Recruitment

[cochise]

Our valuations are not realistic. It’s all very noble saying we won’t pay overs but any player is worth what a given club is willing to pay him.

You've only just glanced off the depth of this possibility.

Firstly, no, any player is not worth what a given club is willing to pay him. Ben Hunt is not worth a reported million bucks, neither is Milford.

But to the valuations - it may be possible that our valuations are realistic, but we are simply in a dangerous market against more desperate or reckless clubs.

It's like the Sydney housing market - I don't think anyone thinks house prices in Sydney are good value, but go to any auction and there are a hundred idiots throwing money at property.

Now maybe you just need to join the idiots and throw cash at the problem, or maybe you stick to your budget and play the long game. I would argue that Tigers have already had significant experience throwing cash at roster issues, and it has worked out badly. They are choosing a different approach under the restrictions of a salary cap.

Because if we are talking high-profile targets, it distills to a pretty clear scenario - we have only lost out to Bulldogs and Souths recently? If Tigers were interested in Latrell, JAC, Jai Arrow and TPJ, they either went to Wayne Bennett, or huge cash offers from the Bulldogs.

I personally don't think it's wise to try and compete with Bulldogs, because they truly appear to be bringing out the chequebook for any notable player on the market, and applying very blunt strokes to address their own problems. Have Bulldogs signed a decent half to pair with Burton? No. Have they signed a decent hooker? No. Have they ironed out their preferred fullback? No. Have they got any decent juniors? I haven't really seen them, maybe this Biondi fellow, and Averillo is worth persisting with.

Have any of the Bulldogs 2019-2021 signings come good? No not really; actually it's been a bit of a horror show - Meaney, Allan, Napa, Flanagan, Britt, Stimson, Jesse Sue, Christian Crichton, Jack Cogger, DWZ, Foran, Hetherington, Tim Lafai, Cotric, Corey Waddell, Sione Katoa. All average to terrible signings. Pass mark maybe for Luke Thompson.

Actually any player is worth what a given club is willing to pay him. West Tigers might think tpj is worth 600k per year but he is actually worth 2.2 over three years that is what the dogs have paid for him

So Mbye is worth $850k

that is what we paid for him

So in your opinion that is what he is worth?

 

[Jedi_Tiger]

Our valuations are not realistic. It’s all very noble saying we won’t pay overs but any player is worth what a given club is willing to pay him.

You've only just glanced off the depth of this possibility.

Firstly, no, any player is not worth what a given club is willing to pay him. Ben Hunt is not worth a reported million bucks, neither is Milford.

But to the valuations - it may be possible that our valuations are realistic, but we are simply in a dangerous market against more desperate or reckless clubs.

It's like the Sydney housing market - I don't think anyone thinks house prices in Sydney are good value, but go to any auction and there are a hundred idiots throwing money at property.

Now maybe you just need to join the idiots and throw cash at the problem, or maybe you stick to your budget and play the long game. I would argue that Tigers have already had significant experience throwing cash at roster issues, and it has worked out badly. They are choosing a different approach under the restrictions of a salary cap.

Because if we are talking high-profile targets, it distills to a pretty clear scenario - we have only lost out to Bulldogs and Souths recently? If Tigers were interested in Latrell, JAC, Jai Arrow and TPJ, they either went to Wayne Bennett, or huge cash offers from the Bulldogs.

I personally don't think it's wise to try and compete with Bulldogs, because they truly appear to be bringing out the chequebook for any notable player on the market, and applying very blunt strokes to address their own problems. Have Bulldogs signed a decent half to pair with Burton? No. Have they signed a decent hooker? No. Have they ironed out their preferred fullback? No. Have they got any decent juniors? I haven't really seen them, maybe this Biondi fellow, and Averillo is worth persisting with.

