Compressed defence

[jirskyr]

When you have smaller players Jirskyr they struggle to tie the ball up when you use slide

The compressed defence is our only option

Lets see what the incoming coach does , that should give us a few answers

Well this shot isn't proper compressed and it's not sliding, it's just crap like players with concrete shoes on.

Nofo is 16 metres infield, Naiqama is 21 m. Dragons have 3 players in the outside two channels and our line is about 7 metres short of Widdop when he kicks. There's no pressure here, nobody is getting in the face of or making a shot on any of the Dragons backs, I can't even tell you who Nofo thinks he is covering, he's just watching Widdop. Moses is marking Widdop and Frozone is watching Thompson… err who has Lafai or Nightingale?

 

[happy_tiger]

When you have smaller players Jirskyr they struggle to tie the ball up when you use slide

The compressed defence is our only option

Lets see what the incoming coach does , that should give us a few answers

Well this shot isn't proper compressed and it's not sliding, it's just crap like players with concrete shoes on.

Nofo is 16 metres infield, Naiqama is 21 m. Dragons have 3 players in the outside two channels and our line is about 7 metres short of Widdop when he kicks. There's no pressure here, nobody is getting in the face of or making a shot on any of the Dragons backs, I can't even tell you who Nofo thinks he is covering, he's just watching Widdop. Moses is marking Widdop and Frozone is watching Thompson… err who has Lafai or Nightingale?
temp1.jpg

Fro's checking his hair on the big screen obviously

When exactly was this , it happened too many times to be honest

1st ,2nd or 3rd try ??

 

[Geo]

Lockyer and Maloney are 2 of the worst defenders in the last decade. Check the stats. Thurston is run over in dramatic fashion every game… The records of the teams they play in speak for themselves. Forget the man, notice how the other 12 on the park make up for it!

Totally agree. You look at the second rowers that played with them and they were their bodyguards. Tony Carroll or Sam Thaiday were there to smash anyone who tried to run over their playmaker. We are more lets hold and try and get them to the ground. No, hit them hard and it will make them think the next time they have the ball. The only big hit i recall this year was from a front rower on an off balanced halfback. Not good enough

But it goes further in from there as well Webcke ,Civonaceva , and blokes like Parker ,Ennis , McCullough

If you've got one weakness you can cover for it

We have that many weaknesses both sides , they don't get you left side , they switch straight back to the right and get you next tackle

What the…. 😱pen_mouth:

They just need to stay on their feet ...stop making excuses...

 

[jirskyr]

When you have smaller players Jirskyr they struggle to tie the ball up when you use slide

The compressed defence is our only option

Lets see what the incoming coach does , that should give us a few answers

Well this shot isn't proper compressed and it's not sliding, it's just crap like players with concrete shoes on.

Nofo is 16 metres infield, Naiqama is 21 m. Dragons have 3 players in the outside two channels and our line is about 7 metres short of Widdop when he kicks. There's no pressure here, nobody is getting in the face of or making a shot on any of the Dragons backs, I can't even tell you who Nofo thinks he is covering, he's just watching Widdop. Moses is marking Widdop and Frozone is watching Thompson… err who has Lafai or Nightingale?
temp1.jpg

Fro's checking his hair on the big screen obviously

When exactly was this , it happened too many times to be honest

1st ,2nd or 3rd try ??

Second try, it's the Widdop kick to an unmarked Nightingale, 11:43.

 

[happy_tiger]

When you have smaller players Jirskyr they struggle to tie the ball up when you use slide

The compressed defence is our only option

Lets see what the incoming coach does , that should give us a few answers

Well this shot isn't proper compressed and it's not sliding, it's just crap like players with concrete shoes on.

Nofo is 16 metres infield, Naiqama is 21 m. Dragons have 3 players in the outside two channels and our line is about 7 metres short of Widdop when he kicks. There's no pressure here, nobody is getting in the face of or making a shot on any of the Dragons backs, I can't even tell you who Nofo thinks he is covering, he's just watching Widdop. Moses is marking Widdop and Frozone is watching Thompson… err who has Lafai or Nightingale?
temp1.jpg

Fro's checking his hair on the big screen obviously

When exactly was this , it happened too many times to be honest

1st ,2nd or 3rd try ??

Second try, it's the Widdop kick to an unmarked Nightingale, 11:43.

