HAPPY THAT OUR COACH IS IVAN CLEARY

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Masterton
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Re: HAPPY THAT OUR COACH IS IVAN CLEARY

Unread post by Masterton » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 3:57 pm

sheer64 wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 3:11 pm
Don't remember Potter doing it either. Is this our problem?
When the players have more power than the coach at a a club, the coach is hardly going to be handing out public slaggings. Let's hope that has changed.
"I was on the bus before you painted it yellow."


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Unread post by Sco77y » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 4:15 pm

Yeah, basically ref decisions are swings and roundabouts, all teams will get both good calls and dud calls at some point. However in the long term (over a season) if your team is good enough they'll come out on top regardless of referring calls. So to take aim at them like Flanno did is just petty and makes himself and his band of drop kicks look pathetic.

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Unread post by Telltails » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 4:17 pm

Some people lose with humilty others dont simple as that. Flannagan and Barrett both reactive to adversity -
more about individual personalties than anything else.

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Unread post by Geo. » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 4:53 pm

I think Ivan just has a soft spot for refs..

http://www.espn.com.au/espn/story/_/id/ ... ew-job-nrl

Ivan Cleary has been brought in by the NRL amid widespread discontent surrounding the game's officiating.

Former Penrith and Warriors coach Cleary was unveiled by NRL chief executive Todd Greenberg on Wednesday as a part-time consultant to lend his footballing nous to assist with match review, judiciary and refereeing issues.

http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/leag ... omdpp.html

Greenberg, who sought out Cleary for the role, said the appointment would give coaches reassurance the NRL was conscious of their points of view.

"Ivan is one of the most experienced coaches in the game and he has a great feel for what the clubs want from our match and judiciary officials," Greenberg said.

-----------------------------------------


I am also glad Ivan is the Coach...often though I get the feeling with him what is said in the public domain...always very measured... and what is said behind closed doors through the appropriate channels with both the NRL and his players could be different things...I think he is an excellent man manager ...I don't think even in Sheens time especially his later tenure.. we have had that in our Coaching Staff..
Ivan's Laws

1. You are either on the Bus or you are off..
2. The Star of the Team is the Team
3. Be the player your teammates want to play with..
Tiger Watto wrote:
Fri 03 Nov, 2017 8:07 am
Geo nailed it...

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Unread post by Fade To Black » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 6:35 pm

supercoach wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 11:58 am
I guess Cleary is smart enough to know that a rant and a spray gets you 10g fine and nothing else. I also think Cleary is setting the bar for his players. How can you demand discipline and composure in your players and than go off like a two bob cracker at the presso.

Of course the only thing if we had just lost a sudden death final on the back of a couple crappy calls this forum would be going off big time and questioning why Cleary did not let fly at the presso
Sharks didnt lose because of the refs bad calls, they got a few wrong calls go their way too yesterday IMO.
Didn't see Brad Arthur's press conference but he was entitled to be pretty filthy, they got done over by the refs on 4 or 5 bad calls. A 5-1 penalty count in the 2nd half to Melbourne sure goes a long way to getting you over the line in a close game. Manu Mau's was just sheer stupidity on his part but most of the others were questionable except perhaps Alvaro's one.
The refs are atrocious no question, as is the bunker but garbage like Flanagan carried on with deserved more than just a 10k fine.

As for Barrett, haven't seen him look that sooky since he got pinged for running off the mark in the '05 prelim final.


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Unread post by goldcoast tiger » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 7:18 pm

TigerTiger wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 10:15 am
Absolutely.

The whingeing culture of Flanno probably plays a part in the whingeing culture of the Sharks team. Taking dives, playing for the penalty... poor sportsmanship and embarrassing to watch.

I have been saying for a long while now that I would like it so that only the captain is permitted to speak to the referee. And it must be with the utmost respect or the ref will sin bin you. No whingeing to the ref allowed, they should be the ultimate authority. No coaches could whinge about refs either. It's just a reflection of the spoilt brats in our game, whingeing (or tanking or pulling the mental health card) to get out of contracts.

