Club_Sandwich
New member
i don't believe that BS for a second. :rant
Second-tier salary cap woes prevent..AXE..
- Thread starter Geo
- Start date
MacDougall
New member
Yep lies. It is round 8.
**<big>Second-tier salary cap woes prevent Wests Tigers coach Jason Taylor wielding axe</big>
Date April 27, 2016 - 8:00PM
By Adrian Proszenko**
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Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/league-news/secondtier-salary-cap-woes-prevent-wests-tigers-coach-jason-taylor-wielding-axe-20160427-gog61p.html#ixzz471z5AEvl
Wests Tigers coach Jason Taylor won't be able to threaten underperforming players with the axe, with the club right on the limit of its second-tier salary cap.
After a bright start to the season, the pressure is on the club after five consecutive losses, including the meek 60-6 surrender to Canberra last weekend. That performance has heaped pressure on Taylor as he prepares to coach against his former team, South Sydney, at ANZ Stadium on Thursday.
Not that personnel changes are likely. The club has been forced to use 24 players after a quarter of the season, one fewer than the amount needed to get through all of last year. That is in stark contrast to the top teams, with Cronulla and North Queensland using 19 players and Brisbane using 20.
Taylor inherited a raft of salary cap issues when he took the reins and those problems have been exacerbated by a spate of injuries this season. Taylor has had to blood Josh Addo-Carr, Josh Aloiai and JJ Felise, while back-up recruits Joel Edwards, Jack Littlejohn and Jordan Rankin have made their first-grade debuts.
The granting of early releases to Jesse Parahi and Lamar Manuel-Liolevave has consequences to the club's second-tier balance sheet. The lack of depth has been further exposed by an ankle injury to captain Aaron Woods, while Matt Ballin's knee injury has prevented him from playing since shifting from Manly.
The issues mean Taylor has little scope to drop underperforming players. Taylor said his team was still smarting from the Raiders hiding.
"They have been hurting, big-time," Taylor said. "The group has been hurting for a number of weeks now and that's the hardest part about it. We've been really close in all of our games this season, particularly the ones we've lost, to playing our best footy.
"Then last week we had an aberration, that was a performance that just wasn't good enough. We let everybody down who is involved in our club, we let our fans down too, which is disappointing.
"One game doesn't make a season and eight games don't make a season. It's one really poor performance - at this point that's all it is. We get a chance to bounce back."
Taylor knows he is under pressure as his side sits above only the Knights and Roosters on the ladder.
"It's part of the game, it's part of this job and it's part of a lot of jobs in the world today," he said. "I'm fine because what I know is what matters is our performance. How things have gone this week is based on the fact that we played really poorly and it wasn't good enough. That's what comes on the back of that sort of performance.
"It's up to us, we control the pressure by performing better. If we don't perform better the pressure will remain or it will increase. If we do it will go away. We're in charge of that as a club, we're in charge of that as a team and we're the ones who can do something about it."
Taylor brushed off suggestions his team were no longer playing for him. "It's clear to see that the performances this season have been full of great character," he said. "It was only six days prior to the Canberra game that we took the Melbourne Storm into extra time and played a really strong game. That stuff comes on the back of one poor performance, I find that stuff disappointing …
"You're not happy when you're sitting in the coach's box and you see the team performing poorly but it's not due to what I'll receive from the fans and the media, it's because you're disappointed in your own performance. We have absolute pride in our performance and that wasn't good enough last week."
Date April 27, 2016 - 8:00PM
By Adrian Proszenko**
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Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/league-news/secondtier-salary-cap-woes-prevent-wests-tigers-coach-jason-taylor-wielding-axe-20160427-gog61p.html#ixzz471z5AEvl
Wests Tigers coach Jason Taylor won't be able to threaten underperforming players with the axe, with the club right on the limit of its second-tier salary cap.
After a bright start to the season, the pressure is on the club after five consecutive losses, including the meek 60-6 surrender to Canberra last weekend. That performance has heaped pressure on Taylor as he prepares to coach against his former team, South Sydney, at ANZ Stadium on Thursday.
Not that personnel changes are likely. The club has been forced to use 24 players after a quarter of the season, one fewer than the amount needed to get through all of last year. That is in stark contrast to the top teams, with Cronulla and North Queensland using 19 players and Brisbane using 20.
Taylor inherited a raft of salary cap issues when he took the reins and those problems have been exacerbated by a spate of injuries this season. Taylor has had to blood Josh Addo-Carr, Josh Aloiai and JJ Felise, while back-up recruits Joel Edwards, Jack Littlejohn and Jordan Rankin have made their first-grade debuts.
The granting of early releases to Jesse Parahi and Lamar Manuel-Liolevave has consequences to the club's second-tier balance sheet. The lack of depth has been further exposed by an ankle injury to captain Aaron Woods, while Matt Ballin's knee injury has prevented him from playing since shifting from Manly.
The issues mean Taylor has little scope to drop underperforming players. Taylor said his team was still smarting from the Raiders hiding.
"They have been hurting, big-time," Taylor said. "The group has been hurting for a number of weeks now and that's the hardest part about it. We've been really close in all of our games this season, particularly the ones we've lost, to playing our best footy.
