This is it for me. If we get Cleary like I hope, give him 3 years. He has a good start because over half the team are off contract at end of the year which gives him the chance to pick and choose.
This is the last chance for me. Tigers get your shit together or il find another team.
This is the last chance for me. Tigers get your shit together or il find another team.
GNR4LIFE
Well-known member
Sign him up, absolutely, but I'd be in no rush to give him the reigns of the side this year. Last thing we need is yet another coach coming in and working with someone else's team. I'd keep Webster there for the year, give the guy a chance to impress and give himself a nice resume for another head coaching role. Cleary isn't going to come in and turn the club around overnight so let him work behind the scenes, sorting out his playing roster, implementing his structures and ideas. Maybe work alongside Webster in an advisory role.
GNR4LIFE
Well-known member
@ said:
Gamesmanship. Of course they'd have contacted him. If he's telling the truth, Pascoe and co should be following Taylor out the door.
Another quote from him when asked about if he'd be interested "I'd certainly listen. There's a lot of upside at that club, I'd look into it."
What are they waiting for?
GNR4LIFE
Well-known member
@ said:
Well he isn't going to come out and say "yeah I'm already signed".
Masterton
Well-known member
@ said:
Can we start a betting pool on the first forummer to call him a nufty or an idiot? I predict it will happen with the team selection after our first loss.
@ said:
If they didn't sound him out first, they're stupider than I thought.
jirskyr
Well-known member
@ said:
Sorry I meant the differences in the situations to which they arrived at the club. Obviously in terms of personality they are night and day.
jirskyr
Well-known member
@ said:
I don't think that argument flies, sorry.
Taylor's team went from 15th to 9th. This is the best Tigers result since 2011 and Tigers had a great side in 2011\. If that's not a clearly superior improvement in the ultimate decider of a team's performance - wins and ladder position, then I'm obviously watching the wrong game.
Did Taylor's team improve this year? Apparently not. But also you can't really make a call on a team's season until it is more than half done, I mean Cowboys started 2015 with 3 losses, include a heavy one to Brisbane, then went on to win the comp.
I liked Potter, I thought he had potential. But his teams came 15th and 13th. I don't care that he had a horror injury toll, part of the coaches job is to improve the strength, conditioning and rehab approaches. Tim Sheens' teams had injuries too but he copped the same criticism about lack of results, favouritism in selection etc. Old "Teflon" Tim.
I'm all for doing comparisons on areas of improvement between different sites, be it attack, defence discipline etc. But ultimately it comes down to winning. And I've been in discussions before where forummers howled at me "it's winning that counts, forget the rest of the stats".
Taylor's team won a lot more last year than normal. That is pretty clearly an improvement and if you don't think so, you will be impossible to please.
@ said:
It's a very good question. In a vacuum I would say at least two years. Possibly three.
Sadly things are never judged in a vacuum.
JT came in with a young, inexperienced squad with salary cap issues, so we all knew any improvement had to come from within. For whatever reason, that wasn't really happening on any great scale, despite an improved ladder position this year. Obviously the situation was also heavily impacted by the 2018 situation, which probably made the club panic a little more than they would have otherwise.
I do sympathise with him a bit, as there were some outside factors at play, but then again that's kinda part of the job, and I wasn't seeing enough on the field to make me believe that this squad was going places.
I agree with the decision to move JT on, but the timing is ludicrous and suggests all sorts of incompetence further up the line.
I am not a huge Cleary fan, but I do respect what he's done at both NZW and Penrith - develop a squad from the ground up. I know th Penrith situation was due to a cap rebuild (similar to ours) - don't remember what happened at the start of his nz reign.
I think he'll have a bit of pull in the market, and may net us some decent players for next year, as we currently have about four. A lot of questions though.
As for Potter - I felt he was harshly done by as he seemed to be coaching with one hand behind his back. He didn't choose his own staff, had Mayer and the board signing players without his approval and literally against his wishes and suffered a ridiculous injury run. That first half of 2014 was the best we've played in years.
Then again, it seemed the players may not have really respected him, and the injury run may have been his own doing to an extent.
jirskyr
Well-known member
@ said:
Thing is milkster, that can easily be construed as an excuse. It's part of the coaches remit to improve strength and conditioning, rehab etc. Don't you remember all the talk in years gone by, previous coaches, about the soft tissue v bone injuries? Medical experts on the forum, that bone injuries were freak ones but repeated soft tissue injuries possibly pointed to bad preparation or training etc.
I know you were a much younger lad back then, but Sheens and Potter were always criticised on here for the terrible injury tolls they incurred every year, how they crippled our finals runs etc.
Or to put it another way, consider the irony that Taylor really did appear to curtail our injury issues, we've been doing quite well in the past two years, and it has become another way to criticise him because we haven't performed sufficiently despite the consistent team roster. It was not an excuse available to JT the same as it was available to Potter or Sheens.
As for improvement under JT - I was very excited by what I saw for the first period in 2015\. Defence was noticeably better, the team played with a toughness a la early 2014 and we just looked like a promising bunch of kids a year or two off hitting the big time. For whatever reason, after that first bye - we lost it. Got smashed by the Roosters, and JT seemed to panic and overcompensate, leading to that silly 0-8 game against the Cowboys, which just exacerbated things. The defence went backwards and never returned. We'd turn up and play tough every now and then, but it was mostly just flighty Tigers football circa 2007 all over again for the most part.
The team didn't really have an identity, the players mostly looked low on confidence and the results didn't come.
He talked a good game when he arrived, but we never really saw that on the field, and that is a shame.
The team didn't really have an identity, the players mostly looked low on confidence and the results didn't come.
He talked a good game when he arrived, but we never really saw that on the field, and that is a shame.
TurnStyle
Well-known member
@ said:
:roll
It's a sad fact I will never forget that game!
As for the coach I really hope it is Cleary; him being the coach just makes me feel optimistic.
I think he is a good coach who was let go by the panthers with the weakest excuse ever from Gould - "he looks stressed" to paraphrase - and (in a nice touch of irony!) seems to have the temperament the club needs.
Not saying Taylor didn't, but I can imagine him being a bit "David miscavige" away from the cameras.
(He's the head of Scientology. No offence meant to any scientologists here but…psycho!!).
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