Have any of the Bulldogs 2019-2021 signings come good? No not really; actually it's been a bit of a horror show - Meaney, Allan, Napa, Flanagan, Britt, Stimson, Jesse Sue, Christian Crichton, Jack Cogger, DWZ, Foran, Hetherington, Tim Lafai, Cotric, Corey Waddell, Sione Katoa. All average to terrible signings. Pass mark maybe for Luke Thompson.

Actually any player is worth what a given club is willing to pay him. West Tigers might think tpj is worth 600k per year but he is actually worth 2.2 over three years that is what the dogs have paid for him

So Mbye is worth $850k

that is what we paid for him

So in your opinion that is what he is worth?

no I don't think he is worth that but some club does namely us, in Mmbyes case the deal from memory was backended first year we were not paying anywhere near that.

 

[jirskyr]

Our issues have not been so much lack of player development but retention and talent identification. How do you not see the talent of Paseka, Addo Carr, Korobiete, Papynhuyzen and also not be able to keep Tedesco, Moses, Aloai, Matterson etc.

Don't start all that again. Tigers saw the talent in those players, by definition - Koroibete, JAC, Aloiai and Matterson were scouted by Tigers. Tedesco only left for the call of the Rooster and Paps left because he was stuck behind Tedesco.

Paseka was the only one they really didn't seem to think would come good, and in fairness it's taken Manly 5 seasons to get him going.

Please do not ever mention Mitchell Moses, that gutless hack.

 

[jirskyr]

e you could do that. Say hello to the Parramatta Eels for the last several years. If you want sustained, continual actual performance. Just be patient, set your development pathways, get your off field right, get your coaching right and it will come. So it didn’t work with the “Big 4”. It doesn’t matter. One misfire doesn’t offset the data. The results do not lie. We do not buy our way out of this. We tried that, it was dumb. Stop complaini

I did read the whole thing, good analysis and posting.

 

[jirskyr]

Actually any player is worth what a given club is willing to pay him. West Tigers might think tpj is worth 600k per year but he is actually worth 2.2 over three years that is what the dogs have paid for him

It's semantics. I believe "worth" and "value" in rugby league mean a return on the investment.

If you mean "valued at" then yes, someone valued TPJ at an alleged 2.2M over 3 years.

By your argument Moses Mbye is "worth" whatever he is being paid - some 800-950K per season reported, and Russell Packer is currently "worth" some 750K in the last year of his deal. I don't think any Tigers fans is going to agree with those statements; I think Tigers fans expect "worth" to correlate with "return".

 

[jirskyr]

I read every post in one go just now. I'm still struggling to understand the OP - why does being tight with a Tigers member have anything to do with recruitment? When is the last time Dawn Fraser or Tristan The Guy Who Sponsors The Mascot get involved in contract negotiations?

Next @iwasright is going to tell us about the player manager who used to be babysat by the nice lady who runs the merchandise.

 

[twentyforty]

The recruitment has been a bit of a shambles for almost the whole existence of the club tbh. We had a couple of good crops that wielded results, but even then we've only had three finals series (albeit we won a comp and could/should have won another).

Since 2011 the club has gone from panic move to panic move, resulting in lots of failed short term moves. Who can forget old mate Grant Mayer speculating that we'd make a GF in the mid 2010s?

I am a bit more confident in the club's direction over the last year or two. We've made some shrewd buys for the first time in a while, and some very promising youngsters on top of that. There have still been mis-steps (e.g. BJ) but I can at least see what we're building towards now. Hopefully we continue along that route in picking up these young guys and developing them into frontline FGers.

Of course, we'll still need to recruit elite players on top of that. The COE should help - I can't imagine the current/past facilities have sold the club very well.
But it's the old conundrum: you can't sign elite players until you have an elite team. And you can't have an elite team until you have elite players.

There is so much denial in this forum. This comment is a great example.

How have the Bulldogs signed Addo Carr, Tevita, and Burton then?

They do not have an elite team. What about the Titans signing Tino and Fifita? Did they have an elite team?

