Russian invasion of Ukraine

[tig_prmz]

Do you guys think supplying Ukraine with weapons is just prolonging the war and just pushing forward the inevitable? Are we expecting Russia to back off because of Ukraine's resistance? It doesn't sound likely.

Putin will just keep pouring in the army, he doesn't seem to be in any mood to de-escalate the situation. How hard would it be to get NATO, Putin, Zelenskyy and their UN Embassadors in a room and talk it out?

 

[Cobarcats]

Plenty of rest and ice mate...later on physio will benefit you heaps,but take it easy at first....I displaced my rotator cuff on my right shoulder and couldnt lift it above shoulder height for nearly 12 months...6 months of physio and no golf for 4 years and now back to full strength and happy...it all takes time and patients hang in there and take it easy until it fully heals....

Thanks heaps mate, I was at the end of 13 mths of physio and nearing a golf game in two weeks when i poped the bicep, it was like cracking a knuckle without the sound. My surgeon thinks it won't take as long as the shoulder replacement
recovery but did say if it doesnt work out they can re-attach with surgery.
I've had worse to deal with though and more worried my neighbour.
Once again, cheers!

 

[InBenjiWeTrust]

They do have significant reserves (Approx $630B) but it would be interesting to know where that is (onshore/offshore) because if you cant get it, you cant get it.

If the US & EU turned of the tap (or if Russia did) it would cost Russia around $140B a year. Coupled with the other sanctions, massive defence spending and lack of access to foreign capital, those reserves wouldnt last long.


This is the whole point. I agree with this. Trouble is that Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania etc all have large russian minorities. The reason that Putin gave for invading Ukraine applies to all of these countries.



Not obvious at all. It was less than a year ago that Biden canned the Keystone XL pipeline in the US and removed sanctions of the Nordstream pipeline Russia to German. Hardly the actions of the West trying to destabilise Russia.



Poland, Slovakia, Hungary, Romania, Moldova, all now have Russia at their back fence and historically it has never turned out well for them.



So you have made a detailed explanation of why you think military action and sanctions are a bad idea. You have let to explain what should happen? Welcome parades and red carpets?

and an Army brass bend to play The Internationale!

the internationale cyrillic - Google Search

 

[tig_prmz]

Thanks heaps mate, I was at the end of 13 mths of physio and nearing a golf game in two weeks when i poped the bicep, it was like cracking a knuckle without the sound. My surgeon thinks it won't take as long as the shoulder replacement
recovery but did say if it doesnt work out they can re-attach with surgery.
I've had worse to deal with though and more worried my neighbour.
Once again, cheers!

I'm guessing it's distal biceps (near the elbow)? If so, much quicker and fuller recovery than reverse shoulder replacement. If proximal (near the shoulder), would be a bit longer (generally) but still better than replacement.

 

[Cobarcats]

I'm guessing it's distal biceps (near the elbow)? If so, much quicker and fuller recovery than reverse shoulder replacement. If proximal (near the shoulder), would be a bit longer (generally) but still better than replacement.

Mate I've had the shoulder replaced and it pulled away from the top of the bicep, it looks like a golf ball, he said something about a horn, does that make sense. I've got to stay in a low sling until i see him in 2 weeks and i rest the ice pack in the sling ontop of the bicep. It actually isn't painful now unless I accidently curl my arm, got to have another scan when swelling goes down then he's going to namke a final decision. Do you know much about it, is surgery long recovery?

 

[TrueTiger]

Remove immediately all personal sanctions and offer descalation of sanctions proportionate to Russia's military descalation.
Start a process where diplomacy can begin for peace including Ukraine's sovereignty but also included in talks reciprocal descalation including NATO non membership status for Ukraine and reciprocal security arrangements.

A return to the START treaty.

The real problem that some people cant see clearly is that NATO is the problem in Ukraine and Biden and the other political scum have interests in the place..Soros and his neo nazi players are all right in the middle of this squabble...Putin has stated he doesnt want to hurt the people of Ukraine,he wants them to be free and free of the corruption within the place...in reallity the people have been treated poorly for years while Soros and co have made millions from the country..hence the interest in Ukraine by the Clintons,Soros,Obamma,Kerry etc...

Biden went as far as giving China the intelligence on what Russia was going to do in Ukraine to get them onside....what did XiPing do ...he gave the intel to Russia...

As I said before,there is so much more to this so called "invasion" that meets the eye..
Lets see what comes out of this and keep an open mind...

Theres always 3 sides to a story....

1.the narrative..
2.the counter narrative..
3.the truth..

