2023 Israel–Hamas war

[trentrunciman]

Depends on which way you look at it!

the Legend かいと san

 

[trentrunciman]

My point was GAZA has been too infected with Hamas.

Total eradication of Hamas has to be the only end goal. Israel will not stop.

And then there will be peace in the middle east?

 

[Magpie_Magic]

I suppose. I hate what's happening in Gaza just as much as I hate Hamas' attack on Israel and I'm no big fan of the U.S but they are the only realistic counter to the ambitions of China and Russia. If the U.S aren't around, who's left to stop imperialism from both these countries?

Agree,

And Russia and China act as a brake on their ambitions .

The US are super warmongers. Imagine if Russia didn't have that nuclear stockpile, and China too for that matter.....or the US, With AI, nuclear weapons and bio threats we need counterweights.

We need them all.

The US was the nicer guy in many respects for us during the Soviet Union period. We got a better deal. Then they got super aggressive.

I remember the maxim,

Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

 

[trentrunciman]

I suppose. I hate what's happening in Gaza just as much as I hate Hamas' attack on Israel and I'm no big fan of the U.S but they are the only realistic counter to the ambitions of China and Russia. If the U.S aren't around, who's left to stop imperialism from both these countries?

Yeah, that's the polarity argument.

Will be interesting to see how it plays out considering the US is a vassal state for Israel - will the US come to help? i.e. R2P doctrine? I mean the west always and obv provide arms etc and vice versa anyway but i doubt they would act. Again more proxy war and less direct conflict from the super powers. Suppose thats how it will play out and the war will keep going then media won't talk about it for a while.

But I don't get the Russia/China imperialism argument? If you're alluding to Russia's invasion of Ukraine then imho its incredibly hard to argue against Russia's invasion.

 

[pawsandclaws1]

Palestine supporters take to the nation’s streets

Attendance at pro-Palestine rallies around the nation is surging as images of violence in the Middle East reverberate through Australian communities.

www.aap.com.au

 

[Winston Churchill]

And then there will be peace in the middle east?

Its a perfect start.

 

[pawsandclaws1]

Lock em up

We don't deny citizens the right to protest peacefully for the Palestinian people.

 

[Mistymuzzle]

And then there will be peace in the middle east?

Peace in the Middle East has nothing to do with Gaza. Peace is possible in the Middle East without Gaza or Hamas wihch is exactly why UAE, Bahrain, Saudi et al have been normalising relations with Israel and getting on with life regardless of the "Palestinian Problem". This leaves an issue with Iran v Sunni/Wahabi but with strong relationships between Israel/Saudi/UAE/Sunni states including economic, technological and defensive cooperation could provide a strong stable bilateralism that brings peace.

Peace between Israel & Palestinians has everything to do with Gaza and Hamas. There is zero chance for peace whilst Hamas exist as stated by Hamas themselves and they have to be believed. If Hamas is somehow able to be eliminated then a peace might be possible between Israel and Gazan palestinians.

 

[Mistymuzzle]

Another war by proxy, on 2 fronts now haha

Israel v Hamas is not a bilateral proxy war.

 

[Winston Churchill]

We don't deny citizens the right to protest peacefully for the Palestinian people.

Just many other reasons

 

[pawsandclaws1]

Just many other reasons

A pro-Palestine rally has begun outside Town Hall in Sydney

A pro-Palestine rally is underway outside Town Hall in Sydney with attendance expected to climb up to 10,000 people before marching to Belmore Park. Event organisers have been working closely with Sydney police over the past week to ensure the demonstration could be carried out peacefully as...

www.skynews.com.au

 

[Mistymuzzle]

Yeah, that's the polarity argument.

Will be interesting to see how it plays out considering the US is a vassal state for Israel - will the US come to help? i.e. R2P doctrine? I mean the west always and obv provide arms etc and vice versa anyway but i doubt they would act. Again more proxy war and less direct conflict from the super powers. Suppose thats how it will play out and the war will keep going then media won't talk about it for a while.

Just because US & Israel are close allies and have close ties and obviously the US will supply Israel with as much weapons that they need and may even if push comes to shove would directly fight with Israeli's, this does not make this a proxy war. Its not. Israel is not a proxy for the US in this war, Israel is fighting an actual existential threat against an enemy that has stated that their objective is to obliterate Israel and push them into the sea and take over their homes and land and if they cant achieve that, kill as many jews as possible. They are not fighting as a proxy of the US. Hamas is likely to be a proxy for Iran, but its not bilateral.

 

[Mistymuzzle]

We don't deny citizens the right to protest peacefully for the Palestinian people.

