Memo To Mitch and Luke

[Eddie]

These kids need to learn about the NRL.

They talked up a massive game in pre season about being let off the leash and playing their footy.

Talking about their contracts like they were established super stars.

Well guess what, their footy sucks, and they are starting to look like dears in the headlights.

There tackline is terrible, our 5th play options are terrible.

Honestly in a strong club they would be sent back to NSW Cup for 3 months to learn the ropes and learn respect.

In our club they are put out there as the saviour and the next best thing.

Like people have said, its all hype no substance at the minute.

 

[goldcoast_tiger]

Brooks and Moses have the skill to be that good, they are just at a club with a losing culture, surrounded by plodder forwards that get dominated through the middle by any team with size and aggression and years of coaches showing no accountability to poor performances by wielding the selection axe.

If Moses was the six at the Cowboys, he'd be carving up good and proper. If Brooks was the half at the Sharks, he'd be carving up good and proper.

We expect them to dominate, we expect too much. They are talented young players that are being toxified by a terrible club. They should both leave.

I'll second that.
At least the part about them leaving :rant

 

[goldcoast_tiger]

its about time everyone on this forum realize that its not brooks and moses fault, yes there not playing great football, but lets put the blame where it belongs our FORWARD PACK IS CRAP and even if we had JT and cronk as our 1/2s they too would stuggle. club needs to clean out are so call forwards and get some real forwards.

The forwards don't make them throw the ball over the sideline , a la Benji
Or their crap kicking game
They won't go anywhere, as no one else but us will pay big money for them
However I will agree that most of the forwards are sub standard, and it's not likely to change

 

[TrueTiger]

These kids need to learn about the NRL.

They talked up a massive game in pre season about being let off the leash and playing their footy.

Talking about their contracts like they were established super stars.

Well guess what, their footy sucks, and they are starting to look like dears in the headlights.

There tackline is terrible, our 5th play options are terrible.

Honestly in a strong club they would be sent back to NSW Cup for 3 months to learn the ropes and learn respect.

In our club they are put out there as the saviour and the next best thing.

Like people have said, its all hype no substance at the minute.

Eddie old mate,I have said many times that these two were great in their own age group,stepping up to the big arena has left them wanting.. If it was me,instead of telling my coach to let me off the leash,let me play what's in front of me and then not to produce the form I had in the lower grades…I would be embarrassed....JT was trying to teach them what they need to know to play to NRL structures and they thought they knew better,look where they are now,incompetent in the big arena and are being embarrassed week to week by guys who learnt how to play to NRL structures....anyone can blame the coaches,this problem with these overhyped statues,rests clearly on their shoulders,they were given what they wanted and can't produce the goods..... :frowning:

 

[Eddie]

These kids need to learn about the NRL.

They talked up a massive game in pre season about being let off the leash and playing their footy.

Talking about their contracts like they were established super stars.

Well guess what, their footy sucks, and they are starting to look like dears in the headlights.

There tackline is terrible, our 5th play options are terrible.

Honestly in a strong club they would be sent back to NSW Cup for 3 months to learn the ropes and learn respect.

In our club they are put out there as the saviour and the next best thing.

Like people have said, its all hype no substance at the minute.

Eddie old mate,I have said many times that these two were great in their own age group,stepping up to the big arena has left them wanting.. If it was me,instead of telling my coach to let me off the leash,let me play what's in front of me and then not to produce the form I had in the lower grades…I would be embarrassed....JT was trying to teach them what they need to know to play to NRL structures and they thought they knew better,look where they are now,incompetent in the big arena and are being embarrassed week to week by guys who learnt how to play to NRL structures....anyone can blame the coaches,this problem with these overhyped statues,rests clearly on their shoulders,they were given what they wanted and can't produce the goods..... :frowning:

Responsibility rests with both the players and the coach.

It suits your narrative to put it all on the players. I agree they have learnt a valuable lesson.

However I'm not absolving Taylor of all blame. Its the coachs job to win game, motivate players, improve players and im not seeing it in any facet.

Fact is Brooks has regressed as a footballer Since Potter had him in 2013 and 2014.

 

[TrueTiger]

These kids need to learn about the NRL.

They talked up a massive game in pre season about being let off the leash and playing their footy.

Talking about their contracts like they were established super stars.

Well guess what, their footy sucks, and they are starting to look like dears in the headlights.

There tackline is terrible, our 5th play options are terrible.

