Stefano Utoikamanu #241

BAGNF05 said:
Played 22 mins made 21 tackles. Working up to full fitness. This guy is someone to build a team around, no doubt. A 21yo prop won’t win you a game though, still needs quality teammates.
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We need him to make meters. Everyone bitching about the spine forgets that they constantly get the ball on the back foot as the hard work is not being done with the ball up front.
 
stryker 69 said:
He has no mentor at this club. No one to help him prepare, play and recover from a game as a prop. I thought Tamou would provide this but he obviously either doesn’t, or can’t impart trade secrets well enough. Raw talent only gets you so far and for a bloke playing in the toughest position on the field, he is screaming for help.
I’ve seen posters claim we will build our pack around him next year. He ain’t ready for leadership by a long mile.
We need to sign two 5+ year NRL veteran props for next year, with one hopefully an international, who can take him under their wings and bring him on.
Failure to do so will see another shit year from him.
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100% this

Stefano last year played his best games next to Tamou. When he played with an inexperienced prop he wasn’t the same player.

We MUST get Stefano a bash brother with experience over the next 2-3yrs
 
Agree Steph needs a hard prop as well as Papi next year , Blore I still think will be with us and could be excellent as well and Joffa just adds to that as well
 
At the end of the day, Stefano is still very much a rookie and has only played 33 matches.

He's a very long way off a leadership role and for mine, still needs time to establish himself as a first grader.

The club really needs a few experienced props to give him time to develop. Tamou is past his best and even Musgrove only has a fraction more experience than Stefano. With the exception of Twal, everyone else lacks experience.

You only need to look as far as blokes like Jamal Idris (60'ish games and an origin appearance with the dogs) to see how the weight of expectation can destroy some young fellas.
 
I have been thinking about the Props and second rowers.

Good props don't seem to want to play in light teams, bar Manly. (I don't know why but Manly seem to be able to hire 1-2 good props and then get the most out of Curtis Sironen, etc).
Hey why would I want to join a team to be a battering ram, when I can join other Battering rams and get less battered!!

We have Papiiaiiaiiaai coming with Stefano, maybe instead of thinking of experienced props like Tamou or others we should be thinking of getting Props in the Stefano/Papaii age range and building them together. This would mean we would need damn good coaching and support around them. Sure we need leadership up front, but the hire the seasoned prop hasn't worked for us.

I don't know why Tamou hasn't worked here. Honestly I can't understand that as he clearly did wonders at Penrith and probably wasn't quite ready to retire. Dale Finucane clearly inspired Stef at Origin. ... Heck I can't pin what it is, we should be having a much more active pack then we do. We even brought in Cayless this year and he should have upgraded our guys and we seem to downgrade...

I don't get it. Sure some games we are outmuscled but we shouldn't be in the position we are in.
 
weststigerman said:
Agree. Although I don’t know if it’s just coaching and retention.

Senior players set the standards and our senior players are Nofa and Brooks. I don’t remember this being so prevalent when Farah was captaining the club.

This is why I wanted us to sign the likes of Finucane. Hopefully Koroisau helps with this but he’s only one guy.
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Some recruitment fails ,Matilino, Packet,Ballin,Josh Reynolds,Peachy,Gildart
Some retention fails ,Tedesco,Moses,Aloaoi,Addocarr,Eienheuth,Tapou,
, Materson,Papenhausen,Korobete,
The recruitment errors are totally on us either in choosing them or in not being able to coach and motivate them once they got here
The retention errors some we could do nothing about but they all starred once they went elsewhere
 
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Stevec said:
Some recruitment fails ,Matilino, Packet,Ballin,Josh Reynolds,Peachy,Gildart
Some retention fails ,Tedesco,Moses,Aloaoi,Addocarr,Eienheuth,Tapou,
, Materson,Papenhausen,Korobete,
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It's pretty clear to me our retention is the big issue. Look at those players - some outright stars in Koro and the Turd. I don't include Paps mainly because he took his time making it even in Melbourne. He was unrealized talent.

Mbye was another great recruit. Clearly was a horrible recruiter. Look at the list of the players he bought here.
 
Stevec said:
Some recruitment fails ,Matilino, Packet,Ballin,Josh Reynolds,Peachy,Gildart
Some retention fails ,Tedesco,Moses,Aloaoi,Addocarr,Eienheuth,Tapou,
, Materson,Papenhausen,Korobete,
The recruitment errors are totally on us either in choosing them or in not being able to coach and motivate them once they got here
The retention errors some we could do nothing about but they all starred once they went elsewhere
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We can negotiate with Moses come November.
 
crazycat said:
I have been thinking about the Props and second rowers.

Good props don't seem to want to play in light teams, bar Manly. (I don't know why but Manly seem to be able to hire 1-2 good props and then get the most out of Curtis Sironen, etc).
Hey why would I want to join a team to be a battering ram, when I can join other Battering rams and get less battered!!

