It's time to take the fight back to HBG

[Telltails]

Interesting that Darcy is one of the loudest driving for the laws around Poker Machines to be implemented which will directly effect clubs like Wests Ashfield.

 

[Leck]

HBG is a not for profit members club, not a shareholder owned company. It has no shareholders to pay dividends to, so profits are reinvested into the club, sporting programs and community initiatives according to their constitution rather than distributed to private owners.

Even if they sold the club, the money doesn't go to any board members, however they do control where it is spent to an extent.

Once upon a time, leagues clubs were run for their members, however these days they’re a tax break for the pokies and the over-inflated salaries of board members.

The Wests Tigers are the only club in the NRL with a debenture system.

The rot needs to stop.

 

[mtd#2]

i tried to gather dirt , long story short , creepy GranPa didnt quiet understand , but he showed me receipts on his cash backs for greasing the wheels ,and laughed like a hyeana ,and snatched them back when he understood what i wanted them for - here ,blah blah , said he pumped in lots of money in the right circles with the club , they stopped showing him due respect, he put in complaint and now him and his wife have an 80% cash back on what up to 10 at a time spend 1's a month at the club , Told him to shut up before he dropped every 1 in it , is he willing to say all he said on this site - i will take him here there and now , and he went silly old man knows nothing ,just need the surface scratched , But its an open route in front of the in crowd

Can you translate this for me

 

[mtd#2]

Interesting that Darcy is one of the loudest driving for the laws around Poker Machines to be implemented which will directly effect clubs like Wests Ashfield.

leagues clubs would go broke.. can't see it happening.

 

[Merlot]

Can you translate this for me

an old guy bragged about certain club luxuries he was getting ,as some sort of a quid pro rata , i will skip the middle bit - and it ended with him taking paper work back when it was known i want said paper work and his stories to be told on the - hbg thread, Then he laughed in my face saying he will not make his perks public

 

[Suzie-Q]

an old guy bragged about certain club luxuries he was getting ,as some sort of a quid pro rata , i will skip the middle bit - and it ended with him taking paper work back when it was known i want said paper work and his stories to be told on the - hbg thread, Then he laughed in my face saying he will not make his perks public

And that is everything wrong worh the stupid debenture system!!

Imagine if they invested some of that pokie revenue into, I dunno, assistants for Benji, talent scouts, rehab specialists. But, no, it's perks for the boys 🤮

 

[Tom Shines]

leagues clubs would go broke.. can't see it happening.

big employers … bit like when they had to backflip when they were going to get rid of Greyhound racing …

 

[Merlot]

And that is everything wrong worh the stupid debenture system!!

Imagine if they invested some of that pokie revenue into, I dunno, assistants for Benji, talent scouts, rehab specialists. But, no, it's perks for the boys 🤮

silly old bugger jumped in on a convo and started shooting off at the mouth knows where the skeletons are kept ,he's been dinning out on a few for decades , it was all at my fingertips ( some of it ) until he realized it wasn't him that's ego wasn't getting stroked , his son is the same ,they think its cool to spruike what they have ,when 2 millionaires dressed like hobbo's sit either side of them .LOL

 

[Papacito]

And that is everything wrong worh the stupid debenture system!!

Imagine if they invested some of that pokie revenue into, I dunno, assistants for Benji, talent scouts, rehab specialists. But, no, it's perks for the boys 🤮

Is this true though?

Richo himself said that HBG had always come to the party when he'd asked for help.

 

[Suzie-Q]

Is this true though?

Richo himself said that HBG had always come to the party when he'd asked for help.

People have posted the financial input from keagues clubs to nrl teams, and Wests Tigers is the lowest by a huge amount.

 

[TheEnz]

The proof is in the pudding.

You acknowledged earlier today that the HBG decision in December was the wrong one.

That decision halted the talks of Jarome removing his clauses, 4 months later he decided he was off to PNG. It delayed the signing of Bula; he looked at other clubs after December and we ended up paying him more than originally planned.

Whether you like Luai or not, its a marquee player we lost because of them.

Whether you like Bula or not, it's a player we are now paying more than originally planned. You are all about not paying overs too. My guess is the May brothers are also on overs now.

New owners don't come with the disruption of this lot. They can't even keep their own backyard in order with the turnover on their own board.

New owners bring more stability. More money. TPA's. KOE games before NRL games. All senior grades branded the Wests Tigers.

So yeah, the whole club becomes far more appealing and would increase the clubs ability to draw new players.

Personally i think this paying overs stuff is not necessarily our problem, yes we probably pay a premium for players as we have been locked in the bottom 8 for years and have 3 consecutive wooden spoons. I think the bigger issue and real problem is we have not been able to get any value out of our juniors and catchment area for years. A club like ours should be able to spend 80% of our cap and still be consistently successful because we have local juniors coming through regularly and spending 3 - 4 years in first grade and maybe moving on for a bigger payday elsewhere. This is where the lack of investment the club makes in our juniors really hurts. I would love the see the stats of how many players across the NRL actually hail from our catchment area.

I also think the bigger issue in a salary cap is when you fund a player to go elsewhere, and we know that we have been doing that for a few players now and I'm hoping this is the last year. Covering $300k (guessing) of Batemans salary vs paying $100k over each to secure 3 quality players and I know what I would prefer to do.

