Politics Super Thread - keep it all in here

[Yossarian]

Craig Thomson, will be protected under parliamentry privelidge, and by the ranga. Questions over her dealings when a union lawyer, and the purchase of a house and the loans for such, have never been thouroughly scrutinised.

Hasn't there been Victorian, NSW, and federal police investigations? And Fair Work Australia?

Thompson may be telling the truth, your dealing with Union Bosses, where this type of behaviour is more the norm than you would think. In fighting in Unions and the LP are legendary.

Don't think for one moment that the LNP is any different. They have slush funds at their command to ruin people, as Abbott did to Pauline Hanson in having her sent to gaol on a false premise. Most of what they do though is undercover and rarely does the fit hit the shan.

As much as I dislike Abbott I fail to see what he had to do with Hanson being gaoled. As I understand it, it was a QLD police investigation into electoral offences under Qld law. I think it was over vigorous, don't know about false premise. The allegations were reasonably well founded, the appeal judges decided the evidence wasn't strong enough.

All politicians may enter politics with the best intentions, but rarely do they come away not needing a gallon of disinfectant and soap to clean of the stains of party politics.

If I was an Ombudsmen, I'd be taking a very serious look at why Bob Browne took the long walk, more to this than meets the eye.

The Commonwealth Ombudsman? What's he got to do with this? If you've got evidence of something anyone can make a complaint to the CO. I don't think it's area though. Really I think Bob Brown was just sick of the whole thing. He's been there a long time.

 

[Yossarian]

I wonder how the Craig Thomson saga will play out ? He told Laurie Oakes on Ch 9 it was all a big set up to ruin his career. I think he speaks before the parliament in a week or so's time … Wonder if the Independants will pull up stumps ?

Seems like he's already established his defence. Can't see much changing - the indies have pretty much said they'll let the police actions play out. He hasn't even been charged yet unlike Mary Jo Fisher…

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

I wonder how the Craig Thomson saga will play out ? He told Laurie Oakes on Ch 9 it was all a big set up to ruin his career. I think he speaks before the parliament in a week or so's time … Wonder if the Independants will pull up stumps ?

Seems like he's already established his defence. Can't see much changing - the indies have pretty much said they'll let the police actions play out. He hasn't even been charged yet unlike Mary Jo Fisher…

There's a lot riding for this on the Indies. I don't like either Windsor or Oakeshott, but I have to admire them for taking on the unpopular stance of letting the police investigate Thomson before they let it affect their parliamentary duty. They've essentially voted themselves out at next election by doing this.

I reckon something stinks with Thomson too (and I'm going to get pummelled by the pro-Coalition people in here,) but while I understand they're in the public eye and serve the electorate, they're entitled to go about their business until they're either convicted or acquitted of a criminal deed.

 

[Yossarian]

I wonder how the Craig Thomson saga will play out ? He told Laurie Oakes on Ch 9 it was all a big set up to ruin his career. I think he speaks before the parliament in a week or so's time … Wonder if the Independants will pull up stumps ?

Seems like he's already established his defence. Can't see much changing - the indies have pretty much said they'll let the police actions play out. He hasn't even been charged yet unlike Mary Jo Fisher…

There's a lot riding for this on the Indies. I don't like either Windsor or Oakeshott, but I have to admire them for taking on the unpopular stance of letting the police investigate Thomson before they let it affect their parliamentary duty. They've essentially voted themselves out at next election by doing this.

I think that bird flew some time ago. Oakeshott is a million-to-one, Windsor not much better to get re-elected.

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

I wonder how the Craig Thomson saga will play out ? He told Laurie Oakes on Ch 9 it was all a big set up to ruin his career. I think he speaks before the parliament in a week or so's time … Wonder if the Independants will pull up stumps ?

Seems like he's already established his defence. Can't see much changing - the indies have pretty much said they'll let the police actions play out. He hasn't even been charged yet unlike Mary Jo Fisher…

There's a lot riding for this on the Indies. I don't like either Windsor or Oakeshott, but I have to admire them for taking on the unpopular stance of letting the police investigate Thomson before they let it affect their parliamentary duty. They've essentially voted themselves out at next election by doing this.

