Coaching

[galea_11]

If u made a list of positive to negatives for the Tigers compared to the top 5 clubs. How could majority of coaches do any better then jt has done
Wayne Bennett said if u don't have the players u can't win

We don't have the budget or facilities and players the main clubs do. We have payed overs for years on players and we r hurting now on salary cap The junior talent want to be at the Cowboys Broncos storm roosters not the Tigers !!

For all our setbacks as a club we r in the fight most weeks We have sacked coaches last 5-10 yrs. so is it still the coach ?? I do believe he has toughened the Tigers up and made no excuses

 

[GNR4LIFE]

Putting it all on the coaching is quite frankly a cop out. Our issues go way beyond team selections and game plans. How many coaches will this playing group have to fail under before some realise the coach might not be the problem? For some, the issues with JT are so personal it's ridiculous. A simple coaching change will not do jack for this team.

 

[galea_11]

Exactly it's business not personal
If we throw another coach under bus which experienced coach will put hand up to coach is ??
Right or wrong look at Adam Blair The talk in media is Wests hurt his career big dollars at low level team When negotiations with top players are on this is the perception another negative for a coach

 

[Pawsandclaws]

Let's not have more excuses. JT had the opportunity to get results in the first 10 games of the season.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

Let's not have more excuses. JT had the opportunity to get results in the first 10 games of the season.

And where do the players fit into this?

 

[Goose]

Let's not have more excuses. JT had the opportunity to get results in the first 10 games of the season.

And where do the players fit into this?

Agreed. Certainly not all the coaches fault.

Im not a huge Taylor fan, but he is certainly not hopeless.

It is at least obvious what he is trying to do.

I dont agree with all of it, especially how negative we played between the 20's last year.

 

[Russell]

Let's not have more excuses. JT had the opportunity to get results in the first 10 games of the season.

But.. But…But .. we have only played 7

 

[jirskyr]

Putting it all on the coaching is quite frankly a cop out. Our issues go way beyond team selections and game plans. How many coaches will this playing group have to fail under before some realise the coach might not be the problem? For some, the issues with JT are so personal it's ridiculous. A simple coaching change will not do jack for this team.

And look at results.

5 coaches so far and generally speaking the same situation every year - some amazing wins, some terrible losses, some heartbreaking close losses, a run of bad form and missing out on the Top 8.

What are we now, 12 losses from 16 GP games? That's horrendous and you can't blame it on one person, given it's taken 16+ seasons to deliver that stat.

If we are forever buying budget coaches and using budget conditions, we need some luck and a rich vein of form to shake the comp up. Don't expect the bottom 8 sides to magically turn things around in 1-2 seasons, because there are off-field deficits that many clubs struggle to overcome on a consistent basis.

Since 2005, there are 6 clubs that have made the Top 8 on a very regular basis - in fact well over 50% of the time. Wouldn't be too hard to guess who they are:
Broncos 81.82%
Dogs 63.64%
Manly 90.91%
Storm 90.91%
Cowboys 63.64%
Saints 63.64%

The only surprise is that Roosters aren't there. Roosters, Souths and Sharks are all 45.45%. Putting that into perspective, if you are winning 45.45% of your matches, you are not doing particularly well (e.g. WT have won 46.97% of matches played since start of 2005).

Many people consider 50% strike rate for Top 8 to be an average result or modest target, but in fact only 6 teams out of 16 have achieved this. And because some of these sides are so far above 50%, they are taking slots off those lower sides. So you get the Tigers, Panthers, Titans all below 30%.

Can we be any more clear about this? Some teams have their act together on and off-field for many consecutive years and it shows in the finals appearances. The rest are just on and off, making up the numbers that season.

And sure some teams might have had their moment in the sun - Saints and Manly are on a decline, but Saints at least made the Top 8 last year.

