TIGERS Rozelle Development

Balmain Tigers and Western Suburbs Magpies Junior Development Discussion
gallagher
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Re: TIGERS Rozelle Development

Post by gallagher » Sat 10 Feb, 2018 6:08 pm

Yossarian wrote:
Sat 10 Feb, 2018 5:58 pm
gallagher wrote:
Sat 10 Feb, 2018 5:30 pm
How well was Balmain Leagues trading beore it closed? I thought they were struggling and that was blamed on location. If that's the case, what shill be different this time?
Take away the various grants and it was profitable even with a fairly lousy layout. A new club with a decent layout and surrounded by magnet attractions like a supermarket and they should do fine.
That's heartening that they were profitable. Hopefully it all works out. A strong Balmain can only help the JV.


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Post by Needaname » Sat 10 Feb, 2018 6:16 pm

No one particular, but the basis of it is the club might get re established as a West’s Tigers club. Since then and the media realise things may have changed. Or it may be that the face of the club remains as Balmain Tigers as you said the whole point of this is to bring Balmain home but the actual operations of the club and profits may be shared by West’s Ashfield.
After all West’s Ashfield do financially support all the Balmain juniors so it wouldn’t be too far from being a possibility.

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Post by Patts » Sun 11 Feb, 2018 6:14 am

I assume there would be many forum members that are members of Balmain Leagues Club, meaning they should be getting sent annual reports. A quick review of the latest report would reveal the size of today’s liabilities. (Interestingly I couldn’t find a copy of their annual report online. I can see every other other club I searched for; I think legally, community clubs have to make these records public).
Several years ago Balmain sold some of their poker machine licenses to pay down some debt, I don’t know if this has been common practice over the years.

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Post by Geo. » Sun 11 Feb, 2018 6:54 am

Patts wrote:
Sun 11 Feb, 2018 6:14 am
I assume there would be many forum members that are members of Balmain Leagues Club, meaning they should be getting sent annual reports. A quick review of the latest report would reveal the size of today’s liabilities. (Interestingly I couldn’t find a copy of their annual report online. I can see every other other club I searched for; I think legally, community clubs have to make these records public).
Several years ago Balmain sold some of their poker machine licenses to pay down some debt, I don’t know if this has been common practice over the years.
http://www.tigers.org.au/index.php/abou ... overnance/

2015 Report..
Ivan's Laws

1. You are either on the Bus or you are off..
2. The Star of the Team is the Team
3. Be the player your teammates want to play with..

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diedpretty
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Post by diedpretty » Sun 11 Feb, 2018 8:18 am

Yossarian wrote:
Sat 10 Feb, 2018 6:06 pm
Patts wrote:
Sat 10 Feb, 2018 5:11 pm
I seriously hope for Balmain (and consequently the Wests Tigers) that a development can go ahead and they finally get back to Rozelle. Balmain are only a minority shareholder these days but it's definitely better to have a minority partner that can contribute.
My fear for Balmain though is, reportedly, their debts run into the tens of millions it may not be possible to trade out of the hole that is swallowing them. If Balmain know bankruptcy is enivitable, and the Wests Tigers is their only future; than the best move maybe to hand the space over to Wests Ashfield/Wests Tigers to develop a new leagues club on the premises.
They're trading now. If they can get up and trading it should be fine. I don't know what the debt is but I'd doubt it's tens of millions.

Their report shows a debt still to Rozelle of $10 million and they owe Wests Ashfield $6 million. Someone on here said they would be gifted the club ( haven't seen anything to suggest thats true ) but i would assume the debt to Rozelle developments will still stand.


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Post by Patts » Sun 11 Feb, 2018 9:10 am

The last statement I could find (mid 2017) the Balmain Leagues Club had debts a little over $10M (vast majority to the previous Rozelle developer). From what I can make out, in the case of Balmain the football club is the parent company to the leagues club (where as for Western Suburbs it's essentially the other way around).

There was no mention of a debt to the NRL or the Wests Magpies Group but I'm guessing that's because the football club carries the liability for that debt. It was well reported Balmain owed $5.4M to the NRL and the Wests Magpies Group paid back that loan when Balmain couldn't. Obviously in the process Balmain sold half their stake to the Magpies but that still left them with an immediate debt of $2.7M to retain their remaining 25% in the Wests Tigers. That loan would easily be more than $2.7M because of interest and I'm sure Balmain were also needing to borrow for future contributions (to the Wests Tigers). The new loan is either with the NRL, a financial institution or directly with The Wests Magpies Group. I don't think it's directly to the Magpies but I think they have gone guarantor for loan (I'm guessing if Balmain default the Magpies will pay the debt and assume ownership of the remaining 25%).