 

[Suzie-Q]

Personally i think this paying overs stuff is not necessarily our problem, yes we probably pay a premium for players as we have been locked in the bottom 8 for years and have 3 consecutive wooden spoons. I think the bigger issue and real problem is we have not been able to get any value out of our juniors and catchment area for years. A club like ours should be able to spend 80% of our cap and still be consistently successful because we have local juniors coming through regualrly and spending 3 - 4 years in first grade and maybe moving on for a bigger payday elsewhere.

I also think the bigger issue in a salary cap is when you fund a player to go elsewhere, and we know that we have been doing that for a few players now and I'm hoping this is the last year. Covering $300k (guessing) of Batemans salary vs paying $100k over to secure 3 quality players and I know what I would prefer to do.

Is the lack of funding coaches, etc, in the pathways system a reason we don't get that value from our juniors, and possibly why they go on to perform better at other clubs?

 

[mtd#2]

Is the lack of funding coaches, etc, in the pathways system a reason we don't get that value from our juniors, and possibly why they go on to perform better at other clubs?

Lack of funding AND systems is my guess.
Its all good an well to have money, but everyone needs to be on the same page from the NRL through to Harrold Matthews.

 

[Suzie-Q]

Lack of funding AND systems is my guess.
Its all good an well to have money, but everyone needs to be on the same page from the NRL through to Harrold Matthews.

There are too many "pages" at WT

 

[tig_prmz]

People have posted the financial input from keagues clubs to nrl teams, and Wests Tigers is the lowest by a huge amount.

I think that's Richo's way of keeping them happy.

They make $100m a year, only $11m profit. Out of that $1.5m I assume comes to WT, Magpies etc.

They spend $1.2m in donations.

You need that 10% profit because they're spending apparently $50m in salaries. If they have a bad year the next year or so, they can't be spending all their money on WT.

Nearly 30% of their profits they're spending on things they won't see a return on (I.e. Donations/ Football department).

We can beg them to double their investment into WT but even that won't be enough. And why would they invest more when it's a one- way model and they don't get anything back from WT?

My opnion is:
- spend as much as you can in Pathways, create excellent systems, create excellent coaches, excellent physios, S&Cs etc.
- Make them as professional as you can from every rep team onwards and promote these staff from within
- Spend as little as you can on the NRL dept itself other than obviously the salary cap.

Maybe SM is already doing that. Maybe my opinion is flawed too and we might end up losing money if we aren't spending on the NRL.

But we have to do something drastic.

**Disclaimer: not an accountant, just reading the Annual report and trying to understand**

 

[TheEnz]

Is the lack of funding coaches, etc, in the pathways system a reason we don't get that value from our juniors, and possibly why they go on to perform better at other clubs?

I am not across the details, just making assumptions based on the output and snippets I read about the junior system across the league and the number of players that I hear in interviews that hail from western Sydney and have been in the roosters, sharks etc.. systems from a very early age. Obviously we will not get them all, however we will lose the best ones if we dont have the talent scouts and systems in place to secure them....and that requires funding.

 

[KevB]

leagues clubs would go broke.. can't see it happening.

And hotels

 

[tig_prmz]

I know people hate HBG because they're owners and I get it.

But honestly, we have been in the NRL for 25+ years and are barely surviving with autonomy. HBG doesn't take money out of WT, they can literally be considered just a source of income/ sponsorship and that's it.

Even if they were to sell it, who would want to buy a Club that is barely making money. And what makes people confident the new owners will invest money into the Club? Actually, anyone who wants to buy the Club, first invest in it and show us you can spend money on it.

There is no sugar daddy, there's not big corporate facility that's going to save us. We are on our own and need to figure out a way to get this football department going properly.

I am from South West and it pains me that all these talented kids I see, all these families that spend10 hours a weekend going to 4 different games for their kids and they don't have the support they need.

 

[Tom Shines]

I know people hate HBG because they're owners and I get it.

But honestly, we have been in the NRL for 25+ years and are barely surviving with autonomy. HBG doesn't take money out of WT, they can literally be considered just a source of income/ sponsorship and that's it.

Even if they were to sell it, who would want to buy a Club that is barely making money. And what makes people confident the new owners will invest money into the Club? Actually, anyone who wants to buy the Club, first invest in it and show us you can spend money on it.

There is no sugar daddy, there's not big corporate facility that's going to save us. We are on our own and need to figure out a way to get this football department going properly.

I am from South West and it pains me that all these talented kids I see, all these families that spend10 hours a weekend going to 4 different games for their kids and they don't have the support they need.

Don’t you recall Laundy saying he would buy the club 6 months ago ?

They wouldn’t have any troubles offloading the club … the NRL is investment gold currently

 

[tig_prmz]

Don’t you recall Laundy saying he would buy the club 6 months ago ?

They wouldn’t have any troubles offloading the club … the NRL is investment gold currently

I read that most NRL Clubs are making a profit now but remember the NRL grant is $30m. Are any of them making more than $30m?

Also, can they take money out of WT? HBGs charter says they can't.