Mitchell Moses Suspension Thread

[Goose]

Would he have been suspended if he called him a "STRAIGHT C*"…......prob not, just goes to show you cannot insult the minority in our society otherwise you end up paying for it.

Same goes for skin color......call someone a "white C*" and compare what happens if you call someone a "black C*"......you end up with two different results.

IMO....what happens on the field should stay on the field. As a youngster back in the 70's I sat inside the fence during the great wests v souths or parra games at Lidcombe oval and the stuff that used to come out of Tommy's , Dallas's & Boydy's mouth you could not print....not to mention the head stomping or the punch's thrown inside the players tunnel before the game even started.

Today its like we have all become like prima donna's

The reason that it is not frowned apon to call someone straight is that, Straight people ahve not be bashed simply for being that way, have not been denied rights, have not been ostracised from society.
Straight people dont have to hide that fact, they are not told they are going to hell because of it, they are not denied basic rights and dont have the fear that when people find out that they will treated differently, and in many cases shunned completely.
Straight people are not sacked or not welcome in places simply because they are straight.

This is why it is different calling someone gay as an insult, as opposed to calling someone straight..

 

[tigerbill]

Would he have been suspended if he called him a "STRAIGHT C*"…......prob not, just goes to show you cannot insult the minority in our society otherwise you end up paying for it.

Same goes for skin color......call someone a "white C*" and compare what happens if you call someone a "black C*"......you end up with two different results.

IMO....what happens on the field should stay on the field. As a youngster back in the 70's I sat inside the fence during the great wests v souths or parra games at Lidcombe oval and the stuff that used to come out of Tommy's , Dallas's & Boydy's mouth you could not print....not to mention the head stomping or the punch's thrown inside the players tunnel before the game even started.

Today its like we have all become like prima donna's

The reason that it is not frowned apon to call someone straight is that, Straight people ahve not be bashed simply for being that way, have not been denied rights, have not been ostracised from society.
Straight people dont have to hide that fact, they are not told they are going to hell because of it, they are not denied basic rights and dont have the fear that when people find out that they will treated differently, and in many cases shunned completely.
Straight people are not sacked or not welcome in places simply because they are straight.

This is why it is different calling someone gay as an insult, as opposed to calling someone straight..

You beat me to it Goose.
About your other point, footballers are now scrutinised by the media on field and off the field. Everything they say is put in the press which makes their influence much more important. And for the amount they're paid these days; yes I expect them to be professional.

 

[Kul]

boom

what he said

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

_This is why Brooks was pulled out of that game, we now have Anasta and Moses on the sidelines for the next two weeks. Any injuries to our halves this game and we have no first grade standard halves to play the next week.\
\
Moses has been suspended for 2 weeks for calling someone a "g** c****" during the Origin game. How is that worth a suspension? I thought it was Bateman that made the comment and thought he should be left off._


 

[tigerbill]

No bp tiger. Things that are said in the heat of the moment include the following:
"F… you"
"D...head"

Calling someone a Gay C... is nasty and targeted. Big difference.

 

[Kul]

I play Union with a couple of mates with the Sydney Convicts team in Subs Rugby (see a few posts above re. Bingham Cup). The team isn't a "Gay" team, it's an inclusive team, a place where anyone can come and play - I don't know the exact numbers but maybe about 30% are straight.

Having an environment like that is so positive. I've now played along side blokes who have never played union or league (most are leaguies) because it was never a "place for them". They are so happy now being involved in a sport that they love.

But I've also played alongside blokes who wouldn't give a toss about what people thought about them and HAVE gone and played rugby/league at higher levels. For some people its not a big deal, for others, its huge.

As someone mentioned in an early post, I don't think Mitchell is homophobic. Going off opinion polls from the last few years (especially amongst the younger generation), most people are supportive; I'm sure that Mitchell regrets saying what he said - I wouldn't expect anything else from a 19 year old who grew up in the inner suburbs and attended a school like Holy Cross.

The NRL acted appropriately not due to the severity of the incident, but to set an example and send a message.