There are more factors at play here. Our location, our lack of success (3 finals in 21 years), our inability to locate and keep talent, our disregard of campbelltown, a lack of identity etc etc etc

If I was an NRL player right now, with my love of the Tigers, and had an option of the Tigers or any one else, I would not go to this club.

Tigers are the last Sydney club you'd choose. No home ground, no identity, it's not prime area to live, there's really nothing much there to attract people off the field let alone our decade of failure and drama. This is why we need to win games and make finals because we are behind other clubs in those other areas.


There are only 2 possible reasons we can’t get our player to sign on, you’ve mentioned one, the players don’t see the club as a reputation building club. A club with no home ground. Every time I think about that, it leads me to believe that the club’s administration just don’t get it.
The other reason could be, simply that our negotiating team simply don’t have the skill to close the deal? Now this is more likely the case considering that we are often the front runners for the signature.

I don’t believe the “no home ground” thing is an issue for players as much as it is for some fans, players will play where ever they are told, I would have thought?

I think the negotiation team is fine imo, we have a policy of not going over a value we have put on a players worth, other clubs put that worth higher than us. There is a long way to go to next season, I would be confident that the recruitment team have other players in there sights, so all is not lost.

Sure the players will play wherever, but having a home offers another inspirational level. If it didn’t then the other 15 clubs would follow the WT lead and have no home ground. Not having a home ground sends a message of instability and lack of longevity, it’s an integral part of the WT story.
There is a huge difference in having other players in their sights and actually signing players. They get deep into discussions, then decide to move in a different direction. Other clubs seem to be more focussed on achieving their goals.

 

[tigertuff]

The recruitment has been a bit of a shambles for almost the whole existence of the club tbh. We had a couple of good crops that wielded results, but even then we've only had three finals series (albeit we won a comp and could/should have won another).

Since 2011 the club has gone from panic move to panic move, resulting in lots of failed short term moves. Who can forget old mate Grant Mayer speculating that we'd make a GF in the mid 2010s?

I am a bit more confident in the club's direction over the last year or two. We've made some shrewd buys for the first time in a while, and some very promising youngsters on top of that. There have still been mis-steps (e.g. BJ) but I can at least see what we're building towards now. Hopefully we continue along that route in picking up these young guys and developing them into frontline FGers.

Of course, we'll still need to recruit elite players on top of that. The COE should help - I can't imagine the current/past facilities have sold the club very well.
But it's the old conundrum: you can't sign elite players until you have an elite team. And you can't have an elite team until you have elite players.

There is so much denial in this forum. This comment is a great example.

How have the Bulldogs signed Addo Carr, Tevita, and Burton then?

They do not have an elite team. What about the Titans signing Tino and Fifita? Did they have an elite team?

There are more factors at play here. Our location, our lack of success (3 finals in 21 years), our inability to locate and keep talent, our disregard of campbelltown, a lack of identity etc etc etc

If I was an NRL player right now, with my love of the Tigers, and had an option of the Tigers or any one else, I would not go to this club.

Tigers are the last Sydney club you'd choose. No home ground, no identity, it's not prime area to live, there's really nothing much there to attract people off the field let alone our decade of failure and drama. This is why we need to win games and make finals because we are behind other clubs in those other areas.

Have ya been to Bankstown lately?

 

[happy_tiger]

We are quickly running out of clubs to compare ourselves against ......

 

[Geo]

What makes everyone so sure that the current roster will play for a different coach...

Shouldn't they want to play for personal performance and some pride in the jersey they put on..

Sure the Dogs recruitment has been out of this world on paper as was the Knights a few year back..it's got them nowhere really..basically they went away from junior development to trying to buy success..hasn't really worked out yet..doesn't look like it's going too

It's yet to be seen if it does at the Dogs..could work..could flop massively..

Building from within does produce results if done properly.. You develop Jake Simpkin to be our Harry Grant, Stefano Utoikamanu to be our Payne Hass, Tuki Simpkins to be our Pangia Jnr and so on.. Sure that doesn't mean if quality becomes available you don't have a crack or even pay overs if they are exceptional quality Brandon Smith like..

