How bad is this side??

[GNR4LIFE]

Well Im 61 and Ive been following league since I was around 5 and my dad took me to Pratten Park to see the Magpies play and Ive been a Magpie supporter since then through thick and thin, now a Wests Tigers supporter since merge.

A few observations now on this team inc coach.

* Brooks is done, for the good of both please go and try somewhere else. Take the pressure off both club and yourself.

* our players are mentally soft- no idea how to fix it, other clubs dont have as big a problem but geez, its a biggie.

* Our defence is crap, little scramble and little effort.

* Maguire is done. This season has to be his last. We need fresh ideas but we are on the correct path with developing youth and not really paying overs except for a marque player if ever we can get one for that key player. I reckon that may be more due to Hartigan than Maguire.

* Pick one homeground and for gods sake lets try to make is our castle. Campbelltown / Leichhardt doesnt do it for the team, so history aint going to drive anything (and Lidcombe is now in Parra territory). Think either ANZ stadium or Sydney FS must be it. I think the reality is we are an inner city club, so lets get our homeground somewhere there even sharing a facility is fine unless it is overly identified with a rival eg Bankwest being Parra's turf.

* Pascoe may be on his last legs and tiring of the load.

At very elast we wont be bothering the Dally M awards for this year.

You had me applauding until you wanted to dump our suburban jewels for shared, uninviting, no atmosphere stadiums.
I guess you haven’t actually been to a game for some time?

Nope. Last went to a game at Campbelltown in late 90's before I moved out of Sydney. Since then been living in Canberra with multi year postings to Singapore , Port Moresby and Jakarta.

THat statement on a home ground reflected the players lack of effort at both Leichhardt and Campbelltown our spiritual, so called fortresses. It meant nothing to them- no fight, no honour, no effort. So, if the spiritual home grounds mean nothing to them, why should we, the poor, frustrated fans stick with that too????? eg Tommy meant something to all of us, seems like he meant nothing to the players and they didnt even try.

I can’t remember literally anyone ever referring to Leichhardt or Cambo as fortresses

 

[Snake]

Yes the team is not performing and were are not happy but the opening thread heading should be asked more of the teams being flogged by 40points ..the results are not there but WOW there are a few that make the Tigers look good.
I am still feeling after round 10 things will improve I have posted previously that reserve grade holds the key!

 

[BZN]

Its not that the players arent putting its that qe dont have the quality. Our 3 highest paid players are Mbye, Packer and Brooks. Find me another roster with that little star power and tell me how they go. Look at Souths took the star power out of them and they got dont by 50

Packer's not even playing for us. So how does quoting this help overturn our fortunes for the year?
I don't buy using this same old excuse, as this was always going to be the reality of our situation.
I think there are lesser teams than ours still making it work for themselves, I used Cowboys as a great example. I also believe the Warriors are quite similar.
Some creative spark in the team? Yes. Drinkwater and Walsh look good in this aspect.
But other than currently having RTS and Taumalolo in their teams, they don't exactly have star power. They simply appear to be digging deep as a team to overcome adversity.
They've shown some capability of high performance and resolve despite not having the strongest rosters. Even someone like Hess isn't playing like pure garbage because appropriate team changes have been made to help it function better.

So on the basis of that I feel we lack motivation and it ultimately comes down to the onfield leadership.

Another enjoyable read @Lauren
and I :100: agree.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

Sorry to say, but we need to get over the Tommy factor. It’s not that they aren’t having a go, they just aren’t good enough. There’s a difference.