Ultimately what was said on the field was no doubt said in the heat of the moment and is probably just a small example of what else is thrown around out there. But as it was broadcast on TV and no doubt heard by kids and adults struggling with their own identity, this two-week suspension is in my opinion less of a punishment as it is a statement to the community that it's okay to be gay. If Mitch sitting on the sideline results in at least one less person becoming depressed (or worse), then that's a good thing.

 

[simonthetiger]

Well said Kul.

 

[WTDiehard]

I see no diff calling someone a gay C or a dick h*ad or a F* wit or any other insult….because they are all offensive in their own way. I am not trying to say what MM said was OK, because its not, but we also realize that many things are said on the field to intimidate or get inside another players head. Thats why to a certain degree I believe there should be some lee way......

If MM had called someone a Gay C in the street......that is a different story altogether.

And the offense seems to be calling someone GAY...because calling someone a C* on the field offers no punishment....very strange.

 

[Tiger_Watto]

No bp tiger. Things that are said in the heat of the moment include the following:
"F… you"
"D...head"

Calling someone a Gay C... is nasty and targeted. Big difference.

There is a huge cultural problem within this age group…

Calling out someone and telling them you will "rap your sister" is far worse than anything which has been quoted, but apparently that bloke wasn't picked up on microphone...

So, lets hope the NRL has a grander plan to curb these matters other than suspended the bloke who was caught on Mic!

 

[TimmyB]

Great post Kul.

To the guy who compared straight c*** and gay c*** , that just shows you have no understanding of the issue at hand. There IS a huge difference between slurs about a historically oppressed disempowered minority and slurs about a majority.

Google Jane Elliott and the blue-eyed/brown eyed exercise and have a read.

If straight people were historically and presently subject to prejudice based upon sexual orientation then straight c*** would no doubt be offensive.

It also changes with environment. If you were in an environment dominated by gay men and women and in which gay men and women wielded the social power and you were called a straight c*** you'd be a hell of a lot more offended than if this was an environment where this was not the case.

It's basic social psychology.

 

[TimmyB]

I see no diff calling someone a gay C or a d*** h*ad or a F* wit or any other insult….because they are all offensive in their own way. I am not trying to say what MM said was OK, because its not, but we also realize that many things are said on the field to intimidate or get inside another players head. Thats why to a certain degree I believe there should be some lee way......

If MM had called someone a Gay C in the street......that is a different story altogether.

And the offense seems to be calling someone GAY...because calling someone a C* on the field offers no punishment....very strange.

Yes, that is the offense.

I believe the use of the slur 'gay c***' will leave some gay men and women feeling people of their sexual orientation are not welcome in the game. That is supported by anecdotal evidence.

Based on the NRL's statement, that is why Moses has been suspended. They are trying to build a culture in which people of all races, sexual orientations, and genders feel like the game is accepting of them and does not view them as lesser.

If you view the slurs gay c*** as the same as c***, could you please explain how the word c*** disenfranchises an entire segment of the population in the same way the slur gay c*** does?

 

[fibrodreaming]

I believe that our colleagues who suggest that the NRL has overreacted in the Mitchell Moses case are missing the point. Moreover, I don't think that debating the finer point of slurs adds any value to the discussion.

In the old days, no-one cared what was said on the field, or for that matter, what players go up to in their private lives.

Then commercial interests began to sponsor clubs, and the sponsors insisted on high standards of behaviour in order to protect their commercial interests. After all, no business could tolerate badly behaving footballers representing their products and services.

Over this period we also witnessed the commodifaction of the game itself. Rugby League is no longer just a sport – it is just one product among many in the entertainment industry.

Rugby League has to project the right image to maintain and improve its popularity. In this sense, the NRL and the club’s sponsors’ financial interests coalesce. They both demand high standards of the players to promote their brands.

Both the NRL and the clubs make it abundantly clear to players when they join the professional ranks that they represent the NRL brand, their clubs and their sponsors, and that, accordingly, their behaviour should be exemplary. For this, they are rather well remunerated, particularly in comparison to their peers.

The deal is, if they want to earn the money, they must abide by the rules.

