Help me (and others) keep faith in Madge...

[Blocker1963]

What I found most disappointing in Saturday's loss, was the input from Joey Leilua, there was no effort to contribute and he looks like he doesn't want to be a part of it, poor signing. Also Reynolds needs to be gone, he missed that many arm swing tackles and his enthusiasm counts for nothing. I am sure that Madge will make some harsh but good decisions. I hoping they go hard from young Burton

 

[Geo]

I’m a Madge fan. He’s the first coach we’ve had for sometime who can see the systemic issues the club has and is prepared to make tough calls. No more sweetheart deals for rusted on players, no more accepting inconsistency and mediocrity.

We’ve gone backwards this year? Fine. Personally I’d rather run 10th or worse for a couple of years if it means a top 4 team in a few years time. Finishing 9th repeatedly, being vaguely competitive, bring on the cusp of 8th with zero prospects of being a title contender? Had enough of that.

I don't think that is the case..even Taylor identified that Wests Tigers are soft mentally who are terrible defensively ..

We have heard the same from following coaches..so far all have failed to change it for any period of time despite the best effort and talk..

 

[Yossarian]

I’m a Madge fan. He’s the first coach we’ve had for sometime who can see the systemic issues the club has and is prepared to make tough calls. No more sweetheart deals for rusted on players, no more accepting inconsistency and mediocrity.

We’ve gone backwards this year? Fine. Personally I’d rather run 10th or worse for a couple of years if it means a top 4 team in a few years time. Finishing 9th repeatedly, being vaguely competitive, bring on the cusp of 8th with zero prospects of being a title contender? Had enough of that.

I don't think that is the case..even Taylor identified that Wests Tigers are soft mentally who are terrible defensively ..

We have heard the same from following coaches..so far all have failed to change it for any period of time despite the best effort and talk..

But he’s the only one I see as actually do something constructive. Plenty talked it up but then kept selecting the usual suspects. Taylor wasted all his time trying to get rid of one of the better players. Cleary went for the quick fix and blew our future cap on poor buys. None of them did a proper managed clean out.

 

[TheDaBoss]

I look at this way, does anyone seriously thinks that if we had Bellamy, Robinson or Bennett this season with our roster & back office staff that they would of coached the squad into the top 8 this season?

Who in the "back office staff" are you blaming?

I'm still not sold on the barber.

Sorry mate, I don't get it. Who's the barber?

A position in the bubble and long term at the COE. You know giving the boys their haircuts. Blame the barber.

I'm still confused how we don't have a halves coach but have a barber. Any hoo were apparently improving.


The board has only recently authorised an increase in the training budget. What they do with that is anyone’s guess?

Pathways and Development?

Development of juniors? Or specialised skills training for top 30?

personallly 50/50

 

[TrueTiger]

I’m a Madge fan. He’s the first coach we’ve had for sometime who can see the systemic issues the club has and is prepared to make tough calls. No more sweetheart deals for rusted on players, no more accepting inconsistency and mediocrity.

We’ve gone backwards this year? Fine. Personally I’d rather run 10th or worse for a couple of years if it means a top 4 team in a few years time. Finishing 9th repeatedly, being vaguely competitive, bring on the cusp of 8th with zero prospects of being a title contender? Had enough of that.

I don't think that is the case..even Taylor identified that Wests Tigers are soft mentally who are terrible defensively ..

We have heard the same from following coaches..so far all have failed to change it for any period of time despite the best effort and talk..

But he’s the only one I see as actually do something constructive. Plenty talked it up but then kept selecting the usual suspects. Taylor wasted all his time trying to get rid of one of the better players. Cleary went for the quick fix and blew our future cap on poor buys. None of them did a proper managed clean out.

If you look at it from the time when Sheens was here ,he had them playing fast attacking football...the old score more points than them and we win scenario...

Although we have had other coaches since try and change the style of play,Madge is the only one that has staunchly stated the change in culture first and foremost and its no wonder he is a coach who builds gameplans on defensive structures....this team and club at the moment cant handle the change implemented and thats why we see the team ""regressing ""so to speak...I put it down to adapting which takes longer than expected sometimes..

 

[TrueTiger]

I’m a Madge fan. He’s the first coach we’ve had for sometime who can see the systemic issues the club has and is prepared to make tough calls. No more sweetheart deals for rusted on players, no more accepting inconsistency and mediocrity.