Nofo's positioning isn't great but at least he is still watching the ball /carrier which is the key to this great game of ours

People freak out in the modern game about getting caught ball watching , but if you keep a straight line and stay calm and talk about who has who it's not an issue

The thing for me when you see this try from behind our tryline is look how far Tedesco is out of position , not kidding at least 15 metres away from where I would have wanted to be if I was in his shoes

I bet Slater wouldn't get caught out like this unless he'd been involved in the last tackle

I'm not a winger , but if I was reading it from Nofo's pov I'm thinking Widdop's got the overlap to work with so the percentage play is draw catch pass , so i'd be thinking I have to try and not over commit ( to force Widdop to go kick or cut out )but be leaning towards cutting the centre in half , because in dry conditions you get an overlap and your not playing a pack of monkeys more often than not you score

Lots of people at fault as usual

 

[Trisdar]

Jason Taylor would have come up with this option for defence as it technically should be beat for brooks and Moses. But forwards halfs aren't reading the play. Which leaves nofo with options of stay out - try. Try to jam in - try. Intercept - try. He is on a hiding to nothing. They hardly went down our left yesterday, all teams know our deficiencies in defence.

 

[larrycorowa]

Kev is not giving anyone a chance to slide, he is making a decision so early he either leaves Moses exposed or nofo. At the moment he is racing off his line and making it easy for the 7 to make a decision. Another thing wwith up and in is that it makes it very difficult to scramble because the inside defenders have to run around the outside ones.

The only game it has been effective was vs the cowboys. Very old fashioned form of defense which should be used sparingly as a surprise tactic, not something that is so predictable teams are forming game plans around it.

 

[jirskyr]

Well this shot isn't proper compressed and it's not sliding, it's just crap like players with concrete shoes on.

Nofo is 16 metres infield, Naiqama is 21 m. Dragons have 3 players in the outside two channels and our line is about 7 metres short of Widdop when he kicks. There's no pressure here, nobody is getting in the face of or making a shot on any of the Dragons backs, I can't even tell you who Nofo thinks he is covering, he's just watching Widdop. Moses is marking Widdop and Frozone is watching Thompson… err who has Lafai or Nightingale?
temp1.jpg

Fro's checking his hair on the big screen obviously

When exactly was this , it happened too many times to be honest

1st ,2nd or 3rd try ??

Second try, it's the Widdop kick to an unmarked Nightingale, 11:43.

Nofo's positioning isn't great but at least he is still watching the ball /carrier which is the key to this great game of ours

People freak out in the modern game about getting caught ball watching , but if you keep a straight line and stay calm and talk about who has who it's not an issue

The thing for me when you see this try from behind our tryline is look how far Tedesco is out of position , not kidding at least 15 metres away from where I would have wanted to be if I was in his shoes

I bet Slater wouldn't get caught out like this unless he'd been involved in the last tackle

I'm not a winger , but if I was reading it from Nofo's pov I'm thinking Widdop's got the overlap to work with so the percentage play is draw catch pass , so i'd be thinking I have to try and not over commit ( to force Widdop to go kick or cut out )but be leaning towards cutting the centre in half , because in dry conditions you get an overlap and your not playing a pack of monkeys more often than not you score

Lots of people at fault as usual

I agree Tedesco is found wanting at times in defence. I raised it during the off-season, how bad his missed tackle stats are for a FB, compared with other FBs. Only Ben Barba really was worse. There were a lot of excuses / reasons offered, some potentially valid, things such as not making many in-line tackles (like Darius Boyd likes to) or Tigers opening up really big gaps all over the park. But ultimately for a guy you would think is the choice NSW FB, defensively he needs a lot of improvement.

It's not just this kick, the kick that McDonald scored at the end, I know everyone was buggered and they got in and behind Suli, but on the wide shot you see Tedesco walks to his left and only breaks into a run once they kick it, he never gets close to cover. It's not as if Dragons were ripping us side to side yesterday, they'd just punch it up one way, draw us in, then spread it the other way and we wouldn't number.

But I want my #1 closer to the ball to defend those kicks, because the compressed defence can't turn and chase those good kicks, they are vulnerable to the poke kick in-behind and it's worked for a lot of teams this year.

 

[old_man_tiger]

Maybe we should have 9 in the front line and 4 fullbacks

 

[2041]

Lockyer and Maloney are 2 of the worst defenders in the last decade. Check the stats. Thurston is run over in dramatic fashion every game… The records of the teams they play in speak for themselves. Forget the man, notice how the other 12 on the park make up for it!

