Salary Cap

[Geo]

If a player is contacted directly by a company to do TV commercial or become a company ambassador for a product that is not connected with the club or NRL, is that classes a TPA ??

I would have thought any restrictions on the above would be classed as a restraint of trade. Also it would be so easy to rort

Correct..that is the exact intention of TPA's to allow players to earn from their intellectual property..you can not restrict that..the 1st one was Billy Slater and Queensland Banana's…his latest Gatorade..Slater wears no Storm gear ...it's just Billy Slater..There are plenty out there...Teddy with Nike...Smith for VB

As I said earlier they are between Player and 3rd Party not the Club they play for nor are the supposed to be arranged or guaranteed by the players Club...this is where many believe the waters are muddied ...

So Geo, do these deals come under the TPA umbrella?? Because if clubs have a limit on the amount of salaries they can have tied up in TPA's, than it would mean a player might not be able to accept a deal that he had been offered to him, and than we get back to restraint of trade.

On the other hand if they don't come under the TPA umbrella than the system is exposed to crooked deals and I guess most if not all clubs would be exploiting it in some way or another….of course some more than others

There are 2 types of TPA's that are exempt from the Cap..the 1st is Club affiliated TPA's where a Club sponsor can boost a player/s earnings ..this is currently Capped at 600K outside the Cap and can be payed to 1 player or a number of players which also can be guaranteed by the Club..

The second which I think you are asking about is Non-Club Affiliated TPA's..like Slater and Gatorade I mentioned…they have no limit or restrictions apart from they are not to be arranged or guaranteed by the Club the player plays for.... or used as an inducement for the player to play for a certain Club...they are meant to allow the Player to supplement their earnings based on their own intellectual property or brand...For example if Slater left the Storm and played for the Broncos his deal with Gatorade would travel with him if they wanted to continue using his profile...regardless of who he plays for..

It was mentioned that Moylan has Club sponsored 3rd Party agreements as part of his salary at the Panthers..if he were to leave then the 3rd Party would not be obligated to continue the agreement for him to play at another Club...

 

[supercoach]

Thanks Geo, that is the way I thought it worked. So basically clubs that have good contacts in the big end of town have a massive advantage and of course most one team towns. Once again it highlights how uneven the current system i

 

[Munk]

Sink or swim, life isnt fair. Time to grow up and compete on the terms other clubs have been operating at for decades or continue to fade into obscurity.

 

[TCL]

Sink or swim, life isnt fair. Time to grow up and compete on the terms other clubs have been operating at for decades or continue to fade into obscurity.

Yep what the NRL needs is guns! That will whip them into shape!

 

[colmcd]

Thanks Geo, that is the way I thought it worked. So basically clubs that have good contacts in the big end of town have a massive advantage and of course most one team towns. Once again it highlights how uneven the current system i

So why do the Roosters keep getting so much money?
Cocanne this, Kings cross that, bad player this….

Ok we have had our embarrassments, but were better then the Roosters.

 

[kevinmcguiness]

something fishy about this

 

[240z]

Thanks Geo, that is the way I thought it worked. So basically clubs that have good contacts in the big end of town have a massive advantage and of course most one team towns. Once again it highlights how uneven the current system i

So why do the Roosters keep getting so much money?
Cocanne this, Kings cross that, bad player this….

Ok we have had our embarrassments, but were better then the Roosters.

Geez thats a tough call

Craig Field - Manslaughter
John Hoppoata - the proctologist and thug
Tim Simona - Charity thief
Anthony Laffranchi - Charged with rape but charges dropped
Todd Payton - Desecration of a War Memorial
Benny Elias - Dodgy business dealings
Mark O'Neil - sexual harassment in the work place

Probably many more - I know some of these were not committed when playing for the WT's but they are still linked to the club

Every Team has its bad eggs

 

[WestsBenTigers]

Thanks Geo, that is the way I thought it worked. So basically clubs that have good contacts in the big end of town have a massive advantage and of course most one team towns. Once again it highlights how uneven the current system i

So why do the Roosters keep getting so much money?
Cocanne this, Kings cross that, bad player this….

Ok we have had our embarrassments, but were better then the Roosters.

Geez thats a tough call

Craig Field - Manslaughter
John Hoppoata - the proctologist and thug
Tim Simona - Charity thief
Anthony Laffranchi - Charged with rape but charges dropped
Todd Payton - Desecration of a War Memorial
Benny Elias - Dodgy business dealings
Mark O'Neil - sexual harassment in the work place

Probably many more - I know some of these were not committed when playing for the WT's but they are still linked to the club

Every Team has its bad eggs

Kyle Lovett - Cocaine incident

 

[Russell]

Thanks Geo, that is the way I thought it worked. So basically clubs that have good contacts in the big end of town have a massive advantage and of course most one team towns. Once again it highlights how uneven the current system i

So why do the Roosters keep getting so much money?
Cocanne this, Kings cross that, bad player this….