Refs will make mistakes sometimes, they are human, but if you're going to win the game you need to be good enough to beat the other side, beat the iffy refs decisions, and beat lady luck all together. And if you aren't good enough to beat those three things, you aren't good enough to control the things that are in your power, you deserve to lose and it is your own fault.
Now if IC can only stop the constant whinging about Refs from some on the Forum, he will truly be on his way to being our greatest coach ever.

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Unread post by WestsBenTigers » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 7:31 pm

Russell wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 2:43 pm
LARDS wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 11:11 am
MightyMaggy wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 9:59 am
I read the following article this morning:-

http://www.msn.com/en-au/sport/rugby-le ... artandhp

After reading this well-written article, I thought about Ivan Cleary's reactions in press conferences, when the team has lost. If my memory serves me correctly, he is usually complimentary about the general performance of the team, followed by a "but"". Some of these "buts"" have been:-
1. We need to learn to perform like that for the whole eighty minutes.
2. We performed well, but for some of the big moments, we could have done better.
3. We are trying to change the defensive pattern and this takes time.
Ivan does NOT criticise the refereeing and the bunker.
Ivan does NOT blame the players, but he does indicate where they need to improve.

I am glad he is our coach.
To be fair , Jason Taylor, never criticised the refs either.
I guess there are a few coaches who dont. I think Nathan Brown is one as well.
JT also didn't criticise individual players either.
Robbie Farah...

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Unread post by Russell » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 7:39 pm

WestsBenTigers wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 7:31 pm
Russell wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 2:43 pm
LARDS wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 11:11 am
MightyMaggy wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 9:59 am
I read the following article this morning:-

http://www.msn.com/en-au/sport/rugby-le ... artandhp

After reading this well-written article, I thought about Ivan Cleary's reactions in press conferences, when the team has lost. If my memory serves me correctly, he is usually complimentary about the general performance of the team, followed by a "but"". Some of these "buts"" have been:-
1. We need to learn to perform like that for the whole eighty minutes.
2. We performed well, but for some of the big moments, we could have done better.
3. We are trying to change the defensive pattern and this takes time.
Ivan does NOT criticise the refereeing and the bunker.
Ivan does NOT blame the players, but he does indicate where they need to improve.

I am glad he is our coach.
To be fair , Jason Taylor, never criticised the refs either.
I guess there are a few coaches who dont. I think Nathan Brown is one as well.
JT also didn't criticise individual players either.
Robbie Farah...
You know what I am talking about Ben.

Following a game.

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Unread post by Furious1 » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 7:57 pm

supercoach wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 11:29 am
Has the referring standard declined or has the camera work got better. I think we are nearly better off without the bunker. Let the refs make calls in real time at game speed. Slowing the replays down to frame by frame speed is crazy.

I also think the NRL has to start binning players who rush in and give the ref a gob full. I know in the heat of the moment it is not to react but the ref has to be given space and respect
Yes, the reffing has declined. The biggest mistake in this games history in regards to refs came about with Bill Harrigan and his "feel for the game" and own interpretation of rules.

There's a book, it has all the rules of Rugby League in it. The writing is in black ink, the background is white. There is no grey. If referees, ref to the rules, then how can you make a mistake? Funny how in Rugby, the ball still gets put in the middle of the scrum, because if you don't put it in the middle, it's a friggin penalty!!! Thats what it says in the rule book. Want to tidy up the play the balls in our game? Then penalise players who don't play the ball correctly. There has been too much emphasis on letting the game flow, and it's come at the expense of enforcing the rules. If there's no rules or they aren't enforced you have anarchy and a power struggle and unfortunately the players and coaches have had the upper hand in that struggle for quite sometime.
The refs are there to make sure the game is played according to the rules, if they aren't going to enforce them then we don't require refs, it's that simple really.

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Unread post by TrueTiger » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 8:04 pm

Furious1 wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 7:57 pm
supercoach wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 11:29 am
Has the referring standard declined or has the camera work got better. I think we are nearly better off without the bunker. Let the refs make calls in real time at game speed. Slowing the replays down to frame by frame speed is crazy.

