Signings, Suggestions & Rumours Discussion

pawsandclaws1 said:
I think it was the Telegraph that provided the smorgasbord of young WTs' talent - the Large bros, Makasini etc. We have some very good young players coming through and we need to concentrate on getting them through to the NRL. I am not too bothered by results in the lower grades as we all know the club has had many injuries so younger players have been pushed up which means our results will take a hit but our players benefit from being exposed to better competition. I would however like the club to have Latu Fainu in the halves and Faagutu at lock in NSW Cup. These players are highly talented and should be forming a combination. The idea being both increase the pool of quality NRL players we lack now.
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Just a general comment, but our juniors tend to be seen through a lens of upward linear and incremental development as a given.

These kids are 16. There's no guarantee that the best kids in their current age group can emulate that in NRL for any consistent period of time or at all in many cases.

Often the best kids in their age group simply become bog average first graders at best. The NRL is littered with kids that played Australian schoolboys or u16 origin that never progressed past NSW Cup or intermittent first grade appearances.

Don't get me wrong, it's good to have genuine talent coming through, but these kids have proved nothing other than they are better than kids their age. Much of their opposition is underdeveloped 16 year olds and their success may be more a function of their accelerated physical growth rather than genuine talent. You simply don't know until they train with the big boys and create headaches against established first graders.

It seems to me, the kids that translate from youth footy to NRL are those that are considered smallish, but excel anyway. We had Moses and Tedesco who came into grade fairly small, we now have Galvin. Reece Walsh was tiny. Thurston. Cherry Evans. Ben Barba. These guys were cutting up junior teams despite their size disadvantage. The progressive physical strength of playing in the NRL, just made them better players over time.

The hype around our 16 year olds is a little premature considering they have not tested themselves at a professional level and 2 to 3 years is a long time in your teens. Anything can happen.

Not trying to be a doubting Thomas. Just my 2 cents
 
Our major problem is our pathway kids are hitting grade and being put into substandard teams and getting smashed. It comes down to depth and fifty percent of our top grade should be in reserve grade helping the kid’s transition into grade, and filling in when required at NRL level. This problem will not go away till we recruit another four NRL standard players on top of the two coming next season. That than takes up four top 30 spots .

Strong clubs like Melbourne do Not rush their pathway kids and surround them with experienced players in their feeder clubs.
 
weststigers said:
Just a general comment, but our juniors tend to be seen through a lens of upward linear and incremental development as a given.

These kids are 16. There's no guarantee that the best kids in their current age group can emulate that in NRL for any consistent period of time or at all in many cases.

Often the best kids in their age group simply become bog average first graders at best. The NRL is littered with kids that played Australian schoolboys or u16 origin that never progressed past NSW Cup or intermittent first grade appearances.

Don't get me wrong, it's good to have genuine talent coming through, but these kids have proved nothing other than they are better than kids their age. Much of their opposition is underdeveloped 16 year olds and their success may be more a function of their accelerated physical growth rather than genuine talent. You simply don't know until they train with the big boys and create headaches against established first graders.

It seems to me, the kids that translate from youth footy to NRL are those that are considered smallish, but excel anyway. We had Moses and Tedesco who came into grade fairly small, we now have Galvin. Reece Walsh was tiny. Thurston. Cherry Evans. Ben Barba. These guys were cutting up junior teams despite their size disadvantage. The progressive physical strength of playing in the NRL, just made them better players over time.

The hype around our 16 year olds is a little premature considering they have not tested themselves at a professional level and 2 to 3 years is a long time in your teens. Anything can happen.

Not trying to be a doubting Thomas. Just my 2 cents
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Good post. I understand recruitment is not an exact science but some clubs do it better than others. Our players can only play as well as their opponents allow and their opponents are playing for the junior/feeder teams of other NRL clubs. My point being their opponents have also been subject to the same (or similar) identification/recruitment processes as our own. So to achieve at that level is an achievement in itself and should not be undersold.

In many ways it is the development processes at the club which can be a factor as to whether a junior succeeds. I have raised the issue of Faagutu previously being continually played out of position at prop when he excels at lock. Is this because a local junior also plays in the same position? From what I have seen of both, Faagutu is at a higher level. This is where the system needs to ensure Faagutu is given every chance to succeed by being played at lock.

I gauge the market reaction of NRL clubs to certain young players. Players such as Miller and Faagutu have reportedly had approaches from the Storm which to me suggests they are good. We know the Storm are notoriously good at picking apart talented juniors from other clubs.

Insofar as your refer to smaller players, Thurston was recommended to Balmain by I recall Dennis Tutty. He was rejected for being too small and I think Balmain was not the only club.
 
