LIVE GAME Round 25 v Cowboys

Live Game Discussion
jirskyr said:
Pretty upsetting game, not because we are definitely out of the finals (I never gave us a chance) but because we had that game bagged then some old habits crept back in.

Last 1-2 months I've really started to believe in the Tigers again. They are definitely a different side in many ways to what we've seen for the past few years. Old Tigers teams used to be flash and no guts, this team is lots of guts without so much flash.

There's been this pattern now for weeks where Tigers grind back into the game and often get on top. Not necessarily to win but being quite competitive all year apart from a handful of bad results. And specifically recently, they've just been more pleasing to watch - more grit, more effort, more solid defending.

Two slow starts in a row now; including last week we didn't hit and stick very well for about 10 minutes, then found our way into the match. However unlike against Manly, Cowboys were fairly disciplined and when they needed points, they had strike weapons who could burn us. We don't really have the same, we don't have a Dearden or Drinkwater who can do that flashy solo setup, we rely on continued efforts and continued tempo.

Bloody Dearden was everywhere, every cover tackle was made by him, even when we scored it was always him chasing, pouncing on every loose ball, and he gets rewarded being around the traffic so much. We don't really have a guy like Dearden who is in it 100% for the whole match, he appears to fit 100 minutes of football into the regulation 80.

So unfortunately I fell into the trap of "believing", I was quite convinced with the 12-point lead we'd go on with it, very unusual feeling, but they've been doing it for a few weeks now. I had this feeling we'd score again and go on to win by 12 or 18 points. Cowboys looked done, looked desperate.

Then BAM, old school 2023 Tigers, one bad dropped ball and suddenly they've letting in 3 converted tries in 6 minutes. What a letdown. Naden was horrible, sorry mate we just can't handle having you any more, I'd rather have had some young bloke learning the trade and making mistakes, rather than a fairly experienced bloke missing key tackles and being targeted in every set.

But not just him, we are still super lean on the bench. Can't be serious if we have a 20-minute prop, Latu, Murray who seems a nice fellow but bang average, and one of Sukkar or Seyfarth who try hard but lack for the top-tier skills.

So when Cowboys needed points they were able to find it and we got very brittle.
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its bloody frustrating - its a team of new age tosses that will build a very strong legacy imo
 
GNR4LIFE said:
The result is disappointing and there is a sense that we choked yet again in a big game, however I don’t see today as a step back. Every week, someone stands up and makes you realise we have a team of goers. Last week it was Sione, this week it was Taylan. No reason we can’t be pushing for the 8 next year.
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Reality is if we lose last 2 games we could finish 15th. That would be another disaster year.
 
jirskyr said:
Pretty upsetting game, not because we are definitely out of the finals (I never gave us a chance) but because we had that game bagged then some old habits crept back in.

Last 1-2 months I've really started to believe in the Tigers again. They are definitely a different side in many ways to what we've seen for the past few years. Old Tigers teams used to be flash and no guts, this team is lots of guts without so much flash.

There's been this pattern now for weeks where Tigers grind back into the game and often get on top. Not necessarily to win but being quite competitive all year apart from a handful of bad results. And specifically recently, they've just been more pleasing to watch - more grit, more effort, more solid defending.

Two slow starts in a row now; including last week we didn't hit and stick very well for about 10 minutes, then found our way into the match. However unlike against Manly, Cowboys were fairly disciplined and when they needed points, they had strike weapons who could burn us. We don't really have the same, we don't have a Dearden or Drinkwater who can do that flashy solo setup, we rely on continued efforts and continued tempo.

Bloody Dearden was everywhere, every cover tackle was made by him, even when we scored it was always him chasing, pouncing on every loose ball, and he gets rewarded being around the traffic so much. We don't really have a guy like Dearden who is in it 100% for the whole match, he appears to fit 100 minutes of football into the regulation 80.

So unfortunately I fell into the trap of "believing", I was quite convinced with the 12-point lead we'd go on with it, very unusual feeling, but they've been doing it for a few weeks now. I had this feeling we'd score again and go on to win by 12 or 18 points. Cowboys looked done, looked desperate.