Ok we have had our embarrassments, but were better then the Roosters.

Geez thats a tough call

Craig Field - Manslaughter
John Hoppoata - the proctologist and thug
Tim Simona - Charity thief
**<big>Anthony Laffranchi - Charged with rape but charges dropped</big>**
Todd Payton - Desecration of a War Memorial
Benny Elias - Dodgy business dealings
Mark O'Neil - sexual harassment in the work place

Probably many more - I know some of these were not committed when playing for the WT's but they are still linked to the club

Every Team has its bad eggs

Guilty anyway - is that right?

 

[colmcd]

Thanks Geo, that is the way I thought it worked. So basically clubs that have good contacts in the big end of town have a massive advantage and of course most one team towns. Once again it highlights how uneven the current system i

So why do the Roosters keep getting so much money?
Cocanne this, Kings cross that, bad player this….

Ok we have had our embarrassments, but were better then the Roosters.

Geez thats a tough call

Craig Field - Manslaughter
John Hoppoata - the proctologist and thug
Tim Simona - Charity thief
Anthony Laffranchi - Charged with rape but charges dropped
Todd Payton - Desecration of a War Memorial
Benny Elias - Dodgy business dealings
Mark O'Neil - sexual harassment in the work place

Probably many more - I know some of these were not committed when playing for the WT's but they are still linked to the club

Every Team has its bad eggs

Kyle Lovett - Cocaine incident

matthew lodge – kidnapping at gunpoint..

OK sure we have our demons. But why are the Roosters getting so much corporate sponsorship then?
I think we actually do look cleaner, we have a bigger fanbase and following.
Sure they have Pierce and a few other big names, but we had Farah, Marshall and surely we could pip them to the big sponsor dollars. I mean sponsor St George, Souths, Eels they have big fanbases and dollars, but the Roosters? Which audience does your business want to attract, Western Sydney or Milsons point?

 

[240z]

Thanks Geo, that is the way I thought it worked. So basically clubs that have good contacts in the big end of town have a massive advantage and of course most one team towns. Once again it highlights how uneven the current system i

So why do the Roosters keep getting so much money?
Cocanne this, Kings cross that, bad player this….

Ok we have had our embarrassments, but were better then the Roosters.

Geez thats a tough call

Craig Field - Manslaughter
John Hoppoata - the proctologist and thug
Tim Simona - Charity thief
**<big>Anthony Laffranchi - Charged with rape but charges dropped</big>**
Todd Payton - Desecration of a War Memorial
Benny Elias - Dodgy business dealings
Mark O'Neil - sexual harassment in the work place

Probably many more - I know some of these were not committed when playing for the WT's but they are still linked to the club

Every Team has its bad eggs

Guilty anyway - is that right?

I never said he was guilty. Just stating the facts.

Why, do you have problems with the facts?

 

[Tiger_Watto]

matthew lodge – kidnapping at gunpoint..

OK sure we have our demons. But why are the Roosters getting so much corporate sponsorship then?
I think we actually do look cleaner, we have a bigger fanbase and following.
Sure they have Pierce and a few other big names, but we had Farah, Marshall and surely we could pip them to the big sponsor dollars. I mean sponsor St George, Souths, Eels they have big fanbases and dollars, but the Roosters? Which audience does your business want to attract, Western Sydney or Milsons point?

The majority of corporate sponsorship isnt always about their business attracting new customers. Its more an avenue to entertain and collaborate with like minded business associates. The Roosters are well positioned to the big end of town, offer good corporate facilities and the ability to meet with some of Australia's smartest business minds [Gyngell; Bouris etc].

Crowd Numbers are the least of their concerns, but ironically, after this years 2 finals matches, they were the highest crowd average from the Sydney based franchises.

 

[supercoach]

The Chooks for all their so called salary cap rorting have not a lot of silver wear to show for it over the past 20 odd years. If I was in charge I would like to see a better return for all the money spent

 

[Russell]

So why do the Roosters keep getting so much money?
Cocanne this, Kings cross that, bad player this….

Ok we have had our embarrassments, but were better then the Roosters.

