who the hell started this JTJ thing? It’s the most stupid thing ever.
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
People are being too tough on the bowling attack. The pitch gave them nothing and the second half of the day, India stopped scoring runs. Paine’s captaincy left a bit to be desired as it wasn’t attacking enough. Green and Marnus should’ve been utilised more.
In the same breath, India has played out of its skin. Ishant Sharma out of the series, Shami only played one game, Yadav gone in the middle of the innings, Kohli played 1 game, Vihari pulled hammie, Ashwin back pain and hit in the ribs, Jadeja broken thumb. Great resilience.
Yes, a lot of credit has to be given to India. Even if Australia win this series, it’ll be always under question whether if would have been as achievable with Shami, Yadav, Kohli & now Jadeja and Vihari not seeing out the series.
I personally don’t think so. The first test was a comprehensive win. The second test the top 4 let the team down but the bowlers were still 40/40 wickets. The third test was a very gutsy half a day from India on a pitch that gave nothing. The media can give whatever headline they wish but it’s not at all close to panic stations IMO. Australia is doing good.
You don’t think India would have fared better with the second best Test bat in the game and two of their first choice strike bowlers being available?
Maybe but Aus was without Warner for the second Test as well and the openers is where they’ve struggled the most. However, I don’t think a review or anything of that sort is required. The bowlers have taken their wickets, the middle order (Smith/Marnus/Green/Paine) have performed above average.
@Chicken_Faced_Killa said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
Should be scrutiny over the replacement keeper rule too. A bit ordinary that Pant was able to stay off the field to let a better keeper in Saha take the field, only for Pant whom is a better bat to return and nearly crack a ton. Clearly his elbow wasn’t in that bad shape.
The match referee OK’d it since keeping involves diving around and since the injury was still so fresh. Definitely looks sus but any team would’ve done this.
Yeah, I would like the rule fixed to ensure it doesn’t happen again. Saha is a superior keeper and Pant is the better bat. They effectively played with 12 players. Maybe teams need to have a back up keeper in their 11.
I wouldn’t be happy with us exploiting the rule either for the record. It’s not necessarily cheating because it is within the rules but it is very much not in the spirit of the game.
I don’t think Pant was in any physical shape to keep yesterday considering he had gone for scans the night before. Today he batted simply because he had to.
For the future, I am happy with this rule as a wicket keeper is a specialist position, losing a wickie seriously handicaps you, but the replacement keeper shouldn’t be allowed to bat. Not having a wicketkeeper pretty much nullifies your spinner’s wicket taking ability IMO.
I think if you trade a keeper out, that’s it. He’s out for the game. Saha should have completed the game for India.
But he isn’t in the 11? Replacing an injured fielder is common practice but 12th/13th man is never allowed to bat/bowl. I don’t know what else any other team would’ve done. It’s a good rule and especially good when a wickie gets injured.
So they had a better keeper out there and they still got the best of Pant’s better ability to bat? They were at a distinct advantage. Pant wouldn’t have caught COVID in hotel quarantine.
It’s not cheating because it’s within the rules but that was certainly questionable. Perhaps one of the other 11 need to be a back up keeper ala Phil Hughes. If you trade out your keeper he should not return to the game. You can field a substitute keeper but your injured keeper shouldn’t be allowed to bat. If you get special dispensation for a keeper you should give up the injured keeper to bat. You don’t get to replace an injured strike bowler or batsman, they get field substitution and that’s it.
Pant’s ability to bat was a hit and miss. I am confident with the blow (he even dropped the painkiller he was taking) that he wouldn’t have been able to keep. He could’ve easily gotten out taking on the bowlers but he got lucky.
I think the rule change is good as it doesn’t allow a distinct disadvantage of not having a wickie. This time it worked out because Pant played a good innings but in most situations a clearly injured player wouldn’t have been able to.
He is markedly a better bat than Saha. The guy averages nearly 41, which is a very good average for a keeper and is a prolific hitter, pretty sure he strikes at like 72.