100% agree. The idea that gets aired a lot on here that the problem with Brooks and Moses is their defence is bonkers. There's an argument that a good team can't carry two defensive liabilities but it should certainly be able to carry one - with the notable examples you provided. The moment in the Raiders game where Joseph Paolo got to run one on one at Brooks in open field was one of the most disgraceful failures of defensive structure I've ever seen - and something similar happens to the Tigers again and again.

 

[Needaname]

Actually in the first try they did exactly that, went up the middle then spread it right. Jamal made the tackle on Kurt man but could not get him to ground.
He played the ball quick and then went left.
We had 5 players covering there 3 on the left after that as all the players in the ruck rushed back to the blind side. Happens continuously.
That's why we were compressed. Not because of tactic because of errors and positioning.

It starts at the ruck, the Dragons for most of their runs required 4 man tackles. Which meant we were already chasing our tail, and in the case of Mann not being put to ground and getting a quick play the ball, it all fell apart.

I think the compressed defence is fine in the middle of the field. Dragons were compressed alot of time you just wouldNT have noticed it because we didn't spread the ball early in the set.

We need a new strategy with our goal line defence.
It should be a different defensive strategy altogether, it's all about numbers and upper body tackles.

Most teams prefer to defend on their line and would even give away penalties to ensure it, here's why;

A penalty requires all 13 man at the goal line. When the penalty is less than 10m from the try line it ensures we are well covered and there is no body's pushing back from the ruck.
I've noticed teams have been smart to adopt this strategy to their goal line defence.
If you get a chance to watch the game again. Look at how many men the Dragons have at marker less than 20 out. 1\. And less then 10 meters out? 0.

I argee with above we seem to use tedesco as that extra man but look at the positioning on the line between Dugan and Tedesco. Tedesco nearly always gets caught around the ruck on the short side and man's up there.
Dugan although in the line always remains active and is positioned in the open side.
Problem a bunch of kids that haven't learnt how to be first graders and think they deserve too be qualified as superstars.

 

[2041]

Reading all this and of course what I've seen with my own eyes certainly makes me very worried. The problem is that this entire side has, apparently, made no progress at all in the past three years: it's not as if they're undepowered players with a good structure they can't make stick, they're underpowered players who can't run the structure they've been given. So whatever they try to build now fundamentally has no foundations.

All the comments above, to my mind, come back to one thing: lack of cohesion. At root level, the players don't know what to expect from each other - which means they're bound to fail sooner or later. The really scary thing is that this is a team that in the main has been playing together for a while now, it's not a bunch of guys thrown together a few weeks ago.

Unfortunately, a ninth placed finish last year (which itself was massively inflated by the Parra situation and unaccountable explosions by the Roosters and, to a lesser extent, Manly) made some people think the Tigers were on the verge of taking another step forward. What was actually happening was that a team with true talent of maybe 12th didn't improve in the offseason and came back with the same cattle and the same game plan. If you stand still in modern sport you go backwards even if you were fantastic to start with, and that wasn't the case here. Everyone knows how to play the Tigers now, and they will keep doing it ruthlessly until something changes.

There's also clearly no pressure from below because the squad has no depth, so the options are to keep playing guys who demonstrably can't implement the tactics given to them, change tactics to something that is arguably even less likely to work (because it would rely on players who can't follow a game plan to run a new one that they haven't even practised) or bring in players who in all likelihood are not even as good as the ones on the park now.

Which leaves me with two conclusions:
1) I know it's raking over old coals, but Jason Taylor was absolutely out of his depth and didn't go a minute too soon. The tactics he had were barely passable in 2016 and to come into this year with nothing changed was bordeline dereliction of duty..
2) 2017 is a write off. We have to accept that the spoon is a distinct likelihood and 14th is probably the extent of realistic ambition, give Cleary maximum patience and hope an improved cap position and a full offseason lets him turn it round for next year.

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

We could cover two rubbish halves if our defence wasn't compressed to make up for our defensive deficiencies in the middle as well.

Brooks at least hits, sticks sometimes and slows/stops the ball carrier.

Moses is a complete non effort. Coupled with Kev it's a disaster.

