Don't use the turmoil as an excuse

H

hybrid_tiger

Well-known member
The current situation with player turnover is not ideal, however this should NOT be an excuse for how poorly we are playing right now.

I firmly believe that if none of our players had signed elsewhere, or hadn't been offered around we would have still capitulated last night. It has happened so many times before in previous seasons. We play crap teams into form, we never play well when we are favourites, we make garbage teams look like superstars.

How many other games have we played over the past eight years, in the same scenario and lost? We come up against a team we should beat comfortably and we play the same as we did last night. It's always the same: players pushing passes they shouldn't, soft defence at crucial times, a poor kicking game, poor discipline, poor attitude. Rinse, wash and repeat.

Face the facts people. This current team does not have the consistent mental attitude to play tough football at the required level. They are soft. They are mentally weak. You can bring up last year but it was clearly a one off - and if you go back and look at last year it was only the last two months that we started to play some good football. Some of our wins last year were very, very poor. In the entire Sheens reign we have played good, consistent, strong, mentally tough football for about 16 weeks. 16 weeks in eight years.

IMO the broom that is being put through the place is the right decision, just that it has been handled pretty poorly, and the broom also needs to sweep up Sheens with it. (But we all know that will not happen, so I am not even going to discuss it).

I truly believe that none of the players we are let go will come back and bite us. They are all average first graders. Look at last night and the usual suspects let us down. Fifita made more metres sideways than forwards and got smashed by a Parramatta side that would rate as one of the worst in their history. Heighington was completely dominated and did not make a single shred of impact. Gibbs the same, smashed time and time again. Ryan, just too slow to be a good first grader. Moltzen, well I won't even start. He is the perfect example of what is wrong with this club. Runs it back hard to the line from fullback then just as he realises he will be tackled, he throws a hospital pass to McKinnon to take the hitup as he is scared of contact. Exactly the type of player we DON'T need.

Don't blame the turmoil. We are simply not good enough.
 
@hybrid_tiger said:
The current situation with player turnover is not ideal, however this should NOT be an excuse for how poorly we are playing right now.

I firmly believe that if none of our players had signed elsewhere, or hadn't been offered around we would have still capitulated last night. It has happened so many times before in previous seasons. We play crap teams into form, we never play well when we are favourites, we make garbage teams look like superstars.

How many other games have we played over the past eight years, in the same scenario and lost? We come up against a team we should beat comfortably and we play the same as we did last night. It's always the same: players pushing passes they shouldn't, soft defence at crucial times, a poor kicking game, poor discipline, poor attitude. Rinse, wash and repeat.

Face the facts people. This current team does not have the consistent mental attitude to play tough football at the required level. They are soft. They are mentally weak. You can bring up last year but it was clearly a one off - and if you go back and look at last year it was only the last two months that we started to play some good football. Some of our wins last year were very, very poor. In the entire Sheens reign we have played good, consistent, strong, mentally tough football for about 16 weeks. 16 weeks in eight years.

IMO the broom that is being put through the place is the right decision, just that it has been handled pretty poorly, and the broom also needs to sweep up Sheens with it. (But we all know that will not happen, so I am not even going to discuss it).

I truly believe that none of the players we are let go will come back and bite us. They are all average first graders. Look at last night and the usual suspects let us down. Fifita made more metres sideways than forwards and got smashed by a Parramatta side that would rate as one of the worst in their history. Heighington was completely dominated and did not make a single shred of impact. Gibbs the same, smashed time and time again. Ryan, just too slow to be a good first grader. Moltzen, well I won't even start. He is the perfect example of what is wrong with this club. Runs it back hard to the line from fullback then just as he realises he will be tackled, he throws a hospital pass to McKinnon to take the hitup as he is scared of contact. Exactly the type of player we DON'T need.

Don't blame the turmoil. We are simply not good enough.
Click to expand...

Good call most cant be argued with…..but i dont agree with letting sheens go.but if he cant drop players after the last few performances then maybe he should.....last night was so depressing we didnt look in the game at all.Kicking game crap less then 50% completions kills any team
Think it showed last night mckinnon is far to slow at the back.
 
We will always agree to disagree on Sheens, but you're right, he needs to start punting some underperformers. But it just won't happen, never has.
 
Agreed. Under Sheens the hallmark of this side has been inconsistent attitude and performance. All the little things that make a club like Manly, Melbourne and Brisbane regular winners is missing at the Tigers.

* Bringing 100% attitude to the collisions 9/10 weeks
* Having an efficient kicking game
* Being well organised and completing sets
* Running the ball with purpose aiming to dent the line
* Composure and paitence, working for a try as opposed to going the miricle play every 2 minutes
* Ultimately having a game plan that can work consistently in the NRL!