I think that bird flew some time ago. Oakeshott is a million-to-one, Windsor not much better to get re-elected.

Clearly Yoss, but they could have knifed the ALP and done the "honourable" thing to save a little face with their electorates, and they didn't. That's commendable IMO.

 

[Yossarian]

They may as well die with dignity I guess. But you're right, they've taken some tough stands on principles they believe in when it would have been easier to avoid taking those decisions.

 

[happy_tiger]

Wow. Some Laborites on here this morning!

Yoss - Anyone can get employment down my throwing a tonne of money into the system. Yes, the budget is in surplus, but that's only a first step, it would currently it would take 100 years to pay back the debt that has been incurred and when we do have to do it through higher taxes, it will impact employment.

Gary - the fact Labor has wasted money is not retoric. Dodgy insulators & fixes, over paid school halls, a inneficient NBN structure with no proper scrutiny (which is off balance sheet - hense why swan can pull a surplus), Multiple Cash handouts to dead people, prisoners and overseas partial pension recipients. Do I need to list more? Can you provide that many examples over Howards term (which currently is double of Labors)?

Yes, the tax to GDP was higher and they kept working to lower it by reducing our interest burden from the billions in debt…. plus the ComSuper off balance sheet debt labor had left!! That allowed them to reduce the taxes to the levels Labor inherited. Look at trends, not averages.

Don't worry Hammer They will be close to the only 3 that vote for Labour at election time

Hope the 3 aren't all in the same electorate :laughing:

Haha, let's hope happy.

It's amazing to see that even after all the scandals, lies, backroom deals, bad policy and wasted billions that some people here can still be bought out with a cash handout.
..that should really fire them up :laughing:

I just hope they can make their votes count Maybe a little bit of Gerrymander and who knows

 

[Balmain_Bobby]

Yossarian wrote:

As much as I dislike Abbott I fail to see what he had to do with Hanson being gaoled. As I understand it, it was a QLD police investigation into electoral offences under Qld law. I think it was over vigorous, don't know about false premise. The allegations were reasonably well founded, the appeal judges decided the evidence wasn't strong enough.

Seriously, do you ever read. He is proud of his achievement, and it's common knowledge amongst those who follow politics, not just the moronic left.

The Chief Undertaker of Hanson’s political career was one Abbott, A.J.T. (Liberal, Warringah). The manner in which he went about her political assassination had all the hallmarks of a Da Vinci Code plot, without the ethics or restraint. SkepticLawyer made this comment on another thread, which I reproduce below for the fold for consideration.
\
\
To my mind, Abbott cooked his goose with ‘Australians for Honest Politics’. That is, a slush fund designed to ensure that a particular political enemy was wiped off the map (the gaol time for Hanson was just an added bonus). That tops RU 486 and his latest bout of foot-in-mouth-itis.
>
A bit of law for y’all: what Abbott was doing is known at common law as ‘champerty’ or ‘barratry’, that is, funding a suit without having the balls to put one’s own name on the statement of claim. There is a reason why Australians for Honest Politics was set up in NSW: that state had abolished champerty. At the time, none of the other states had.
>
Those of you who are Christians, you’ll probably be aware which circle of Hell Dante sticks barrators in. It’s pretty low down, in there with people who sell church offices (’simony’). Even when not actively illegal, it is extraordinarily poor form, indicative of quite gross moral turpitude.

In other words the LNP slush funds started the destruction of Pauline Hanson, which led to her unlawful arrest, on bogus charges. She was cleared and paid compensation. Don't ever let anyone tell you that politicians in government can't and don't influence Police and the DPP. I wouldn't wipe my arse with a politician, but I'd sure like to wipe the floor with a few of them.

 

[happy_tiger]

Craig Thomson about to make a statement to the House of Reps at about 12.00 Live on ABC 24

Could be interesting

 

[Yossarian]

Yossarian wrote:

As much as I dislike Abbott I fail to see what he had to do with Hanson being gaoled. As I understand it, it was a QLD police investigation into electoral offences under Qld law. I think it was over vigorous, don't know about false premise. The allegations were reasonably well founded, the appeal judges decided the evidence wasn't strong enough.