Buying comps has never been as successful as building them..

Our club is great at finding and developing promising juniors. Unfortunately we are terrible at retaining them

Tim Sheens didn't have that issue in retaining them... We were only terrible through the Potter/Taylor/Voldamort years..

That needs to change clearly they are putting measures in place to rectify those shortfalls..

Here's an analogy.

You are the best at what you do. You win industry awards. But the company doesn't grow and you can't grow because of it. You look around you and your managers are dinosaurs or idiots with bad reputations. Suddenly GOOGLE sends you a message on LinkedIn. "We want you and will make you the highest paid employee in your entire industry".

Do you leave or stay?

How many times in the Sheens era did we hear Farah and Benji state they stayed for less than they could have got elsewhere.. yes it turned sour at the end..mainly because Sheens wanted to refresh the boys Club ..The downhill slide really began and the Wests Tigers have never recovered..

If you believe in what you are doing you stay and make your mark but that's me..

Wait wait wait. Why was it though afterwards the clubs salary cap take a hit from all their back ended payments.

Maybe ‘they’ll take less’ was in terms of right now with the promise of being caught up in the future.

What mainly caused the Salary Cap issues and made it worse was paying Blair, Farah, Gibbs Sironen, Fifita etc to play for other Clubs ..

Post Sheens decisions

 

[avocadoontoast]

We are quickly running out of clubs to compare ourselves against ......

Imagine being a Dewsbury Rams fan, those guys suck!

 

[Snake]

The recruitment has been a bit of a shambles for almost the whole existence of the club tbh. We had a couple of good crops that wielded results, but even then we've only had three finals series (albeit we won a comp and could/should have won another).

Since 2011 the club has gone from panic move to panic move, resulting in lots of failed short term moves. Who can forget old mate Grant Mayer speculating that we'd make a GF in the mid 2010s?

I am a bit more confident in the club's direction over the last year or two. We've made some shrewd buys for the first time in a while, and some very promising youngsters on top of that. There have still been mis-steps (e.g. BJ) but I can at least see what we're building towards now. Hopefully we continue along that route in picking up these young guys and developing them into frontline FGers.

Of course, we'll still need to recruit elite players on top of that. The COE should help - I can't imagine the current/past facilities have sold the club very well.
But it's the old conundrum: you can't sign elite players until you have an elite team. And you can't have an elite team until you have elite players.

There is so much denial in this forum. This comment is a great example.

How have the Bulldogs signed Addo Carr, Tevita, and Burton then?

They do not have an elite team. What about the Titans signing Tino and Fifita? Did they have an elite team?

There are more factors at play here. Our location, our lack of success (3 finals in 21 years), our inability to locate and keep talent, our disregard of campbelltown, a lack of identity etc etc etc

If I was an NRL player right now, with my love of the Tigers, and had an option of the Tigers or any one else, I would not go to this club.

Tigers are the last Sydney club you'd choose. No home ground, no identity, it's not prime area to live, there's really nothing much there to attract people off the field let alone our decade of failure and drama. This is why we need to win games and make finals because we are behind other clubs in those other areas.


There are only 2 possible reasons we can’t get our player to sign on, you’ve mentioned one, the players don’t see the club as a reputation building club. A club with no home ground. Every time I think about that, it leads me to believe that the club’s administration just don’t get it.
The other reason could be, simply that our negotiating team simply don’t have the skill to close the deal? Now this is more likely the case considering that we are often the front runners for the signature.

I don’t believe the “no home ground” thing is an issue for players as much as it is for some fans, players will play where ever they are told, I would have thought?

I think the negotiation team is fine imo, we have a policy of not going over a value we have put on a players worth, other clubs put that worth higher than us. There is a long way to go to next season, I would be confident that the recruitment team have other players in there sights, so all is not lost.