When you add all these things up, you realise why we we put in so many embarrassing performances. Ultimately there is only 1 man i can blame for this and that is the coach. However, mind numbingly he stays so lets move on. The clear out was probably the only other option so lets see how it goes. I would consider immediately getting rid of Gibbs and Ryan who have already showed their disenchantment publicly. Then drop Mckinnon, Lui and Moltzen who are playing like complete busteds.
 
I think we look like a rabble at the moment and I agree it has nothing to do with player turmoil. They are doing what they love and getting paid well to do it.

Sheeens needs to take some of the blame for the poor performances but so do the players.
 
Hybrid tiger a well balance and fair post.

I agree with your statement "IMO the broom that is being put through the place is the right decision, just that it has been handled pretty poorly" a good clean out at any club long term is a good thing.

Tim Sheens is not your problem,i believe the immaturity and tight bond between certain players is our problem.This creates a unprofessional environment which i feel Sheens is trying to rectify.

Look at who we are offloading all are manchildren with maturity problems.

Just a theory!
 
The current situation with player turnover is not ideal, however this should NOT be an excuse for how poorly we are playing right now.
>
I firmly believe that if none of our players had signed elsewhere, or hadn't been offered around we would have still capitulated last night. It has happened so many times before in previous seasons. We play crap teams into form, we never play well when we are favourites, we make garbage teams look like superstars.
>
How many other games have we played over the past eight years, in the same scenario and lost? We come up against a team we should beat comfortably and we play the same as we did last night. It's always the same: players pushing passes they shouldn't, soft defence at crucial times, a poor kicking game, poor discipline, poor attitude. Rinse, wash and repeat.
>
Face the facts people. This current team does not have the consistent mental attitude to play tough football at the required level. They are soft. They are mentally weak. You can bring up last year but it was clearly a one off - and if you go back and look at last year it was only the last two months that we started to play some good football. Some of our wins last year were very, very poor. In the entire Sheens reign we have played good, consistent, strong, mentally tough football for about 16 weeks. 16 weeks in eight years.
>
IMO the broom that is being put through the place is the right decision, just that it has been handled pretty poorly, and the broom also needs to sweep up Sheens with it. (But we all know that will not happen, so I am not even going to discuss it).
>
I truly believe that none of the players we are let go will come back and bite us. They are all average first graders. Look at last night and the usual suspects let us down. Fifita made more metres sideways than forwards and got smashed by a Parramatta side that would rate as one of the worst in their history. Heighington was completely dominated and did not make a single shred of impact. Gibbs the same, smashed time and time again. Ryan, just too slow to be a good first grader. Moltzen, well I won't even start. He is the perfect example of what is wrong with this club. Runs it back hard to the line from fullback then just as he realises he will be tackled, he throws a hospital pass to McKinnon to take the hitup as he is scared of contact. Exactly the type of player we DON'T need.
>
Don't blame the turmoil. We are simply not good enough.

My feelings exactly and I posted something similar in another thread.

Not sure why it's the case but forever and a day we have struggled in games like this.
 
while we have said our piece on rhino,he is the only one i would keep out of the lot.
so overall,i do agree.
as you say,the performance of this team the last month or so is no different than we have seen in the past.
if it has got to the players,then it has only confirmed that the squad lacks the mentality of a winner.

there is no happy way to do a clean out.
it is ruthless,especially when the rules state you can rip teams apart at any time during the season.
the only way you can say we did it right or wrong will be in our results over the following 3 years.
of course we will all have different concerns until this process is complete.
 
The ability is there….so we are taking mentality?

The coach and half or 3/4 the spine however will still remain, just how much change can be achieved this way is debateable.

Change your coach and key personnel and youre guaranteed a different direction imo
 
IMO the broom that is being put through the place is the right decision, just that it has been handled pretty poorly, and the broom also needs to sweep up Sheens with it. (But we all know that will not happen, so I am not even going to discuss it

.

HT while I do not necessarily agree with your enitre post, I think you've hit the nail on the head right there.

Simply put - they're not machines! It is all well and good people stating that they are paid professionals and should just get on with it etc but that is just not reality.

Part of my profession entails corporate re-structuring and I have seen what may be happening at WT . Change of strategy, redundancy rounds etc all will inevitably lead to lack of motivation, low morale and ultimately loss of productvity and performance issues without proper change management structure around the change.

The players are only human afterall. They are concerned about their futures and that of their colleagues or team mates. If they are not engaged properly they will feel isolated, disenfranchised and vulnerable.

It may be that WT management have not invested in this and we are now seeing the results.

I'd say 2011 will be a long hard road. 2012 may not be much better if they don't address it.
 
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