Proper blooding...

C

crouching_tiger

New member
Thought i would repost this in a new thread as it was beginning to hijack another one..

Well as i mentioned this time last year, this is where Sheens could to be a little bit less reckless as in previous seasons. By slowly blooding less experienced players sparingly when appropriate, and against certain opposition where he may be able to weaken the bench slightly or utilising a certain players' attributes to his advantage EARLY in the season. This in turn will prepare these youngsters for further depth if/when required if injuries strike further into the season. If Sheens fails to do so once again, we could all be re-living our woes for the 5th consecutive season.
Players such as Schirnack, Stolk, Woods, Gower, Fifita, and Davidson are all already waiting in the ranks and IMO have what it takes to step up if the situation arises.
This should have happened last year whilst Skando was still playing and able to teach and help develop these guys onfield and in the sheds. But now, there is no real "hard-head veteran prop" to teach these guys of good old-fashioned hard running. Cayless is new to the team and may be able to provide some assistance, but that will depend on how well he can take charge and authority in new surroundings.
Gibbs and Galloway are still IMO not quite veterans in my eyes, and are still developing to their highest potential.
If you look back on history, most teams require one of these old-school hard nuts to lead a team to grand final glory. Players such as a Steve Price, Shane Webke, Ruben Wiki who don't go missing, roll their sleeves up and do the dirty work, chew up valuable yardage when required and under the pump. This is a key to any winning formula of a rugby league team and has been for decades.
Can Cayless provide this for WT in 2010?? Well, we can all sit back and hope..
 
I'd say Sheens' love of the old brigade in Heighno, Payten and Fulton will see that u wont get your wish.

In reality, i think your theory has merit, but i'd be more inclined to do it with the backrow. The likes of Gower, Mataka, Akeripa and Dwyer are the future and need game time or they'll move on and we'll be stuck with just the solid first graders we've had in those spots. Front rowers mature a little later and i believe Fafita and Woods have plenty of time. All those backrow youngsters have more ability than some of the older guys, they first need to get the opportunity, than they need to show that not only do they have the talent but the right frame of mind for NRL. Its up to them when they get the chance.

In my eyes, the only certainty in the backrow should be Ellis. The rest to be chosen purely on form.
 
I don't believe the club has a major issue with depth for the backrow. There could be several combinations used. The likes of the youngsters in the backrow IMO will struggle to push the likes of seasoned 1st graders Heighington, Ellis, Payten out of the top 17 at this stage. So bench spots are up for grabs for the ones who want to prove themselves in the top grade.
The concern is the front row. Has been. And still could be. There are STILL question marks here even AFTER this round of recruitment. But as stated, there is plenty of promise for at least one of these 3-4 players(Stolk, Woods, Fifita, Davidson) to push through the ranks NOW and become a longer term investment on keeping their own juniors in the system of progression.
You talk about backrowers moving onto other clubs, well regardless, the same could well happen with the younger front rowers as you say, front rowers mature later on, so this would mean the likes of Galloway and Gibbs may be around for plenty of years to come, where the older players such as Heighington, Ellis, Payten will likely move on sooner than later.
Cayless i would classify as a veteran, but nobody can be sure if he still has what it takes at NRL level or if the club has him as a plug to fill a void for the short term.
Recent history has shown, WT have never really had depth issues with backrowers, as it is MORE versatile to fill in.
By shifting larger centres into the backrow is usually a managable task, and 9 times out of 10, you will not see a disappointing result.
But if You have no front rowers in the kitty, then the only thing a coach can do is push a backrower up front. That experiment has failed miserably, over and over again most noteably Harrison and Galea.
Personally, i think Sheens is going to try and do this again with Jr. Moops.
 
Junior Moors is 110kg though, significantly bigger than Galea and Harrison and better built to handle the front row IMO. I see what you are saying though. The Tigers have plenty of stocks in the backrow but should we lose two starting front rowers at anytime in the season, and it has happened before, then Sheens will either have to throw a backrower in up front, or promote a young bopper such as Fifita.
 
i think Junior Moors is very much a frame like Fui Fui and Jeff Lima - this places him perfectly for the Front Row. Additionally he has good footwork, can punch the line and has an offload. I think he will fit the mould perfectly.

