The Bench

Boonboon2
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The Bench

Post by Boonboon2 » Fri 29 Dec, 2017 11:33 am

So what I want to talk about is less the individuals on the bench but the structure of who we have on our bench - what skills, positions and also how this will work with the limited amount of interchanges. Only 8 interchanges has made a big difference to the benches over the last couple of years and was one of the reasons the Dogs for example struggled last year.

I start by saying we need 2 props on the bench
Interchanges 1 and 2 = Prop 1 - On at 25 mins replacing starting prop and then back off for same at 60 minutes
Interchnages 3 and 4 = Prop 2 - On at 25 mins replacing starting prop and then back off for same at 60 minutes

So that is half your interchanges gone

Reserve 3 and 4 have up to 4 interchanges to themselves but 1 must be saved for a last couple of minutes injury
so that reduces it to 3. This means that both players can't come on and off

Interchange 5- Saved for Injury

Interchange 6 - Bench 3 coming on
Interchange 7- Bench 4 coming on
Interchange 8 - Injury during match or player 3/4 coming off

This means your 4th bench player either comes on and stays on or only plays the last 5-10 minutes

Most teams in 2017 used their 4th playing sparingly unless they had an injury.

Bench 3 and 4
Option 1 - Means your hooker/half might play 10-15 minutes max unless injury
1 Backrower who can play outside backs in case of injury -
1 hooker/half

Option 2 - Leaves your best backrowers on the bench and no back up for
1 backrower/middle forward - to play lock off the bench
1 backrower/ outside back - in case of injury

In 2017 we went with option 1 because we didnt have an 80 minute hooker. However even with this option 2 doesen't give you much extra because they will generally play 10 mins.

What this means is when looking at the bench the key part is can your 4th bench player fill the gaps in case of injury because without injuries they don't really matter

Options for Tigers 2018
Prop 1- Twal
Prop 2 - Grant
Backrower/ Middle- Sue, Esienhuth,
Backrower/ Outside back - Lawrence, Chee-Kam, Masters,
Hooker/Half- McIllwrick, Marshall

Personally I see our starting backrow being Eisenhuth, ET, McQueen.

Given that I think our bench will probably want Sue as the 3rd middle/ backrower with Mcqueen able to move into the outside backs meaning Marshall is prob the best option given his versatility

However the other option is that ET starts at hooker and then Liddle comes on at 20 minutes which would mean having another backrower on the bench such as Lawrence.

So I see our full strength bench as either

Option 1
Twal, Grant, Sue, Marshall

Option 2
Twal, Grant, Lawrence, Liddle (with ET starting hooker)


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avocadoontoast
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Post by avocadoontoast » Fri 29 Dec, 2017 11:42 am

Boonboon2 wrote:
Fri 29 Dec, 2017 11:33 am
So what I want to talk about is less the individuals on the bench but the structure of who we have on our bench - what skills, positions and also how this will work with the limited amount of interchanges. Only 8 interchanges has made a big difference to the benches over the last couple of years and was one of the reasons the Dogs for example struggled last year.

I start by saying we need 2 props on the bench
Interchanges 1 and 2 = Prop 1 - On at 25 mins replacing starting prop and then back off for same at 60 minutes
Interchnages 3 and 4 = Prop 2 - On at 25 mins replacing starting prop and then back off for same at 60 minutes

So that is half your interchanges gone

Reserve 3 and 4 have up to 4 interchanges to themselves but 1 must be saved for a last couple of minutes injury
so that reduces it to 3. This means that both players can't come on and off

Interchange 5- Saved for Injury

Interchange 6 - Bench 3 coming on
Interchange 7- Bench 4 coming on
Interchange 8 - Injury during match or player 3/4 coming off

This means your 4th bench player either comes on and stays on or only plays the last 5-10 minutes

Most teams in 2017 used their 4th playing sparingly unless they had an injury.

Bench 3 and 4
Option 1 - Means your hooker/half might play 10-15 minutes max unless injury
1 Backrower who can play outside backs in case of injury -
1 hooker/half

Option 2 - Leaves your best backrowers on the bench and no back up for
1 backrower/middle forward - to play lock off the bench
1 backrower/ outside back - in case of injury

In 2017 we went with option 1 because we didnt have an 80 minute hooker. However even with this option 2 doesen't give you much extra because they will generally play 10 mins.