"Then last week we had an aberration, that was a performance that just wasn't good enough. We let everybody down who is involved in our club, we let our fans down too, which is disappointing.
"One game doesn't make a season and eight games don't make a season. It's one really poor performance - at this point that's all it is. We get a chance to bounce back."
Taylor knows he is under pressure as his side sits above only the Knights and Roosters on the ladder.
"It's part of the game, it's part of this job and it's part of a lot of jobs in the world today," he said. "I'm fine because what I know is what matters is our performance. How things have gone this week is based on the fact that we played really poorly and it wasn't good enough. That's what comes on the back of that sort of performance.
"It's up to us, we control the pressure by performing better. If we don't perform better the pressure will remain or it will increase. If we do it will go away. We're in charge of that as a club, we're in charge of that as a team and we're the ones who can do something about it."
Taylor brushed off suggestions his team were no longer playing for him. "It's clear to see that the performances this season have been full of great character," he said. "It was only six days prior to the Canberra game that we took the Melbourne Storm into extra time and played a really strong game. That stuff comes on the back of one poor performance, I find that stuff disappointing …
"You're not happy when you're sitting in the coach's box and you see the team performing poorly but it's not due to what I'll receive from the fans and the media, it's because you're disappointed in your own performance. We have absolute pride in our performance and that wasn't good enough last week."
happy_tiger
Well-known member
Look we aren't the only side that has had injury concerns this season
Look at the Warriors , Manly ,Raiders etc
They still manage to put on a side that looks on paper to be NRL standard and fires up most weeks
And to think yet again according to Pascoe 2017 is looking ugly , sorry I don't want to hear about our issues
I want to now what the solutions are and when will they finally get here (if they ever get here )
Look at the Warriors , Manly ,Raiders etc
They still manage to put on a side that looks on paper to be NRL standard and fires up most weeks
And to think yet again according to Pascoe 2017 is looking ugly , sorry I don't want to hear about our issues
I want to now what the solutions are and when will they finally get here (if they ever get here )
No where in the article is there one quote from Taylor about the Cap affecting team selections…It is all from the journalist...none the less...carry on....
Black_n_White
New member
I dont know if you all want to wrap your head around the salary cap and how it works, but I can give it a go to explain a pretty basic version, and how it relates to the squad as pre TT's easter update, and why it is so alarming that our top 25 looks the way it does.
Everyone understands that the top 25 players are to be paid from a $6.1M salary cap, easy enough to understand, but how that Top 25 is determined is not so easy to explain.
I dont know how to say this any clearer, but the top 25 list you will see given throughout this season is actually calculated from last seasons player earnings, also taking into account newer signings base contracts before incentives. Our real top 25 wont be sorted until the last game is played. Its not as though the club nominates its top 25 pre-season, it is actually a fluid and changing group of 25 players. Clear as mud!
Now for a team like ours, who doesnt look to be finishing any better than last year, thus similar incentives triggered it gives us a fair look at who is signed to what base salaries as we should be barely cracking incentive clauses….
Drinkwater, Hunt and Littlejohn wouldnt have triggered many high paying incentives if any last yr, though from the list we are working from are on higher base salaries than Milone, JAC and JJ felise, players which are actually useful to our top squad.
I suppose its best here to use this info to evaluate our top squad once we have one last basic piece of info pertaining to second tier cap. Once a player plays 4 first grade games he is considered a FG player, which in turn triggers a $9k ish retirement contribution, and earns them a minimum wage FG salary (can be made up a few ways, either they have a low base but high incentives which pushes them above the minimum by acruing many games and wins ( can possibly bump well above minimum wage), or a low base and not enough incentives which earns the minimum wage the second he runs out on the pitch the 4th time).
Now onto why our 25 looks so scary. In another thread I mentioned that there is 9 hookers and halves in that squad, to which someone mentioned that Taylor signed a few of them, but if you were to take a good objective look at the TT's 25, and if all were healthy picked a game day 17...have a good look at what is left, we are skinny to cover injuries all over the park, why? Because JLJ, Drinkwater and Hunt arent actually intended to be on our FG books. They only made the list because of their Salary, which goes all the way back to the start of this post, the 25 is fluid.... but raises another question, why...
We all know why, over-paying. To play nice with figures, lets pretend Farah, Woods, Teddy, Moses, Brooks and Lawrence are all on $500k (it should even out on the low side) thats $3m, half of our cap in one foul swoop. that leaves less than $160k per player for the other 19... sounds easy, until you count in Sironen, Nofa and Simona, who would between them eat twice their share you would think another cool million. We are a conservative 2/3 of the cap down, 16 players to pay out of $2.1M, $131k each... The minimum salary is $83K, we dont have much room to move at this point.
Its late.... will get to second tier tomorrow some time
Everyone understands that the top 25 players are to be paid from a $6.1M salary cap, easy enough to understand, but how that Top 25 is determined is not so easy to explain.
I dont know how to say this any clearer, but the top 25 list you will see given throughout this season is actually calculated from last seasons player earnings, also taking into account newer signings base contracts before incentives. Our real top 25 wont be sorted until the last game is played. Its not as though the club nominates its top 25 pre-season, it is actually a fluid and changing group of 25 players. Clear as mud!