Mitchell Moses comment in the SOO has embarrassed the NRL, the club and many Tigers’ supporters (perhaps also Meriton). For this there is a price to pay. I agree with those who suggest he should cop it sweet, get his head down and learn from the experience.

 

[WTDiehard]

Timmy B

So if we call someone a Fat C* or a big nosed C* we are not welcoming all the fat people or the big nosed people to our game and they will not feel welcome to our game going by your analogy.

I donot think people really understand what racism or what vilification are. Examples of such are: - when you are told you cannot drink at the same bar as other races, or you cannot use the same toilet, or you have to sit at the back of the bus, or that you cannot vote, you are mentally and psychically persecuted and sometimes killed for being different. When you donot have the same basic human rights as every other person. We donot have that in this country. A gay person has the same job as a straight person, a black person has the same job as a white person…...we are all the same.....we pay the same tax, we vote, we eventually get old and die.

Are there bigot's and idiots amongst us....of coarse, they are protected by the freedom of speech in this country and we in turn can give it right back to them.

Banter on the sporting field which is almost always insulting has nothing to do with racism...it has to do with insulting the other person...race or vilification has nothing to do with it......we choose to bring it in.

 

[TimmyB]

Can you answer my question?

In any case, comparing slurs about fat people and people with big noses is really not relevant. People who are overweight and people who have big noses to my knowledge don't feel marginalised by the game and don't have a history of discrimination.

I provided an excerpt in which a gay man explained he never felt like his AFL team was a place where his sexuality was welcome **because** of the homophobic language that was used. Kul has provided anecodtal evidence that he has friends who feel the same way.

Now if this sort of language makes people feel unwelcome why the hell would you be happy for it to continue?

 

[genoshan]

Game is taking a turn for the worse. These are men, playing a full contact sport.

When I played, a hell of a lot worse than that was said and I said a hell of a lot worse. Is the player he call a gay C*** actually gay ?

 

[TimmyB]

Are there bigot's and idiots amongst us….of coarse, they are protected by the freedom of speech in this country and we in turn can give it right back to them.

Banter on the sporting field which is almost always insulting has nothing to do with racism...it has to do with insulting the other person...race or vilification has nothing to do with it......we choose to bring it in.

How many times. It isn't about the individual concerned. It is about creating an environment of tolerance and ensuring all members of the Australian community feel welcome in Rugby League. This language is unwelcoming.

Not to mention the point made earlier that it puts the individual whom the slur was directed at in a potentially difficult position. What if he is gay? Does he have to make a formal complaint and potentially confirm his sexuality to the public? What if he doesn't want to discuss his sexuality? He then has to put up with slurs?

Anyway, I can't state my position any more plainly. I for one am stoked the NRL has acted. It brings the NRL into line with just about every other workplace in Australia.

 

[TimmyB]

Game is taking a turn for the worse. These are **men**, playing a full contact sport.

The irony.

 

[Goose]

Game is taking a turn for the worse. These are men, playing a full contact sport.

When I played, a hell of a lot worse than that was said and I said a hell of a lot worse. Is the player he call a gay C*** actually gay ?

how does it make the game worse by preventing people from making homophobic slurs. or racial slurs.

ive been involved with footy my whole life and understand what it is like in the heat of battle and every other argument thrown up.

a comment designed to imply that a class of people is worse off is wrong. It should be stamped out.

It is not a sign of the game getting worse, but hopefully a sign of society getting better.

 

[Marshall_magic]

I think the suspension is fair. What he did goes against what is trying to be achieved by the game, and he should cop a punishment. At the same time, I don't think the comments came from a conscious homophobic place. The important thing is that Mitch learns his lesson, because he is a kid who made a mistake, and he needs to make sure it doesn't happen again. A very dumb thing to say, but I don't think there was any more malice in his comment than there would be in a standard "you're a dickhead" sledge.

 

[galea_11]

The nrl are just playing politics. UFC does the same if there is an issue they go through the motions. Counselling it keeps the Interest groups quiet. They don't care but in public they make a stand. That's how this world world tell people wst they want to hear