We’ve gone backwards this year? Fine. Personally I’d rather run 10th or worse for a couple of years if it means a top 4 team in a few years time. Finishing 9th repeatedly, being vaguely competitive, bring on the cusp of 8th with zero prospects of being a title contender? Had enough of that.

I don't think that is the case..even Taylor identified that Wests Tigers are soft mentally who are terrible defensively ..

We have heard the same from following coaches..so far all have failed to change it for any period of time despite the best effort and talk..

But he’s the only one I see as actually do something constructive. Plenty talked it up but then kept selecting the usual suspects. Taylor wasted all his time trying to get rid of one of the better players. Cleary went for the quick fix and blew our future cap on poor buys. None of them did a proper managed clean out.

If you look at it from the time when Sheens was here ,he had them playing fast attacking football...the old score more points than them and we win scenario...

Although we have had other coaches since try and change the style of play,Madge is the only one that has staunchly stated the change in culture first and foremost and its no wonder he is a coach who builds gameplans on defensive structures....this team and club at the moment cant handle the change implemented and thats why we see the team ""regressing ""so to speak...I put it down to adapting which takes longer than expected sometimes..

This is why you see Benji being the attacking player he is ...its what he was taught and specialised in it....thats why his defense is so poor...

 

[Papacito]

The coach isn't the one out there, missing tackles or dropping balls.

We just don't have a roster that's good enough to compete for 80 minutes.

The guys show flashes of brilliance and sometimes do enough good stuff to scrape together a victory, but they aren't mentally strong enough to do this all the time.

This is why, in a lot of cases, their previous club let them go.

Joey Leilua is a textbook example. Amazing skill, but only his mum would claim he plays well for the entire game. Exactly why Ricky Stuart gave him the boot.

Sadly, there's no easy solution. Ditching another coach won't solve our fundamental problems.

We don't have the cash or profile to recruit a good roster and our development system seems to be limited to five ok'ish guys in a development squad.

The fact that Harry Grant has been our best this year shows where we're at and how far we have to go.

 

[pawsandclaws1]

I’m a Madge fan. He’s the first coach we’ve had for sometime who can see the systemic issues the club has and is prepared to make tough calls. No more sweetheart deals for rusted on players, no more accepting inconsistency and mediocrity.

We’ve gone backwards this year? Fine. Personally I’d rather run 10th or worse for a couple of years if it means a top 4 team in a few years time. Finishing 9th repeatedly, being vaguely competitive, bring on the cusp of 8th with zero prospects of being a title contender? Had enough of that.

I don't think that is the case..even Taylor identified that Wests Tigers are soft mentally who are terrible defensively ..

We have heard the same from following coaches..so far all have failed to change it for any period of time despite the best effort and talk..

But he’s the only one I see as actually do something constructive. Plenty talked it up but then kept selecting the usual suspects. Taylor wasted all his time trying to get rid of one of the better players. Cleary went for the quick fix and blew our future cap on poor buys. None of them did a proper managed clean out.

If you look at it from the time when Sheens was here ,he had them playing fast attacking football...the old score more points than them and we win scenario...

Although we have had other coaches since try and change the style of play,Madge is the only one that has staunchly stated the change in culture first and foremost and its no wonder he is a coach who builds gameplans on defensive structures....this team and club at the moment cant handle the change implemented and thats why we see the team ""regressing ""so to speak...I put it down to adapting which takes longer than expected sometimes..

This is why you see Benji being the attacking player he is ...its what he was taught and specialised in it....thats why his defense is so poor...

The reality is Benji's attacking game is probably the best for a half in the NRL. His defence is not the strongest but could be accommodated in a better defensive team.

In a team already accommodating other defensive liabilities on the right, it is hard to hide all of them as Bellamy exposed. I'd rather move the others on and keep Benji. I loved those passes to Kepaoa.

 

[tig_prmz]

It's very weird that we let Matterson go without a proper compensation. I am thinking we may have been negligent in duty of care and didn't want to risk Matterson taking any legal action. It's either that or we are the dumbest club in the comp for letting our best player go without any compensation.