 

[jrtiger]

Sorry to say, but we need to get over the Tommy factor. It’s not that they aren’t having a go, they just aren’t good enough. There’s a difference.

the thing is with this group though, is that we know that they have a decent performance in them when they get it together. we took a full strength Souths side to golden point. while we were incredibly clunky, the effort was there against St George. against Newcastle, we were down with 10 to go and we were able to find a way to win.

if we had not won a game all year and shown zero promise then you'd say that what happened on Saturday was expected, but it was not expected of us to go missing again, irrespective of the Tommy factor. when this team finds their shoulders and works together more often then not they find themselves in the contest, but for most of the year its been as if they don't want to do that. for such an 'easy fix' as Madge calls it, he's having a tough old time getting them to do it consistently.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

Sorry to say, but we need to get over the Tommy factor. It’s not that they aren’t having a go, they just aren’t good enough. There’s a difference.

the thing is with this group though, is that we know that they have a decent performance in them when they get it together. we took a full strength Souths side to golden point. while we were incredibly clunky, the effort was there against St George. against Newcastle, we were down with 10 to go and we were able to find a way to win.

if we had not won a game all year and shown zero promise then you'd say that what happened on Saturday was expected, but it was not expected of us to go missing again, irrespective of the Tommy factor. when this team finds their shoulders and works together more often then not they find themselves in the contest, but for most of the year its been as if they don't want to do that. for such an 'easy fix' as Madge calls it, he's having a tough old time getting them to do it consistently.

The Dragons was a terrible performance. We were just lucky they were worse. Any team on their day can have a red hot crack. It’s the consistency that separates the good teams from the bad. We can only muster it up once every 5 or 6 weeks. We just don’t have it in us to do it every week.

 

[jrtiger]

Sorry to say, but we need to get over the Tommy factor. It’s not that they aren’t having a go, they just aren’t good enough. There’s a difference.

the thing is with this group though, is that we know that they have a decent performance in them when they get it together. we took a full strength Souths side to golden point. while we were incredibly clunky, the effort was there against St George. against Newcastle, we were down with 10 to go and we were able to find a way to win.

if we had not won a game all year and shown zero promise then you'd say that what happened on Saturday was expected, but it was not expected of us to go missing again, irrespective of the Tommy factor. when this team finds their shoulders and works together more often then not they find themselves in the contest, but for most of the year its been as if they don't want to do that. for such an 'easy fix' as Madge calls it, he's having a tough old time getting them to do it consistently.

The Dragons was a terrible performance. We were just lucky they were worse. Any team on their day can have a red hot crack. It’s the consistency that separates the good teams from the bad. We can only muster it up once every 5 or 6 weeks. We just don’t have it in us to do it every week.

but the effort was there. we jolted the ball free on multiple occasions. yes they weren't clinical in attack, but it was a gutsy performance. this week there was no guts. that's my issue. i don't mind if they're clunky as long as they have a crack, but they have proven multiple times this year that they can match it with anyone for periods, but they fade in and out consistently.

 

[sleeve]

We are at least 3 yrs away from being a top 8 side, We have to produce or buy at least 5 quality players. That's just a simple fact!

 

[Telltails]

I think we all need to be realistic about how clubs and coaches are adapting to the new rules . Alot of talk about defence winning matches and really their are only two teams that I can identify that can be happy with their defence - Melbourne and Penrith - and that is because their attack blows every other club out of the water. Parra and Roosters are on the next tier and after that all other teams have been victims to leaking points and inconsistency.
The game between Manly and Warriors yesterday two teams fairly evenly matched was not won on defence. Can guarantee the coaches defensive structures were not successful and what won Manly the game was their ability to score when they had their chances. You have a squad that cant capitalize on their chances with the ball you won't win despite your coach and the defensive structures practised at training.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

Sorry to say, but we need to get over the Tommy factor. It’s not that they aren’t having a go, they just aren’t good enough. There’s a difference.

the thing is with this group though, is that we know that they have a decent performance in them when they get it together. we took a full strength Souths side to golden point. while we were incredibly clunky, the effort was there against St George. against Newcastle, we were down with 10 to go and we were able to find a way to win.

if we had not won a game all year and shown zero promise then you'd say that what happened on Saturday was expected, but it was not expected of us to go missing again, irrespective of the Tommy factor. when this team finds their shoulders and works together more often then not they find themselves in the contest, but for most of the year its been as if they don't want to do that. for such an 'easy fix' as Madge calls it, he's having a tough old time getting them to do it consistently.