 

[cktiger]

Forgetting all the ridiculous defensive patterns - how hard is it to mark your man?
You get taught it when you start playing the game.
How many times do you see other teams have a two or three man overlap on the Tigers?
EVERY BLOODY WEEK!

 

[jirskyr]

Forgetting all the ridiculous defensive patterns - how hard is it to mark your man?
You get taught it when you start playing the game.
How many times do you see other teams have a two or three man overlap on the Tigers?
EVERY BLOODY WEEK!

As soon as the opposition brings their fullback into the attack you are outnumbered, so you can't just go man-on-man at this time.

I agree there should not be 2- and 3-man overlaps, that is a total misread of the play and/or lack of fitness/scramble. The idea that Nofo REGULARLY has 2 or more players on his outside is ridiculous.

I was thinking a bit more about the defence, absorbing a lot of good commentary in this thread. One thing that has been singled out for me is the Tigers should not be sticking to just one defensive structure all game, which is what the seem to do. Webster talked in the presser about failing to identify the attack's "shape", which is probably true, but as a sideline nobody it seems to me sometimes we are so determined to set our own shape that we force / guide the opposition.

E.g. the second Nightingale try, I already posted a pic earlier. Widdop was encouraged to kick when you view it and think about it. First try similar shape, he goes cut-out to the left and they score, albeit from some dodgy cover which could have stopped the play. So second time around with depth and Nightingale open and at the line, he opts to kick.

I don't know what Nofo is supposed to do about that, he's followed his men in, he is watching WIddop and in replay he very clearly thinks a kick might be on, because as soon as Widdop shapes Nofo is turning and chasing a kick, he isn't still coming forward and pressuring the runners. But the issue is he is 16 metres in-field and can't cover the ground quickly enough… even a handful of metres closer to the sideline and he might have affected a decent tackle.

So my point is, if compressed defence is your thing, fine, but do it when you are on top and managing the set. About 20 mins into the game yesterday Tigers got really tough, lots of aggressive tackling and hurting Dragons, lead by McIlwrick. It lasted about 2-3 sets and really put us front-foot, ended up with Nofo making that break off the Woods offload, before we murdered the opportunity (like we did the other week when JLJ was on the break). This is a fine time for compressed footy, you are dominating the ruck and out-muscling your opponent.

But for Nightingale's 2nd try, all of his tries really, Saints are working us over right before shifting it left and attacking with pinpoint. It seems to me as a nobody, this is when you slide defend, because your defenders have been drawn to one side and you are exposed out wide. Fair enough, Saints worked us over there, but to continue with the compressed defence when most of your team are on one side of the paddock, just seems ridiculous. Especially when tired tacklers are retreating to the line, the set defenders should all be pushing to the open field, the markers should work extra hard to ensure the DH or hitup doesn't exploit the ruck gap, and everyone else should be pushing right. To think we get drawn across as 851 notes, Mann gets a quick PTB and the entire RHS is pushing forward and in... seems crazy to me, you are just inviting them to go over the top of you.

 

[Needaname]

Forgetting all the ridiculous defensive patterns - how hard is it to mark your man?
You get taught it when you start playing the game.
How many times do you see other teams have a two or three man overlap on the Tigers?
EVERY BLOODY WEEK!

As soon as the opposition brings their fullback into the attack you are outnumbered, so you can't just go man-on-man at this time.

I agree there should not be 2- and 3-man overlaps, that is a total misread of the play and/or lack of fitness/scramble. The idea that Nofo REGULARLY has 2 or more players on his outside is ridiculous.

I was thinking a bit more about the defence, absorbing a lot of good commentary in this thread. One thing that has been singled out for me is the Tigers should not be sticking to just one defensive structure all game, which is what the seem to do. Webster talked in the presser about failing to identify the attack's "shape", which is probably true, but as a sideline nobody it seems to me sometimes we are so determined to set our own shape that we force / guide the opposition.

E.g. the second Nightingale try, I already posted a pic earlier. Widdop was encouraged to kick when you view it and think about it. First try similar shape, he goes cut-out to the left and they score, albeit from some dodgy cover which could have stopped the play. So second time around with depth and Nightingale open and at the line, he opts to kick.

I don't know what Nofo is supposed to do about that, he's followed his men in, he is watching WIddop and in replay he very clearly thinks a kick might be on, because as soon as Widdop shapes Nofo is turning and chasing a kick, he isn't still coming forward and pressuring the runners. But the issue is he is 16 metres in-field and can't cover the ground quickly enough… even a handful of metres closer to the sideline and he might have affected a decent tackle.