**The compensation was not having to pay Matterson a dollar for season 2020, whereas if they protracted it they would have had to pay his salary for however many months it took to find a new player, for him to kick up a stink during pre-season and not contribute to a winning culture at the club.**

Also they spent the money on Luciano, so sometimes the compensation is not a direct swap, but what you are able to do when the player is gone.

I don't know what you mean by that

However, as for Luciano, I thought Luciano was signed before Matterson? Eitherway, they aren't in the same league. Matterson is likely in the top 5 backrowers this year whereas Luciano will struggle for a starting 13 spot in most teams.

I still think there is something fishy there.

 

[Tigerbuck63]

I think WT really have to muscle up and start to demonstrate they're not going to continue as a soft touch. Tear up the contracts of players not performing inc the high priced ones- pay them out and get rid of them.Take the NRL to court over the Farah penalty amount- he has not taken it up to date and probably wont now. Our early release of Corey Thompson has bitten us but I can only assume somewhere in the background WT were supposed to get a backline player but that didnt eventuate. Matterson's release without compensation and the obvious Parra meddling. If Bankwest / Parra Stadium is not working out rip it up - we did it because ANZ stadium was going to be torn down. State Govt reversed decision on that so why should we be bound to a ground situation forced on us? And for gods sake pick a home ground.

The coach has a plan to turn things around with getting youth pipeline working and gradually ridding the deadwood- both players and coaching / support staff. I'm for giving Maguire 2 more years to actually be able to judge him in the final year or two when most of the 30 man roster is his and the salary cap can truely be matched against coach / team roster / team performance / club performance and strategy..

It’s a nice thought but tearing up $1.6M is not easy. The contract is between two parties, it’s much easier to have bravado and say than to actually execute. We have to be patient and accept that not much will change in 2021, 2022 is a different story.

Nice to know what the plan actually is but everything around the back end of the season is dealing with bush fires.

It’s a nothing statement last night by Madge about players no longer with club next season unless you elaborate or had discussions already considering the Benji debacle.

It just feeds media a story to write about without being factual and does not add to team culture.

Personally all it does is deflect the performance of the teams effort last night and the coach!!!

Until Packer & Reynolds leave, not much will change. Hopefully we get JAC and Tamou turns out to be a great buy. Other than that that’s probably all that will happen in 2021, apart from signing on a few players on minimal contracts.

Tend to agree another year of missing finals as other teams around us get better?

Reynolds, Packer, Mybe lose those 3 and the salary situation will ease yeah 2022.

 

[jadtiger]

I’m a Madge fan. He’s the first coach we’ve had for sometime who can see the systemic issues the club has and is prepared to make tough calls. No more sweetheart deals for rusted on players, no more accepting inconsistency and mediocrity.

We’ve gone backwards this year? Fine. Personally I’d rather run 10th or worse for a couple of years if it means a top 4 team in a few years time. Finishing 9th repeatedly, being vaguely competitive, bring on the cusp of 8th with zero prospects of being a title contender? Had enough of that.

I don't think that is the case..even Taylor identified that Wests Tigers are soft mentally who are terrible defensively ..

We have heard the same from following coaches..so far all have failed to change it for any period of time despite the best effort and talk..

But he’s the only one I see as actually do something constructive. Plenty talked it up but then kept selecting the usual suspects. Taylor wasted all his time trying to get rid of one of the better players. Cleary went for the quick fix and blew our future cap on poor buys. None of them did a proper managed clean out.

If you look at it from the time when Sheens was here ,he had them playing fast attacking football...the old score more points than them and we win scenario...

Although we have had other coaches since try and change the style of play,Madge is the only one that has staunchly stated the change in culture first and foremost and its no wonder he is a coach who builds gameplans on defensive structures....this team and club at the moment cant handle the change implemented and thats why we see the team ""regressing ""so to speak...I put it down to adapting which takes longer than expected sometimes..

This is why you see Benji being the attacking player he is ...its what he was taught and specialised in it....thats why his defense is so poor...

The reality is Benji's attacking game is probably the best for a half in the NRL. His defence is not the strongest but could be accommodated in a better defensive team.

In a team already accommodating other defensive liabilities on the right, it is hard to hide all of them as Bellamy exposed. I'd rather move the others on and keep Benji. I loved those passes to Kepaoa.