As for the announcement last week that Balmain would be "gifted" space for a leagues club; I took this to mean they would get the space rent free. But "gifted" could also mean rent cheaper than the market rate.

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Post by Russell » Sun 11 Feb, 2018 9:19 am

Patts wrote:
Sun 11 Feb, 2018 9:10 am
The last statement I could find (mid 2017) the Balmain Leagues Club had debts a little over $10M (vast majority to the previous Rozelle developer). From what I can make out, in the case of Balmain the football club is the parent company to the leagues club (where as for Western Suburbs it's essentially the other way around).

There was no mention of a debt to the NRL or the Wests Magpies Group but I'm guessing that's because the football club carries the liability for that debt. It was well reported Balmain owed $5.4M to the NRL and the Wests Magpies Group paid back that loan when Balmain couldn't. Obviously in the process Balmain sold half their stake to the Magpies but that still left them with an immediate debt of $2.7M to retain their remaining 25% in the Wests Tigers. That new loan is either with the NRL, a financial institution or directly with The Wests Magpies Group. I don't think it's directly to the Magpies but I think they have gone guarantor for loan (I'm guessing if Balmain default the Magpies will pay the debt and assume ownership of the remaining 25%).

As for the announcement last week that Balmain would be "gifted" space for a leagues club; I took this to mean they would get the space rent free. But "gifted" could also mean rent cheaper than the market rate.
Maybe it could mean they get the space back that they sold for $1.00 to the previous developer in the biggest rort in League history.

As far as I am aware the Balmain Football Club is not responsible for any debts incurred by the Balmain Leagues Club.
However they do owe the Joint Venture for their share as it becomes due. They lost voting rights on the board and 25% of their ownership to pay back money due. Wests will let them buy this back if they ever become financial again.

Help! - am I incorrect in this scenario????

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Post by weststigers » Thu 01 Mar, 2018 6:57 pm

Looks like another spanner in the works.

Is Balmain the unluckiest club in history??

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/bal ... 4z29l.html

Does this mean we sold the club for $1 and we won’t get a thing? Or do we have some financial recourse?

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Post by smithy » Thu 01 Mar, 2018 7:41 pm

I know this news may be disappointing but it could work in Balmain leagues favour.the majority of the residents want the club back but not the height of the two towers as in previous plans.speaking to residents a few weeks back they all agreed that this new proposal is almost acceptable.so next time it goes up I believe it will get approved because there is no way the residents will allow a motorway ramp in rozelle and the development to them is the better of two evils.the rozelle action group is no pushover and with an state election next year the government don't want any more protests.

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Post by innsaneink » Thu 01 Mar, 2018 8:06 pm

smithy wrote:
Thu 01 Mar, 2018 7:41 pm
I know this news may be disappointing but it could work in Balmain leagues favour.the majority of the residents want the club back but not the height of the two towers as in previous plans.speaking to residents a few weeks back they all agreed that this new proposal is almost acceptable.so next time it goes up I believe it will get approved because there is no way the residents will allow a motorway ramp in rozelle and the development to them is the better of two evils.the rozelle action group is no pushover and with an state election next year the government don't want any more protests.
I dont think there is much room, if any for negotiation when it comes to compulsory acquisition.
I dont think Balmain would get any compensation either.
This whole saga has stunk from the beginning and its becoming clearer where its coming from

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Post by hammertime » Thu 01 Mar, 2018 9:31 pm

Darcy and nearby residents are about to regret they didn't accept prior proposals. Rozelle will be a nightmare for years if they use that site for excavation.

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Post by Nelson » Thu 01 Mar, 2018 10:07 pm

smithy wrote:
Thu 01 Mar, 2018 7:41 pm
I know this news may be disappointing but it could work in Balmain leagues favour.the majority of the residents want the club back but not the height of the two towers as in previous plans.speaking to residents a few weeks back they all agreed that this new proposal is almost acceptable.so next time it goes up I believe it will get approved because there is no way the residents will allow a motorway ramp in rozelle and the development to them is the better of two evils.the rozelle action group is no pushover and with an state election next year the government don't want any more protests.
It's the Rozelle Residents Action Group (RRAG), presumably so people don't refer to them as "the rag" and councillors don't say things like "gee the rag is causing me trouble this month". Always gotta think about your acronyms...

