Politics Super Thread - keep it all in here

[system]

This campaign has been successfully dragged into alot of non issues.

National broadband is not anywhere near the top of the pile, hell not even the midpoint of the pile but it is a major platform for infrastructure.

The boat people issue is laughable considering they make up less that 2% at last measure of people attempting to gain entry to this country. Yet people want to spend more money on it.

It is truly boggling how every single election cycle the parties and media is allowed to set the agenda with only passing looks at the issues that actually influence peoples everyday lives

 

[stryker]

Yossarian, Labors plan is gonna take 8 years minimum and cost 43 Billion - minimum….I maen realistically you could add a couple of years and 10 Billion to that going on past performances.

Why does the government have to build it? why cant the companies who are the experts in the field get the job done?

It's nationally significant infrastructure. That's why.

Thats not an answer….not even close to one!

My question was why does this pigheaded government have to be in charge of the build? We ALL know that they couldn't organise a chook raffle, booze up in a brewary, root in a brothel.....etc....so why are their supporters happy for THEM and not the experts to run this project?

The only possible result of a Labor government run NBN is the waste of 10's of Billions of dollars and the technology most probably being out of date by the time it is implemented.

They would need another three terms to complete the project, I suggest at a minimum, it's just plain stupid for them to be in charge.

 

[Blackpearl]

i dont know what all the fuss is about…. its ok to work for $10/hr, lose your working conditions, have overseas multi-nationals control communications & mining. let banks making huge profits for their shareholders. i say turn the leaky around and let the refugees fend for themselves. even though a piece of glacier 4 x the size of the ACT broke away this week i say global warming is a myth ! lets keep selling the farms in the hunter to mining companies for open cut coal mining.. hell they are only good for bloody cows anyway and when the miners are finished we can use the crater left behind as a tip. how dare we ask for more taxes from o/s companies for our mined resources to spend on schools, hospitals, roads, broadband and after all this just think, and for a future vision of the country we can all go back to the good old days... 50 yrs ago...... eh mr abbott !!!

 

[stryker]

i dont know what all the fuss is about…. its ok to work for $10/hr, lose your working conditions, have overseas multi-nationals control communications & mining. let banks making huge profits for their shareholders. i say turn the leaky around and let the refugees fend for themselves. even though a piece of glacier 4 x the size of the ACT broke away this week i say global warming is a myth ! lets keep selling the farms in the hunter to mining companies for open cut coal mining.. hell they are only good for bloody cows anyway and when the miners are finished we can use the crater left behind as a tip. how dare we ask for more taxes from o/s companies for our mined resources to spend on schools, hospitals, roads, broadband and after all this just think, and for a future vision of the country we can all go back to the good old days... 50 yrs ago...... eh mr abbott !!!

Who are you trying to scare with this nonsense?

 

[Geo]

I've made my decision that god aweful 'stop the boat add' on the radio has tipped me over the edge….

Labor gets my vote....

 

[stryker]

So for those of you who are ok with Labors wilfull spending and borrowing, take a look at this…..

http://www.usdebtclock.org/index.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This is the US National Debt Clock in real time. Note that they are spending more in welfare payments than they are receiving in tax revenue....therefore they are borrowing to pay welfare then paying interest on this. The IMF said this morning that the US is effectively broke.

BIG big trouble is on its way. We have to stop spending....the nest egg Liberal left is gone, what happens when the next, real crash happens?

 

[BRET]

I also heard on the radio yesterday that before the GFC the debt percentage for USA was 78% (and Europe was something similar) to our 6%. All this harping on about how they saved us from the GFC doesn't seem to carry as much weight when comparing with the rest of the world given we were in a far better standing before it started. USA is now 114%, I missed where we are now.

 

[system]

Our debt rise is well within projected levels and well within the median acceptable.

Comparing our system to the US on any level is a waste of time as our ecconomies are regulated in seperate ways from our structuring of international trades and tarriffs right through to the regulation of financial institutions.

The most amusing part of any campaign though is each party telling us how the others policy will cost us more in bills and "at the checkout". Heres the hot tip. They go up regardless. Short of regulation by a federal body prices will always rise. For the last 10 years or so prices have risen above levels of inflation and there is nothing we can do to change that.

Of course major services and so forth would not have been affected in a way that made them unaffordable in many cases if these industries were not privatised in the first place. But thats a different kettle of fish alltogether. Needless to say the surplice dwindled by the current government was a a false surplice established by the sale of major utilities and infrastructure through privatisation. On a personal level I would have preffered not to watch welfare recipients get a hand out and instead subsidise essential services which were still government controlled. But thats just me.

In the greater scheme we are paying also now for the sins of the Whitlam and Fraser years. Cycles are far longer than the electorate at large realises

 

[stryker]

Yeah Smeg but we as a nation need to vote in the party that can get us through the next downturn as it is shaping up as a beauty.

 

[system]

Remembering though that the US ecconomy is no longer the key indicator it was. Ever since they took a bite from the Japanese slump they are not as central as they once were.

In the great scheme of things we will travel on a relatively even keel due to our resource sector. Commodities have not been as volatile as early in the prior century.

Ecconomic management has fallen into the trap of being overpoliticised to the hilt. The electorate is a dumb one in that it only concentrates on the now, the immediate consequence and their own desires, not needs. A true political and ecconomic cycle of correct management would require far more time than any fickle electoral system would allow

 

[Gary_Bakerloo]

Thats not an answer….not even close to one!

My question was why does this pigheaded government have to be in charge of the build? We ALL know that they couldn't organise a chook raffle, booze up in a brewary, root in a brothel.....etc....so why are their supporters happy for THEM and not the experts to run this project?