I also think the NRL has to start binning players who rush in and give the ref a gob full. I know in the heat of the moment it is not to react but the ref has to be given space and respect
Yes, the reffing has declined. The biggest mistake in this games history in regards to refs came about with Bill Harrigan and his "feel for the game" and own interpretation of rules.

There's a book, it has all the rules of Rugby League in it. The writing is in black ink, the background is white. There is no grey. If referees, ref to the rules, then how can you make a mistake? Funny how in Rugby, the ball still gets put in the middle of the scrum, because if you don't put it in the middle, it's a friggin penalty!!! Thats what it says in the rule book. Want to tidy up the play the balls in our game? Then penalise players who don't play the ball correctly. There has been too much emphasis on letting the game flow, and it's come at the expense of enforcing the rules. If there's no rules or they aren't enforced you have anarchy and a power struggle and unfortunately the players and coaches have had the upper hand in that struggle for quite sometime.
The refs are there to make sure the game is played according to the rules, if they aren't going to enforce them then we don't require refs, it's that simple really.
Great post F1,rules are rules they outline and define our game,changing them will inevitably change the original game to something else under its banner..
You may see me struggle...but you will never see me quit... :D

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Unread post by stryker » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 8:41 pm

Fade To Black wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 6:35 pm

Sharks didnt lose because of the refs bad calls, they got a few wrong calls go their way too yesterday IMO.
Didn't see Brad Arthur's press conference but he was entitled to be pretty filthy, they got done over by the refs on 4 or 5 bad calls. A 5-1 penalty count in the 2nd half to Melbourne sure goes a long way to getting you over the line in a close game. Manu Mau's was just sheer stupidity on his part but most of the others were questionable except perhaps Alvaro's one.
The refs are atrocious no question, as is the bunker but garbage like Flanagan carried on with deserved more than just a 10k fine.
I think 100% opposite. The refs did not get Melbourne home, Parras poor discipline did hence the lop sided penalty count. Your bias is blinding you.
Alternately, some of those decisions towards the end of the game yesterday could well have cost the Sharks the win.

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Unread post by Fade To Black » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 9:07 pm

stryker wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 8:41 pm
Fade To Black wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 6:35 pm

Sharks didnt lose because of the refs bad calls, they got a few wrong calls go their way too yesterday IMO.
Didn't see Brad Arthur's press conference but he was entitled to be pretty filthy, they got done over by the refs on 4 or 5 bad calls. A 5-1 penalty count in the 2nd half to Melbourne sure goes a long way to getting you over the line in a close game. Manu Mau's was just sheer stupidity on his part but most of the others were questionable except perhaps Alvaro's one.
The refs are atrocious no question, as is the bunker but garbage like Flanagan carried on with deserved more than just a 10k fine.
I think 100% opposite. The refs did not get Melbourne home, Parras poor discipline did hence the lop sided penalty count. Your bias is blinding you.
Alternately, some of those decisions towards the end of the game yesterday could well have cost the Sharks the win.
You dont reckon Melbourne's 1st try was from a blatant forward pass? One of the more obvious forward passes of this season IMO, it was just a one-handed sling/lob that didn't remotely look like it went backwards.....how do they miss it when the refs are both hovering around the tryline? -it wasn't like it was a midfield one where the refs might not have had a clear look at it.
The disallowed try against Parra was also very iffy, would of been spewing water if it was our team that had it disallowed.
Ruck penalties are always contentious, Melbourne got a few calls go their way around the ruck in the 2nd half whereas Parra got no joy in that area.
Gallen's drop in the play the ball at the end of their game was his own fault, sure Prior had his hand on the ball a second or so before Gallen dropped it but surely the roided-up freak is strong enough to hold the footy in that instance- it wasn't like it was forcefully reefed out.
As a neutral observer in both of those matches IMO Parra copped a raw deal overall, Cronulla didn't . If your view is different then so be it.

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Unread post by Tigerdon » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 9:09 pm

Sharks had a 65% completion rate and missed over 30 tackles....but it's the ref fault according to the coach.
Ivan "Billy Beane from Moneyball" Cleary!
It's the Ivan of the tiger, It's the thrill of the fight...