 

[ricksen]

There are a fair few issues at WT, but I feel JT is definitely part of that.
His job is to put his players in the best position in which they can succeed, and I don't feel he's doing that.
His secondary mandate would be to develop and improve the players individually, and I don't really feel as though that's happening either.
I wholeheartedly agree with his approach and feel as though he's placing the emphasis in the right areas, but it just isn't translating into performances.
Coming out last night and saying 'fans should be really excited' was a real kick in the teeth for me. The effort was definitely there, but we suffered from the same old issues as always, and ultimately couldn't beat an out of form and under-strength Melbourne team at one of our supposed fortresses.

 

[Telltails]

Putting it all on the coaching is quite frankly a cop out. Our issues go way beyond team selections and game plans. How many coaches will this playing group have to fail under before some realise the coach might not be the problem? For some, the issues with JT are so personal it's ridiculous. A simple coaching change will not do jack for this team.

Agree to a certain extent. But if players who want to further their career choose to move on rather than play under Taylor then we have a big problem. All very well to say let them all leave to watch them prosper somewhere else, and then not be able to attract any others to replace them unless you offer ridiculous money - and I am not sure we need players who are just chasing money. If Taylor cant attract numerous players to replace the ones we lose then we are going nowhere by continuing to support him. That's not personal that's about putting the interests of the club ahead of Taylor. Is he the coach that can draw players that we need to this club while also retaining the ones we want - not so sure.

 

[galea_11]

We just went golden time with Melbourne top 5 side for past 10 yrs Minus. Woods sue Simona nofo. In an unbalanced team due part to poor salary cap decisions past 5 yrs past Tigers teams would of lost that game by 10+. I see wat jt is saying we r standing up and battling

We moved on Wayne Pearce
We moved on terry lamb
We moved on tim sheens
We moved on mick potter

Hmmm. Maybe there is a bigger problem here :brick:

 

[galea_11]

Again we don't have the budget -third party deals- facilities etc of top sides .player manager will advise there players to only go Tigers if u have to !
So then how does jt attract top players away from the top clubs ??
Just like Motorsport how did Craig Lowndes go when he not in the top teams ? Every sport the same it's not even playing field to blame just coach

 

[stevetiger]

Putting it all on the coaching is quite frankly a cop out. Our issues go way beyond team selections and game plans. How many coaches will this playing group have to fail under before some realise the coach might not be the problem? For some, the issues with JT are so personal it's ridiculous. A simple coaching change will not do jack for this team.

What would. If you blame this all on the players or something else it's a cop out.

I also don't get the comments as if this team is the same team as we've had for the past 5 years when it isn't. There have been roster changes.

Tedesco, Brooks and Moses are all new players in the line-up.

These broad comments that you are so keen to make in my opinion don't make any sense whatsoever.

Tell us at a detailed level what is wrong.

 

[stevetiger]

We just went golden time with Melbourne top 5 side for past 10 yrs Minus. Woods sue Simona nofo. In an unbalanced team due part to poor salary cap decisions past 5 yrs past Tigers teams would of lost that game by 10+. I see wat jt is saying we r standing up and battling

We moved on Wayne Pearce
We moved on terry lamb
We moved on tim sheens
We moved on mick potter

Hmmm. Maybe there is a bigger problem here :brick:

What is the problem ?

 

[stevetiger]

There are a fair few issues at WT, but I feel JT is definitely part of that.
His job is to put his players in the best position in which they can succeed, and I don't feel he's doing that.
His secondary mandate would be to develop and improve the players individually, and I don't really feel as though that's happening either.
I wholeheartedly agree with his approach and feel as though he's placing the emphasis in the right areas, but it just isn't translating into performances.
Coming out last night and saying 'fans should be really excited' was a real kick in the teeth for me. The effort was definitely there, but we suffered from the same old issues as always, and ultimately couldn't beat an out of form and under-strength Melbourne team at one of our supposed fortresses.

I think it's fairly clear that Taylor failed completely last year. This year isn't looking good.

I'm not sure if Taylor is too blame for our performances this year. I think our spine hasn't performed to expectations especially our halves.

