A Year Monitoring Crypto during COVID

[old_man_tiger]

Returns are commensurate with risk. I thought I lost everything I had put into crypto (a very modest sum 4 or 5 years ago) then earlier this year I got out for a profit. If I'd held I would have doubled the initial investment. If you buy near a peak it can end very badly, but like @momo_amp_medo said, play with an amount you can afford to lose.

@jirskyr it is very easy to trade in Aus and withdraw fiat currency. I used BTC markets and it was painless.

 

[jirskyr]

Returns are commensurate with risk. I thought I lost everything I had put into crypto (a very modest sum 4 or 5 years ago) then earlier this year I got out for a profit. If I'd held I would have doubled the initial investment. If you buy near a peak it can end very badly, but like @momo_amp_medo said, play with an amount you can afford to lose.

@jirskyr it is very easy to trade in Aus and withdraw fiat currency. I used BTC markets and it was painless.

Still not for me I don't think. I have a mortgage to pay, I just plow my money into that, because it definitely goes down. Sure I can risk to gain more on crypto or stocks, but I'll let my Super do that modestly whilst I try to climb out of common debt.

I also, frankly, don't have the spare time to manage a portfolio. My personality, once I started investing in these things, I'd ride them up and down, analysing, projecting, thinking... too much mental energy for 10 or 20K here and there.

 

[jirskyr]

@jirskyr it is very easy to trade in Aus and withdraw fiat currency. I used BTC markets and it was painless.

And when there's a loss of confidence and owners rush to sell bitcoin, is it still painless?

 

[mike]

My issue is not whether or not the relative value yo-yos (because I don't invest in crypto anyway) but the question always remains - can you actually exercise your crypto whenever you please?

So if you see a 500% gain on speculative value, can you take that bitcoin and buy a house or a car or simply turn it into old fiat currency? Because I am of the understanding it's not that simple to covert your "gains", in which case it becomes a question of exactly what kind of "profit" you have made.

For example, it's all fine and dandy for the bank to value your house at $X, but another thing entirely to find buyers who agree and will stump up the cash.

My concern is also, if you are more and more exposed to crypto as a means of investment, it is extremely high risk of external influence, as already noted. Some punk can make a twitter comment and half your projected investment value in 1 day. Sure the stock market can do similar things, but at least with stocks you can diversify very broadly and you have some very long-term dependably performing stocks, which themselves are informed by the success of the relative business. And fundamentally, businesses exist to be successful and make profit, so there is an inherent drive within business to succeed, upon which investors can judge whether the expertise/capability/market exists for that success.

For crypto, there are really only a handful of legitimate large players, they absolutely do not have long-term dependable performance and there is no inherent drive for success, except for the hoarding and hyping of existing owners. Crypto doesn't actually exist in any physical capacity, there's no tangible group or person or performance metric driving the crypto values. It's only speculation and FOMO that drives the prices.

So if you have spare 000s you can afford to lose, go for it, but you might as well gamble that money all over the place; hedge your bets.

As far as I am aware you can't draw your cryptos down in Australia. I use Coinbase as my wallet and whilst I can buy crypto through them they don't have withdrawal services yet. However, this link, which I have posted previously in a crypto thread, is an Aussie firm that allows you to pay your bills through Bpay or Credit cards and even bank transfers. https://www.livingroomofsatoshi.com/ So I have been watching Foxtel for free since November, paid my gas and electricity bills and my monthly mobile ph account cos I never counted it as real money. Crypto is simply a gamble - only get into it if you can afford to lose some initial outlay. The surge in November mirrored the same growth 2 years ago. Come April 2019 it began to taper off. Is growth sustainable? Boom & Bust is real. A bit like the TIgers Finals drought.

Not so. You can very easily convert any of the Crypto currencies into $AUD through a number of exchanges based in Australia, straight into your bank account.

 

[Speed2burn]

Thanks for sharing.

I’m not as knowledgeable as some crypto heads on here but I have dabbled a bit into Bitcoin & ETH a few years back as well as a bit in some ALGO & Ankr about 6 months back

All have returned a healthy profit for me personally so far.

 

[finnzo]

It’s so early in the grand scheme of things I highly recommend people start looking into it abit more there is serious money to be made

 

[mike]

My issue is not whether or not the relative value yo-yos (because I don't invest in crypto anyway) but the question always remains - can you actually exercise your crypto whenever you please?

**So if you see a 500% gain on speculative value, can you take that bitcoin and buy a house or a car or simply turn it into old fiat currency? Because I am of the understanding it's not that simple to covert your "gains", in which case it becomes a question of exactly what kind of "profit" you have made.**

For example, it's all fine and dandy for the bank to value your house at $X, but another thing entirely to find buyers who agree and will stump up the cash.