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Unread post by Cosimo_Zaretti » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 9:19 pm

Easy to be sportsmanlike when you're handed an under strength side mid season that's already at the bottom of the ladder. Lets see if he's that reasoned at the pointy end of next year with a season on the line.

So far though; Ivan does seem like the grownup in the room.

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Unread post by Fade To Black » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 9:37 pm

Tigerdon wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 9:09 pm
Sharks had a 65% completion rate and missed over 30 tackles....but it's the ref fault according to the coach.
Exactly.

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Unread post by jirskyr » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 10:02 pm

TrueTiger wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 8:04 pm
Furious1 wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 7:57 pm
supercoach wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 11:29 am
Has the referring standard declined or has the camera work got better. I think we are nearly better off without the bunker. Let the refs make calls in real time at game speed. Slowing the replays down to frame by frame speed is crazy.

I also think the NRL has to start binning players who rush in and give the ref a gob full. I know in the heat of the moment it is not to react but the ref has to be given space and respect
Yes, the reffing has declined. The biggest mistake in this games history in regards to refs came about with Bill Harrigan and his "feel for the game" and own interpretation of rules.

There's a book, it has all the rules of Rugby League in it. The writing is in black ink, the background is white. There is no grey. If referees, ref to the rules, then how can you make a mistake? Funny how in Rugby, the ball still gets put in the middle of the scrum, because if you don't put it in the middle, it's a friggin penalty!!! Thats what it says in the rule book. Want to tidy up the play the balls in our game? Then penalise players who don't play the ball correctly. There has been too much emphasis on letting the game flow, and it's come at the expense of enforcing the rules. If there's no rules or they aren't enforced you have anarchy and a power struggle and unfortunately the players and coaches have had the upper hand in that struggle for quite sometime.
The refs are there to make sure the game is played according to the rules, if they aren't going to enforce them then we don't require refs, it's that simple really.
Great post F1,rules are rules they outline and define our game,changing them will inevitably change the original game to something else under its banner..
No offence but you want the game to be reffed more like rugby? Please no.

If you blow the pea out of the whistle the game will be worse off than what we have now. I honestly feel rugby is a joke for exactly that reason.

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Unread post by ricksen » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 10:31 pm

Fade To Black wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 9:07 pm
stryker wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 8:41 pm
Fade To Black wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 6:35 pm

Sharks didnt lose because of the refs bad calls, they got a few wrong calls go their way too yesterday IMO.
Didn't see Brad Arthur's press conference but he was entitled to be pretty filthy, they got done over by the refs on 4 or 5 bad calls. A 5-1 penalty count in the 2nd half to Melbourne sure goes a long way to getting you over the line in a close game. Manu Mau's was just sheer stupidity on his part but most of the others were questionable except perhaps Alvaro's one.
The refs are atrocious no question, as is the bunker but garbage like Flanagan carried on with deserved more than just a 10k fine.
I think 100% opposite. The refs did not get Melbourne home, Parras poor discipline did hence the lop sided penalty count. Your bias is blinding you.
Alternately, some of those decisions towards the end of the game yesterday could well have cost the Sharks the win.
You dont reckon Melbourne's 1st try was from a blatant forward pass? One of the more obvious forward passes of this season IMO, it was just a one-handed sling/lob that didn't remotely look like it went backwards.....how do they miss it when the refs are both hovering around the tryline? -it wasn't like it was a midfield one where the refs might not have had a clear look at it.
It was deflected off the Eels winger - was a great call by the officials.

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Unread post by upthetigers » Mon 11 Sep, 2017 10:42 pm

supercoach wrote:
Mon 11 Sep, 2017 11:29 am
Has the referring standard declined or has the camera work got better. I think we are nearly better off without the bunker. Let the refs make calls in real time at game speed. Slowing the replays down to frame by frame speed is crazy.

I also think the NRL has to start binning players who rush in and give the ref a gob full. I know in the heat of the moment it is not to react but the ref has to be given space and respect
When it goes to the bunker I don't think the ref should have to award it a try/no try. They can't be sure and it's the reason it's going to the bunker. They should just send it to the bunker without influencing the decision.

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