We have Papiiaiiaiiaai coming with Stefano, maybe instead of thinking of experienced props like Tamou or others we should be thinking of getting Props in the Stefano/Papaii age range and building them together. This would mean we would need damn good coaching and support around them. Sure we need leadership up front, but the hire the seasoned prop hasn't worked for us.

I don't know why Tamou hasn't worked here. Honestly I can't understand that as he clearly did wonders at Penrith and probably wasn't quite ready to retire. Dale Finucane clearly inspired Stef at Origin. ... Heck I can't pin what it is, we should be having a much more active pack then we do. We even brought in Cayless this year and he should have upgraded our guys and we seem to downgrade...

I don't get it. Sure some games we are outmuscled but we shouldn't be in the position we are in.
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Just desire mate....

Put 2 Bricklayers that are happy to lay Bricks working side by side... They'll poke along and lay Bricks all day - No problem.

Put in a 3rd bloke that not only wants to lay bricks, But wants to do it better and wants to lay more Bricks than anyone around him.... All of a sudden you get 10-20% more out of the other blokes.

There's no one in our pack with the desire to win the contest - Hasn't been for the best part of 10 years. We get one or 2 of those will go a long, long way to lifting the output of the talent we already have.
 
BAGNF05 said:
I hope the club are bringing him along slowly and get him some experienced help up front. He’s still a kid.
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Maybe we had to stop hiring wingers and halves as coaches and get an ex prop to understand that a go forward team needs not just one, but 4 props?
 
crazycat said:
I have been thinking about the Props and second rowers.

Good props don't seem to want to play in light teams, bar Manly. (I don't know why but Manly seem to be able to hire 1-2 good props and then get the most out of Curtis Sironen, etc).
Hey why would I want to join a team to be a battering ram, when I can join other Battering rams and get less battered!!

We have Papiiaiiaiiaai coming with Stefano, maybe instead of thinking of experienced props like Tamou or others we should be thinking of getting Props in the Stefano/Papaii age range and building them together. This would mean we would need damn good coaching and support around them. Sure we need leadership up front, but the hire the seasoned prop hasn't worked for us.

I don't know why Tamou hasn't worked here. Honestly I can't understand that as he clearly did wonders at Penrith and probably wasn't quite ready to retire. Dale Finucane clearly inspired Stef at Origin. ... Heck I can't pin what it is, we should be having a much more active pack then we do. We even brought in Cayless this year and he should have upgraded our guys and we seem to downgrade...

I don't get it. Sure some games we are outmuscled but we shouldn't be in the position we are in.
Click to expand...
Regarding Tamou - He has always been bog average. How he ever got to play Origin I will never know. Did alright at Penrith because he had a great team around him and he is obviously a reasonable leader. But as a player - very average. We need more than 'average' up front. That's what we have had forever. (Even the 2005 team had a a couple of very average props - if we are being honest. But they had amazing talent around the place so the team got by). We have some real talent coming for next year in Paps and Api. But at least one really good prop would be exactly what is required to make us competitive. Then the other average players like Tamou can do a job.
 
Mighty_Tiger said:
100% this

Stefano last year played his best games next to Tamou. When he played with an inexperienced prop he wasn’t the same player.

We MUST get Stefano a bash brother with experience over the next 2-3yrs
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Haven't we?

Klemmer?
ICE?
Bateman.. Ok Klemmer or ICE are really the Bash Brothers.

I actually picked Stefano leaving our side after Origin. It seemed really obvious that Dale Finucane had a huge effect on him re training and the standard that needed to be displayed. Yet he did not stump up, he accepted a contract renewal here which is great.

His training did not change.

I hope Klemmer + ICE + Bateman have a massive and positive effect on the squad. I know Klemmer was Gym Boss at the Knights and I hope he brings that here, pushing us in the Gym. Yet, we cannot import this culture, we have to foster it.

Farah is the only person in the coaching group with that right attitude and I hope he plus our new signings take it hard here.
 
crazycat said:
Haven't we?

Klemmer?
ICE?
Bateman.. Ok Klemmer or ICE are really the Bash Brothers.

I actually picked Stefano leaving our side after Origin. It seemed really obvious that Dale Finucane had a huge effect on him re training and the standard that needed to be displayed. Yet he did not stump up, he accepted a contract renewal here which is great.

His training did not change.

I hope Klemmer + ICE + Bateman have a massive and positive effect on the squad. I know Klemmer was Gym Boss at the Knights and I hope he brings that here, pushing us in the Gym. Yet, we cannot import this culture, we have to foster it.

Farah is the only person in the coaching group with that right attitude and I hope he plus our new signings take it hard here.
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We didn’t back in July when I made the comment.

We have improved the leadership quality around Stefano and if he is ever going to shine and live ip to the hype it will be over the next 2-3yrs. Klemmer & Api are the real deals and should help Stefano’s game and confidence a heap.

Excited to see what the next few years hold.
 
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