What this means is when looking at the bench the key part is can your 4th bench player fill the gaps in case of injury because without injuries they don't really matter

Options for Tigers 2018
Prop 1- Twal
Prop 2 - Grant
Backrower/ Middle- Sue, Esienhuth,
Backrower/ Outside back - Lawrence, Chee-Kam, Masters,
Hooker/Half- McIllwrick, Marshall

Personally I see our starting backrow being Eisenhuth, ET, McQueen.

Given that I think our bench will probably want Sue as the 3rd middle/ backrower with Mcqueen able to move into the outside backs meaning Marshall is prob the best option given his versatility

However the other option is that ET starts at hooker and then Liddle comes on at 20 minutes which would mean having another backrower on the bench such as Lawrence.

So I see our full strength bench as either

Option 1
Twal, Grant, Sue, Marshall

Option 2
Twal, Grant, Lawrence, Liddle (with ET starting hooker)
I think you forgot Aloiai.

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willow
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Post by willow » Fri 29 Dec, 2017 11:48 am

My starting backrow would be Aloiai, McQueen and Eisenhuth. Twal, Grant/Felise, Taylor and Marsters on the bench.

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Post by Earl » Fri 29 Dec, 2017 1:37 pm

I'll split it into middle players and edge players. I honestly think you need 3 middle players on the bench and hopefully one or two of the 6 middle players can play on the edge as well but only if an injury occurs. I also think we need a dummy half on the bench because I don't think Liddle or McIlwrick can play anywhere near 80 minutes of good footy.

So I'd go with the following:-

Starting Props:- Packer & Matulino
Reserve Props:- Twal & Sue
Staring Lock:- Eisenhuth
Reserve Lock:- Aloiai
Edge Backrowers:- McQueen (left) and Taylor (right)
Starting Hooker:- McIlwrick
Reserve Hooker:- Liddle

That leaves Lawrence, Grant, Marsters & Benji missing out on spots in the top team at least at the start of the year.

Grant could replace Sue but I think Sue has the ability to add some impact off the bench. Aloiai coming up the middle is also a weapon. The issue is that McQueen and Taylor have to play 80 minutes but they should be able to do that on the edge. We will lack impact edge second rowers but those two should be able to defend well and hopefully add something to our attack.

Our middle should be really strong with those 6 players going hard.

I also like that make-up because it's a bigger pack. If we play Taylor in the middle we do get great defence and ball playing but he isn't as big a body as Eisenhuth.

There are a lot of options for us though. I think Grant is still a quality first grade player who goes hard. Marsters is a great option in the centres or the backrow and Benji could be our best half.

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Post by will1999 » Fri 29 Dec, 2017 1:59 pm

starting props Matulino- Packer
second row Mcqueen- Taylor/hooker
lock Eisenhuth
hooker Mcillwrick
bench: Twal, Sue, Grant, Aloiai


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Post by wt01 » Fri 29 Dec, 2017 2:10 pm

will1999 wrote:
Fri 29 Dec, 2017 1:59 pm
starting props Matulino- Packer
second row Mcqueen- Taylor/hooker
lock Eisenhuth
hooker Mcillwrick
bench: Twal, Sue, Grant, Aloiai
thats a big bench :) :D

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Post by GNR4LIFE » Fri 29 Dec, 2017 5:25 pm

Taylor is a certain starter in the back row imo. He'll most likely be captain. The big question will be if Rowdy can force his way onto the bench.

I think the back row will be

11. McQueen
12. ET
13. Hooth

Twal is a certainty as is Aloiai. Liddle seems likely too. Which leaves Sue and Lawrence fighting it out for the other bench spot. I don't think Grant will feature much at all. Wouldn't' surprise me if he leaves mid season. And Felise seems to have fallen off the face of the earth.

So I'd say

14. Liddle
15. Aloiai
16. Twal
17. Sue/Lawrence

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Post by WestsBenTigers » Fri 29 Dec, 2017 8:50 pm

14. Marsters
15. Twal
16. Sue
17. Aloiai

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Post by InBenjiWeTrust » Fri 29 Dec, 2017 9:15 pm

My take:

8 Matulino
9 Liddle
10 Packer
11 McQueen
12 Taylor
13 Eisenhuth

14 Twal
15 Sue
16 Aloiai
17 Marsters/Falise

:sign:

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Post by Geo. » Sat 30 Dec, 2017 5:13 am

Poor Rowdy.... :(
Wests Tigers don't need a Coach.. The playing group has taken over..