Seriously, do you ever read. He is proud of his achievement, and it's common knowledge amongst those who follow politics, not just the moronic left.

The Chief Undertaker of Hanson’s political career was one Abbott, A.J.T. (Liberal, Warringah). The manner in which he went about her political assassination had all the hallmarks of a Da Vinci Code plot, without the ethics or restraint. SkepticLawyer made this comment on another thread, which I reproduce below for the fold for consideration.
\
\
To my mind, Abbott cooked his goose with ‘Australians for Honest Politics’. That is, a slush fund designed to ensure that a particular political enemy was wiped off the map (the gaol time for Hanson was just an added bonus). That tops RU 486 and his latest bout of foot-in-mouth-itis.
>
A bit of law for y’all: what Abbott was doing is known at common law as ‘champerty’ or ‘barratry’, that is, funding a suit without having the balls to put one’s own name on the statement of claim. There is a reason why Australians for Honest Politics was set up in NSW: that state had abolished champerty. At the time, none of the other states had.
>
Those of you who are Christians, you’ll probably be aware which circle of Hell Dante sticks barrators in. It’s pretty low down, in there with people who sell church offices (’simony’). Even when not actively illegal, it is extraordinarily poor form, indicative of quite gross moral turpitude.

In other words the LNP slush funds started the destruction of Pauline Hanson, which led to her unlawful arrest, on bogus charges. She was cleared and paid compensation. Don't ever let anyone tell you that politicians in government can't and don't influence Police and the DPP. I wouldn't wipe my arse with a politician, but I'd sure like to wipe the floor with a few of them.

I spent a fair bit of time working in law enforcement and your comments are pretty insulting to the DPP (Commonwealth and State) and police. Besides it is garbage but of course you'd know better…

The Hanson case is very detailed and really (based on my readings) comes down to how technicalities are perceived. Primarily the questions is whether people signing up were becoming members of a party or a support group since it appeared that the ONP only had 3 members. Part of the problems seems to have been the lousy defence at the original trial but different judges interpret evidence differently.

Did she receive compensation? The SMH/AAP would beg to differ:
http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/hanson-compo-rejected/2005/10/26/1130291435860.html

Yeah I do read, just not a lot of the nutjob sources you do. Not that you ever source your quotes... For others the above material in BB's post is from a site called larvatusprodeo.net - the material was posted by someone commenting on an article on that site. We have no real way of judging the accuracy of what is being said or even who is saying it.

What I do know if the CMC in Queensland said "Clearly, Mr Abbott’s conduct could not amount to misconduct within the meaning of the Crime and Misconduct Act 2001."

The full comments are in the CMC document titled: THE PROSECUTION OF PAULINE HANSON AND DAVID ETTRIDGE on page 15.

 

[Yossarian]

Craig Thomson about to make a statement to the House of Reps at about 12.00 Live on ABC 24

Could be interesting

45 minutes in and still going… To summarise thus far:

Blames Kathy Jackson for most things - points out KJ's partner is high up at the FWA which, in his view, casts some doubt on its independence.
Talks up his record as an MP
FWA full of inaccuracies...
Not true he withdrew money on HSU cards
Blames a guy called Marco Bolano for trying to set him up re hookers
Declares that 3 of the 7 times he was suppose to be with a pro he had an alibi
Says not true his license was used at brothel - just the number
Wants cops to get CCTV footage from brothel which will prove he wasn't there
Can't explain misuse of phone - makes vague inferences about ID theft not being investigated
One call made from Bateau Bay when he didn't live there

 

[system]

Guilty or not Thomson comes out of this looking like an utter loon

 

[Yossarian]

Guilty or not Thomson comes out of this looking like an utter loon

Yeah. When you look at his explanation it's a mixture of "Mm that sort of makes sense" and "Oh come on!"

Not quite sure I buy the phone cloning thing… Possible but... yeah...

Probably enough smoke to get him to the next election and unless someone charges him with something I'm not sure anything will happen to him.