Now for a team like ours, who doesnt look to be finishing any better than last year, thus similar incentives triggered it gives us a fair look at who is signed to what base salaries as we should be barely cracking incentive clauses….
Drinkwater, Hunt and Littlejohn wouldnt have triggered many high paying incentives if any last yr, though from the list we are working from are on higher base salaries than Milone, JAC and JJ felise, players which are actually useful to our top squad.
I suppose its best here to use this info to evaluate our top squad once we have one last basic piece of info pertaining to second tier cap. Once a player plays 4 first grade games he is considered a FG player, which in turn triggers a $9k ish retirement contribution, and earns them a minimum wage FG salary (can be made up a few ways, either they have a low base but high incentives which pushes them above the minimum by acruing many games and wins ( can possibly bump well above minimum wage), or a low base and not enough incentives which earns the minimum wage the second he runs out on the pitch the 4th time).
Now onto why our 25 looks so scary. In another thread I mentioned that there is 9 hookers and halves in that squad, to which someone mentioned that Taylor signed a few of them, but if you were to take a good objective look at the TT's 25, and if all were healthy picked a game day 17...have a good look at what is left, we are skinny to cover injuries all over the park, why? Because JLJ, Drinkwater and Hunt arent actually intended to be on our FG books. They only made the list because of their Salary, which goes all the way back to the start of this post, the 25 is fluid.... but raises another question, why...
We all know why, over-paying. To play nice with figures, lets pretend Farah, Woods, Teddy, Moses, Brooks and Lawrence are all on $500k (it should even out on the low side) thats $3m, half of our cap in one foul swoop. that leaves less than $160k per player for the other 19... sounds easy, until you count in Sironen, Nofa and Simona, who would between them eat twice their share you would think another cool million. We are a conservative 2/3 of the cap down, 16 players to pay out of $2.1M, $131k each... The minimum salary is $83K, we dont have much room to move at this point.
Its late.... will get to second tier tomorrow some time
foreveratiger
New member
One thing we have improved on this year is the Media spin that we have contributed, the spin and excuses we have used by players and Coach in the media to justify this or that is quite Sad really.
innsaneink
Well-known member
So how in hell can we sign Elijah Taylor?
G
Guest
Guest
I would suggest that after tonight the pressure cooker will be just about ready to go off.
cqtiger
Well-known member
@tiga4eva said:
Here we go again. It's those bloody TPAs.
Most top clubs don't pay full cap value to their players, their TPA sponsors keep them out if the poo.
GCT wrote:
Start and earn your money , or resign and take a couple of your mates with you.
I never expect much from this club and that is exactly what you and some of your playersare delivering.
Well I guess if you never expect much from WT and that is what JT and some of the players are delivering. You can't be disappointed can you?
Start and earn your money , or resign and take a couple of your mates with you.
I never expect much from this club and that is exactly what you and some of your playersare delivering.
Well I guess if you never expect much from WT and that is what JT and some of the players are delivering. You can't be disappointed can you?
happy_tiger
Well-known member
I think something that people need to understand is clubs quite regularly have salary cap breaches (whether it be from your Top 25 or your 2nd tier cap ) but their are fines involved
I would say on average 4-6 clubs have breaches every season , we have been done a fair bit , but the fines are rather minor (maybe 10 k )
You might remember how the WT's were looking at a major fine (around 168 k) with the Robbie Farah issue with his Junior club etc a few seasons ago
Which again brings up the whole "rich get richer , poor don't get the picture " scenario
Clubs like Parra who Leagues clubs are quite financial purposely blow the cap in minor ways and just pay the fines
I'm not even sure how the NRL works out the clubs fines if they breach , maybe B&W can explain that to us
I would say on average 4-6 clubs have breaches every season , we have been done a fair bit , but the fines are rather minor (maybe 10 k )
You might remember how the WT's were looking at a major fine (around 168 k) with the Robbie Farah issue with his Junior club etc a few seasons ago
Which again brings up the whole "rich get richer , poor don't get the picture " scenario
Clubs like Parra who Leagues clubs are quite financial purposely blow the cap in minor ways and just pay the fines
I'm not even sure how the NRL works out the clubs fines if they breach , maybe B&W can explain that to us
Thanks for that "Black 'n White" - it clears up some of my problems. Basically how it roughly all works.
Should clear up a fair bit for some others shooting their mouth off - without having understood how the cap works.
That is alright though - just blame good ol' JT - it is his fault, there is no trans gender toilet at Leichhardt as well.lol
Should clear up a fair bit for some others shooting their mouth off - without having understood how the cap works.
That is alright though - just blame good ol' JT - it is his fault, there is no trans gender toilet at Leichhardt as well.lol
@happy tiger said:
Minor breaches are usually $ for $…
Major breaches or intentional RORTING can be anything ...loss of points stripped of premierships playing for no points .On top of fines.ie see Melbourne Storm Canterbury Bulldogs and soon to be Parramatta Eels...they have already been fined $500K...