Also, i say it again TUPOU was bought to the club to fit into the front row. He should be counted as one of our props as that is what he has been recruited as. Those who have him down for a wing spot are off the mark. When i called past Concord before Christmas he was training with the forwards, not the backs. I think Tupou would be a great 'off-the-bench' prop option.
 
I think with only a year under his belt in the NRL, Ellis can be the cool hard head the OP is talking about, he's been around for years, has played every level eligible to him, seems to command respect from all quarters…would be a natural progression. It dont have to be a prop...ala Hindy at Parra & Fitzy at Easts
 
@towntiger said:
i think Junior Moors is very much a frame like Fui Fui and Jeff Lima - this places him perfectly for the Front Row. Additionally he has good footwork, can punch the line and has an offload. I think he will fit the mould perfectly.

Also, i say it again TUPOU was bought to the club to fit into the front row. He should be counted as one of our props as that is what he has been recruited as. Those who have him down for a wing spot are off the mark. When i called past Concord before Christmas he was training with the forwards, not the backs. I think Tupou would be a great 'off-the-bench' prop option.
Click to expand...

Moors is taller than both of them. He stands at 6ft 4". Tupou is around 6ft 3" but 7kg heavier than Moors according to the WT site. Both boys are big units who would not look out of place in the front row though.
 
Hey CT???

Whats with all the serious posts????

I keep waiting for the punch line but you arent delivering???

Whats going on?????Is this a new CT for 2010????
 
@simonthetiger said:
Lol….he might be hiding here,but you cant miss him at the game......I go to all the games and he is always there,and doesnt the camera love him,it used to be kingy,but is CT now the number one most recognisable tiger fan????
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Do you think Ellis could be the cool hard nut we might be lacking?
 
I think our front row stocks are actually better than 2005.

Fifita is going to be a star, Tupou I'm sure will be a hit, Moors always looked good at the Panthers, Cayless is class, Galloway is pushing rep honors, Payten is under-rated, Gibbs was doing some good stuff in 09.

I don't think there is a weakness there at all.

I haven't been as excited about a coming season as this one!
 
@Buckets of blood said:
@simonthetiger said:
Lol….he might be hiding here,but you cant miss him at the game......I go to all the games and he is always there,and doesnt the camera love him,it used to be kingy,but is CT now the number one most recognisable tiger fan????

Do you think Ellis could be the cool hard nut we might be lacking?
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

I don't think C_t is a big fan of Ellis…...Anyhow what happened to if your good enough your old enough.......

Dwyer, Mataka, A. Schirnack, Gower, Lui all tasted first grade last year....and will be better for it...

I can't wait for 2010 and I 😛ray: C_t v Sheens returns before round 1.......
 
Sheens seems the most methodical coach in the NRL in regard to bringing players through at a certain pace, in particular the forwards. He has always had this trait as a coach but the further along in his career he gets the more calculating he becomes.

Sometimes it seems players progress is slowed to the extent it is detrimental to the NRL squads success but his concern for player welfare in the way he brings players along is highly commendable and long term will be of great benefit to the Wests Tigers
 
A lot will come down to the refs and how quick they allow the play the ball. If we get a quick game like in 2009 we will be well placed up front, if they slow it down a little we will struggle. You never never know every year they seem to do something different. Big rugged brutes excel in the slow arm wrestle style of game and the quicker,smaller mobile frontrowers excel in the quicker form of the game. Although I would kill to have Souths frontrow in any form of the game
 
@supercoach said:
A lot will come down to the refs and how quick they allow the play the ball. If we get a quick game like in 2009 we will be well placed up front, if they slow it down a little we will struggle. You never never know every year they seem to do something different. Big rugged brutes excel in the slow arm wrestle style of game and the quicker,smaller mobile frontrowers excel in the quicker form of the game. Although I would kill to have Souths frontrow in any form of the game
Click to expand...

Our Pack isnt the small pack it once was.

Recruits such as Cayless, Tupuo plus the next crop of youngsters have some size…
 
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