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Tom Shines said:
how old are Makasini and Large ? They are years away … 18 yr old Galvin is the exception and not the rule …
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Interesting comment. You look back and Ben Ikin was 18 years old, Brasher was younger I recall and David Fairleigh was 19 in the second row. No doubt there are many others. Many would argue it was tougher then because players were not under the same level of scrutiny via replays, judiciary etc.
 
supercoach said:
Our major problem is our pathway kids are hitting grade and being put into substandard teams and getting smashed. It comes down to depth and fifty percent of our top grade should be in reserve grade helping the kid’s transition into grade, and filling in when required at NRL level. This problem will not go away till we recruit another four NRL standard players on top of the two coming next season. That than takes up four top 30 spots .

Strong clubs like Melbourne do Not rush their pathway kids and surround them with experienced players in their feeder clubs.
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I’m starting to think that the NSW Cup team is no place for our young guys to be learning their trade… getting belted every week by reserve graders… …Galvin, Mason and Luke L got promoted out of Flegg and at least haven’t had their confidence beaten out of them…yet..

I’ve been holding my breath and stamping my feet since April about getting some more first graders signed …yet nothing..
 
pawsandclaws1 said:
Interesting comment. You look back and Ben Ikin was 18 years old, Brasher was younger I recall and David Fairleigh was 19 in the second row. No doubt there are many others. Many would argue it was tougher then because players were not under the same level of scrutiny via replays, judiciary etc.
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you are pointing to an elite few? There are dozens of 16 year olds that are highly touted and never make it… if you are interested I posted an old media link about Bud Sullivan in that thread when he was 17 … the next Thurston apparently and quotes from his manager that his phone was running off the hook from other clubs wanting to sign him …sound familiar?

look ..I hope these guys turn into the next Fittler … even the next Brasher would be great … but I’ve heard this talk about so many players coming through the ranks that don’t make it… let’s just wait and see what happens …
 
Tom Shines said:
you are pointing to an elite few? There are dozens of 16 year olds that are highly touted and never make it… if you are interested I posted an old media link about Bud Sullivan in that thread when he was 17 … the next Thurston apparently and quotes from his manager that his phone was running off the hook from other clubs wanting to sign him …

look ..I hope these guys turn into the next Fittler … even Brasher would be great … but I’ve heard this talk about so many players coming through the ranks that don’t make it… let’s just wait and see what happens …
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Not the elite few, just those I remember. Billy Moore was around 18 years of age and had played Qld 17s and was a forward. We all hope they do make it. I cannot recall Sullivan being compared like that but while he is an NRL quality player, he is not at the level of Thurston. Not many are unfortunately.
 
pawsandclaws1 said:
Not the elite few, just those I remember. Billy Moore was around 18 years of age and had played Qld 17s and was a forward. We all hope they do make it. I cannot recall Sullivan being compared like that but while he is an NRL quality player, he is not at the level of Thurston. Not many are unfortunately.
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Here is the link on Bud

www.nine.com.au

The rookie halfback dubbed the next JT

'There is something special about this kid'
www.nine.com.au www.nine.com.au

It’s pretty much word for word what we heard from Large’s manager a month back

What about all the kids that have been hyped up here the last few years that have been a disappointment? I can list them but I’m pretty sure that you know who they are better than most people …
 
Tom Shines said:
Here is the link on Bud

www.nine.com.au

The rookie halfback dubbed the next JT

'There is something special about this kid'
www.nine.com.au www.nine.com.au

It’s pretty much word for word what we heard from Large’s manager a month back

What about all the kids that have been hyped up here the last few years that have been a disappointment? I can list them but I’m pretty sure that you know who they are better than most people …
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Large's manager can say or write whatever he wants but his client will have to produce good football at WTs. Isn't he contracted for another 3 or 4 years which in itself is an indication the club rates him as do quite a few other NRL and RU clubs.
 
pawsandclaws1 said:
Large's manager can say or write whatever he wants but his client will have to produce good football at WTs. Isn't he contracted for another 3 or 4 years which in itself is an indication the club rates him as do quite a few other NRL and RU clubs.
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As Bud was at the Dragons …means nothing until they prove it at NRL level
 
Tom Shines said:
you are pointing to an elite few? There are dozens of 16 year olds that are highly touted and never make it… if you are interested I posted an old media link about Bud Sullivan in that thread when he was 17 … the next Thurston apparently and quotes from his manager that his phone was running off the hook from other clubs wanting to sign him …sound familiar?

look ..I hope these guys turn into the next Fittler … even the next Brasher would be great … but I’ve heard this talk about so many players coming through the ranks that don’t make it… let’s just wait and see what happens …
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You could probably go through Australian school boys sides throughout time and find that maybe 5% went on to lengthy NRL careers. It’s a massive leap, it’s why fans need to get excited about the Galvin’s, Fainus and the Bula’s.
 
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