Like I said, I am OK with teams being able to field a replacement keeper if it is deemed a specialist position, but if you sub out a keeper, he cedes his ability to bat. You keep your 11 fielders but you lose your batsman to an injury. That is what would happen if you lose a batsman anyway. You sub them in the field and they don’t bat.
India gained an advantage IMO from a rule that is merely meant to prevent disadvantage. We can argue until the cows come home on the outcome if he didn’t bat but he had a marked impact on the innings with a supposed injured elbow. Again, it is within the rules and they played within them so I am in no way claiming wrongdoing, but I believe the rule needs looking at.
Yep I completely understand that you’re not claiming wrongdoing. But I disagree that the injured player shouldn’t have been able to bat/bowl. Jadeja with a broken/dislocated thumb would’ve batted as well. Same with Graeme Smith a few years ago, Kumble with a broken jaw bowling etc etc.
As for gaining an advantage? I hardly think India gained any advantage when Australia scored 300 runs in the 2nd innings.
To me there are two questions that need to be answered in any scenario like this:
- Is the injured player capable of fielding/keeping? That’s up to match referee and medicos
- Should the injured player be allowed to bat/bowl? That’s up to medicos and the player
However, one thing that did skip my mind is that there is a rule where an injured player cannot bat in the next innings for the amount of time he was off in the previous innings. I’m not sure if this applies as well?
There is a rule about time off the field and relating to batting. It use to be that you couldn’t come into bat until after a certain number of overs or 5 wickets down. This may be different for the wicket keeper as they can’t be subbed make onto the field.
I don’t think India did anything wrong Pant was clearly injured and has a right to come out and bat. The fact he batted well doesn’t make it unfair.
i think it was 3 down and he came in at 36 overs, quite curious to see what the rules are with this. He was off for 87 overs I’m guessing.
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
Should be scrutiny over the replacement keeper rule too. A bit ordinary that Pant was able to stay off the field to let a better keeper in Saha take the field, only for Pant whom is a better bat to return and nearly crack a ton. Clearly his elbow wasn’t in that bad shape.
The match referee OK’d it since keeping involves diving around and since the injury was still so fresh. Definitely looks sus but any team would’ve done this.
Yeah, I would like the rule fixed to ensure it doesn’t happen again. Saha is a superior keeper and Pant is the better bat. They effectively played with 12 players. Maybe teams need to have a back up keeper in their 11.
I wouldn’t be happy with us exploiting the rule either for the record. It’s not necessarily cheating because it is within the rules but it is very much not in the spirit of the game.
I don’t think Pant was in any physical shape to keep yesterday considering he had gone for scans the night before. Today he batted simply because he had to.
For the future, I am happy with this rule as a wicket keeper is a specialist position, losing a wickie seriously handicaps you, but the replacement keeper shouldn’t be allowed to bat. Not having a wicketkeeper pretty much nullifies your spinner’s wicket taking ability IMO.
I think if you trade a keeper out, that’s it. He’s out for the game. Saha should have completed the game for India.
But he isn’t in the 11? Replacing an injured fielder is common practice but 12th/13th man is never allowed to bat/bowl. I don’t know what else any other team would’ve done. It’s a good rule and especially good when a wickie gets injured.
So they had a better keeper out there and they still got the best of Pant’s better ability to bat? They were at a distinct advantage. Pant wouldn’t have caught COVID in hotel quarantine.
It’s not cheating because it’s within the rules but that was certainly questionable. Perhaps one of the other 11 need to be a back up keeper ala Phil Hughes. If you trade out your keeper he should not return to the game. You can field a substitute keeper but your injured keeper shouldn’t be allowed to bat. If you get special dispensation for a keeper you should give up the injured keeper to bat. You don’t get to replace an injured strike bowler or batsman, they get field substitution and that’s it.
Pant’s ability to bat was a hit and miss. I am confident with the blow (he even dropped the painkiller he was taking) that he wouldn’t have been able to keep. He could’ve easily gotten out taking on the bowlers but he got lucky.