Sure the players will play wherever, but having a home offers another inspirational level. If it didn’t then the other 15 clubs would follow the WT lead and have no home ground. Not having a home ground sends a message of instability and lack of longevity, it’s an integral part of the WT story.
There is a huge difference in having other players in their sights and actually signing players. They get deep into discussions, then decide to move in a different direction. Other clubs seem to be more focussed on achieving their goals.

The club has to make the decision if staying with a strategy that was initiated over 20yrs ago when the club was formed or moving forward now the entity is owned by one . Until the truth of the situation is laid bare nothing will change the failure will continue.
This club is not a joint venture club anymore and there is no need to play out of multiple grounds , this club is owned by ONE entity and therefore should have one home ground this is the reality of the situation this is the truth ,board members should face the facts of the situation it’s called leadership and this club really needs some !
GIVE US A HOME!

 

[JC99]

The recruitment has been a bit of a shambles for almost the whole existence of the club tbh. We had a couple of good crops that wielded results, but even then we've only had three finals series (albeit we won a comp and could/should have won another).

Since 2011 the club has gone from panic move to panic move, resulting in lots of failed short term moves. Who can forget old mate Grant Mayer speculating that we'd make a GF in the mid 2010s?

I am a bit more confident in the club's direction over the last year or two. We've made some shrewd buys for the first time in a while, and some very promising youngsters on top of that. There have still been mis-steps (e.g. BJ) but I can at least see what we're building towards now. Hopefully we continue along that route in picking up these young guys and developing them into frontline FGers.

Of course, we'll still need to recruit elite players on top of that. The COE should help - I can't imagine the current/past facilities have sold the club very well.
But it's the old conundrum: you can't sign elite players until you have an elite team. And you can't have an elite team until you have elite players.

There is so much denial in this forum. This comment is a great example.

How have the Bulldogs signed Addo Carr, Tevita, and Burton then?

They do not have an elite team. What about the Titans signing Tino and Fifita? Did they have an elite team?

There are more factors at play here. Our location, our lack of success (3 finals in 21 years), our inability to locate and keep talent, our disregard of campbelltown, a lack of identity etc etc etc

If I was an NRL player right now, with my love of the Tigers, and had an option of the Tigers or any one else, I would not go to this club.

Tigers are the last Sydney club you'd choose. No home ground, no identity, it's not prime area to live, there's really nothing much there to attract people off the field let alone our decade of failure and drama. This is why we need to win games and make finals because we are behind other clubs in those other areas.

Have ya been to Bankstown lately?

Yet they're signing big name players aren't they... they're doing something right. Laundy hotels have a lot of pull, we've got big mouth Lee

 

[TigerWest]

The recruitment has been a bit of a shambles for almost the whole existence of the club tbh. We had a couple of good crops that wielded results, but even then we've only had three finals series (albeit we won a comp and could/should have won another).

Since 2011 the club has gone from panic move to panic move, resulting in lots of failed short term moves. Who can forget old mate Grant Mayer speculating that we'd make a GF in the mid 2010s?

I am a bit more confident in the club's direction over the last year or two. We've made some shrewd buys for the first time in a while, and some very promising youngsters on top of that. There have still been mis-steps (e.g. BJ) but I can at least see what we're building towards now. Hopefully we continue along that route in picking up these young guys and developing them into frontline FGers.

Of course, we'll still need to recruit elite players on top of that. The COE should help - I can't imagine the current/past facilities have sold the club very well.
But it's the old conundrum: you can't sign elite players until you have an elite team. And you can't have an elite team until you have elite players.

There is so much denial in this forum. This comment is a great example.

How have the Bulldogs signed Addo Carr, Tevita, and Burton then?

They do not have an elite team. What about the Titans signing Tino and Fifita? Did they have an elite team?

