Most missed tackles

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TIGER
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Most missed tackles

Post by TIGER » Tue 21 Aug, 2018 10:32 pm

So apparently we're a much improved defensive team.
Even though we've missed more tackles than any team in the comp.
This is a concerning stat!!

I know people are going to say that we scramble well etc (I think that's ridiculous) but is anybody happy with the fact we lead the league in missed tackles?

Are we going to be a contender in the future if we continue to be the leading team for missed tackles but scramble well?

Scrambling zaps the energy out of you.
I think we need to improve our missed tackles, whadda reckon?


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Post by gallagher » Tue 21 Aug, 2018 10:35 pm

Is there a list from best to worst ? Maybe it's not important.

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Post by jirskyr » Tue 21 Aug, 2018 11:39 pm

Maybe excess scrambling tires the side and affects the attack. The attack stats are certainly down. But then shouldn't a tired side also concede points, perhaps late in the game as their resolve weakens?

But if you look purely at points conceded, then missed tackles don't seem to matter for Tigers in 2018 - 3rd best defence in the comp in terms of points conceded.

Note that the top 5 worst teams for missed tackles are Tigers (852), Panthers (844), Warriors (792), Titans (764), Raiders (732). However 2 of those 5 are in the Top 8 and 2 more are 9th and 10th respectively.

Furthermore, Panthers have the 6th-best defence and Warriors have 7th-best. So missed tackles don't seem to cripple teams points-wise, and in fact the worst 3 teams for missed tackles make up 3 of the Top 7 teams defensively. It appears, if you are going to miss tackles, then the worse you do it the better your defence ends up!?

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sheer64
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Post by sheer64 » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 1:59 am

Total tackles may need to be brought into the equation as well.
Arise Sir Waste Anasta, Tool of the highest order!

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Post by larrycorowa » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 6:39 am

We need 6 x Gareth Ellis


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Post by weststigerman » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 6:39 am

I think this stat has a lot to do with the defensive styles teams apply. This year we’ve used a lot of line speed to get our defence on the front foot, which sometimes means rushing the attacker which has a bigger chance of missing the tackle but will generally slow the player down.

We also have a couple of individuals who miss a lot of tackles like Brooks.

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Post by The Patriot » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 7:39 am

sheer64 wrote:
Wed 22 Aug, 2018 1:59 am
Total tackles may need to be brought into the equation as well.
You bet it does, the stat really doesnt mean much without it.

If the ref keeps blowing penalties and the other team get set after set you are going to miss some tackles.
Its an opinion!

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Post by supercoach » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 8:12 am

It’s as a previous poster said. We employ what’s known as a rushing defensive system and it’s all about getting multiple people into the tackles quickly as possible. In the process you are going to get a lot of misses that the second wave cleans up. It’s been very effective when you consider what has happened in the past

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Post by Silentio » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 9:35 am

Interesting observation, OP.

A lot of old school coaches used to get worried about low missed tackle counts. They said "You can only miss the tackles you're trying to make."

think there's a lot of truth in that statement.

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Post by beachtiger » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 9:49 am

Does anyone know what actually constitutes a "missed tackle"?

If a player makes first contact, slows the attacker down but doesn't stick and then comes for a second effort and wraps them up with or without help from a team mate do they get a missed tackle for the first contact then also an effective tackle for the second effort?

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Post by FOD001 » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 10:18 am

beachtiger wrote:
Wed 22 Aug, 2018 9:49 am
Does anyone know what actually constitutes a "missed tackle"?

If a player makes first contact, slows the attacker down but doesn't stick and then comes for a second effort and wraps them up with or without help from a team mate do they get a missed tackle for the first contact then also an effective tackle for the second effort?
I’m with you. What if a player skips sideways across the field but goes past 6/7 players with the defensive team sticking their arm out yet the player makes 0m forward are they really missed tackles

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Post by TIGER » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 10:23 am

So just as I assumed a lot of us are going to come up with reasons why we lead the comp in missed tackles.