I think the rule change is good as it doesn’t allow a distinct disadvantage of not having a wickie. This time it worked out because Pant played a good innings but in most situations a clearly injured player wouldn’t have been able to.
He is markedly a better bat than Saha. The guy averages nearly 41, which is a very good average for a keeper and is a prolific hitter, pretty sure he strikes at like 72.
Like I said, I am OK with teams being able to field a replacement keeper if it is deemed a specialist position, but if you sub out a keeper, he cedes his ability to bat. You keep your 11 fielders but you lose your batsman to an injury. That is what would happen if you lose a batsman anyway. You sub them in the field and they don’t bat.
India gained an advantage IMO from a rule that is merely meant to prevent disadvantage. We can argue until the cows come home on the outcome if he didn’t bat but he had a marked impact on the innings with a supposed injured elbow. Again, it is within the rules and they played within them so I am in no way claiming wrongdoing, but I believe the rule needs looking at.
Yep I completely understand that you’re not claiming wrongdoing. But I disagree that the injured player shouldn’t have been able to bat/bowl. Jadeja with a broken/dislocated thumb would’ve batted as well. Same with Graeme Smith a few years ago, Kumble with a broken jaw bowling etc etc.
As for gaining an advantage? I hardly think India gained any advantage when Australia scored 300 runs in the 2nd innings.
To me there are two questions that need to be answered in any scenario like this:
- Is the injured player capable of fielding/keeping? That’s up to match referee and medicos
- Should the injured player be allowed to bat/bowl? That’s up to medicos and the player
However, one thing that did skip my mind is that there is a rule where an injured player cannot bat in the next innings for the amount of time he was off in the previous innings. I’m not sure if this applies as well?
Jadeja is a bowler first and foremost. He (and India,) are at a clear disadvantage because he cannot bowl, and his batting would have been impaired. It is not comparable for mine. Again with Smith, he was batting with a busted hand, he and SA were at a clear disadvantage despite him being a batsman. India received a fit keeper and a bloke that was obviously fit enough to bat. He was throwing the bat around just fine, I am dubious about the nature of his injury. There was a clear advantage IMO.
Australia may have scored 300+, but Saha took four catches also.
All regulation catches though. The advantage was Pant’s batting who was already in the 11. As I said, to me it comes down to the two questions I asked. There was definitely an inury on Day 3- there was no playacting. It is a known fact that any fielder with half an injury is wrapped in cotton wool. I personally like this rule as long as it’s not exploited which it isn’t in this case. A rule that was exploited was the runner’s which was scrapped but wasn’t available yesterday with Vihari who again had a lefit injury.
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
People are being too tough on the bowling attack. The pitch gave them nothing and the second half of the day, India stopped scoring runs. Paine’s captaincy left a bit to be desired as it wasn’t attacking enough. Green and Marnus should’ve been utilised more.
In the same breath, India has played out of its skin. Ishant Sharma out of the series, Shami only played one game, Yadav gone in the middle of the innings, Kohli played 1 game, Vihari pulled hammie, Ashwin back pain and hit in the ribs, Jadeja broken thumb. Great resilience.
Yes, a lot of credit has to be given to India. Even if Australia win this series, it’ll be always under question whether if would have been as achievable with Shami, Yadav, Kohli & now Jadeja and Vihari not seeing out the series.
I personally don’t think so. The first test was a comprehensive win. The second test the top 4 let the team down but the bowlers were still 40/40 wickets. The third test was a very gutsy half a day from India on a pitch that gave nothing. The media can give whatever headline they wish but it’s not at all close to panic stations IMO. Australia is doing good.
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
Should be scrutiny over the replacement keeper rule too. A bit ordinary that Pant was able to stay off the field to let a better keeper in Saha take the field, only for Pant whom is a better bat to return and nearly crack a ton. Clearly his elbow wasn’t in that bad shape.
The match referee OK’d it since keeping involves diving around and since the injury was still so fresh. Definitely looks sus but any team would’ve done this.