The Dragons was a terrible performance. We were just lucky they were worse. Any team on their day can have a red hot crack. It’s the consistency that separates the good teams from the bad. We can only muster it up once every 5 or 6 weeks. We just don’t have it in us to do it every week.

but the effort was there. we jolted the ball free on multiple occasions. yes they weren't clinical in attack, but it was a gutsy performance. this week there was no guts. that's my issue. i don't mind if they're clunky as long as they have a crack, but they have proven multiple times this year that they can match it with anyone for periods, but they fade in and out consistently.

Because they aren’t good enough to do it consistently

 

[Tiger5150]

Joey Leilua’s TRY was brilliant to watch ...simply off the back fence from a scrum ...zero chance of stopping him... in the 1st half there were 2 other scrums virtually on the same blade of grass yet no one thought hey let’s try that again...

Now it doesn’t take a tactical genius or anything

I saw and thought exactly the same thing. The first try was simplistic genius. Stack the opposite side leaving only two on Joeys side. Impossible to stop. I was screaming at them to do it again. The only thing I can think is it was a double bluff and that they thought Titans would think they were going to do it again and leave a hole on the other side. The titans right centres blood pressure went up.

 

[BZN]

Well Im 61 and Ive been following league since I was around 5 and my dad took me to Pratten Park to see the Magpies play and Ive been a Magpie supporter since then through thick and thin, now a Wests Tigers supporter since merge.

A few observations now on this team inc coach.

* Brooks is done, for the good of both please go and try somewhere else. Take the pressure off both club and yourself.

* our players are mentally soft- no idea how to fix it, other clubs dont have as big a problem but geez, its a biggie.

* Our defence is crap, little scramble and little effort.

* Maguire is done. This season has to be his last. We need fresh ideas but we are on the correct path with developing youth and not really paying overs except for a marque player if ever we can get one for that key player. I reckon that may be more due to Hartigan than Maguire.

* Pick one homeground and for gods sake lets try to make is our castle. Campbelltown / Leichhardt doesnt do it for the team, so history aint going to drive anything (and Lidcombe is now in Parra territory). Think either ANZ stadium or Sydney FS must be it. I think the reality is we are an inner city club, so lets get our homeground somewhere there even sharing a facility is fine unless it is overly identified with a rival eg Bankwest being Parra's turf.

* Pascoe may be on his last legs and tiring of the load.

At very elast we wont be bothering the Dally M awards for this year.

You had me applauding until you wanted to dump our suburban jewels for shared, uninviting, no atmosphere stadiums.
I guess you haven’t actually been to a game for some time?

Nope. Last went to a game at Campbelltown in late 90's before I moved out of Sydney. Since then been living in Canberra with multi year postings to Singapore , Port Moresby and Jakarta.

THat statement on a home ground reflected the players lack of effort at both Leichhardt and Campbelltown our spiritual, so called fortresses. It meant nothing to them- no fight, no honour, no effort. So, if the spiritual home grounds mean nothing to them, why should we, the poor, frustrated fans stick with that too????? eg Tommy meant something to all of us, seems like he meant nothing to the players and they didnt even try.

I hear what you’re saying and I agree about the players attitudes, it’s the responsibility of the coaching staff to highly motivate the players for such occasions ala Roy Masters style approach!
The coach can yell, scream and pint fingers but it requires more than that in the dressing room - the guy with the porn star haircut (or someone in management) should have ensured there were motivation videos of the halcyon days of Tommy, Dorahy, Les Boyd, Dallas Donnelly cranking up to unimaginable levels in that dressing room prior to kick off ... most of these players weren’t around during those halcyon days so a chat from the coach is more akin to a bedtime story - no wonder they were sleep walking out on the field.
I’m from the Balmain side of the merger but I remember the ferocity of the Wests pack back in Tommy’s era - spine tingling stuff!!!
For the players to absorb the era of this amazing man Tommy Raudonikas it needs to be slick audio/visual cranked up to the max in the dressing room leading up to kick off.
Trust me - the major shared stadiums are a major turnoff to supporters ... I went to the 2005 Grand Final and had good seats in the members area but it was like watching a silent movie (without Charlie Chaplin) with no feel for the game, can’t hear the ref’s whistle or players.

