Cameron Smith : Are you a salary cap cheating dog?

[radiowave82]

There's never been any evidence to suggest any player knew that they were over the cap. Would Robbie Farah know the in's and out's of what every player in the squad is on, and have the knowledge to know we'd be over the cap? I highly doubt it.

Storm players signed 2 seperate contracts-if you don't think that is cheating then I would love to live on your planet. Cheats are cheats,,, Inglis, Smith, Slater, Gallen etc are all only still playing in the NRL because of their profile…the NRL are a corrupt organization that rewards corruption. Prove differently if you disagree.

So the player manager says to Smith at a later stage , you have got a contract upgrade ??

How would the player know different FTB ??

The player wouldn't give two hoots , show me the money ??

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If you get the chance I highly recommend reading the book Storm Cloud: The Real Story Behind **Melbourne Storms Demise and Resurrection**. It details the whole salary cap cheating scandal. Personally I can't see how the players would not have been aware that it was a bit strange the way there own contracts were managed. Certainly the player managers were aware and were punished.

It also gives an interesting insight as to how the salary cap is managed by clubs and the issues that they face.

'Demise and resurrection' yeah right, except for 2010 when the scandal broke and they were forced to get the spoon, the Storm have played finals footy every year since, including 2012 when they won the premiership. No, I haven't actually read the book.

 

[mctiger]

There's never been any evidence to suggest any player knew that they were over the cap. Would Robbie Farah know the in's and out's of what every player in the squad is on, and have the knowledge to know we'd be over the cap? I highly doubt it.

Quoting from the book…...........The NRL Report of Salary Cap Auditor into Melbourne Storm Salary Cap Breaches 2011 says of player involvement says that all the players interviewed denied any knowledge of Salary Cap breaches. Where they had arrangements where payments were made outside the cap the players asserted that they thought it was either approved third party arrangements which the Storm had said would be cleared with the NRL.

"While with one exception I have seen no evidence amongst the material that I have reviewed that conclusively establishes that an individualo player knew that the Storm was not disclosing all his remuneration to the Salary Cap Auditor, a number of players received payments and benefits negotiated with the Storm that were not contained in their registered NRL playing contracts. Given this, alarm bells should have been ringing for these players........

 

[happy_tiger]

There's never been any evidence to suggest any player knew that they were over the cap. Would Robbie Farah know the in's and out's of what every player in the squad is on, and have the knowledge to know we'd be over the cap? I highly doubt it.

Quoting from the book…...........The NRL Report of Salary Cap Auditor into Melbourne Storm Salary Cap Breaches 2011 says of player involvement says that all the players interviewed denied any knowledge of Salary Cap breaches. Where they had arrangements where payments were made outside the cap the players asserted that they thought it was either approved third party arrangements which the Storm had said would be cleared with the NRL.

"While with one exception I have seen no evidence amongst the material that I have reviewed that conclusively establishes that an individualo player knew that the Storm was not disclosing all his remuneration to the Salary Cap Auditor, a number of players received payments and benefits negotiated with the Storm that were not contained in their registered NRL playing contracts. Given this, alarm bells should have

been ringing for these players........

But many clubs have been finding TPA's for players and then making it look like the Player Manager's organized the deal

When I say many , I mean many Very hard to prove otherwise as well

These players have probably been courted by many clubs doing the exact same thing with the deals being offered to entice them

The other thing that many probably don't realize is the only time that many players actually meets with the club is when the contract is signed

Yes they will inspect clubs gym and stuff but the player managers do virtually everything

 

[Newtown]

Fair enough, but why are we rehashing it 5 yrs later? Hardly think anything said in this thread won't be anything that has already been said 100 times over the last 5 yrs. Old news.

If that is old news what about the hate against Manly that still keeps cropping up after the poaching they were perceived to have carried out at least 30 years ago.

Manly has no one anyone likes , even their own family can't stand them

Storm have likable players everywhere at SOO time :sunglasses:

Manly can't be all bad, their coach appears to be a good judge and very gracious. He stated on NRL360 this week that he thought that the Wests Tigers would be a very good side this year and certainly the next.

 

[mctiger]

There's never been any evidence to suggest any player knew that they were over the cap. Would Robbie Farah know the in's and out's of what every player in the squad is on, and have the knowledge to know we'd be over the cap? I highly doubt it.