Geez thats a tough call

Craig Field - Manslaughter
John Hoppoata - the proctologist and thug
Tim Simona - Charity thief
**<big>Anthony Laffranchi - Charged with rape but charges dropped</big>**
Todd Payton - Desecration of a War Memorial
Benny Elias - Dodgy business dealings
Mark O'Neil - sexual harassment in the work place

Probably many more - I know some of these were not committed when playing for the WT's but they are still linked to the club

Every Team has its bad eggs

Guilty anyway - is that right?

I never said he was guilty. Just stating the facts.

Why, do you have problems with the facts?

Well I don't - why put a guy in a list of guilty people who was found NOT guilty.
It means he is no more guilty than you.

Oh! never mind I give up… you just don't get it. Lol

 

[jirskyr]

Geez thats a tough call

Craig Field - Manslaughter
John Hoppoata - the proctologist and thug
Tim Simona - Charity thief
**<big>Anthony Laffranchi - Charged with rape but charges dropped</big>**
Todd Payton - Desecration of a War Memorial
Benny Elias - Dodgy business dealings
Mark O'Neil - sexual harassment in the work place

Probably many more - I know some of these were not committed when playing for the WT's but they are still linked to the club

Every Team has its bad eggs

Guilty anyway - is that right?

I never said he was guilty. Just stating the facts.

Why, do you have problems with the facts?

Well I don't - why put a guy in a list of guilty people who was found NOT guilty.
It means he is no more guilty than you.

Oh! never mind I give up… you just don't get it. Lol

I get it Russ.

Not fair to put Laffranchi in a list of dodgy persons when he wasn't convicted of anything. It's like saying Brett Stewart is a crook even though he was exonerated.

 

[innsaneink]

mud sticks

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Yes but does it discriminate based on certain attributes? Will a defensive second rower grade worse than an attacking second rower? Will metres gained, tries scored and line breaks be favoured over total tackles, least missed tackles and less errors?

Mate, I dont know the answer to the actualy scenario which would attribute to a grading system, but I know it simply cant be like Super Coach or Fantasy League etc. They are some of the dumbest gradings I have seen.

I feel Experience over Rookie has a exact value, I feel a Centre over a Halfback has another value, a 5 game SOO player over a 20 Game SOO Player etc, but I dont feel it should be based on each players actualy work-rate.

Its only an option/alternative to discuss based on most peoples disgust in the current un-even playing field based on a $ Cap, TPA's and the lack of reward for clubs who develop juniors etc.

I'm not disputing what you're advocating has no merit, just thinking out loud on how it would work.

And with the points system, it would seem that money can still win over when say Easts and Wests are chasing the same player with the same points because they both have the points available and Easts can ring in an "external TPA" and still sign said player over us. It will create a more even spread of talent in a manner of speaking but where battling clubs are competing against richer clubs for the same crop of players the richer clubs will always win out.

All of these scenarios would need to be played out when considering a change to such system. I suspect no matter how the NRL approach it, there will always be loopholes to exploit.

With a points base system it doesn't matter how much you pay a player, it what his value in points that matters.
If Cameron Smith is valved at 52 points the Storm can pay him $10 million dollars or $20k per year.
It's the points that determine his part of the Storms points limit.
So clubs can't assemble a team of stars by having small contracts and topping them up with huge TPA's from rich benefactors that have nothing to do with the club, but are pressured by influential people like Nick or Packer and co.
Anything has got to be better than the current system that lends itself to be wroughted by huge TPA's that the richer clubs or rich supporters can provide.

Sorry BT, I don't think I explained the point well enough.

Example: If Easts and Wests both have the same amount of cap points available and Tedesco is on the market for the same amount, so both clubs are in the running to secure his signature. We know that Easts are significantly stronger financially and can offer more than Wests, so he chooses to go to Easts anyway. Money is still the primary factor in that instance I believe.

 

[supercoach]

Under a point system, yes the Chooks could blow our bid out of the water for a player like Tedesco, but they would be limited to how many of these sorts of players they could get under the point quota. So they would have to be very careful how they assembled their roster.

Basically under a point system it becomes the same for every club unlike it is now.

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Yeah it might spread the top talent out more evenly but what's to stop teams loading up and still nabbing the two best players in the game and surrounding them with nobodies and kids AKA the Craig Bellamy method.

 

[supercoach]

Yeah it might spread the top talent out more evenly but what's to stop teams loading up and still nabbing the two best players in the game and surrounding them with nobodies and kids AKA the Craig Bellamy method.

Sure, but you would hope there was enough good players to spread around the 16 clubs. I guess where you might have a problem is with the red hot juniors who would only attract a small point rating, the likes of the Chooks could out bid the other clubs for their services. Anyway any system is better than we have now and It would all come down to how they rate players