Honestly in a strong club they would be sent back to NSW Cup for 3 months to learn the ropes and learn respect.

In our club they are put out there as the saviour and the next best thing.

Like people have said, its all hype no substance at the minute.

Eddie old mate,I have said many times that these two were great in their own age group,stepping up to the big arena has left them wanting.. If it was me,instead of telling my coach to let me off the leash,let me play what's in front of me and then not to produce the form I had in the lower grades…I would be embarrassed....JT was trying to teach them what they need to know to play to NRL structures and they thought they knew better,look where they are now,incompetent in the big arena and are being embarrassed week to week by guys who learnt how to play to NRL structures....anyone can blame the coaches,this problem with these overhyped statues,rests clearly on their shoulders,they were given what they wanted and can't produce the goods..... :frowning:

Responsibility rests with both the players and the coach.

It suits your narrative to put it all on the players. I agree they have learnt a valuable lesson.

However I'm not absolving Taylor of all blame. Its the coachs job to win game, motivate players, improve players and im not seeing it in any facet.

Fact is Brooks has regressed as a footballer Since Potter had him in 2013 and 2014.

Totally agree with your point about JT,he does shoulder SOME of the blame,but not all,Brooks has only regressed because he has had to have more responsibility in this team as the main playmaker,more than when he was with Potter….he has failed to adapt to NRL standard structures,mainly because its so much tougher than in NYC...he can improve but he needs to do a heck of a lot more work than what he does,his defense is woeful and this is one area he had to improve on ....how did he look against the Raiders,arm grabbing and going for the intercept in a most inappropriate position to do so....don't get me wrong Eddie,I'm all for giving the young ones a go,however they must also put in the hard yards by listening to the coaching staff and not thinking he knows the lot because of the big money he wants or that he was a superstar in the NYC .....cheers mate.....

 

[Tiga89]

Brooks and Moses have the skill to be that good, they are just at a club with a losing culture, surrounded by plodder forwards that get dominated through the middle by any team with size and aggression and years of coaches showing no accountability to poor performances by wielding the selection axe.

If Moses was the six at the Cowboys, he'd be carving up good and proper. If Brooks was the half at the Sharks, he'd be carving up good and proper.

We expect them to dominate, we expect too much. They are talented young players that are being toxified by a terrible club. They should both leave.

Brooks and Moses are appaling defenders that is one skill they lack.

Another is inability to take the line on regularly and try and change the game and lift the team there is another skill they lack.

They have to often showed a lack of commitment and I cring everytime Moses or Brooks attempt a tackle.

And the last part lacking commitment is nothing you can train or teach they just dont have it.

Overrated overhyped overpaid. Not NRL quality

 

[MacDougall]

Brooks and Moses have the skill to be that good, they are just at a club with a losing culture, surrounded by plodder forwards that get dominated through the middle by any team with size and aggression and years of coaches showing no accountability to poor performances by wielding the selection axe.

If Moses was the six at the Cowboys, he'd be carving up good and proper. If Brooks was the half at the Sharks, he'd be carving up good and proper.

We expect them to dominate, we expect too much. They are talented young players that are being toxified by a terrible club. They should both leave.

Brooks and Moses are appaling defenders that is one skill they lack.

Another is inability to take the line on regularly and try and change the game and lift the team there is another skill they lack.

They have to often showed a lack of commitment and I cring everytime Moses or Brooks attempt a tackle.

And the last part lacking commitment is nothing you can train or teach they just dont have it.

Overrated overhyped overpaid. Not NRL quality

With respect, I disagree. Brooks and Moses technically are okay defenders. Not even close to as useless as a guy like Soward. The issue is that they are left isolated far too frequently, they are worked over with reckless abandon. Other teams packs aren't taught to back off by being belted because our pack are pussies. Sometimes our pack gets on top of another with finesse but never toughness.

Brooks and Moses both take the line on a lot, but unless there is some movement over the advantage line they are taking on set lines with little opportunity to break it.

I think Moses's commitment cannot be faulted. I agree with Brooks though. I feel like his passion for the game itself is waning. I feel like you can see in his body language he's not enjoying his footy.

I would encourage Brooks to go elsewhere for his and our benefit, but Moses is worth persevering with. We need a decent halfback to go with him that can organise a team though. Heck Drinkwater might even be good enough but we wouldn't know because nobody tries anything here.

 

[teddy23]

Brooks and Moses have the skill to be that good, they are just at a club with a losing culture, surrounded by plodder forwards that get dominated through the middle by any team with size and aggression and years of coaches showing no accountability to poor performances by wielding the selection axe.