I respect your devotion to Benji but i feel you are blind to his many faults.I totally disagree about
"Benji"s attacking game is probably the best for a half in the NRL".His attack is littered with poor options with no game management whatsoever.His defence is the worst in any position in the NRL imo.At this stage no other club in the NRL wants him including every team that is finishing behind us and no firm offers from overseas.

He was a great player and we should give him his last game for us and hope he goes out as a winner and has a decent game along with another in Chris Lawrence.I would love to belt the slugs on their own dungheap and put their season in turmoil

 

[earl]

I’m a Madge fan. He’s the first coach we’ve had for sometime who can see the systemic issues the club has and is prepared to make tough calls. No more sweetheart deals for rusted on players, no more accepting inconsistency and mediocrity.

We’ve gone backwards this year? Fine. Personally I’d rather run 10th or worse for a couple of years if it means a top 4 team in a few years time. Finishing 9th repeatedly, being vaguely competitive, bring on the cusp of 8th with zero prospects of being a title contender? Had enough of that.

I don't think that is the case..even Taylor identified that Wests Tigers are soft mentally who are terrible defensively ..

We have heard the same from following coaches..so far all have failed to change it for any period of time despite the best effort and talk..

But he’s the only one I see as actually do something constructive. Plenty talked it up but then kept selecting the usual suspects. Taylor wasted all his time trying to get rid of one of the better players. Cleary went for the quick fix and blew our future cap on poor buys. None of them did a proper managed clean out.

I think we've under performed this year which is bad and it's on the coach. At the same time I agree with your comments here. Madge to me is the first coach in ages that appears to be building for the longer term.

 

[clontarfkid]

Madge inherited a 9th place team and benefitted in 2020 from returns of Packer/Reynolds and Musgrave..PLUS a hooker who wld lead the Dally Ms mid year..PLUS Souths best back in the finals,PLUS Dragons best young forward PLUS a grand final centre!!
Thats a top 6 team at worst....I actually hate to admit this,but I cld smell 2005...
But it didnt happen,we went backwards and its totally on Madge IMO
Having said that,the very LAST thing we need rite now is yet another revolving coach door,
So Im for supporting Madge thru the next year or two and give him an opportunity to change the culture with better recruits that will also fit in with whomver inherits the team
Anything past 2022 Madge needs to earn with forward progress..exactly the opposite to this year

 

[Moh]

I want to know who the Madge haters want as coach?

Haven't we longed for a coach who makes players accountable, and will not accept mediocre performances no matter what your name or status in the game is?

He hasn't been able to do that more recently because 1, we don't have the players and 2 there's too much pressure to send out Rowdy and Benji on the field.

Madge is not the issue, the cattle is. We are a weak club, and those who complain can see themselves out.

Side note, irks me that Saint Ivan doesn't get hammered enough in the media for what he did at this club in terms of the signings he made.

 

[Tiger_heart]

If the roster is the reason that coaches do well, then Madge is no better (or worse) than a Bennet, or Sticky or Bellamy - in the sense that, given a strong squad, any coach is capable of looking good.
See what happened with Bennett at Newcastle - substandard signing, and results to match.
What I am yet to see (apart from what Sheens did for us in 2005) is a coach that uses what he has and makes them perform to the best of their ability. Cleary is looking like a top coach now because of the roster Penrith has. He certainly wasn't mentioned in the same vein when coaching us. What I see here is a failure to even raise the standard of the current crop of players (numbers don't lie). I don't expect them to beat top 4 material, but it is reasonable to expect at least improvements in some, if not most of the players. With the exception of Nofa, has anyone really stepped up their game this year?

 

[Tiger_heart]

I want to know who the Madge haters want as coach?

I don't think it is a question of replacing him, but it is reasonable to expect a degree of accountability on his part?

Haven't we longed for a coach who makes players accountable, and will not accept mediocre performances no matter what your name or status in the game is?

See my point above

He hasn't been able to do that more recently because 1, we don't have the players and 2 there's too much pressure to send out Rowdy and Benji on the field.

Pressure? from who, sponsors, the club? It is a fact of life, though, in many sports where commercial interests prevail.

Madge is not the issue, the cattle is. We are a weak club, and those who complain can see themselves out.

OK, the cattle is the problem, so how many of them have actually improved since last year?

Side note, irks me that Saint Ivan doesn't get hammered enough in the media for what he did at this club in terms of the signings he made.

