. We had 7 guys playing in this years 4 nations comp and a duel international winger all in our run on side.

Do we have the depth? - Yes. Some promising juniors are in the wings and we have bought well.

Can we suffer major injuries to key personnel? - Yes...With the exception of Marshal I think we can get to the finals even with bad injuries to our stars. There are enough accomplished and experienced players to cover for all bar Benji.

Can we handle being the favourites? - Maybe...History says no but it is about time that we evolve into the side that can be constant front runners.

What are our weaknesses? - Now that Moltz is staying and judging by the way he finished this year off he can cover either half or fullback. With the purchase of Reddy, I would love to see Tim as 1/2 back and Joel as custodian. If this happens, my only question will be Lote. He is a champion though and hopefully has one great year left in him.

Will rep footy hurt us? - Yes I think it will. I expect us to be at the pointy end around origin time which will result in Robbie, Kieth and Chris to be starters for NSW with Woods and possibly Moltz or Ayshford as smokies. Throw in the mid year test and this will be a tough period for the club. We are not used to this and it may slow our progress for a couple of months.

Expectations? - I agree with Chris...I think we should be well placed to have our second GF berth and hopefully win the whole show. Depending upon circumstance, I think a GF berth is a must for the talent in the squad. Luck does play it's part but it can also be created by the top players. We have our fair share of these types.

Should Sheens face the chop? - Depends...if we experience any floggings this year or the players drop their bundles again the question has to be asked. We shouldnt have to do it tough to make the 8. We are one of the best sides. We really should finish top 4 as a minimum.

Should we consider the year a failure if we fail to win the big one? - No absolutely not. Not at this stage. I really want us to play in the decider but if this doesnt happen because of some freak football from another side I cant blame the boys for missing out. Thats life and thats football.

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Post by Tiger Watto » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 6:32 am

A fair expectation considering where we are at in terms of our playing roster, but there is alot of variables that go into making the Finals, reaching the Grand Final and winning the Title. I think only after the season is over can you really do an assessment that could ultimately see the club making changes like punting a Head Coach. Furthermore, the decision of punting a head coach also has many variables. Is there another suitable option is probably the biggest question. Georgalis has no real NRL experience and while he is tied to the club through past achievements, he doesn't have a suitable resume to be in charge of an assembled squad as this playing group. If you feel Tim can't get this team to go that extra step, why would you think a nobody coach can.

Do we really have the best squad? Are we suspect in the Frontrow? Are we able to get our new 7 to compliment our 9 & 6? Is our depth as capable as we think? Sounds like we have alot of variables to our season before the year even starts.

I feel we are a Top 8 team. The rest....
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Post by Frank the tank » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 7:16 am

I agree with everything said in stryker's post.......Well said. I Can't add anything of substance to that
I'm not a complete idiot.............there are some pieces missing!

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Post by Balmain Bug » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 7:20 am

Fifita and Gibbs are massive losses.
Wests Tigers colours are Black, White & Orange. Balmain are Black & Orange. Wests Tigers are not Balmain. Please take note Wests Tigers CEO.

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Post by willow » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 8:07 am

Balmain Bug wrote:Fifita and Gibbs are massive losses.
Gibbs is a loss, Fifita is easily covered by the emergence and consistency of Woods and Groat, who both run straight for that matter - something Fifita had trouble doing.

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Post by tigerbenji » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 8:26 am

We have a great squad, our biggest problem will be replacing Gibbs as i feel he is the best defensive prop in the game. Fifita might end up a good player but @ the moment he cant stop running sideways, & no one can replace Benji if he is out.

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Post by cunno » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 9:16 am

Agree with you Chris, the club is in a strong position and yes Sheens and co have assembled a strong squad, with that comes added pressure on Sheens. He has a team that should do well with many quality players who have all moved along in experience as well. Sheens will need to produce results to satisfy the expectations of all those interested in Wests Tigers success. There are a few areas to watch though, half and fullback as mentioned and I hope Benji stays fit as he would be hard to replace. As mentioned SOO could hit us significantly but I'd be very surprised if Robbie gets a run unless Ennis is injured (not that I agree with Ennis' selection but he has the political pals). I see planning and the ability to be flexible and adapt where the plans are influenced by injury, rep selections, egos, team harmony etc as essential to Sheens management of the teams progress and success. Having said this, he will need to ensure the basics are taken care of in terms of game plans and tactics for opposition teams as well as fitness and injury management.