Yeah, I would like the rule fixed to ensure it doesn’t happen again. Saha is a superior keeper and Pant is the better bat. They effectively played with 12 players. Maybe teams need to have a back up keeper in their 11.
I wouldn’t be happy with us exploiting the rule either for the record. It’s not necessarily cheating because it is within the rules but it is very much not in the spirit of the game.
I don’t think Pant was in any physical shape to keep yesterday considering he had gone for scans the night before. Today he batted simply because he had to.
For the future, I am happy with this rule as a wicket keeper is a specialist position, losing a wickie seriously handicaps you, but the replacement keeper shouldn’t be allowed to bat. Not having a wicketkeeper pretty much nullifies your spinner’s wicket taking ability IMO.
I think if you trade a keeper out, that’s it. He’s out for the game. Saha should have completed the game for India.
But he isn’t in the 11? Replacing an injured fielder is common practice but 12th/13th man is never allowed to bat/bowl. I don’t know what else any other team would’ve done. It’s a good rule and especially good when a wickie gets injured.
So they had a better keeper out there and they still got the best of Pant’s better ability to bat? They were at a distinct advantage. Pant wouldn’t have caught COVID in hotel quarantine.
It’s not cheating because it’s within the rules but that was certainly questionable. Perhaps one of the other 11 need to be a back up keeper ala Phil Hughes. If you trade out your keeper he should not return to the game. You can field a substitute keeper but your injured keeper shouldn’t be allowed to bat. If you get special dispensation for a keeper you should give up the injured keeper to bat. You don’t get to replace an injured strike bowler or batsman, they get field substitution and that’s it.
Pant’s ability to bat was a hit and miss. I am confident with the blow (he even dropped the painkiller he was taking) that he wouldn’t have been able to keep. He could’ve easily gotten out taking on the bowlers but he got lucky.
I think the rule change is good as it doesn’t allow a distinct disadvantage of not having a wickie. This time it worked out because Pant played a good innings but in most situations a clearly injured player wouldn’t have been able to.
He is markedly a better bat than Saha. The guy averages nearly 41, which is a very good average for a keeper and is a prolific hitter, pretty sure he strikes at like 72.
Like I said, I am OK with teams being able to field a replacement keeper if it is deemed a specialist position, but if you sub out a keeper, he cedes his ability to bat. You keep your 11 fielders but you lose your batsman to an injury. That is what would happen if you lose a batsman anyway. You sub them in the field and they don’t bat.
India gained an advantage IMO from a rule that is merely meant to prevent disadvantage. We can argue until the cows come home on the outcome if he didn’t bat but he had a marked impact on the innings with a supposed injured elbow. Again, it is within the rules and they played within them so I am in no way claiming wrongdoing, but I believe the rule needs looking at.
Yep I completely understand that you’re not claiming wrongdoing. But I disagree that the injured player shouldn’t have been able to bat/bowl. Jadeja with a broken/dislocated thumb would’ve batted as well. Same with Graeme Smith a few years ago, Kumble with a broken jaw bowling etc etc.
As for gaining an advantage? I hardly think India gained any advantage when Australia scored 300 runs in the 2nd innings.
To me there are two questions that need to be answered in any scenario like this:
- Is the injured player capable of fielding/keeping? That’s up to match referee and medicos
- Should the injured player be allowed to bat/bowl? That’s up to medicos and the player
However, one thing that did skip my mind is that there is a rule where an injured player cannot bat in the next innings for the amount of time he was off in the previous innings. I’m not sure if this applies as well?
People are being too tough on the bowling attack. The pitch gave them nothing and the second half of the day, India stopped scoring runs. Paine’s captaincy left a bit to be desired as it wasn’t attacking enough. Green and Marnus should’ve been utilised more.
In the same breath, India has played out of its skin. Ishant Sharma out of the series, Shami only played one game, Yadav gone in the middle of the innings, Kohli played 1 game, Vihari pulled hammie, Ashwin back pain and hit in the ribs, Jadeja broken thumb. Great resilience.