Some of been vocal (Tunksy on 2SM for one) but he is a media darling...Hence once they are out of the finals, it will be #kissbyebyeIvan ...

 

[Geo]

Why are you a hater if you question Maguire .. the not his team is getting old ... there will be 26 of the 30 man squad signed re signed or extended by him in 2021 that extends to 29 of 30 in 2022 should he get an extension..it’s the head coaches job to get the best from those players..thankfully he hasn’t hid behind that in fact the opposite he believes in this mob even if us as fans do not..

As for replacing him who knows really until you did.

Personally I’ve always thought Geoff Toovey was a decent coach

 

[clontarfkid]

I want to know who the Madge haters want as coach?

I don't think it is a question of replacing him, but it is reasonable to expect a degree of accountability on his part?

Haven't we longed for a coach who makes players accountable, and will not accept mediocre performances no matter what your name or status in the game is?

See my point above

He hasn't been able to do that more recently because 1, we don't have the players and 2 there's too much pressure to send out Rowdy and Benji on the field.

Pressure? from who, sponsors, the club? It is a fact of life, though, in many sports where commercial interests prevail.

Madge is not the issue, the cattle is. We are a weak club, and those who complain can see themselves out.

OK, the cattle is the problem, so how many of them have actually improved since last year?

Side note, irks me that Saint Ivan doesn't get hammered enough in the media for what he did at this club in terms of the signings he made.

Some of been vocal (Tunksy on 2SM for one) but he is a media darling...Hence once they are out of the finals, it will be #kissbyebyeIvan ...

No-one "hates" Madge....Its all about accountability...
in the past year most players have regressed,the culture has regressed,his purchases have generally disappointed,and the results have regressed despite having a better roster than recent years.
He needs time to turn it all around,but we shouldnt blindly sign him for life.
He needs to deliver in the medium term at minimum
He deserves time to address these years

 

[pawsandclaws1]

I’m a Madge fan. He’s the first coach we’ve had for sometime who can see the systemic issues the club has and is prepared to make tough calls. No more sweetheart deals for rusted on players, no more accepting inconsistency and mediocrity.

We’ve gone backwards this year? Fine. Personally I’d rather run 10th or worse for a couple of years if it means a top 4 team in a few years time. Finishing 9th repeatedly, being vaguely competitive, bring on the cusp of 8th with zero prospects of being a title contender? Had enough of that.

I don't think that is the case..even Taylor identified that Wests Tigers are soft mentally who are terrible defensively ..

We have heard the same from following coaches..so far all have failed to change it for any period of time despite the best effort and talk..

But he’s the only one I see as actually do something constructive. Plenty talked it up but then kept selecting the usual suspects. Taylor wasted all his time trying to get rid of one of the better players. Cleary went for the quick fix and blew our future cap on poor buys. None of them did a proper managed clean out.

If you look at it from the time when Sheens was here ,he had them playing fast attacking football...the old score more points than them and we win scenario...

Although we have had other coaches since try and change the style of play,Madge is the only one that has staunchly stated the change in culture first and foremost and its no wonder he is a coach who builds gameplans on defensive structures....this team and club at the moment cant handle the change implemented and thats why we see the team ""regressing ""so to speak...I put it down to adapting which takes longer than expected sometimes..

This is why you see Benji being the attacking player he is ...its what he was taught and specialised in it....thats why his defense is so poor...

The reality is Benji's attacking game is probably the best for a half in the NRL. His defence is not the strongest but could be accommodated in a better defensive team.

In a team already accommodating other defensive liabilities on the right, it is hard to hide all of them as Bellamy exposed. I'd rather move the others on and keep Benji. I loved those passes to Kepaoa.

I respect your devotion to Benji but i feel you are blind to his many faults.I totally disagree about
"Benji"s attacking game is probably the best for a half in the NRL".His attack is littered with poor options with no game management whatsoever.His defence is the worst in any position in the NRL imo.At this stage no other club in the NRL wants him including every team that is finishing behind us and no firm offers from overseas.

He was a great player and we should give him his last game for us and hope he goes out as a winner and has a decent game along with another in Chris Lawrence.I would love to belt the slugs on their own dungheap and put their season in turmoil

I respect your opinion. This is an emotive subject but I hope Benji gets a great farewell. I am going to miss him.