Thanks TonyTiger.

ONe thing is clear from my point of view. I am damned pleased its not me in the hot seat trying to figure out what to do with the team. Somewhat ironically despite all Ive said, I do think we arent too far off it but I just cant figure out what 'it' is. I think one or two key changes to roster for vital positions and leadership may just bring it together. Whether that includes the coach and his staff in not being able to get the team to gel and work as a group I'm suspecting it may be but only the inner sanctum of the club really knows whats going on on that front.

I love the Wests Tigers, they will be my team forever, I cant help it, but by god they try me so. Ive almost reached a stage of thinking they will never compete for the grand final again and possibly rarely ever appear in the final 8 in my remaining lifetime, but I always will want them there in the competition. With my beloved Magpies gone and WT in their place, I just think Im a born masochist and just cant help it.

As to the home ground I just want to have one. I do think we rare a inner city background club so the ground should be somewhere there. IT needs to have Govt development $$$ to help its upgrade and be readily accessible by public transport.

I feel like I know you already, I can tell you’re a nice person. You would remember the old days when you got remunerated depending on a WIN or a LOSS!
Well those games were fought to the death when your wage depended the game result. Needless to say teamwork was at the top of every player’s priority.

Ye, reckon there is only positives if you have minimum salary contracts and the rest i made up of bonuses for wins, winning the competition, place in finals, grand final and winning the lot. That would make performance more meaningful for the players. :grinning: :grinning:

:+1: :100: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[PJ_]

Coming from a Joey critic, he has been good the last 2 weeks. Playing for a contract? Possibly. The silver lining is if the club activates his contract for 2022, he’ll be playing for a contract again. Then sign him for a further year, so he’s playing for a contract AGAIN.

Yeah man. Year by year extensions would suit him. Otherwise he just coasts

 

[BZN]

Well Im 61 and Ive been following league since I was around 5 and my dad took me to Pratten Park to see the Magpies play and Ive been a Magpie supporter since then through thick and thin, now a Wests Tigers supporter since merge.

A few observations now on this team inc coach.

* Brooks is done, for the good of both please go and try somewhere else. Take the pressure off both club and yourself.

* our players are mentally soft- no idea how to fix it, other clubs dont have as big a problem but geez, its a biggie.

* Our defence is crap, little scramble and little effort.

* Maguire is done. This season has to be his last. We need fresh ideas but we are on the correct path with developing youth and not really paying overs except for a marque player if ever we can get one for that key player. I reckon that may be more due to Hartigan than Maguire.

* Pick one homeground and for gods sake lets try to make is our castle. Campbelltown / Leichhardt doesnt do it for the team, so history aint going to drive anything (and Lidcombe is now in Parra territory). Think either ANZ stadium or Sydney FS must be it. I think the reality is we are an inner city club, so lets get our homeground somewhere there even sharing a facility is fine unless it is overly identified with a rival eg Bankwest being Parra's turf.

* Pascoe may be on his last legs and tiring of the load.

At very elast we wont be bothering the Dally M awards for this year.

You had me applauding until you wanted to dump our suburban jewels for shared, uninviting, no atmosphere stadiums.
I guess you haven’t actually been to a game for some time?

Nope. Last went to a game at Campbelltown in late 90's before I moved out of Sydney. Since then been living in Canberra with multi year postings to Singapore , Port Moresby and Jakarta.

THat statement on a home ground reflected the players lack of effort at both Leichhardt and Campbelltown our spiritual, so called fortresses. It meant nothing to them- no fight, no honour, no effort. So, if the spiritual home grounds mean nothing to them, why should we, the poor, frustrated fans stick with that too????? eg Tommy meant something to all of us, seems like he meant nothing to the players and they didnt even try.