There are more factors at play here. Our location, our lack of success (3 finals in 21 years), our inability to locate and keep talent, our disregard of campbelltown, a lack of identity etc etc etc

If I was an NRL player right now, with my love of the Tigers, and had an option of the Tigers or any one else, I would not go to this club.

Tigers are the last Sydney club you'd choose. No home ground, no identity, it's not prime area to live, there's really nothing much there to attract people off the field let alone our decade of failure and drama. This is why we need to win games and make finals because we are behind other clubs in those other areas.

Have ya been to Bankstown lately?

Yet they're signing big name players aren't they... they're doing something right. Laundy hotels have a lot of pull, we've got big mouth Lee

When Laundy’s business hits the fan, he will be hoping the big mouth comes and saves his butt?

 

[TigerWest]

The recruitment has been a bit of a shambles for almost the whole existence of the club tbh. We had a couple of good crops that wielded results, but even then we've only had three finals series (albeit we won a comp and could/should have won another).

Since 2011 the club has gone from panic move to panic move, resulting in lots of failed short term moves. Who can forget old mate Grant Mayer speculating that we'd make a GF in the mid 2010s?

I am a bit more confident in the club's direction over the last year or two. We've made some shrewd buys for the first time in a while, and some very promising youngsters on top of that. There have still been mis-steps (e.g. BJ) but I can at least see what we're building towards now. Hopefully we continue along that route in picking up these young guys and developing them into frontline FGers.

Of course, we'll still need to recruit elite players on top of that. The COE should help - I can't imagine the current/past facilities have sold the club very well.
But it's the old conundrum: you can't sign elite players until you have an elite team. And you can't have an elite team until you have elite players.

There is so much denial in this forum. This comment is a great example.

How have the Bulldogs signed Addo Carr, Tevita, and Burton then?

They do not have an elite team. What about the Titans signing Tino and Fifita? Did they have an elite team?

There are more factors at play here. Our location, our lack of success (3 finals in 21 years), our inability to locate and keep talent, our disregard of campbelltown, a lack of identity etc etc etc

If I was an NRL player right now, with my love of the Tigers, and had an option of the Tigers or any one else, I would not go to this club.

Tigers are the last Sydney club you'd choose. No home ground, no identity, it's not prime area to live, there's really nothing much there to attract people off the field let alone our decade of failure and drama. This is why we need to win games and make finals because we are behind other clubs in those other areas.


There are only 2 possible reasons we can’t get our player to sign on, you’ve mentioned one, the players don’t see the club as a reputation building club. A club with no home ground. Every time I think about that, it leads me to believe that the club’s administration just don’t get it.
The other reason could be, simply that our negotiating team simply don’t have the skill to close the deal? Now this is more likely the case considering that we are often the front runners for the signature.

I don’t believe the “no home ground” thing is an issue for players as much as it is for some fans, players will play where ever they are told, I would have thought?

I think the negotiation team is fine imo, we have a policy of not going over a value we have put on a players worth, other clubs put that worth higher than us. There is a long way to go to next season, I would be confident that the recruitment team have other players in there sights, so all is not lost.


Sure the players will play wherever, but having a home offers another inspirational level. If it didn’t then the other 15 clubs would follow the WT lead and have no home ground. Not having a home ground sends a message of instability and lack of longevity, it’s an integral part of the WT story.
There is a huge difference in having other players in their sights and actually signing players. They get deep into discussions, then decide to move in a different direction. Other clubs seem to be more focussed on achieving their goals.




The club has to make the decision if staying with a strategy that was initiated over 20yrs ago when the club was formed or moving forward now the entity is owned by one . Until the truth of the situation is laid bare nothing will change the failure will continue.
This club is not a joint venture club anymore and there is no need to play out of multiple grounds , this club is owned by ONE entity and therefore should have one home ground this is the reality of the situation this is the truth ,board members should face the facts of the situation it’s called leadership and this club really needs some !
GIVE US A HOME!

GIVE US A BREAK, not having one home ground is not the reason we are in our current predicament.
Edit: BTW, if we went to one ground, which one would you choose?