If Moses was the six at the Cowboys, he'd be carving up good and proper. If Brooks was the half at the Sharks, he'd be carving up good and proper.

We expect them to dominate, we expect too much. They are talented young players that are being toxified by a terrible club. They should both leave.

Brooks and Moses are appaling defenders that is one skill they lack.

Another is inability to take the line on regularly and try and change the game and lift the team there is another skill they lack.

They have to often showed a lack of commitment and I cring everytime Moses or Brooks attempt a tackle.

And the last part lacking commitment is nothing you can train or teach they just dont have it.

Overrated overhyped overpaid. Not NRL quality

With respect, I disagree. Brooks and Moses technically are okay defenders. Not even close to as useless as a guy like Soward. The issue is that they are left isolated far too frequently, they are worked over with reckless abandon. Other teams packs aren't taught to back off by being belted because our pack are pussies. Sometimes our pack gets on top of another with finesse but never toughness.

Brooks and Moses both take the line on a lot, but unless there is some movement over the advantage line they are taking on set lines with little opportunity to break it.

I think Moses's commitment cannot be faulted. I agree with Brooks though. I feel like his passion for the game itself is waning. I feel like you can see in his body language he's not enjoying his footy.

I would encourage Brooks to go elsewhere for his and our benefit, but Moses is worth persevering with. We need a decent halfback to go with him that can organise a team though. Heck Drinkwater might even be good enough but we wouldn't know because nobody tries anything here.

100% agree with everything you said MacDougall it's important we keep Mitch and Luke but I'm being selfish tbh for brooks I don't want him to leave but if he does he'll end up being a better player out of it and would improve

Unless we actually sign a few decent forwards Broses's potential will just be a Myth and another what if predicament

 

[Tiga89]

Brooks and Moses have the skill to be that good, they are just at a club with a losing culture, surrounded by plodder forwards that get dominated through the middle by any team with size and aggression and years of coaches showing no accountability to poor performances by wielding the selection axe.

If Moses was the six at the Cowboys, he'd be carving up good and proper. If Brooks was the half at the Sharks, he'd be carving up good and proper.

We expect them to dominate, we expect too much. They are talented young players that are being toxified by a terrible club. They should both leave.

Brooks and Moses are appaling defenders that is one skill they lack.

Another is inability to take the line on regularly and try and change the game and lift the team there is another skill they lack.

They have to often showed a lack of commitment and I cring everytime Moses or Brooks attempt a tackle.

And the last part lacking commitment is nothing you can train or teach they just dont have it.

Overrated overhyped overpaid. Not NRL quality

With respect, I disagree. Brooks and Moses technically are okay defenders. Not even close to as useless as a guy like Soward. The issue is that they are left isolated far too frequently, they are worked over with reckless abandon. Other teams packs aren't taught to back off by being belted because our pack are pussies. Sometimes our pack gets on top of another with finesse but never toughness.

Brooks and Moses both take the line on a lot, but unless there is some movement over the advantage line they are taking on set lines with little opportunity to break it.

I think Moses's commitment cannot be faulted. I agree with Brooks though. I feel like his passion for the game itself is waning. I feel like you can see in his body language he's not enjoying his footy.

I would encourage Brooks to go elsewhere for his and our benefit, but Moses is worth persevering with. We need a decent halfback to go with him that can organise a team though. Heck Drinkwater might even be good enough but we wouldn't know because nobody tries anything here.

Problem is all our pre season training eg plays etc would of been done with these halves I am unsure if Taylor would want to tweak that as he doesnt like changes at all.

I respect your opinion however I have not seen enough evidence that Moses is NRL quality.

Being left isolated or not is irrelevant as a first grader you must be able to hold your own in defence. Moses may try more but a lot of his tackles are ineffective.

 

[Bob]

These guys would be good working under the walker brothers - something has happened and they now rely to much on set plays, they no longer count the opposition numbers and play off the cuff. Walker brothers got forwards doing it. I'm sure they could teach these guys a thing or too. I'm not even talking as head coaches, (Although they are the only non established coaches I'd go for arm) just hire them to work on forward offloads and attack!!!

 

[Tiga89]

They wont be any good until they can defend of NRL standard! They are liabilitys and with our weak small pack they only add to our defensive frailties.

 

[MacDougall]

They're never going to be Mitch Pearce level tacklers. Thurston level is about their peak and they aren't far off. The thing is Thurston has help.

