Tennis - The Joker the GOAT?

Tucker

Tucker

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Novak Djokovic has won his 10th Australian Open in straight sets.
He now has 22 grand slams, tied with Nadal.
  • Nadal: 22
  • Djokovic: 22
  • Federer: 20
  • Sampras: 14
  • Emerson: 12
  • Laver: 11
  • Borg: 11
  • Tilden: 10
With Rafa’s body giving up on him, it would be a brave man who would predict he’ll win the French Open again.
Novak should stand on his own by years end I’d say.
Unbelievable player.
 
Tucker said:
Novak Djokovic has won his 10th Australian Open in straight sets.
He now has 22 grand slams, tied with Nadal.
  • Nadal: 22
  • Djokovic: 22
  • Federer: 20
  • Sampras: 14
  • Emerson: 12
  • Laver: 11
  • Borg: 11
  • Tilden: 10
With Rafa’s body giving up on him, it would be a brave man who would predict he’ll win the French Open again.
Novak should stand on his own by years end I’d say.
Unbelievable player.
Click to expand...
You have to give credit where due - but what an arrogant A-hole!!

I thought Goran Ivanisevic was unlikeable - but this bloke wears the crown!!
 
Snidest 0 said:
You have to give credit where due - but what an arrogant A-hole!!

I thought Goran Ivanisevic was an unlikeable prick - but this bloke wears the crown!!
Click to expand...
As I said in another thread recently…A-holes run the world.
Nice guys get the dregs leftover.
This guy will be in the discussion for greatest sportsperson ever one day.
 
It must be a little difficult keeping your feet grounded when fans and media are practically worshipping the guy....sometimes things are going to slip.
Those who are close to him probably think he's a really nice guy....we can't read into media that nuch and the slight language barrier night not help.
However as far as GOAT of tennis he has to be right up there hey.
Our own indigenous female Evonne Fay Goolagong Cawley, Margret Court, The Rockhampton Rocket were considered GOATS of their time but for various reasons there careers didn't seem to go on for ages like modern players, is this right... Or just an assumption?
 
Cobarcats said:
It must be a little difficult keeping your feet grounded when fans and media are practically worshipping the guy....sometimes things are going to slip.
Those who are close to him probably think he's a really nice guy....we can't read into media that nuch and the slight language barrier night not help.
However as far as GOAT of tennis he has to be right up there hey.
Our own indigenous female Evonne Fay Goolagong Cawley, Margret Court, The Rockhampton Rocket were considered GOATS of their time but for various reasons there careers didn't seem to go on for ages like modern players, is this right... Or just an assumption?
Click to expand...
Before 1968, tennis was an amateur sport, so with no dollars, naturally players' careers were not too long. Professional monies, earnings, tournament fees and sponsorships have brought a whole new ball game.
Any ways, I reckon stats only tell half a story.
Therein lies the basis of endless pub debates as to who the best might be.
 
tiger_one said:
Before 1968, tennis was an amateur sport, so with no dollars, naturally players' careers were not too long. Professional monies, earnings, tournament fees and sponsorships have brought a whole new ball game.
Any ways, I reckon stats only tell half a story.
Therein lies the basis of endless pub debates as to who the best might be.
Click to expand...
Off course mate, footy was the same, playing for 100 bucks and a carton to share. It's a solud argument that we shouldn't compare eras.
However if you say modern day tennis, post McEnroe, you would have to say the Novak Djokovic with more fames to come is probably the goat.
 
Cobarcats said:
It must be a little difficult keeping your feet grounded when fans and media are practically worshipping the guy....sometimes things are going to slip.
Those who are close to him probably think he's a really nice guy....we can't read into media that nuch and the slight language barrier night not help.
However as far as GOAT of tennis he has to be right up there hey.
Our own indigenous female Evonne Fay Goolagong Cawley, Margret Court, The Rockhampton Rocket were considered GOATS of their time but for various reasons there careers didn't seem to go on for ages like modern players, is this right... Or just an assumption?
Click to expand...
Just had a quick look at the players you mentioned...

Evonne Goolagong Cawley won 7 Grand Slams from 1971-1980 (10 Years).

Margaret Court won 24 Grand Slams from 1960-1973 (14 Years).

Rod Laver won 11 Grand Slams from 1960-1969 (10 Years).

Novak Djokovic has won 22 Grand Slams from 2008-2023 (16 Years).

All are legendary in their own right, I agree that factors such as the game turning professional, and therefore the improvement of sport science etc. have led to players like Djokovic, Federer, and Nadal having exceptionally long careers at the highest level.
 