Then BAM, old school 2023 Tigers, one bad dropped ball and suddenly they've letting in 3 converted tries in 6 minutes. What a letdown. Naden was horrible, sorry mate we just can't handle having you any more, I'd rather have had some young bloke learning the trade and making mistakes, rather than a fairly experienced bloke missing key tackles and being targeted in every set.

But not just him, we are still super lean on the bench. Can't be serious if we have a 20-minute prop, Latu, Murray who seems a nice fellow but bang average, and one of Sukkar or Seyfarth who try hard but lack for the top-tier skills.

So when Cowboys needed points they were able to find it and we got very brittle.
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Interesting because my reaction was exactly the opposite. I.E. Too much time left, this is when we drop our bundle. I'm sorry to say they met my expectations.
On the other hand, I wasnt too phased that the cows jumped ahead at the start. I had faith that we could reel them in.
From a player attitude perspective, it seems to me that we are better at chasing points than leading, taking our foot off the pedal and losing concentration.
 
TYGA said:
Our team will be much better with the inclusion of KPP on the right edge back row. He is a good tackler in space his length cuts outside backs down. Toa is our only right centre.

I know people like them but naden, Seyfarth, bird, hunt, sukkar need to be replaced and we need another starting prop.

Don’t know if we can recruit enough in one offseason to fix the issues but it has to be done. We have cap space.
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People like them?
 
jirskyr said:
More important was how many crucial tackles he missed. I think they scored 4 going through him directly:
1. first try Nanai directly through him
2. second try Valamei was set up after Naden missed Purdue twice (also others missed him)
3. fifth try Burns is set up by a Clifford run through Naden and Sukkar; Naden gets up slow at marker and they shift to where he would normally defend
4. sixth and winning try Drinkwater busts directly through Naden

Basically Cowboys and Tigers both had a lot of success shifting left through Naden and Vailea.

Not a first-grade quality player Nados. 1.5 grade at best.
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Mistakes have been the hallmark of his career,despite considerable talent
It will be at worst his second last game for us
 
The first 10 -15 mins of the game we were beaten on both sides of the ball. Thats what I find most concerning moving forward without a significant addition in the middle. I think the first set of the game when we kicked the Cowboys had their first tackle close to their 40m line. I'd have to look again but thats just rubbish especially with the wind behind us.
There were some really poor efforts at times yesterday, well before the game came to the crunch time. Effort plays that make a difference. The line break by Purdue leading to the Cowboys second try, Terrell, Sione and Api treated him like he had spiders on him. Required more effort. The one nobody has mentioned, Deardons try off the May dropped ball. Tito, Luai and Bula stood there and showed no urgency to kill the play, unlike Deardon who swooped on it to score. Disappointing.

Im not sure I have the same optimism for 26 that others do without some astute recruitment. Other teams will improve too. Teams that are currently below us like Parra ( Moses at the peak of his powers now) and Souths who have had an absolute horrible run with injuries. We will need a preseason where our defensive resolve and line speed improve a lot.
 
What was obvious to the naked eye was the differences in defence, whilst we can hustle, we almost always need 3 or 4 players to bring their forwards down/shut down the offload. They almost always bend our line and in doing so immediately shift the ball out as our tacklers are either still getting up or still offside. In reverse when we run the ball we seem to hit a brick wall and stop...they have 2 defenders and a defensive line set. Physicality in first contact is lacking, especially through the middle.
The good news is with Taylan may added to our backs we now have the quality to match most teams as long as either Star and potentially Makasini are fit and playing first grade. Our attack through our backs is starting to really click and we scored some wonderful long distance tries. Jerome was great and Latu did an admirable job stepping in for AD, other than that dropped ball he was very good.
However, our forwards need work, Terrell is great as he is consistent on both sides of the ball and Samuela runs some good variations out wide, he really needs to put on a bit of bulk in the offseason, especially through the legs and torso. KPP will be great as his defence is solid and he often keeps his feet in tackles and gets an offload or at least sucks in an extra defender to stop the offload. Pole has become impotent and what we call his footwork at the line looks more to me like he is shying away from impact. He really needs to pull his finger out or move aside.
As I have said previously and many people have posted, we really need an impact forward that can play at least 30 mins at a high tempo and if Pole keeps trending down in his performances, maybe we need to be looking at a 50 - 60 min starting forward that has impact.
 
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