The only possible result of a Labor government run NBN is the waste of 10's of Billions of dollars and the technology most probably being out of date by the time it is implemented.

They would need another three terms to complete the project, I suggest at a minimum, it's just plain stupid for them to be in charge.

Yossarian is correct, but did not quite nail your question. The NBN is a national infrastructure that is essentially a public good. The private sector will not build it because of market failure inherent with public good (ie: free riders). This is just an instance where the government has to act because the market won't.

I doubt the government would be solely in charge as it would have to consult with the representatives and experts of the IT sector.

 

[Gary_Bakerloo]

Yeah Smeg but we as a nation need to vote in the party that can get us through the next downturn as it is shaping up as a beauty.

Government's role in the economy is minimal at the most.

 

[hammertime]

Remembering though that the US ecconomy is no longer the key indicator it was. Ever since they took a bite from the Japanese slump they are not as central as they once were.

In the great scheme of things we will travel on a relatively even keel due to our resource sector. Commodities have not been as volatile as early in the prior century.

Ecconomic management has fallen into the trap of being overpoliticised to the hilt. The electorate is a dumb one in that it only concentrates on the now, the immediate consequence and their own desires, not needs. A true political and ecconomic cycle of correct management would require far more time than any fickle electoral system would allow

Not true at all Smeg. China is now the major holder of US debt and if the US start to falter, or pay back their debt through inflation, you will see the effects flow through to China to Aus. They aren't as central, but they are still THE central economy.

China has been stockpiling resources and looking for other countries to source from (i.e. Africa) so I wouldn't be so convinced that we are immune from any downturn. Especially if we start to jack up resource prices to cover the new tax.

 

[hammertime]

Yeah Smeg but we as a nation need to vote in the party that can get us through the next downturn as it is shaping up as a beauty.

Government's role in the economy is minimal at the most.

So you don't think proper Govt regulations in the US could have stopped this downturn?

I wish Swan knew some Finance. He could have easily set up a clearing house (like the SFE) to make sure our derivatives trading doesn't get to the same risky heights as the US. They need to do something while there is still momentum for reform.

I'm hoping Hockey will do it since he knows a lot more, but it's never something that they will announce…

 

[citizen_cub]

If this government gets re-elected, we're. I hate to think what the deficit will be come 2013, I hate to think how many more asylum seekers will be let through our weak borders and I also hate to think how many schools get facilities they don't need under this farce they call the BER. Gillard has no idea, she's ignorant, she's no different to Rudd (probably worse) and would have no chance of winning this election if she wasn't female. Seriously, half the voters are as thick as two short planks, lol, on the night of the great debate, most of them were watching masterchef! You only have to look at how many meatheads have voted the NSW government in 4 times. NSW, once the most thriving state in Australia is now a laughing stock and is nothing compared to Queensland and Victoria (the labor governments are actually okay in those two states)

 

[stryker]

The private sector will not build it because of market failure inherent with public good (ie: free riders). This is just an instance where the government has to act because the market won't.

Thats not true mate, Howard had in place a signed $1Billion contract with OPEL which was to get things started. They were then to continue the installation at their cost and were to recoup costs once the project was finalised.

Labor decided to take this project on, after dismissing the OPEL deal, because Rudd couldn't help but micromange everything.

 

[stryker]

Agreed CC, I know a couple of people who vote the way they do because thats how they were brought up by their parents…i.e. This is a Labor family.

I was stunned that NSW Labor got back in last election and it'll be an absolute embarassment if they crack it for another start next year. Most people vote the same way time after time. It's another reason why compulsory voting is rubbish.

 

[citizen_cub]

Agreed CC, I know a couple of people who vote the way they do because thats how they were brought up by their parents…i.e. This is a Labor family.

I was stunned that NSW Labor got back in last election and it'll be an absolute embarassment if they crack it for another start next year. Most people vote the same way time after time. It's another reason why compulsory voting is rubbish.

There's no way Labor will get back in NSW (as thick as we are), but the Federal government keeping government remains a big possibility and infact is probably the favourite heading into the election. And your right with your first point, many voters don't sit down and think through their decision, most couldn't really care. Adding to your point on compulsory voting, I think they should push the voting age back to 25, I mean, 18 year olds couldn't really couldn't care about the election considering they've got an upcoming HSC, they wouldn't be following the election too closely and would probably just vote for who their parents are.

**POST EDITED BY MODS**

 

[chilbury]

Labor and Liberal" both wings of the same bird!!

 

[chilbury]

Agreed CC, I know a couple of people who vote the way they do because thats how they were brought up by their parents…i.e. This is a Labor family.

I was stunned that NSW Labor got back in last election and it'll be an absolute embarassment if they crack it for another start next year. Most people vote the same way time after time. It's another reason why compulsory voting is rubbish.

There's no way Labor will get back in NSW (as thick as we are), but the Federal government keeping government remains a big possibility and infact is probably the favourite heading into the election. And your right with your first point, many voters don't sit down and think through their decision, most couldn't really care. Adding to your point on compulsory voting, I think they should push the voting age back to 25, I mean, 18 year olds couldn't really couldn't care about the election considering they've got an upcoming HSC, they wouldn't be following the election too closely and would probably just vote for who their parents are.

**POST EDITED BY MODS**

Very true!! forcing people to vote opens the whole election up for the Donkey Vote!!
If you vote Greens you vote for Labor lol and if you vote Family First you vote Liberal lol
crazy system i say lol
not voting this year dudes ..