I though prefer to look at what specific actions are going to be taken to improve the results. At this point I think getting rid of Taylor at the end of his contract has to be a given unless massive improvements are made and soon.

 

[stevetiger]

If we are forever buying budget coaches and using budget conditions, we need some luck and a rich vein of form to shake the comp up. Don't expect the bottom 8 sides to magically turn things around in 1-2 seasons, because there are off-field deficits that many clubs struggle to overcome on a consistent basis.

Just to clarify this point. Are you stating that a top quality coach and top quality facilities will turn us into a consistent top performing team ?

So the answer is to sack JT and get a quality coach and then ensure we have great training facilities.

Just to give the flip side of this point - what if JT is doing as good a job as possible and our facilities are good ? What if you get Bellamy in and we still don't win games consistently ? We did have Tim Sheens who was a high quality coach. I also think we've improved our facilities or maybe better put our strength and conditioning staff last year.

Another way to look at this is look at the SOO series. I think Qld have had a dud coach and I bet the training facilities are just as good for NSW and QLD. Maybe it's just the players that are the problem.

I'm not stating you are wrong but I'm not sold on this being the problem. I think it comes down to having a well coached team and the players that can perform.

 

[851]

Some of our supporters are exactly what the club want, they will make excuses for losses tell us we are getting better and everything will be alright.
Well real world for me is, we have lost 5 games in a row, we are conceding 22.4 points per match, team selection is ordinary, ball control is ordinary and we play like a pub team who have just met each other.
Our ability to surrender leads is second to none, our uncanny knack of letting in tries just before and just after halftime is outstanding, and our inability to close out a game is second to none.
Has Taylor improved anything since he arrived, yes, but other things have stayed the same or regressed, is he the right coach for us moving forward, no he is definitely not.

 

[Eddie]

We just went golden time with Melbourne top 5 side for past 10 yrs Minus. Woods sue Simona nofo. In an unbalanced team due part to poor salary cap decisions past 5 yrs past Tigers teams would of lost that game by 10+. I see wat jt is saying we r standing up and battling

We moved on Wayne Pearce
We moved on terry lamb
We moved on tim sheens
We moved on mick potter

Hmmm. Maybe there is a bigger problem here :brick:

Just to play devils advocate where are these coaches doing now??

Have they gone on to prove those decisions wrong??

 

[hobbo]

Some of our supporters are exactly what the club want, they will make excuses for losses tell us we are getting better and everything will be alright.
Well real world for me is, we have lost 5 games in a row, we are conceding 22.4 points per match, team selection is ordinary, ball control is ordinary and we play like a pub team who have just met each other.
Our ability to surrender leads is second to none, our uncanny knack of letting in tries just before and just after halftime is outstanding, and our inability to close out a game is second to none.
Has Taylor improved anything since he arrived, yes, but other things have stayed the same or regressed, is he the right coach for us moving forward, not he is definitely not.

We need an hard arsed coach , one who won't accept mediocrity .
A coach who the players look up to , want to play for and a coach who can get into the heads of the butterfly chasing Gen Y players .

STEVE FOLKES

 

[GNR4LIFE]

Some of our supporters are exactly what the club want, they will make excuses for losses tell us we are getting better and everything will be alright.
Well real world for me is, we have lost 5 games in a row, we are conceding 22.4 points per match, team selection is ordinary, ball control is ordinary and we play like a pub team who have just met each other.
Our ability to surrender leads is second to none, our uncanny knack of letting in tries just before and just after halftime is outstanding, and our inability to close out a game is second to none.
Has Taylor improved anything since he arrived, yes, but other things have stayed the same or regressed, is he the right coach for us moving forward, not he is definitely not.

We need an hard arsed coach , one who won't accept mediocrity .
A coach who the players look up to , want to play for and a coach who can get into the heads of the butterfly chasing Gen Y players .

STEVE FOLKES

Been out of the game way too long.