 

[TYGA]

Our issues have not been so much lack of player development but retention and talent identification. How do you not see the talent of Paseka, Addo Carr, Korobiete, Papynhuyzen and also not be able to keep Tedesco, Moses, Aloai, Matterson etc.

Don't start all that again. Tigers saw the talent in those players, by definition - Koroibete, JAC, Aloiai and Matterson were scouted by Tigers. Tedesco only left for the call of the Rooster and Paps left because he was stuck behind Tedesco.

Paseka was the only one they really didn't seem to think would come good, and in fairness it's taken Manly 5 seasons to get him going.

Please do not ever mention Mitchell Moses, that gutless hack.

The issue remains when players come good or have obvious talent they have left. Development is pointless if you don’t retain and extend ahead of contracts expiring.

 

[TigerWest]

Our issues have not been so much lack of player development but retention and talent identification. How do you not see the talent of Paseka, Addo Carr, Korobiete, Papynhuyzen and also not be able to keep Tedesco, Moses, Aloai, Matterson etc.

Don't start all that again. Tigers saw the talent in those players, by definition - Koroibete, JAC, Aloiai and Matterson were scouted by Tigers. Tedesco only left for the call of the Rooster and Paps left because he was stuck behind Tedesco.

Paseka was the only one they really didn't seem to think would come good, and in fairness it's taken Manly 5 seasons to get him going.

Please do not ever mention Mitchell Moses, that gutless hack.

The issue remains when players come good or have obvious talent they have left. Development is pointless if you don’t retain and extend ahead of contracts expiring.

Are you referring to things from the past, the club was broke, we couldn’t keep a lot of players at the time.
We are a whole different club now, with departments in place to stop that happening, thanks mainly to Pascoe imo.

 

[Russell]

The recruitment has been a bit of a shambles for almost the whole existence of the club tbh. We had a couple of good crops that wielded results, but even then we've only had three finals series (albeit we won a comp and could/should have won another).

Since 2011 the club has gone from panic move to panic move, resulting in lots of failed short term moves. Who can forget old mate Grant Mayer speculating that we'd make a GF in the mid 2010s?

I am a bit more confident in the club's direction over the last year or two. We've made some shrewd buys for the first time in a while, and some very promising youngsters on top of that. There have still been mis-steps (e.g. BJ) but I can at least see what we're building towards now. Hopefully we continue along that route in picking up these young guys and developing them into frontline FGers.

Of course, we'll still need to recruit elite players on top of that. The COE should help - I can't imagine the current/past facilities have sold the club very well.
But it's the old conundrum: you can't sign elite players until you have an elite team. And you can't have an elite team until you have elite players.

There is so much denial in this forum. This comment is a great example.

How have the Bulldogs signed Addo Carr, Tevita, and Burton then?

They do not have an elite team. What about the Titans signing Tino and Fifita? Did they have an elite team?

There are more factors at play here. Our location, our lack of success (3 finals in 21 years), our inability to locate and keep talent, our shit house facilities, our disregard of campbelltown, a lack of identity etc etc etc

If I was an NRL player right now, with my love of the Tigers, and had an option of the Tigers or any one else, I would not go to this club. It would be career suicide.

Then your love of the Tigers is not strong apparently - just an opinion.

 

[Guest]

The recruitment has been a bit of a shambles for almost the whole existence of the club tbh. We had a couple of good crops that wielded results, but even then we've only had three finals series (albeit we won a comp and could/should have won another).

Since 2011 the club has gone from panic move to panic move, resulting in lots of failed short term moves. Who can forget old mate Grant Mayer speculating that we'd make a GF in the mid 2010s?

I am a bit more confident in the club's direction over the last year or two. We've made some shrewd buys for the first time in a while, and some very promising youngsters on top of that. There have still been mis-steps (e.g. BJ) but I can at least see what we're building towards now. Hopefully we continue along that route in picking up these young guys and developing them into frontline FGers.