 

[cqtiger]

They may regret holding off until June. Their price is dropping by the week.

 

[supercoach]

its about time everyone on this forum realize that its not brooks and moses fault, yes there not playing great football, but lets put the blame where it belongs our FORWARD PACK IS CRAP and even if we had JT and cronk as our 1/2s they too would stuggle. club needs to clean out are so call forwards and get some real forwards.

Yes the forward pack is way below NRL standard, but our six and seven have been average and can not escape criticism because they are playing behind a average pack. Brooks defence and decision making has been very poor all year. Moses has played with plenty of enthusiasm and shown lots of skill but his game is still erratic.

If they want the big bucks,than they have to be able to perform week in and week out. If they are a work in progress than they should be paid accordingly. With big bucks comes accountability…...but we are talking WT where accountability is not in their vocabulary

 

[goldcoast_tiger]

That sort of ends the whole point being made within that post.

I think Brooks really put in against Canberra. He was running fast and hard and he gave it a shot. He needs a lot of work to become a polished NRL player but I think on the right money he deserves much more of a go.

I'd offer him $150k and a PS-4
Take it or see ya !

That is a bit harsh, He has had an ordinary year. I'm starting to see something there with him though but he needs a lot of work.

Our spine really needs a lot of work. Tedesco is a weapon but he needs to be utilised better and he needs some support.

Firstly …
Brooks and Moses both need to learn to tackle , especially goal line defence . No other players can help you out on your goal line , it's up to them .
i honestly can't fathom that the club has these two rookies pencilled in for 600k !
Just ridiculous .

Aaarrrrhhhh , we do things differently in the West
Where elsewhere , the coach would blow the bejesus out of the halves for imitating a Revolving door, and for not having a clue where their kicks were going.just to name a few problems.
Here , our meditation expert , would take the Coach and the halves out to a beautiful Tofu and Mung Bean dinner, and, to the lilting sound of Tibetan chimes, calmly tell both the coach and players that once their Ying and their Yang are perfectly aligned, all will be well,
Tries will flow, opposition players will fall to the ground before them in fear and trepidation.
More importantly those people here on the Forum that have so unfairly said that they need to get acquainted with a halves coach, ( and a tackling bag)!!!!! will have their cabbage patch ravaged by a herd of Himalayan Mules.
Despite this, The coach was trying to constantly say that he was a half once and could possibly help the players. The result of this was that the meditation expert couldn't stop laughing, but eventually was able to regain control.
More would have been achieved if the expert hadn't had an appointment in Townsville to get to, something about a Coach up there who needed help with the hassles of moving South to a Coaching job that looked likely be occurring verySoon

 

[hobbo]

I'd offer him $150k and a PS-4
Take it or see ya !

That is a bit harsh, He has had an ordinary year. I'm starting to see something there with him though but he needs a lot of work.

Our spine really needs a lot of work. Tedesco is a weapon but he needs to be utilised better and he needs some support.

Firstly …
Brooks and Moses both need to learn to tackle , especially goal line defence . No other players can help you out on your goal line , it's up to them .
i honestly can't fathom that the club has these two rookies pencilled in for 600k !
Just ridiculous .

Aaarrrrhhhh , we do things differently in the West
Where elsewhere , the coach would blow the bejesus out of the halves for imitating a Revolving door, and for not having a clue where their kicks were going.just to name a few problems.
Here , our meditation expert , would take the Coach and the halves out to a beautiful Tofu and Mung Bean dinner, and, to the lilting sound of Tibetan chimes, calmly tell both the coach and players that once their Ying and their Yang are perfectly aligned, all will be well,
Tries will flow, opposition players will fall to the ground before them in fear and trepidation.
More importantly those people here on the Forum that have so unfairly said that they need to get acquainted with a halves coach, ( and a tackling bag)!!!!! will have their cabbage patch ravaged by a herd of Himalayan Mules.
Despite this, The coach was trying to constantly say that he was a half once and could possibly help the players. The result of this was that the meditation expert couldn't stop laughing, but eventually was able to regain control.
More would have been achieved if the expert hadn't had an appointment in Townsville to get to, something about a Coach up there who needed help with the hassles of moving South to a Coaching job that looked likely be occurring verySoon

R U OK Mate ? :laughing:

 

[goldcoast_tiger]

That is a bit harsh, He has had an ordinary year. I'm starting to see something there with him though but he needs a lot of work.