 

[InBenjiWeTrust]

The real problem that some people cant see clearly is that NATO is the problem in Ukraine and Biden and the other political scum have interests in the place..Soros and his neo nazi players are all right in the middle of this squabble...Putin has stated he doesnt want to hurt the people of Ukraine,he wants them to be free and free of the corruption within the place...in reallity the people have been treated poorly for years while Soros and co have made millions from the country..hence the interest in Ukraine by the Clintons,Soros,Obamma,Kerry etc...

Biden went as far as giving China the intelligence on what Russia was going to do in Ukraine to get them onside....what did XiPing do ...he gave the intel to Russia...

Note that Putin is an ex KGB/NKVD lieutenant colonel and that NO ONE can get to such a position without being vetted by the nomenclatura. So I would take everything that he says through that perspective. Also, it is highly suspicious that after his inauguration he did not go through any uncorrupted election process.
I read a lot of KGB/NKVD agitatsiya, and never forget that ex nomenclature took over the government, power and bought everything that was worth owning after collapse of the USSR!

So, my opinion is that among other reasons for the occupation of Ukraine, one is that Russian oligarch just want to possess more, and they charged Putin with the new task. Always check cui bono!

 

[coivtny]

Note that Putin is an ex KGB/NKVD lieutenant colonel and that NO ONE can get to such a position without being vetted by the nomenclatura. So I would take everything that he says through that perspective. Also, it is highly suspicious that after his inauguration he did not go through any uncorrupted election process.
I read a lot of KGB/NKVD agitatsiya, and never forget that ex nomenclature took over the government, power and bought everything that was worth owning after collapse of the USSR!

So, my opinion is that among other reasons for the occupation of Ukraine, one is that Russian oligarch just want to possess more, and they charged Putin with the new task. Always check cui bono!

Intelligent post.

 

[twentyforty]

This is so sad on many levels.

 

[tig_prmz]

But if the leadership is already sanctioned and demonisated they may feel they have little to loose and more to win by being brutal, and they have the conventional weapons to do so. They may even feel their relatively soft approach is encouraging volunteers and resistance.

So a dangerous time for Ukrainians.

That's what I was thinking too. With sanctions, you are hoping the Russian public also views the Ukranian invasion wrongful enough to overthrow their leader who has been there for 20+ years. A leader who is epitomised by many.

It's like a chess game where almost every action by the West can have a predicted reply by the Russians. Violence or threat of violence needs to be taken off the table first.

 

[tig_prmz]

Remove immediately all personal sanctions and offer descalation of sanctions proportionate to Russia's military descalation.
Start a process where diplomacy can begin for peace including Ukraine's sovereignty but also included in talks reciprocal descalation including NATO non membership status for Ukraine and reciprocal security arrangements.

A return to the START treaty.

If the west seriously cared about Ukraine and Ukrainians they could even offer to Russia that if they immediately cease and withdraw talks will begin on preserving Ukraine's sovereignty and non NATO status and sanctions will be withdrawn incrementally.

Too good to be true.

Again, I don't know much about this entire thing, I only know what I've read in the last 3 weeks and your post seems great.

The outcome of war and violence is predicted. There is absolutely no point in even bringing it up.

 

[momo_amp_medo]

The real problem that some people cant see clearly is that NATO is the problem in Ukraine and Biden and the other political scum have interests in the place..Soros and his neo nazi players are all right in the middle of this squabble...Putin has stated he doesnt want to hurt the people of Ukraine,he wants them to be free and free of the corruption within the place...in reallity the people have been treated poorly for years while Soros and co have made millions from the country..hence the interest in Ukraine by the Clintons,Soros,Obamma,Kerry etc...

Biden went as far as giving China the intelligence on what Russia was going to do in Ukraine to get them onside....what did XiPing do ...he gave the intel to Russia...

As I said before,there is so much more to this so called "invasion" that meets the eye..
Lets see what comes out of this and keep an open mind...

Theres always 3 sides to a story....

1.the narrative..
2.the counter narrative..
3.the truth..

Where the $&#@*&$ do you get this rubbish from.
I think you may be lost …. your place is definitely in one of the Russian tanks kicking the crap out of the Ukrainians and driving them out of their homes and possessions.
Total looser supporting a mental case Putin and his mad aspirations.

 

[twentyforty]

Only a nutter would support Putin’s madness!

 

[Tim Sheens]

There are plenty of options short of war. E.g suspension of all oil and gas trade with Russia. Might cause some momentary difficulty in places like Germany, but in the scheme of things higher gas prices is not really a huge sacrifice.
Sanctions could also be applied to Chinese companies trading with Russia to close that back door.