Of course, we'll still need to recruit elite players on top of that. The COE should help - I can't imagine the current/past facilities have sold the club very well.
But it's the old conundrum: you can't sign elite players until you have an elite team. And you can't have an elite team until you have elite players.

There is so much denial in this forum. This comment is a great example.

How have the Bulldogs signed Addo Carr, Tevita, and Burton then?

They do not have an elite team. What about the Titans signing Tino and Fifita? Did they have an elite team?

There are more factors at play here. Our location, our lack of success (3 finals in 21 years), our inability to locate and keep talent, our disregard of campbelltown, a lack of identity etc etc etc

If I was an NRL player right now, with my love of the Tigers, and had an option of the Tigers or any one else, I would not go to this club.

Tigers are the last Sydney club you'd choose. No home ground, no identity, it's not prime area to live, there's really nothing much there to attract people off the field let alone our decade of failure and drama. This is why we need to win games and make finals because we are behind other clubs in those other areas.


There are only 2 possible reasons we can’t get our player to sign on, you’ve mentioned one, the players don’t see the club as a reputation building club. A club with no home ground. Every time I think about that, it leads me to believe that the club’s administration just don’t get it.
The other reason could be, simply that our negotiating team simply don’t have the skill to close the deal? Now this is more likely the case considering that we are often the front runners for the signature.

I don’t believe the “no home ground” thing is an issue for players as much as it is for some fans, players will play where ever they are told, I would have thought?

I think the negotiation team is fine imo, we have a policy of not going over a value we have put on a players worth, other clubs put that worth higher than us. There is a long way to go to next season, I would be confident that the recruitment team have other players in there sights, so all is not lost.


Sure the players will play wherever, but having a home offers another inspirational level. If it didn’t then the other 15 clubs would follow the WT lead and have no home ground. Not having a home ground sends a message of instability and lack of longevity, it’s an integral part of the WT story.
There is a huge difference in having other players in their sights and actually signing players. They get deep into discussions, then decide to move in a different direction. Other clubs seem to be more focussed on achieving their goals.




The club has to make the decision if staying with a strategy that was initiated over 20yrs ago when the club was formed or moving forward now the entity is owned by one . Until the truth of the situation is laid bare nothing will change the failure will continue.
This club is not a joint venture club anymore and there is no need to play out of multiple grounds , this club is owned by ONE entity and therefore should have one home ground this is the reality of the situation this is the truth ,board members should face the facts of the situation it’s called leadership and this club really needs some !
GIVE US A HOME!

GIVE US A BREAK, not having one home ground is not the reason we are in our current predicament.
Edit: BTW, if we went to one ground, which one would you choose?

If we went to one home ground it would have to be neither Leichhardt or Campbelltown to maintain the spirit of a joint venture.
Even if you dispute that it's still a joint venture the fact is that Wests own 90% so Leichhardt as a sole home ground is out of the question.
Campbelltown just doesn't seem to have the supporter base any more, so it's out.
Which only leaves Homebush or Parra's home ground.
So nobody would be happy

 

[2005magic]

Our issues have not been so much lack of player development but retention and talent identification. How do you not see the talent of Paseka, Addo Carr, Korobiete, Papynhuyzen and also not be able to keep Tedesco, Moses, Aloai, Matterson etc.

Don't start all that again. Tigers saw the talent in those players, by definition - Koroibete, JAC, Aloiai and Matterson were scouted by Tigers. Tedesco only left for the call of the Rooster and Paps left because he was stuck behind Tedesco.

Paseka was the only one they really didn't seem to think would come good, and in fairness it's taken Manly 5 seasons to get him going.

Please do not ever mention Mitchell Moses, that gutless hack.

The issue remains when players come good or have obvious talent they have left. Development is pointless if you don’t retain and extend ahead of contracts expiring.

Obvious most recent example was Matterson.