Molten

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Re: Molten

Post by Snake » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 11:41 am

tomcat wrote:
king sirro wrote:Id support Moltzen being named at fullback again. And i believe his mistakes last night wont happen again.
Are you Tim Sheens or Tim Moltzen ??
To call your self a 1st gader and not to even contest a bomb! what happened last night WILL happen again and again .I have my view on why Moltzen did not want to go to the Dragons he did not want to play fullback full stop.


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Post by Irvine » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 12:02 pm

There didn't seem any miscommunication when Tedesco was taking bombs in the trials. Even as a rookie he knew it was his job. Moltzen knows its his job he just doesn't want to do it.

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Post by willow » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 12:27 pm

The Tigers need a solution at half and fullback. At the moment, the options in place are not truly working as they should. Humble tries, but lacks the creativity and kicking game to relieve pressure on Marshall and Farah. Moltzen is capable of good plays, but has his moments of weakness where he fails to commit himself 100% out on the field. Last night was an example. I know he's got some big boys running at him, but that's what he is paid for. Slater isn't big but has no hesitation in throwing himself at the ball.

Half of the Tigers problems in attack stem from the fact they don't have a proper fullback or halfback playing to their absolute full potential.

Should Moltzen be dropped after last night's performance? Yes, but he probably won't be. The thing is, at this stage the Tigers are not in a position where they can afford to wait for Moltzen to find form in the last 8 weeks of the competition. The Tigers season will be over by then at this rate.

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Post by king sirro » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 12:41 pm

Well even Lockyer blamed Ryan for the first bomb.....just saying
LAUGH NOW CRY LATER--JS

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Post by Granto87 » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 12:43 pm

Moltzen looks scared at least he could have a dig at catching it on the full, imo Mckinnon was good in terms of puting his body on the line and sniffing around for an offload, Moltzen only follows Benji, pitty Mckinnon was slow and injury prone because he really made a difference to our team. I think if Tedesco was injury free our attack wouldn't be struggling at times you can see half opertunities created where a traditional fullback would crack the line and finish off.


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Post by underdog » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 12:47 pm

Irvine wrote:There didn't seem any miscommunication when Tedesco was taking bombs in the trials. Even as a rookie he knew it was his job. Moltzen knows its his job he just doesn't want to do it.
this is very true.

Tedesco would have taken all the bombs thrown at him last night including the fortunate "knock-back" by Jack Reed.
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Post by innsaneink » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 12:50 pm

bbobb wrote:Whatever anyone says about him - Moltzen is a classy player and as they say class is permanent and form is temporary.

I think most would agree this is true but there are problems. In my opinion, Tim is not as mentally strong as some other players. Mistakes, injuries etc all play on his mind and he cannot seem to play through it to the detriment of his performances.

When he returned from his ACL injury, he was extremely tentative - I think the thought of it happening again really worried him. This is not we as fans expect from our first grade team as some put their bodies on the line week in weekout and play through injury.

Again last night, I cannot help but think that his timidity was in part due to Crocker's hit from the previous week which left him concussed. Was he thinking to himself, if I take this bomb who is going to come and hit me?

After the Bronco's game, Tim will need to rebuid his confidence. I think the interesting part is who Sheens will handle this dilemma. Will a fortnight in state cup allow him to regain his confidence or will it further eat away at Tim as he feels he is on the outer? If Sheens picks him again and there is a repeat of this week's performance - what then?

There is an upside to this. When "confidence" players are down, they are really down but when they get their mojo they can be absolutely devastating.
The thing is, he took the first bomb fine iirc.
That shouldve boosted his confidence.

hannanr

Post by hannanr » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 1:04 pm

boonboon wrote:Look I abused him as much as everyone else their last night. But in the clear light of day - he messed up 2 bombs - yes he should have gone for them as he is the fullback - other then that though he played well. He is the best choice at fullback, he had a bad night under the high ball - im sure it will be practiced hard all week and he wont make the same mistakes next week when Luke Walsh peppers him with high kicks
Moltzen will continue to get the support of the coach and his room buddie. It doesn't matter how bad he goes/keeps going. Law of averages suggests he will have a reasonable game soon. We will then have all the Moltzen apologists crowing how good he is. I feel sorry for all the poor buggers who have a go week in and week out and have to try and cover up his messes.