Inciting violence "Gas the Jews", "Death to Jews" is simply illegal and these people should be arrested. Australia doesnt have a bill of rights and there is no legal "right" to free speech although morally we should fight for it, but that doesnt extend to incitement to violence.

Its a ridiculous simple argument, simply by the thought experiment of what would happen if there was a parade through Sydney streets chanting "Death to Muslims".

I am genuinely shocked that people are defending this and it is showing peoples real colours.

 

[pawsandclaws1]

Inciting violence "Gas the Jews", "Death to Jews" is simply illegal and these people should be arrested. Australia doesnt have a bill of rights and there is no legal "right" to free speech although morally we should fight for it, but that doesnt extend to incitement to violence.

Its a ridiculous simple argument, simply by the thought experiment of what would happen if there was a parade through Sydney streets chanting "Death to Muslims".

I am genuinely shocked that people are defending this and it is showing peoples real colours.

Criminal & Traffic Lawyers Newcastle - Hamilton Janke

Top-Rated Newcastle Criminal Lawyers. 24/7 Criminal & Traffic Lawyers. All NSW Courts. Charged with an offence? Claim your obligation-free consultation here.

www.hamiltonjanke.com.au

I wrote the right to protest peacefully.

 

[Mistymuzzle]

Criminal & Traffic Lawyers Newcastle - Hamilton Janke

Top-Rated Newcastle Criminal Lawyers. 24/7 Criminal & Traffic Lawyers. All NSW Courts. Charged with an offence? Claim your obligation-free consultation here.

www.hamiltonjanke.com.au

I wrote the right to protest peacefully.

Yes, in response to the examples provided by Winston of people protesting illegally in accordance with the laws you posted. I can only take from that, that you believe people have the right the parade through the streets chanting "death to Jews"? If thats the case you have pretty clearly posted your colours.

 

[Aceshigh]

Yes, in response to the examples provided by Winston of people protesting illegally in accordance with the laws you posted. I can only take from that, that you believe people have the right the parade through the streets chanting "death to Jews"? If thats the case you have pretty clearly posted your colours.

There is no place for anybody to be chanting death to anyone or burning of flags , half the protesters are just pests that just want to part of any protest

 

[pawsandclaws1]

Yes, in response to the examples provided by Winston of people protesting illegally in accordance with the laws you posted. I can only take from that, that you believe people have the right the parade through the streets chanting "death to Jews"? If thats the case you have pretty clearly posted your colours.

I have written my position clearly in that I support the right to protest peacefully which is permitted by the law. I have posted the link. The 850 NSW Police in attendance enforce the law.

If Winston has instances of the law been broken, no doubt he can bring them to the attention of the NSW Police..

 

[pawsandclaws1]

I have reported the last post to the moderators. It is highly offensive and disgusting. Have the decency to remove it.

 

[Mistymuzzle]

I have reported the last post to the moderators. It is highly offensive and disgusting. Have the decency to remove it.

Pre-edit?

 

[Winston Churchill]

I have written my position clearly in that I support the right to protest peacefully which is permitted by the law. I have posted the link. The 850 NSW Police in attendance enforce the law.

If Winston has instances of the law been broken, no doubt he can bring them to the attention of the NSW Police..

Sydney government apologizes for pro-Palestine protest that had ‘gas the Jews’ chants

Police are investigating a separate incident in Melbourne in which a group of men allegedly said they were 'on the hunt to kill Jews'

www.timesofisrael.com

Antisemitic chants to be treated as a hate crime under tough new Queensland laws

Comments heard at a recent pro-Palestine protest in Sydney would come under the laws which aim to crack down on vilification, lawyers say

www.theguardian.com

‘Reprehensible’ anti-Israel protesters chant ‘Gas the Jews’ outside Sydney Opera House: video

Around 1,000 protesters gathered outside Sydney’s iconic performing arts hall carrying flares and Palestinian flags Monday night.

nypost.com

https://www.thejc.com/news/world/pro-palestine-demonstrators-spark-anger-after-chanting-gas-the-jews-at-sydney-protest-4wEC8qwiIUkzy02ZZdmd2O

Sydney government apologizes for pro-Palestinian protest that included ‘gas the Jews’ chants - Jewish Telegraphic Agency

Officials have rejected protesters' request for another rally this weekend.

www.jta.org

Police investigate pro-Palestinian protest at Sydney Opera House over alleged anti-Semitism

Australian police said on Tuesday they were investigating a pro-Palestinian protest outside Sydney Opera House, after footage emerged of a small group appearing to chant anti-Semitic slogans at the demonstration.

www.reuters.com