 

[happy_tiger]

Yoss , the information that links Kathy Jackson and her EX partner colluding to set Thomson up

I'm not divorced , but my parents are . I couldn't imagine the two of them agreeing that the colour of the sky is blue let alone working together to take someone else down to the advantage of one or the other

 

[Yossarian]

Yoss , the information that links Kathy Jackson and her EX partner colluding to set Thomson up

I'm not divorced , but my parents are . I couldn't imagine the two of them agreeing that the colour of the sky is blue let alone working together to take someone else down to the advantage of one or the other

Happy these aren't my comments I was just relaying the twitter feeds. Hard to say though, some exes get along, some don't - the fact they are ex partners is really neither here nor there. Whether the whole thing is true is of course a completely different matter. Doubt it but it's another layer of smoke and intrigue…

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Guilty or not Thomson comes out of this looking like an utter loon

Yeah. When you look at his explanation it's a mixture of "Mm that sort of makes sense" and "Oh come on!"

Not quite sure I buy the phone cloning thing… Possible but... yeah...

Probably enough smoke to get him to the next election and unless someone charges him with something I'm not sure anything will happen to him.

They won't do anything. He's as good as gone next election, the ALP have wiped their hands clean of him as best they can and if by some small miracle he's done nothing what has been alleged I hazard a guess that he'll probably go after all an sundry who have tarnished his name.

The one thing I would believe out of the lot is that his family probably would have received a large amount of abuse, and if they have that's nothing short of disgraceful.

 

[happy_tiger]

Yoss , the information that links Kathy Jackson and her EX partner colluding to set Thomson up

I'm not divorced , but my parents are . I couldn't imagine the two of them agreeing that the colour of the sky is blue let alone working together to take someone else down to the advantage of one or the other

Happy these aren't my comments I was just relaying the twitter feeds. Hard to say though, some exes get along, some don't - the fact they are ex partners is really neither here nor there. Whether the whole thing is true is of course a completely different matter. Doubt it but it's another layer of smoke and intrigue…

He didn't really cover the 270 k he alledgedly used to help his re election,but your right he says , she says in my opinion We probably will never learn the truth .

But at least now Unions will now be more heavily managed and be more accountable for their actions

But then again Unions are Unions and they answer to no one , and Labour can't understand why they will get belted at the next election

 

[happy_tiger]

The other point I forgot to add was that why did he not come out in a press conference and say all these things

Why , if what you are telling us is the truth , do you use the sanctity of the parliament where you can hide behind your parliamentary priviledges and basically name and shame anyone

 

[Yossarian]

The other point I forgot to add was that why did he not come out in a press conference and say all these things

Why , if what you are telling us is the truth , do you use the sanctity of the parliament where you can hide behind your parliamentary priviledges and basically name and shame anyone

Because he knows he can't prove most of it even if it was true. In any case given this in response to parliamentary procedures aimed at removing him, it is not as dubious as some other examples of parliamentary priviledge being used.

 

[Yossarian]

Yoss , the information that links Kathy Jackson and her EX partner colluding to set Thomson up

I'm not divorced , but my parents are . I couldn't imagine the two of them agreeing that the colour of the sky is blue let alone working together to take someone else down to the advantage of one or the other

Happy these aren't my comments I was just relaying the twitter feeds. Hard to say though, some exes get along, some don't - the fact they are ex partners is really neither here nor there. Whether the whole thing is true is of course a completely different matter. Doubt it but it's another layer of smoke and intrigue…

He didn't really cover the 270 k he alledgedly used to help his re election,but your right he says , she says in my opinion We probably will never learn the truth .

But at least now Unions will now be more heavily managed and be more accountable for their actions

But then again Unions are Unions and they answer to no one , and Labour can't understand why they will get belted at the next election

Unions are just as answerable as any big business. I do hope that great regulation goes into their activities though. Some unions are good, some are bad. The HSU seems to have forgotten why it existed in the first place. Well the executive anyway - it's hard not to feel sorry for the organisers out on the frontline who have worked their butts off and now see their members fleeing in droves.

As for the 270k, I'm assuming this covers everything from wages, to use of equipment etc. Who knows. Personally I suspect it is true in theory - unions assist ALP candidates all the time. It's when it moves from petty stuff like use of office space, stationary etc to actual money changes hands that it gets out of hand.