Quoting from the book…...........The NRL Report of Salary Cap Auditor into Melbourne Storm Salary Cap Breaches 2011 says of player involvement says that all the players interviewed denied any knowledge of Salary Cap breaches. Where they had arrangements where payments were made outside the cap the players asserted that they thought it was either approved third party arrangements which the Storm had said would be cleared with the NRL.

"While with one exception I have seen no evidence amongst the material that I have reviewed that conclusively establishes that an individualo player knew that the Storm was not disclosing all his remuneration to the Salary Cap Auditor, a number of players received payments and benefits negotiated with the Storm that were not contained in their registered NRL playing contracts. Given this, alarm bells should have

been ringing for these players........

But many clubs have been finding TPA's for players and then making it look like the Player Manager's organized the deal

When I say many , I mean many Very hard to prove otherwise as well

These players have probably been courted by many clubs doing the exact same thing with the deals being offered to entice them

The other thing that many probably don't realize is the only time that many players actually meets with the club is when the contract is signed

Yes they will inspect clubs gym and stuff but the player managers do virtually everything

If I have a tax agent do my tax I am still responsible….......

 

[happy_tiger]

There's never been any evidence to suggest any player knew that they were over the cap. Would Robbie Farah know the in's and out's of what every player in the squad is on, and have the knowledge to know we'd be over the cap? I highly doubt it.

Quoting from the book…...........The NRL Report of Salary Cap Auditor into Melbourne Storm Salary Cap Breaches 2011 says of player involvement says that all the players interviewed denied any knowledge of Salary Cap breaches. Where they had arrangements where payments were made outside the cap the players asserted that they thought it was either approved third party arrangements which the Storm had said would be cleared with the NRL.

"While with one exception I have seen no evidence amongst the material that I have reviewed that conclusively establishes that an individualo player knew that the Storm was not disclosing all his remuneration to the Salary Cap Auditor, a number of players received payments and benefits negotiated with the Storm that were not contained in their registered NRL playing contracts. Given this, alarm bells should have

been ringing for these players........

But many clubs have been finding TPA's for players and then making it look like the Player Manager's organized the deal

When I say many , I mean many Very hard to prove otherwise as well

These players have probably been courted by many clubs doing the exact same thing with the deals being offered to entice them

The other thing that many probably don't realize is the only time that many players actually meets with the club is when the contract is signed

Yes they will inspect clubs gym and stuff but the player managers do virtually everything

If I have a tax agent do my tax I am still responsible….......

Yes but they are two different things

The amount being stated to the ATO from the player is correct

If the club reports something different the onus is on the club not the player

A payment summary is still a payment summary

 

[Black_n_White]

Happy, I hope you are trolling…

Your case her pretty much revolves around the players not only signing two seperate contracts, but having to open seperate bank accounts to recieve funds from the different contracts.... and never questioning, or even thinking twice about it.

I do believe that there are a number of footballers out there that are as thick as besa blocks, though the players implicated in the rorting arent all of that mould. If you think Slater, Smith and Cronk alone werent intelligent enough to put 2 and 2 together, not a single one of them, I really do not know what to tell you.

 

[mctiger]

But many clubs have been finding TPA's for players and then making it look like the Player Manager's organized the deal

When I say many , I mean many Very hard to prove otherwise as well

These players have probably been courted by many clubs doing the exact same thing with the deals being offered to entice them

The other thing that many probably don't realize is the only time that many players actually meets with the club is when the contract is signed

Yes they will inspect clubs gym and stuff but the player managers do virtually everything

If I have a tax agent do my tax I am still responsible….......

Yes but they are two different things

The amount being stated to the ATO from the player is correct

If the club reports something different the onus is on the club not the player

A payment summary is still a payment summary

I wasn't trying to compare what the player earns against what is reported to the ATO. I was saying the ultimate responsibilty is with the player. You can't always blame your manager. If my tax return is wrong I wear the blame. Not my agent.

Again according to the book "Rule 26(1) of the NRL Playing Contract and Remuneration Rules prohibits a player from engaging in any conduct that in any way assists a club to avoid compliance with the Rules. This does not mean intentional conduct, it could include conduct that consitutes reckless indifference or, even negligence".

The NRL report noted: "The individual obligation that the player owes is to ensure that his NRL playing contract discloses all of the agreed remuneration and third party agreements. if he does not comply with this obligation and enters into arrangements that are in breach if the Salary Cap rules then he is enabling his club to breach its disclosure obligations and he really has no basis for thinking other than that this is the way the club operates across the board.