So my point is, if compressed defence is your thing, fine, but do it when you are on top and managing the set. About 20 mins into the game yesterday Tigers got really tough, lots of aggressive tackling and hurting Dragons, lead by McIlwrick. It lasted about 2-3 sets and really put us front-foot, ended up with Nofo making that break off the Woods offload, before we murdered the opportunity (like we did the other week when JLJ was on the break). This is a fine time for compressed footy, you are dominating the ruck and out-muscling your opponent.

But for Nightingale's 2nd try, all of his tries really, Saints are working us over right before shifting it left and attacking with pinpoint. It seems to me as a nobody, this is when you slide defend, because your defenders have been drawn to one side and you are exposed out wide. Fair enough, Saints worked us over there, but to continue with the compressed defence when most of your team are on one side of the paddock, just seems ridiculous. Especially when tired tacklers are retreating to the line, the set defenders should all be pushing to the open field, the markers should work extra hard to ensure the DH or hitup doesn't exploit the ruck gap, and everyone else should be pushing right. To think we get drawn across as 851 notes, Mann gets a quick PTB and the entire RHS is pushing forward and in... seems crazy to me, you are just inviting them to go over the top of you.

I'll think you'll find it was me that posted that, I spent a lot of time, too much time, analysing game structures and play not just of the tigers.
I also stated that teams use a different defensive system when they are on the goal line.

 

[TrueTiger]

Lots of good opinions in this thread and I would like to add that this team DOES NOT PLAY WITH A PURPOSE,you can see in their indecisions how they seem to be confused or the lack of vision with ball in hand,,,,they had plenty of opportunity yesterday to put points on the board….Ill leave the rest up to you to ponder.....

 

[2041]

Forgetting all the ridiculous defensive patterns - how hard is it to mark your man?
You get taught it when you start playing the game.
How many times do you see other teams have a two or three man overlap on the Tigers?
EVERY BLOODY WEEK!

As soon as the opposition brings their fullback into the attack you are outnumbered, so you can't just go man-on-man at this time.

I agree there should not be 2- and 3-man overlaps, that is a total misread of the play and/or lack of fitness/scramble. The idea that Nofo REGULARLY has 2 or more players on his outside is ridiculous.

I was thinking a bit more about the defence, absorbing a lot of good commentary in this thread. One thing that has been singled out for me is the Tigers should not be sticking to just one defensive structure all game, which is what the seem to do. Webster talked in the presser about failing to identify the attack's "shape", which is probably true, but as a sideline nobody it seems to me sometimes we are so determined to set our own shape that we force / guide the opposition.

E.g. the second Nightingale try, I already posted a pic earlier. Widdop was encouraged to kick when you view it and think about it. First try similar shape, he goes cut-out to the left and they score, albeit from some dodgy cover which could have stopped the play. So second time around with depth and Nightingale open and at the line, he opts to kick.

I don't know what Nofo is supposed to do about that, he's followed his men in, he is watching WIddop and in replay he very clearly thinks a kick might be on, because as soon as Widdop shapes Nofo is turning and chasing a kick, he isn't still coming forward and pressuring the runners. But the issue is he is 16 metres in-field and can't cover the ground quickly enough… even a handful of metres closer to the sideline and he might have affected a decent tackle.

So my point is, if compressed defence is your thing, fine, but do it when you are on top and managing the set. About 20 mins into the game yesterday Tigers got really tough, lots of aggressive tackling and hurting Dragons, lead by McIlwrick. It lasted about 2-3 sets and really put us front-foot, ended up with Nofo making that break off the Woods offload, before we murdered the opportunity (like we did the other week when JLJ was on the break). This is a fine time for compressed footy, you are dominating the ruck and out-muscling your opponent.

But for Nightingale's 2nd try, all of his tries really, Saints are working us over right before shifting it left and attacking with pinpoint. It seems to me as a nobody, this is when you slide defend, because your defenders have been drawn to one side and you are exposed out wide. Fair enough, Saints worked us over there, but to continue with the compressed defence when most of your team are on one side of the paddock, just seems ridiculous. Especially when tired tacklers are retreating to the line, the set defenders should all be pushing to the open field, the markers should work extra hard to ensure the DH or hitup doesn't exploit the ruck gap, and everyone else should be pushing right. To think we get drawn across as 851 notes, Mann gets a quick PTB and the entire RHS is pushing forward and in... seems crazy to me, you are just inviting them to go over the top of you.