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Post by Swordy » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 1:09 pm

I think everyone has different opinions. I am a big fan of Moltzen because he has something extra. There is no doubt his confidence is right down at the moment. There are a thousand reasons why, but some who dislike him simply dislike him and thats fair enough. He isn't doing much to disprove their opinion. I think it doesn't matter who you are when you train all pre-season in one position, last four games and then get changed. The same is happening to Humble.

I can't complain too much, many on here seem to think that BMM is the next big thing. I personally have not seen one single thing from him that makes me think he is nothing more than a stop gap forward. That may change but time will tell. I would be happy to be proven wrong.

I may be proved wrong on either assessment.

I think Moltzen is not going well in a team of others not going well confidence wise and one that has been smashed through injury. I personally would not make any changes based on performances of the last 2 weeks.
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Post by tominator » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 1:38 pm

I hope that this game will treat Moltz like the Parra game treated Big Manu Vatuvei. If Moltz is chosen at fullback next week I think he will have a blinder which will increase his confidence 1000%

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Post by bbobb » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 2:02 pm

The thing is, he took the first bomb fine iirc.
That shouldve boosted his confidence.
I see your point ink but in my opinion his mental fragility makes him a unpredictable. Really is a case of rocks and diamonds at the moment. The whole half back to full back thing would not do a player like Moltzen any good at all.

I am leaning to giving him another shot at fullback. Let him get some self confidence from others (coach, senior players) showing some confidence in him. If we move/drop him now, it could have the opposite of the intended outcome.

I think it is really a case in seeing how effective a man manager TIm Sheens is. If I were him, I'd probably do the exact opposite of what is generally expected. I'd look to get him more involved in the play by building some set pieces around him or encourage him to inject himself into the backline next week. Build on his strengths in the hope they have positive impact on his weaknesses.
Last edited by bbobb on Sat 07 Apr, 2012 2:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by saundo55 » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 2:04 pm

Not Timmy is solely to blame for those bombs - Lockyer said in the call both of those should have been taken by the wingers.
The problem appears to be lack of communication


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Post by Snake » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 2:06 pm

Granto87 wrote:Moltzen looks scared at least he could have a dig at catching it on the full, imo Mckinnon was good in terms of puting his body on the line and sniffing around for an offload, Moltzen only follows Benji, pitty Mckinnon was slow and injury prone because he really made a difference to our team. I think if Tedesco was injury free our attack wouldn't be struggling at times you can see half opertunities created where a traditional fullback would crack the line and finish off.
I don't think Moltzen is the greatest player but I draw the line when the "he looks scared" tag if you play 1st grade scared doesn"t come into it...

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Post by 1/4 chicken,chips » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 3:21 pm

bbobb wrote:Whatever anyone says about him - Moltzen is a classy player and as they say class is permanent and form is temporary.

I think most would agree this is true but there are problems. In my opinion, Tim is not as mentally strong as some other players. Mistakes, injuries etc all play on his mind and he cannot seem to play through it to the detriment of his performances.

When he returned from his ACL injury, he was extremely tentative - I think the thought of it happening again really worried him. This is not we as fans expect from our first grade team as some put their bodies on the line week in weekout and play through injury.

Again last night, I cannot help but think that his timidity was in part due to Crocker's hit from the previous week which left him concussed. Was he thinking to himself, if I take this bomb who is going to come and hit me?

After the Bronco's game, Tim will need to rebuid his confidence. I think the interesting part is who Sheens will handle this dilemma. Will a fortnight in state cup allow him to regain his confidence or will it further eat away at Tim as he feels he is on the outer? If Sheens picks him again and there is a repeat of this week's performance - what then?