In summary it is a year where the ball is definitely in sheens court imo, he has been around for a long time and with his experience and commitment should get there.

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Post by T-REXX » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 9:28 am

Balmain Bug wrote:Fifita and Gibbs are massive losses.
Fifita was going to be a liabiltiy.. He could have cost us games with his poor attitude and defence. His fend can only go so far

Gibbs is a huge loss. His defensive work was 2nd to none. But at the same time we have him covered to. His injurys were becoming worse and every year less game time and would have been better to hold on to Groat and Woods then keep Gibbs... Club has made the right decisions i think

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Post by Tiger Watto » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 9:43 am

T-REXX wrote:
Balmain Bug wrote:Fifita and Gibbs are massive losses.
Fifita was going to be a liabiltiy.. He could have cost us games with his poor attitude and defence. His fend can only go so far

Gibbs is a huge loss. His defensive work was 2nd to none. But at the same time we have him covered to. His injurys were becoming worse and every year less game time and would have been better to hold on to Groat and Woods then keep Gibbs... Club has made the right decisions i think
yep... Age and injuries was the main reason I was supportive of moving Bryce on. Woods will be something special in the next 2-3 years and I couldnt see any reason to hold him back.

Funnily enough, I notice Cronulla have signed Ben Ross again to 'stock up' there Frontrow depth?
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Post by supercoach » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 9:46 am

Iam happy with a top four finish, really once you get their anything can happen. On top of being a great side in top form you need luck,you need to get the close calls and you need to be injury free. Last year we make the right fifth tackle option and we could have been playing Manly in the big one.

Iam not so optimistic as a lot on this forum, rookie no7,work in progress no1, no Gibbs, Ellis and Rhino starting to come back to the field a little, woods and groat second season syndrome, goal kicking, big game decision making and the lack of that Manly mongrel attitude. Time will tell, we should be in the mix, but every team in this comp is in with a show in round one, its that close come the last round its the team with the hard nose attitude and plenty of luck that usually prevails.

As for Sheens, I must be getting old but I will give him a top five pass mark

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Post by happy tiger » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 9:52 am

It will be interesting to see how Sheens covers for Gibbs

We are at our best when we are rushing up in defense and maintaining a good defensive line speed and imo Bryce is the best at that in the NRL

As seen in the last 50 minutes in the Warriors semi we kept getting bent back in defence and had no line speed

Blair will help in defence with his wrestling skills but he can't make every tackle

Along with the 7 issue this is next biggest concern

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Post by king sirro » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 10:27 am

Yes we do have a very strong roster, and our depth is 2nd to none.

However im prepared to wait for 8 to 10 rounds into the conpitition before i start calling for a Grand Final and nothing less. My reasons for this are:

1. We are going into the comp with no idea who our 7 will be, and whoever we choose will be unproven. Its a big ask to win a comp like that as in my eyes, halfback is the most important position in rugby league.;..its not as important at the Tigers as other clubs, because Farah and Marshall play such significant roles, but generally speaking going into a comp expecting to win it with an unknown halfback is very difficult.

2.Ill be waiting to see if we can step up defensively around the ruck. Gibbs and Payten held our pack together in this department and those little extra efforts need to be made by someone else. If a die hard Saints supporter tells me Gibbs saves more tries than any other forward in the comp, then thats enough for me to realise he may be hard to replace.

So yeh we have a great roster and depth, but theres some things that need to be worked out IMO before we look to October. If we do pull it off in 2012, i think it will be one of the most satisfying and well deserved premierships ever.

Im pumped to watch our new number 7, whoever that may be.
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Post by white_tiger » Fri 30 Dec, 2011 11:07 am

End of the day the reason we look so good for 2012, both on and off the field is greatly thanks to Tim Sheens. He has assembled an excellent playing roster and it was definatley not Tim's fault we didnt make the GF in 2010 and in 2011, we did everything right to beat the warriors except win.

If Tim picks players in their correct positions in 2012 I can only see us being successful again
Last edited by white_tiger on Fri 30 Dec, 2011 11:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

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