My concern is also, if you are more and more exposed to crypto as a means of investment, it is extremely high risk of external influence, as already noted. Some punk can make a twitter comment and half your projected investment value in 1 day. Sure the stock market can do similar things, but at least with stocks you can diversify very broadly and you have some very long-term dependably performing stocks, which themselves are informed by the success of the relative business. And fundamentally, businesses exist to be successful and make profit, so there is an inherent drive within business to succeed, upon which investors can judge whether the expertise/capability/market exists for that success.

For crypto, there are really only a handful of legitimate large players, they absolutely do not have long-term dependable performance and there is no inherent drive for success, except for the hoarding and hyping of existing owners. Crypto doesn't actually exist in any physical capacity, there's no tangible group or person or performance metric driving the crypto values. It's only speculation and FOMO that drives the prices.

So if you have spare 000s you can afford to lose, go for it, but you might as well gamble that money all over the place; hedge your bets.

Basically yes you can today on Australian Based exchanges. It's really that easy. That never used to be the case but it is now. As I stated in my original conclusion you need to be aware of or your tax obligations. For investments, Just like shares, 'events' would be subject to capital gains tax.

 

[old_man_tiger]

@jirskyr it is very easy to trade in Aus and withdraw fiat currency. I used BTC markets and it was painless.

And when there's a loss of confidence and owners rush to sell bitcoin, is it still painless?

I'd say that it would be equally distressing for any asset that can bleed double digits in a day. Dynamics are not any different to any other market, if it was an amp it would have just have the gain knob turned up to 11.

I'm not a crypto advocate by the way, as the lows are just as real as the highs. I am conservatively focused on my own mortgage and super.

 

[mccarry2]

The trillion dollar question for crypto is will governments stay sitting on their hands as these currencies reduce their power?

In the past the government controls their own currency. This is a MASSIVE form of control and power for the country.

If Crypto becomes mainstream govts lose that control.

My experience with people in power is they don’t give it up easily.

 

[mike]

The trillion dollar question for crypto is will governments stay sitting on their hands as these currencies reduce their power?

In the past the government controls their own currency. This is a MASSIVE form of control and power for the country.

If Crypto becomes mainstream govts lose that control.

My experience with people in power is they don’t give it up easily.

No idea, certainly one of the risks I would think for sure.

 

[Geo]

How much is a PIE...

 

[mike]

How much is a PIE...

Assuming a gourmet pie of around $6.60 that would currently translate to 0.000095 BTC (bitcoin)

 

[hobbo1]

How much is a PIE...


Assuming a gourmet pie of around $6.60 that would currently translate to 0.000095 BTC (bitcoin)

Do you know of any bakery’s that accepts Bitcoin

( asking for a friend)

 

[mike]

How much is a PIE...


Assuming a gourmet pie of around $6.60 that would currently translate to 0.000095 BTC (bitcoin)

Do you know of any bakery’s that accepts Bitcoin

( asking for a friend)

I have no idea, which is typical because I have little idea about most things. ?

 

[hobbo1]

How much is a PIE...


Assuming a gourmet pie of around $6.60 that would currently translate to 0.000095 BTC (bitcoin)

Do you know of any bakery’s that accepts Bitcoin

( asking for a friend)

I have no idea, which is typical because I have little idea about most things. ?

I thought you were one of the heavy hitters on here when it came to knowledge.

 

[Dyloh]

My issue is not whether or not the relative value yo-yos (because I don't invest in crypto anyway) but the question always remains - can you actually exercise your crypto whenever you please?

So if you see a 500% gain on speculative value, can you take that bitcoin and buy a house or a car or simply turn it into old fiat currency? Because I am of the understanding it's not that simple to covert your "gains", in which case it becomes a question of exactly what kind of "profit" you have made.

For example, it's all fine and dandy for the bank to value your house at $X, but another thing entirely to find buyers who agree and will stump up the cash.

My concern is also, if you are more and more exposed to crypto as a means of investment, it is extremely high risk of external influence, as already noted. Some punk can make a twitter comment and half your projected investment value in 1 day. Sure the stock market can do similar things, but at least with stocks you can diversify very broadly and you have some very long-term dependably performing stocks, which themselves are informed by the success of the relative business. And fundamentally, businesses exist to be successful and make profit, so there is an inherent drive within business to succeed, upon which investors can judge whether the expertise/capability/market exists for that success.

For crypto, there are really only a handful of legitimate large players, they absolutely do not have long-term dependable performance and there is no inherent drive for success, except for the hoarding and hyping of existing owners. Crypto doesn't actually exist in any physical capacity, there's no tangible group or person or performance metric driving the crypto values. It's only speculation and FOMO that drives the prices.

So if you have spare 000s you can afford to lose, go for it, but you might as well gamble that money all over the place; hedge your bets.

Have you used PayID or Osko through your bank at all? That uses Blockchain technology and just a small example of it creeping into our everyday lives.