I hear what you’re saying and I agree about the players attitudes, it’s the responsibility of the coaching staff to highly motivate the players for such occasions ala Roy Masters style approach!
The coach can yell, scream and pint fingers but it requires more than that in the dressing room - the guy with the porn star haircut (or someone in management) should have ensured there were motivation videos of the halcyon days of Tommy, Dorahy, Les Boyd, Dallas Donnelly cranking up to unimaginable levels in that dressing room prior to kick off ... most of these players weren’t around during those halcyon days so a chat from the coach is more akin to a bedtime story - no wonder they were sleep walking out on the field.
I’m from the Balmain side of the merger but I remember the ferocity of the Wests pack back in Tommy’s era - spine tingling stuff!!!
For the players to absorb the era of this amazing man Tommy Raudonikas it needs to be slick audio/visual cranked up to the max in the dressing room leading up to kick off.
Trust me - the major shared stadiums are a major turnoff to supporters ... I went to the 2005 Grand Final and had good seats in the members area but it was like watching a silent movie (without Charlie Chaplin) with no feel for the game, can’t hear the ref’s whistle or players.

Well 8000 last night compared to 29000 at ANZ and 14000 at Bankwest suggests otherwise.

You can’t compare a game on a cold night against a Queensland team with minimal travelling supporters

Well Im 61 and Ive been following league since I was around 5 and my dad took me to Pratten Park to see the Magpies play and Ive been a Magpie supporter since then through thick and thin, now a Wests Tigers supporter since merge.

A few observations now on this team inc coach.

* Brooks is done, for the good of both please go and try somewhere else. Take the pressure off both club and yourself.

* our players are mentally soft- no idea how to fix it, other clubs dont have as big a problem but geez, its a biggie.

* Our defence is crap, little scramble and little effort.

* Maguire is done. This season has to be his last. We need fresh ideas but we are on the correct path with developing youth and not really paying overs except for a marque player if ever we can get one for that key player. I reckon that may be more due to Hartigan than Maguire.

* Pick one homeground and for gods sake lets try to make is our castle. Campbelltown / Leichhardt doesnt do it for the team, so history aint going to drive anything (and Lidcombe is now in Parra territory). Think either ANZ stadium or Sydney FS must be it. I think the reality is we are an inner city club, so lets get our homeground somewhere there even sharing a facility is fine unless it is overly identified with a rival eg Bankwest being Parra's turf.

* Pascoe may be on his last legs and tiring of the load.

At very elast we wont be bothering the Dally M awards for this year.

You had me applauding until you wanted to dump our suburban jewels for shared, uninviting, no atmosphere stadiums.
I guess you haven’t actually been to a game for some time?

Nope. Last went to a game at Campbelltown in late 90's before I moved out of Sydney. Since then been living in Canberra with multi year postings to Singapore , Port Moresby and Jakarta.

THat statement on a home ground reflected the players lack of effort at both Leichhardt and Campbelltown our spiritual, so called fortresses. It meant nothing to them- no fight, no honour, no effort. So, if the spiritual home grounds mean nothing to them, why should we, the poor, frustrated fans stick with that too????? eg Tommy meant something to all of us, seems like he meant nothing to the players and they didnt even try.

I hear what you’re saying and I agree about the players attitudes, it’s the responsibility of the coaching staff to highly motivate the players for such occasions ala Roy Masters style approach!
The coach can yell, scream and pint fingers but it requires more than that in the dressing room - the guy with the porn star haircut (or someone in management) should have ensured there were motivation videos of the halcyon days of Tommy, Dorahy, Les Boyd, Dallas Donnelly cranking up to unimaginable levels in that dressing room prior to kick off ... most of these players weren’t around during those halcyon days so a chat from the coach is more akin to a bedtime story - no wonder they were sleep walking out on the field.
I’m from the Balmain side of the merger but I remember the ferocity of the Wests pack back in Tommy’s era - spine tingling stuff!!!
For the players to absorb the era of this amazing man Tommy Raudonikas it needs to be slick audio/visual cranked up to the max in the dressing room leading up to kick off.
Trust me - the major shared stadiums are a major turnoff to supporters ... I went to the 2005 Grand Final and had good seats in the members area but it was like watching a silent movie (without Charlie Chaplin) with no feel for the game, can’t hear the ref’s whistle or players.