There is an upside to this. When "confidence" players are down, they are really down but when they get their mojo they can be absolutely devastating.
hey bboobb how many games does he have to blow before the club admits they erred in keeping him . he has a good turn of pace on the inside ball from benji and thats about it .excuses excuses excuses .

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Post by Glennb » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 5:32 pm

saundo55 wrote:Not Timmy is solely to blame for those bombs - Lockyer said in the call both of those should have been taken by the wingers.
The problem appears to be lack of communication


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And whose role is communication at the back?

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Post by Glennb » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 5:45 pm

bbobb wrote:
The thing is, he took the first bomb fine iirc.
That shouldve boosted his confidence.
I see your point ink but in my opinion his mental fragility makes him a unpredictable. Really is a case of rocks and diamonds at the moment. The whole half back to full back thing would not do a player like Moltzen any good at all.

I am leaning to giving him another shot at fullback. Let him get some self confidence from others (coach, senior players) showing some confidence in him. If we move/drop him now, it could have the opposite of the intended outcome.

I think it is really a case in seeing how effective a man manager TIm Sheens is. If I were him, I'd probably do the exact opposite of what is generally expected. I'd look to get him more involved in the play by building some set pieces around him or encourage him to inject himself into the backline next week. Build on his strengths in the hope they have positive impact on his weaknesses.
I am over this "mental fragility", "lack of confidence", "timid after his hit from Crocker", "man management required by Sheens" fluff. You do realise that we are talking about a NRL first grade player on good coin?

The truth is he DOES look scared (not timid). He has done for a couple of years. I have given him some slack as many else have here because we keep hearing that he has something "special". Can someone fair dinkum tell me what this specialty is? He has had years now to show what he can do and he has shown nothing. Guess what, the emperor is wearing no clothes. This year was the obvious and perfect opportunity for him to stand up. After the St George drama, which lets be honest was embarrassing, more than a full year after his knee op, a crack in his supposed position and he has done what?

He is fast and can run a line that has been given to him and through a hole by Benji. Other than that? Defence? Passing game? kicking Game? Under the high ball?

I felt sorry for him at one stage last night as he just looks out of his depth and should have been put out of his misery, but then I noticed sonething I have noticed a few times this year. On more than one occassion, he is shouting at his team mates, eiterh boring it up them or trying to rev them up. When the team is constantly struggling due to his errors I think he should just shut up and roll his sleeves up but it doesnt happen. I could imagine his team mates getting sick of him to be honest as they are doing a lot of hard work due to his errors, not to mention getting behind on the score board and ultimately losing. At one stage last night I saw Beau Ryan turn to give it to him and he seemed to bite his lip and keep it in.

Hard thing to say, but he is a myth and really cant be persisted with. Possibly he does have the talent that so many espouse about him, but he lacks ticker and hard work and seems to have an inflated opinion of himself. I would rather someone else having a crack.

mc1991

Post by mc1991 » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 6:00 pm

Very disappointing. He started well but I don't know what happened.

Watch the media pull s*** out of their asses now about a rift between the playing squad. Winning hides everything true and not true. Looking forward to stringing some wins together.

After some thinking though we have 18 games left this season, we're 1 from five, meaning for every 1 loss we need to win 2 from here on in to be guaranteed a spot in the 8 with our remaining matches. Achievable.


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Post by Granto87 » Sat 07 Apr, 2012 6:23 pm

Snake wrote:
Granto87 wrote:Moltzen looks scared at least he could have a dig at catching it on the full, imo Mckinnon was good in terms of puting his body on the line and sniffing around for an offload, Moltzen only follows Benji, pitty Mckinnon was slow and injury prone because he really made a difference to our team. I think if Tedesco was injury free our attack wouldn't be struggling at times you can see half opertunities created where a traditional fullback would crack the line and finish off.
I don't think Moltzen is the greatest player but I draw the line when the "he looks scared" tag if you play 1st grade scared doesn"t come into it...
What does he look then, he runs away from the ball when the opposition puts up a bom? or maybe it's just a phobea of catching boms and running it back hard on kick returns? Moltzenitus?

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