Question here: to what extent do you think the Tigers are damned if they do, damned if they don't by their personnel? Looking at yesterday, you're absolutely right that the defence was too compressed during periods where the Dragons were winning the ruck. BUT in the Raiders game (admittedly only after the team had committed hara-kiri anyway) when the left side finally did spread we ended up with Brooks getting steamrolled into the core of the earth by Joseph Paulo.

What I'm saying is, is compressed effectively the only option because of ALL OF the following:
- The back rowers aren't good enough to cover lots of width on the fringes.
- The halves have to be given a corridor about 50cm wide outside the back rowers because they are such liabilities defensively.
- The centres aren't smart or athletic enough defensively to provide extra lateral coverage.

In other words, it's a house of cards that collapses week after week but there isn't really any other way of doing it with these personnel. Might as well sell out because at least with up and in you make the oppo execute their long passing/kicks and you might jag an intercept or two along the way.

 

[jirskyr]

Question here: to what extent do you think the Tigers are damned if they do, damned if they don't by their personnel? Looking at yesterday, you're absolutely right that the defence was too compressed during periods where the Dragons were winning the ruck. BUT in the Raiders game (admittedly only after the team had committed hara-kiri anyway) when the left side finally did spread we ended up with Brooks getting steamrolled into the core of the earth by Joseph Paulo.

What I'm saying is, is compressed effectively the only option because of ALL OF the following:
- The back rowers aren't good enough to cover lots of width on the fringes.
- The halves have to be given a corridor about 50cm wide outside the back rowers because they are such liabilities defensively.
- The centres aren't smart or athletic enough defensively to provide extra lateral coverage.

In other words, it's a house of cards that collapses week after week but there isn't really any other way of doing it with these personnel. Might as well sell out because at least with up and in you make the oppo execute their long passing/kicks and you might jag an intercept or two along the way.

Well those are golden questions, if you can answer them and come up with a new strategy you might as well be the defensive coach.

We definitely lose the ruck most weeks, that is about power and technique. Not enough dominant tackles, not enough smart work at the PTB without giving away penalties. We are quite sloppy and give up too much yardage to aggressive teams at the ruck.

We are vulnerable in the gap behind the ruck and it sucks out forwards in. They do not move well laterally after this.

Our backs come in too hard and set too early, especially when the forwards have been drawn in.

They have to work as a team, it's diabolical to have Luke Brooks facing a 1-1 with a player like Paulo. We just didn't see it coming, I don't know how not, the guy is a mountain, but he's slow and there should be alarm bells when he's lining up out wide. Papalii is a different animal, you know he's going to work the halves over all game, you just have to stay on top of him. I'd be filthy if I was a HB and my inside man let me take a prop 1-1.

It ends up being a team thing - they just don't work hard enough, don't communicate enough, aren't dedicated enough for 80 mins of play. They can do it for 30-40 mins, but then the micro errors start to explode, all the 1%ers become the defining moments of the play.

So I try to think when I am watching the Tigers, why are they always moving in and trying to drop their shoulders into the inside runners? Why do they so rarely slide with the ball? Part of it is instruction, because they keep the same shape often, but part of it is lack of trust. The centres don't trust the halves to make a proper contact (and come in), the halves don't trust their backrowers and continually pick up the biggest frame in the backline (dummy or not).

But even just looking at yesterday, the defensive line of JLJ-Idris-Suli wasn't really exploited, and Dragons went that way they were mostly shut down. They are vulnerable to the kick because Suli is inexperienced and both he and Idris turn like tankers. But it's not like the RHS, they aren't being split because each of those boys is a decent defender, and with JLJ replacing Brooks they appear less worried about him being isolated.

 

[jirskyr]

Then I compare to a team like Brisbane, they aren't a particularly huge side, but they scramble and move so well as a defensive unit. I mean Pangai and Ese'ese are big frames but they are fairly raw, not defensive powerhouses. Thaiday is arguably their biggest starter and Maguire is not huge for a prop.

But the whole team just moves together - up together, across together, cover inside and out. Milford is a small and poor defender, but he's always got cover in every situation, he's never left alone 1-1 with a Boyd Cordner or Josh Papalii.