Well 8000 last night compared to 29000 at ANZ and 14000 at Bankwest suggests otherwise.

You are comparing apples with marbles:
Last night’s game was a cold night against against an interstate team that had little support!
The 2 games you are comparing with are:
1). The Bankwest game was a warm sunny afternoon packed with Manly supporters drawn there by Turbo Tom in top form.
2). The ANZ game you refer to was again a Sydney team in Souths in top form - again packed with mad Bunnies supporters.

If you want to come to the table then don’t bring me a rubbish argument,.

I got 16 years of stats of our stadiums getting bigger crowds than the suburban ones.

Rejoice in your stats, I’ll stay at home and watch it on Fox and create my own atmosphere ... I want tribalism not binoculars

Got no problem with you preferring the small grounds. But you don't speak for all fans as your first post suggested.

The field size is the same everywhere, the NRL does have standards, the atmosphere differs, anyhow enjoy your stats whilst the NSW Govt plays favourites by committing their funds to Liberal electorates in Brookvale and Kohorah whilst snubbing Leichhardt and Campbelltown stadiums.
In hope you don’t have a glass jaw like ScoMo ?

Gee,I reckon your the one with a glass jaw. Don't be afraid of the truth, embrace it.

Don’t forget to subtract 50% off your Double Header crowd stats, otherwise that would be misleading ?

Think he's talking about Queenslanders.

I you are talking about Queenslanders then you have to take another 50% off the crowd totals if they are counting heads.

That upvote comes from an ex NSWelshman living in QLD for 38 years
If only some of our players had two heads then we may be able to think twice as quick
Or is it twice as slow

Got me beat. Ex Ashfield boy here. I've only been up here for 20 years.

[/QUOTE]

 

[Mr_Magpie]

Worst West Tigers team I have seen. When I was following the Magpies they got floggings and wooden spoons but I stayed with them from 1962 til the merger. Difference is, this lot are highly paid professionals. Should be able to perform all the skills well. Coach isn't to be blamed for them failing the basic. Hell, you see better efforts in the park! Only job is to play league. Be interesting if they still had small contracts and win/loss payments!

 

[2005magic]

This lack of mental toughness makes me wonder, mostly seriously rather than in jest, whether we should have a psych assessment for this undertaken on potential players before contract signed. Not foolproof but may prevent a few mentally weak ones getting through.

 

[izotope]

Coming from a Joey critic, he has been good the last 2 weeks. Playing for a contract? Possibly. The silver lining is if the club activates his contract for 2022, he’ll be playing for a contract again. Then sign him for a further year, so he’s playing for a contract AGAIN.

Yeah man. Year by year extensions would suit him. Otherwise he just coasts

Are you allowed to not activate an option and resign him on a lower value?

Hope so

 

[Mr_Magpie]

This lack of mental toughness makes me wonder, mostly seriously rather than in jest, whether we should have a psych assessment for this undertaken on potential players before contract signed. Not foolproof but may prevent a few mentally weak ones getting through.

Not sure about that but seriously think the team needs psych help now.
I reckon, because of results, they're down and thinking of another loss each week.
It shows in their attitude. Compare it to the top teams.

 

[cktiger]

They might be a bad side, but Doueihi is a deadset star

If we had 17 Doueihi’s (of various sizes of course) on the field we’d win the comp. The only one in the team who plays with passion and pride in the jersey.

He's a good player and I admire him but his poor defence is one of the reasons we concede points. Why hasn't he fixed it? He is not a rookie.

Why don’t you try blaming the blokes around him or the coach ?
Seems to work for Brooks.?

 

[supercoach]

Individually we have some good players but collectively they are terrible and that basically comes down to not having a top notch play maker. Put a guy like Munster in the side and we probably would have three or four more wins.

Sadly also the side at present lacks the skills and speed to adapt to the new game. I would be more up beat if I thought we were a realistic chance to recruit some top quality but it ain’t going to happen