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Post by jadtiger » Sat 30 Dec, 2017 6:57 am

Geo. wrote:
Sat 30 Dec, 2017 5:13 am
Poor Rowdy.... :(
I dont care who gets selected each week as long as it is based on form.Hopefully this is what will happen each and every week, if Lawrences form is good enough he should get picked but no favouritism for any player.I have faith in Ivan to get it right when so many before him have failed

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Post by Earl » Sat 30 Dec, 2017 7:38 am

I think it's Lawrence or McQueen who makes the team. I can't see how you can have both of them. What about poor Marsters or Benji or Grant.

I wouldn't be surprised if Lawrence does make the team but I couldn't pick him at the start based on who is available.

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Post by Masterton » Sat 30 Dec, 2017 8:51 am

Geo. wrote:
Sat 30 Dec, 2017 5:13 am
Poor Rowdy.... :(
No offence to Rowdy who is a club legend, but in the 2nd row I have him behind McQueen, Taylor, Aloiai, perhaps even Marsters.

That said, injuries are almost inevitable. Aloiai could spend some time in the middle, or Taylor at hooker. I suspect Lawry will be a better player if he makes 10 appearances in first grade rather than 20. He seems to get worn down over the course of a season.
"I was on the bus before you painted it yellow."

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Post by Masterton » Sat 30 Dec, 2017 8:55 am

Earl wrote:
Sat 30 Dec, 2017 7:38 am
What about poor Marsters or Benji or Grant.
"Wests Tigers are sad to lose Tim Grant, but could not stand in the way of the 2 year offer from Penrith."
"I was on the bus before you painted it yellow."

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Post by jirskyr » Sat 30 Dec, 2017 9:06 am

InBenjiWeTrust wrote:
Fri 29 Dec, 2017 9:15 pm
My take:

8 Matulino
9 Liddle
10 Packer
11 McQueen
12 Taylor
13 Eisenhuth

14 Twal
15 Sue
16 Aloiai
17 Marsters/Falise

:sign:
I agree with the starting pack (as likely) but I am 99% sure Benji will be on the bench Rd 1. He and ET and Reynolds can cover hooker if Liddle needs downtime and Benji can be brought on for clutch moments or if the halves are off the boil.

I like Marsters a lot but I think he's the one that makes way for Benji.

It's a weird but good position to be in, not being able to find space for decent footballers like Lawrence, Marsters, MCK. A lot of people would be happy about guys like MCK and Lawrence playing reserves, but also I don't think young fringe players become much better toiling around in reggies. E.g. Felise, I can't see him making it without more first grade time.

Lolo, Nofo, Milne, Suli, Fonua, Reynolds, Brooks, Mats, Liddle, Packer, McQ, ET, Hooth, Twal, Sue, Aloiai, Benji

No space for MWZ, Kev, Marsters, Lawrence, MCK, Rochow, McIlwrick. I think Marsters did just fine last year and has a lot of talent, but I don't feel he has the same potential as Suli, with whom he is directly competing.
Last edited by jirskyr on Sat 30 Dec, 2017 9:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by jalafaci » Sat 30 Dec, 2017 9:07 am

I have a feeling masters will be playing in the centres and not the back row. He made quite a good fist of playing in the centre plus hasn’t he lost weight so he could play in that position.

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Post by innsaneink » Sat 30 Dec, 2017 9:23 am

jadtiger wrote:
Sat 30 Dec, 2017 6:57 am
Geo. wrote:
Sat 30 Dec, 2017 5:13 am
Poor Rowdy.... :(
I dont care who gets selected each week as long as it is based on form.Hopefully this is what will happen each and every week, if Lawrences form is good enough he should get picked but no favouritism for any player.I have faith in Ivan to get it right when so many before him have failed
"Each and every week"?

Sonic a player has one poor game theyre dropped?

That makes for a.lot of disruption and unnecessary change.

It would be fairly unrealistic to expect players to perform at their peak week after week after week...it just doesn't happen

Coaches will make as few unforced changes as possible

Good teams use the least players

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Post by Balmainian » Sat 30 Dec, 2017 9:25 am

Marsters threw some ripper long cut out balls that created opportunities out wide on a few occasions last year.
He’s not afraid to literally throw it around, a genuine footballer, hope to see more of him this year.

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