- Our defensive style contributes to it
- What actually constitutes a missed tackle and does it really matter.
- The amount of tackles attempted.
- Our points conceded
- Our scramble
- Is scramble more beneficial to the defending team or attacking in regards to energy. etc.

These may or may not be valid reasons, and some may think that this missed tackle stat isn't a good Indication but to me a missed tackle is a missed tackle no matter how we cover it.
It's great that we're covering our missed tackles and our points conceded isn't drastically effected by the amount missed but can we keep this up and be a contender?

Is this a symptom of our defensive style and was this defensive style put in place cover our defensive deficiencies?

Is this style sustainable long-term, can we keep leading in missed tackles while continuing to reduce our points conceded and increase our points scored?
Because we'll have to do both in the future if we're going to play semi finals football.

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Post by happy tiger » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 10:28 am

I prefer looking % completion

Tells a bigger story

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Post by greatodensraven » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 11:01 am

I think there was a "Coaching Corner"(?) segment earlier in the season on Fox analysing our improved defence & comparing it to the eels. That was when we were going through our 5 from 6 stage against all the top 4 teams.

Even then the commentary stated how technically our defence was poor, i.e. lots of missed tackles, etc. however it was our scramble/team-work/attitude that kept the defensive line intact.

Although our scramble has been great this year, I can see how having to make multiple tackles per ruck can sap the team of energy, potentially impacting our attack, etc.

At the end of the day, with our defence now 3rd in the league thats a massive improvement & should be celebrated. Hopefully its a good platform that we can continue to build on.

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Post by Silentio » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 11:23 am

FOD001 wrote:
Wed 22 Aug, 2018 10:18 am
beachtiger wrote:
Wed 22 Aug, 2018 9:49 am
Does anyone know what actually constitutes a "missed tackle"?

If a player makes first contact, slows the attacker down but doesn't stick and then comes for a second effort and wraps them up with or without help from a team mate do they get a missed tackle for the first contact then also an effective tackle for the second effort?
I’m with you. What if a player skips sideways across the field but goes past 6/7 players with the defensive team sticking their arm out yet the player makes 0m forward are they really missed tackles
The NRL define it as: Missed tackles – Defensive player does not bring player to ground or complete tackle

Not sure if it's still the case, but there used to be at least one subscription based stats provider that broke these down into more detail.

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Post by jirskyr » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 11:27 am

TIGER wrote:
Wed 22 Aug, 2018 10:23 am
It's great that we're covering our missed tackles and our points conceded isn't drastically effected by the amount missed but can we keep this up and be a contender?

Is this a symptom of our defensive style and was this defensive style put in place cover our defensive deficiencies?

Is this style sustainable long-term, can we keep leading in missed tackles while continuing to reduce our points conceded and increase our points scored?
Because we'll have to do both in the future if we're going to play semi finals football.
What does "sustainable" mean? Obviously it is a sustainable strategy because we are 2 rounds from the end of the season and still 3rd-best defence, and we've been around that mark all season.

Does it mean sustainable in terms of making the finals? Hard to say at this time, we've only employed the strategy for one season. Certainly the Panthers and Warriors are comfortably in finals contention and they also have large missed tackle counts - so large missed tackles isn't necessarily an indicator of missing finals.

And in fact if we had a Maloney, a Kikau, an RTS, a Shaun Johnson then we might be a superior attacking team - that might be the main difference between our sides.

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Post by yeti » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 11:58 am

I think more telling is the number of line breaks conceded and metres conceded after contact.
That tells you more about how the opposition is rolling through you - or not - as the case may be

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Post by maxxy86 » Wed 22 Aug, 2018 12:47 pm

happy tiger wrote:
Wed 22 Aug, 2018 10:28 am
I prefer looking % completion

Tells a bigger story
Tend to agree and how many penalties we concede. Anyone got a stat of how many penalty counts we’ve won?? Guessing it wouldn’t be many
Well its nearly time to have a 'CRACK'....Go you :sign:

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