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Post by gallagher » Thu 01 Mar, 2018 10:29 pm

:roll
Nelson wrote:
Thu 01 Mar, 2018 10:07 pm
smithy wrote:
Thu 01 Mar, 2018 7:41 pm
I know this news may be disappointing but it could work in Balmain leagues favour.the majority of the residents want the club back but not the height of the two towers as in previous plans.speaking to residents a few weeks back they all agreed that this new proposal is almost acceptable.so next time it goes up I believe it will get approved because there is no way the residents will allow a motorway ramp in rozelle and the development to them is the better of two evils.the rozelle action group is no pushover and with an state election next year the government don't want any more protests.
It's the Rozelle Residents Action Group (RRAG), presumably so people don't refer to them as "the rag" and councillors don't say things like "gee the rag is causing me trouble this month". Always gotta think about your acronyms...
:roll

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Post by andrew 474 » Fri 02 Mar, 2018 8:26 am

Right from the start this whole things was never planned well , The Tigers probably should have sold it to Harry ( Meriton ). The guy seems to get things done , you only need to drive around and Meriton are everywhere , Poor Descisions , people out of their Depth and Stupid Councils and Action Groups have all help Dig the whole this old club will be buried in , How would people like Keith Barnes feel about this and many others who played for the club or used the club as a meeting place for a feed and a drink , specially the older folks who do meet at these types of venues for a cheaper Feed and get together , real Shame

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Post by Balmain Boy » Fri 02 Mar, 2018 9:59 am

Spending hundreds of millions of dollars to buy land in an extremely prominent position for a dive site? A site crucial for the long term survival of small businesses in Rozelle. All for another tunnel which no one wants?

the westconnex tunnel from lilyfield to iron cove bridge is one thing, and will help traffic in the area.

Hadn't rozelle village already sold it to the new developers?

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Post by hammertime » Fri 02 Mar, 2018 11:48 am

Balmain Boy wrote:
Fri 02 Mar, 2018 9:59 am
Spending hundreds of millions of dollars to buy land in an extremely prominent position for a dive site? A site crucial for the long term survival of small businesses in Rozelle. All for another tunnel which no one wants?

the westconnex tunnel from lilyfield to iron cove bridge is one thing, and will help traffic in the area.

Hadn't rozelle village already sold it to the new developers?
They'll spend the money initially but sell it back once complete.

Darcy is copping it on FB that he got what he deserved by whinging at every proposal that came his way (as well as the Labor govt being the initial trigger for the Tigers to vacate the site)

I actually lived on Lilyfield Rd, right near the rug shop. Managed to sell out just before the smoke stacks were announced, but right after the massive park was. So glad I did, the suburb is going to be one massive construction site for decades. The bays precinct hasn't even started yet and it will go for 20 years...

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Post by quintus » Fri 02 Mar, 2018 12:12 pm

We will rise from the ashes.... :sign:

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Post by Basil Tiger » Fri 02 Mar, 2018 1:05 pm

andrew 474 wrote:
Fri 02 Mar, 2018 8:26 am
Right from the start this whole things was never planned well , The Tigers probably should have sold it to Harry ( Meriton ). The guy seems to get things done , you only need to drive around and Meriton are everywhere , Poor Decisions , people out of their Depth and Stupid Councils and Action Groups have all help Dig the whole this old club will be buried in , How would people like Keith Barnes feel about this and many others who played for the club or used the club as a meeting place for a feed and a drink , specially the older folks who do meet at these types of venues for a cheaper Feed and get together , real Shame
Yeah,absolute tragedy,i agree with all of the above,there are several 'Directors'(who couldn't be trusted to put out garbage bins') and a couple of ex-Balmain players that should be ashamed of themselves.
There were members at the time that predicted all this folly,once the Club gave up ownership we were gone,it was just a matter of when,where and to what extent.
I also feel extremely sorry for the post WW11 members that fought and scaped to get the Leagues Club up and running,in a prime location,in the first place.
Greetings All,from far Northern NSW.

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