Agree, though as it is still winter in the region it is a very hard decision for families to potentially let their children go cold like their fellows in some towns across across Ukraine are suffering right now with snow still falling.

Easier to get community support in neighbouring countries when it is warm rather than freezing cold.

 

[Tim Sheens]

Where the $&#@*&$ do you get this rubbish from.
I think you may be lost …. your place is definitely in one of the Russian tanks kicking the crap out of the Ukrainians and driving them out of their homes and possessions.
Total looser supporting a mental case Putin and his mad aspirations.

Yeah, [This word has been automatically removed] me, when I read his earlier claim today that Putin hates Soros because he supports antifa and blm, it just confirmed how far he has fallen.

I disagree though on him being a total loser, rather viewing him as the victim of the people that now have him peddling the above. Such people prey on the disaffected and sadly he was ripe for the picking with the many challenges life has thrown his way in the past few years.

I have little to no sympathy, let alone empathy for some of the others peddling similar crap here. Plenty though for TT and as many here have witnessed his fall, I am sure that I am far from alone in hoping that he gets help sooner rather than later

 

[TrueTiger]

Where the $&#@*&$ do you get this rubbish from.
I think you may be lost …. your place is definitely in one of the Russian tanks kicking the crap out of the Ukrainians and driving them out of their homes and possessions.
Total looser supporting a mental case Putin and his mad aspirations.

Nice reply...I never said I supported Putin....do your homework about the corruption within Ukraine and the people I mentioned....
then come back with an adult conversation...
I did say in an earlier post that there is more to this scenario than any of us could know its not all BLACK and WHITE....

 

[TrueTiger]

Note that Putin is an ex KGB/NKVD lieutenant colonel and that NO ONE can get to such a position without being vetted by the nomenclatura. So I would take everything that he says through that perspective. Also, it is highly suspicious that after his inauguration he did not go through any uncorrupted election process.
I read a lot of KGB/NKVD agitatsiya, and never forget that ex nomenclature took over the government, power and bought everything that was worth owning after collapse of the USSR!

So, my opinion is that among other reasons for the occupation of Ukraine, one is that Russian oligarch just want to possess more, and they charged Putin with the new task. Always check cui bono!

Thoughtful post .....how come Putin has been in charge for over 20 years and most of the corruption by the oligarks you mention has been subverted...all you here is how good Russia is since he has been in power and the people have more freedom than before...Im not a supporter of Putin,my dad was Polish and he went through horrific times as a young fellow because of much influence from Russia...he could even speak Russian as he spent time there when in the Polish army....he is deceased now,but would love to have his input about Russia...

 

[innsaneink]

Yeah, **** me, when I read his earlier claim today that Putin hates Soros because he supports antifa and blm, it just confirmed how far he has fallen.

I disagree though on him being a total loser, rather viewing him as the victim of the people that now have him peddling the above. Such people prey on the disaffected and sadly he was ripe for the picking with the many challenges life has thrown his way in the past few years.

I have little to no sympathy, let alone empathy for some of the others peddling similar crap here. Plenty though for TT and as many here have witnessed his fall, I am sure that I am far from alone in hoping that he gets help sooner rather than later

Quite sad to see his somewhat lucid and rational posts on the team and the footy and then go full 180' when it comes to politics and covid.... We remember years ago none of this garbage was forthcoming from you @TrueTiger
Just brings home how real it all is and how you've changed because there's no way in hell it's a gee up

 

[TrueTiger]

Quite sad to see his somewhat lucid and rational posts on the team and the footy and then go full 180' when it comes to politics and covid.... We remember years ago none of this garbage was forthcoming from you @TrueTiger
Just brings home how real it all is and how you've changed because there's no way in hell it's a gee up

No worries mate....we are all Gods children,some have varying opinions and thoughts than others...God bless Ink it will be good to catch up at the footy again one day...

 

[Tim Sheens]

Do you guys think supplying Ukraine with weapons is just prolonging the war and just pushing forward the inevitable? Are we expecting Russia to back off because of Ukraine's resistance? It doesn't sound likely.

Putin will just keep pouring in the army, he doesn't seem to be in any mood to de-escalate the situation. How hard would it be to get NATO, Putin, Zelenskyy and their UN Embassadors in a room and talk it out?

Yes, absobloodylutely!

If our closest much more populated and/or powerful neighbour attacked my country of Australia, I would expect that our allies would send troops as well as weapons. If not, what is the point of having alliances

As I wrote near the beginning this thread, I remember when Ukrainians agreed to give up their nuclear weapons with guarantees of protection, yet now they have been attacked by one of the signatory nations and let down by others.