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
Should be scrutiny over the replacement keeper rule too. A bit ordinary that Pant was able to stay off the field to let a better keeper in Saha take the field, only for Pant whom is a better bat to return and nearly crack a ton. Clearly his elbow wasn’t in that bad shape.
The match referee OK’d it since keeping involves diving around and since the injury was still so fresh. Definitely looks sus but any team would’ve done this.
Yeah, I would like the rule fixed to ensure it doesn’t happen again. Saha is a superior keeper and Pant is the better bat. They effectively played with 12 players. Maybe teams need to have a back up keeper in their 11.
I wouldn’t be happy with us exploiting the rule either for the record. It’s not necessarily cheating because it is within the rules but it is very much not in the spirit of the game.
I don’t think Pant was in any physical shape to keep yesterday considering he had gone for scans the night before. Today he batted simply because he had to.
For the future, I am happy with this rule as a wicket keeper is a specialist position, losing a wickie seriously handicaps you, but the replacement keeper shouldn’t be allowed to bat. Not having a wicketkeeper pretty much nullifies your spinner’s wicket taking ability IMO.
I think if you trade a keeper out, that’s it. He’s out for the game. Saha should have completed the game for India.
But he isn’t in the 11? Replacing an injured fielder is common practice but 12th/13th man is never allowed to bat/bowl. I don’t know what else any other team would’ve done. It’s a good rule and especially good when a wickie gets injured.
So they had a better keeper out there and they still got the best of Pant’s better ability to bat? They were at a distinct advantage. Pant wouldn’t have caught COVID in hotel quarantine.
It’s not cheating because it’s within the rules but that was certainly questionable. Perhaps one of the other 11 need to be a back up keeper ala Phil Hughes. If you trade out your keeper he should not return to the game. You can field a substitute keeper but your injured keeper shouldn’t be allowed to bat. If you get special dispensation for a keeper you should give up the injured keeper to bat. You don’t get to replace an injured strike bowler or batsman, they get field substitution and that’s it.
Pant’s ability to bat was a hit and miss. I am confident with the blow (he even dropped the painkiller he was taking) that he wouldn’t have been able to keep. He could’ve easily gotten out taking on the bowlers but he got lucky.
I think the rule change is good as it doesn’t allow a distinct disadvantage of not having a wickie. This time it worked out because Pant played a good innings but in most situations a clearly injured player wouldn’t have been able to.
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
@tig_prmz said in Cricket Season Thread:
@Cultured_Bogan said in Cricket Season Thread:
Should be scrutiny over the replacement keeper rule too. A bit ordinary that Pant was able to stay off the field to let a better keeper in Saha take the field, only for Pant whom is a better bat to return and nearly crack a ton. Clearly his elbow wasn’t in that bad shape.
The match referee OK’d it since keeping involves diving around and since the injury was still so fresh. Definitely looks sus but any team would’ve done this.
Yeah, I would like the rule fixed to ensure it doesn’t happen again. Saha is a superior keeper and Pant is the better bat. They effectively played with 12 players. Maybe teams need to have a back up keeper in their 11.
I wouldn’t be happy with us exploiting the rule either for the record. It’s not necessarily cheating because it is within the rules but it is very much not in the spirit of the game.
I don’t think Pant was in any physical shape to keep yesterday considering he had gone for scans the night before. Today he batted simply because he had to.
For the future, I am happy with this rule as a wicket keeper is a specialist position, losing a wickie seriously handicaps you, but the replacement keeper shouldn’t be allowed to bat. Not having a wicketkeeper pretty much nullifies your spinner’s wicket taking ability IMO.
I think if you trade a keeper out, that’s it. He’s out for the game. Saha should have completed the game for India.
But he isn’t in the 11? Replacing an injured fielder is common practice but 12th/13th man is never allowed to bat/bowl. I don’t know what else any other team would’ve done. It’s a good rule and especially good when a wickie gets injured.