MC 24/14, wow! I remember watching newsreels as a kid. She was tallish. The rackets they used were smaller, cutgut strings and hitting the ball required talent.
I kept hitting the wood when I had a friendly hit 🤣 Being tall I had a great fast serve but if he managed to return it I just let it go.... pointless trying... I was crap 🥴
 
Cobarcats said:
It must be a little difficult keeping your feet grounded when fans and media are practically worshipping the guy....sometimes things are going to slip.
Those who are close to him probably think he's a really nice guy....we can't read into media that nuch and the slight language barrier night not help.
However as far as GOAT of tennis he has to be right up there hey.
Our own indigenous female Evonne Fay Goolagong Cawley, Margret Court, The Rockhampton Rocket were considered GOATS of their time but for various reasons there careers didn't seem to go on for ages like modern players, is this right... Or just an assumption?
Click to expand...
KingRobbie said:
Just had a quick look at the players you mentioned...

Evonne Goolagong Cawley won 7 Grand Slams from 1971-1980 (10 Years).

Margaret Court won 24 Grand Slams from 1960-1973 (14 Years).

Rod Laver won 11 Grand Slams from 1960-1969 (10 Years).

Novak Djokovic has won 22 Grand Slams from 2008-2023 (16 Years).

All are legendary in their own right, I agree that factors such as the game turning professional, and therefore the improvement of sport science etc. have led to players like Djokovic, Federer, and Nadal having exceptionally long careers at the highest level.
Click to expand...
You’re forgetting that Laver sat out 6 or 7 years of the 10 you have him down for while playing on the pro circuit.
His records far exceed anything before or since.
Current tennis players acknowledge not only his greatness but the fact that what he did set them all up to make money out of the sport.
 
Consider that Novak played against other generational talents like Rafa and Federer as well, it's an amazing achievement. If those two weren't around to pilfer grand slam titles as well, Novak would already be 30+ GS wins. It's a shame that Nadal has had so many injuries during his career, he would have had more titles as well.

Novak is definitely on another level.
 
cktiger said:
You’re forgetting that Laver sat out 6 or 7 years of the 10 you have him down for while playing on the pro circuit.
His records far exceed anything before or since.
Current tennis players acknowledge not only his greatness but the fact that what he did set them all up to make money out of the sport.
Click to expand...
I did not know this, wow.
Wrong thread but still a racquet sport...what about the Hunts in squash. The most prolific Australian male of all time, Geoff Hunt.
Months at World #1: 59
World Championship Titles: 4
World Championship Finals: 5
British Open Titles: 8
British Open Finals: 10
There are a few champs in this article like Hunt's battles with Jahangir Khan and another great Heather McKay... worth a read.
www.psaworldtour.com

GREATEST SQUASH PLAYER OF ALL TIME: Michelle Martin & Geoff Hunt voted number 8 - PSA World Tour

Over the last month, we have given squash fans the chance to decide the greatest players in squash history as we looked over the achievements and legacies of some of the most recognisable names ever to take to a squash court. The votes are now in and we will be announcing the results in...
www.psaworldtour.com www.psaworldtour.com

It seem that the greatest players practically intimidated their opposition just by being up against them, some opponents were beaten before the game began.
Karrie Webb, when at the top of her game was like that. Ali, Tom Brady, Garry Kasparov 🙂
2023 Wests Tigers 🤞🤣
 
IMHO, it is especially difficult because:
- the game has changed, e.g. after mostly serve/volleyers generation, now nearly all top players are baseliners ;
- racquet and strings technology improved the overall game e.g. sweet spot area increased -> better control of the ball -> easier to play ;
- the balls are very different - intentional change, to disadvantage serve/volley players;
- the surfaces are different - intentional change, again to disadvantage serve/volley players;
- small group group of players were professionals;
- the players are in general more agile and physically stronger.

So to make the comparison more viable, we have to assume:
- that all players have a choice of the latest technology racquets/strings;
- the court surfaces must be similar/same;
- the balls are the same/similar;
- all players have the opportunity to train in the same/similar condition.
Just a few things to consider when making the comparison.;)

IMHO, Laver, Hoad, Sampras, Rosewall, Borg, McEnroe, Lendl, Connors, Gonzales, Sampras would be very competitive with todays' players :)
 
As in football and in every other sport, it’s hard to compare sportspeople’s achievements from different eras due to the many changes over time and greater advantages given to players in more modern times.

That said, Novak is certainly the greatest tennis player I’ve seen in 50 odd years of watching the game and Margaret Court’s achievements are just outstanding, especially considering the dominance of players like Navratilova, Graf & Williams that have come after her, yet couldn’t surpass her!
 
He lucked out when Carlos Alcaraz withdrew- if he starts healthy in the Majors Djokovic might not get another one.
 
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