Our spine really needs a lot of work. Tedesco is a weapon but he needs to be utilised better and he needs some support.

Firstly …
Brooks and Moses both need to learn to tackle , especially goal line defence . No other players can help you out on your goal line , it's up to them .
i honestly can't fathom that the club has these two rookies pencilled in for 600k !
Just ridiculous .

Aaarrrrhhhh , we do things differently in the West
Where elsewhere , the coach would blow the bejesus out of the halves for imitating a Revolving door, and for not having a clue where their kicks were going.just to name a few problems.
Here , our meditation expert , would take the Coach and the halves out to a beautiful Tofu and Mung Bean dinner, and, to the lilting sound of Tibetan chimes, calmly tell both the coach and players that once their Ying and their Yang are perfectly aligned, all will be well,
Tries will flow, opposition players will fall to the ground before them in fear and trepidation.
More importantly those people here on the Forum that have so unfairly said that they need to get acquainted with a halves coach, ( and a tackling bag)!!!!! will have their cabbage patch ravaged by a herd of Himalayan Mules.
Despite this, The coach was trying to constantly say that he was a half once and could possibly help the players. The result of this was that the meditation expert couldn't stop laughing, but eventually was able to regain control.
More would have been achieved if the expert hadn't had an appointment in Townsville to get to, something about a Coach up there who needed help with the hassles of moving South to a Coaching job that looked likely be occurring verySoon

R U OK Mate ? :laughing:

No, Dammit!!! It's finally got to me , after approx 55 yrs years of supporting Wests , and Wests Tigers, I've finally cracked up.
I think I'm going to get some of that Tofu and Mung Beans, :brick:

 

[sideline_eye]

Brooks and Moses have the skill to be that good, they are just at a club with a losing culture, surrounded by plodder forwards that get dominated through the middle by any team with size and aggression and years of coaches showing no accountability to poor performances by wielding the selection axe.

If Moses was the six at the Cowboys, he'd be carving up good and proper. If Brooks was the half at the Sharks, he'd be carving up good and proper.

We expect them to dominate, we expect too much. They are talented young players that are being toxified by a terrible club. They should both leave.

Brooks and Moses are appaling defenders that is one skill they lack.

Another is inability to take the line on regularly and try and change the game and lift the team there is another skill they lack.

They have to often showed a lack of commitment and I cring everytime Moses or Brooks attempt a tackle.

And the last part lacking commitment is nothing you can train or teach they just dont have it.

Overrated overhyped overpaid. Not NRL quality

With respect, I disagree. Brooks and Moses technically are okay defenders. Not even close to as useless as a guy like Soward. The issue is that they are left isolated far too frequently, they are worked over with reckless abandon. Other teams packs aren't taught to back off by being belted because our pack are pussies. Sometimes our pack gets on top of another with finesse but never toughness.

Brooks and Moses both take the line on a lot, but unless there is some movement over the advantage line they are taking on set lines with little opportunity to break it.

I think Moses's commitment cannot be faulted. I agree with Brooks though. I feel like his passion for the game itself is waning. I feel like you can see in his body language he's not enjoying his footy.

I would encourage Brooks to go elsewhere for his and our benefit, but Moses is worth persevering with. We need a decent halfback to go with him that can organise a team though. Heck Drinkwater might even be good enough but we wouldn't know because nobody tries anything here.

Look, I agree that the halves may be worth persevering with but something is wrong when Moses only made 7 metres in attack on Saturday, whereas Brooks made 81 metres. These blokes are still quite small and may have some excuse for their defence, as appalling as it was but when Boyd scored between the posts he ran to Siro's right but Siro didn't even look at him, in fact he stared studiously to his left. I don't believe that the halves' defence cost us the game, it was the forwards lack of defence. The missed tackles stat by the forwards doesn't show the complete picture because many times the tackle wasn't even attempted. I do agree that that both Brooks and Moses need to defend better because any attack worth its salt will try to trample the smallest players on the goal line. Where is our defensive coach?

 

[tiga4eva]

I mentioned after the Storm game that Brooks is so hit/miss with the intercepts. Got us a try but then let Cronk in straight after,when he went for another one. Raiders first try where he shot up and left a hole was garbage. It's a weak option , demonstrating his lack of desire to make a tackle.
3 times he was tackled on the 5th, meaning he's out of the play on the last,ridiculous for a halfback.
Its just astounding that after 50 odd NRL games, his career has gone backwards. I so want this kid to turn it around, but I don't know if he has the ability.