With contracts and then side letters being signed it's hard to believe things were not suspected.

PS - Nobody needs to buy the book if I keep quoting segments :slight_smile:

 

[happy_tiger]

Happy, I hope you are trolling…

Your case her pretty much revolves around the players not only signing two seperate contracts, but having to open seperate bank accounts to recieve funds from the different contracts.... and never questioning, or even thinking twice about it.

I do believe that there are a number of footballers out there that are as thick as besa blocks, though the players implicated in the rorting arent all of that mould. If you think Slater, Smith and Cronk alone werent intelligent enough to put 2 and 2 together, not a single one of them, I really do not know what to tell you.

Two bank accounts ??

Where the hell does that come from ??

They didn't get paid two contracts B&W

 

[MAFIA]

So my question is this if they don't know what there getting per season who does there managers do all the talk cam wants 900k because you are paying slater 800k they all knew wat they were getting and what they were getting under the table if you believe in what they said at the time you all must believe in the tooth fairy

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[Black_n_White]

Two bank accounts ??

Where the hell does that come from ??

They didn't get paid two contracts B&W

Happy, it is not really worth my time to trawl through loads of articles, though the crux of the case was that the players signed the NRL contract, as well as a second document that was kept in a different room in a seperate safe, undeniably reported by every single media outlet.

More indepth articles about the rort included secondary bank accounts and such.

Actually to make it easy for you, read this article Happy…

http://resources.news.com.au/files/2010/07/15/1225892/093299-aus-file-storm-investigation.pdf

if you need me to provide more evidence to back up my claims, I may reluctantly do so, depends on how many friday night bevies I tuck away.

 

[Geo]

The answer to the Title Thread is …....YES

 

[happy_tiger]

Two bank accounts ??

Where the hell does that come from ??

They didn't get paid two contracts B&W

Happy, it is not really worth my time to trawl through loads of articles, though the crux of the case was that the players signed the NRL contract, as well as a second document that was kept in a different room in a seperate safe, undeniably reported by every single media outlet.

More indepth articles about the rort included secondary bank accounts and such.

Actually to make it easy for you, read this article Happy…

http://resources.news.com.au/files/2010/07/15/1225892/093299-aus-file-storm-investigation.pdf

if you need me to provide more evidence to back up my claims, I may reluctantly do so, depends on how many friday night bevies I tuck away.

But you claimed two bank accounts

Can't see that mentioned once

 

[hobbo]

If smith was from New South Wales , happy would say guilty as … FACT !

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[happy_tiger]

Again it just makes no sense for the players to know

As I said with the example with Farah and Mayer , a player could tear the club down with that knowledge if they got a bee in their bonnet or too much turps one night

 

[Geo]

Ummm …he may not know what other players earn probably didn't that is not the issue....the Issue was the systematic rorting of the Salary Cap...If you believe Smith knew nothing about it...you still put milk and cookies out for Santa...

 

[tig_prmz]

Again it just makes no sense for the players to know

As I said with the example with Farah and Mayer , a player could tear the club down with that knowledge if they got a bee in their bonnet or too much turps one night

that's one of the only reasons im giving smith and co the benefit of the doubt… this remained a secret for what 5 years? i mean there were no rumours or anything of that sort before.. just innuendo.

in saying that though, if roosters get caught cheating the cap next year- who'd be surprised? who would say that oh sbw and mini knew they were rorting the cap?

 

[Black_n_White]

But you claimed two bank accounts

Can't see that mentioned once

what I provided was a document that showed players knew their partners were getting cars, boats paid off… pretty much proof the players werent duped an unknowing. Iron clad evidence the players knew.

Stop the strawman games, they are guilty, proven so without doubt.

Though Happy if you require me to filter through hundreds of articles to find proof of the bank accounts, I will do you a deal. Since I am already beating a dead horse, how about a bet... say 1 year avatar and Signature bet, no games on the sig bet, colour black, text size normal....

 

[happy_tiger]

We know the Storm cheated the cap

We will never know conclusively (unless one admits it) that Smith or any player knew 100% what was going on

They aren't private eyes , they are footballers

What some are suggesting that Smith knew conclusively they were over the cap

I'm saying unless he knew what everyone was getting paid he can't say for sure what was going on

If you had someone at your work asking every person who worked there what they were earning , would you tell them ??

 

[Black_n_White]

Someone recieved a car, not listed in their NRL approved contract including TPA's…

Strawman Happy, Strawman.