2023 Israel–Hamas war

Status
Not open for further replies.
It’s HAMAS that has the ethic cleansing doctrine. Please read the charter. Israel has no such policy.
Everytime Palestinians and their supporters quote Amnesty Internationals determination of Israel as "apartheid" I shake my head. 18% of the population of Israel is Muslim and have the same rights as jewish populations. There are 10 members of the Israeli parliament that are arab, 9 of them muslim.

What percentage of the population in Gaza, Iran, Jordan do you think is Jewish?
 
Disclaimer: I DO NOT support or condone Hamas. Nor do I support or condone the actions of Israeli forces. Hamas doesn’t represent innocent Palestinians. Hamas is an Israeli creation designed to give the illusion there is an equal sided conflict. The reality is, Israel is a military powerhouse backed by big governments and secret societies, with one of the most sophisticated intelligence agencies in the world (Mossad).

What is happening in Palestine is settler colonialism, military occupation, land theft and ethnic cleansing. A conflict means there is equal footing, which is not the case. There is an active oppressor (Israel) and an oppressed (Palestine). A colonizer (Israel) and a colonized (Palestine).

This is not a conflict, it’s only a conflict when you fall for the mainstream media narrative.

Say anything they don’t want said about Israel and its treatment of Palestinians or of Zionism and it’s corruption of Judaism and bang, you’re anti-Semitic. Just like the same ‘conspiracy theorist’ derogatory label they use to steer people from the truth. Don’t let cognitive dissonance takeover whats truly taking place, put aside any pre concieved notions or beliefs, your worldview perception on this topic has been shaped from the mainstream, the same mainstream that is completely controlled and lie to you every single day.

Disagreeing with the policies of another nation does not make you anti-Semitic.

Disagreeing with the Israeli treatment of Palestinians does not make you anti-Semitic.

Disagreeing with the hundreds of millions of lives lost in the name of Political Zionism through genocide, wars, financial manipulation and government corruption does not make you anti-Semitic.

This is about HUMANITY as one, all ethnicities, races, religious beliefs, sexual preferences, financial positions, political views, don’t allow these fault lines of division to distract you, do not be fooled by the hidden hand that your awake to for one Agenda, but asleep to for another. This is merely division tactics from the same hidden hand in control.
 
Disclaimer: I DO NOT support or condone Hamas. Nor do I support or condone the actions of Israeli forces. Hamas doesn’t represent innocent Palestinians. Hamas is an Israeli creation designed to give the illusion there is an equal sided conflict. The reality is, Israel is a military powerhouse backed by big governments and secret societies, with one of the most sophisticated intelligence agencies in the world (Mossad).

Now we are getting to the meat of it. What are these secret societies that you are referring to?
What is happening in Palestine is settler colonialism, military occupation, land theft and ethnic cleansing. A conflict means there is equal footing, which is not the case. There is an active oppressor (Israel) and an oppressed (Palestine). A colonizer (Israel) and a colonized (Palestine).

A few questions. In this story of "settler colonialism", when do you start the clock and what were the boundaries of this "Palestine" that you speak of that Israel colonised?

This is not a conflict, it’s only a conflict when you fall for the mainstream media narrative.
Some fall for "mainstream narrative", a great many others fall for activist narrative. Both are looking for an easy to understand, pre digested simple way to look at the world and neither are correct. Unfortunately the number of people that actually take time to look at a wider view of history to try to understand how we came to this.


Say anything they don’t want said about Israel and its treatment of Palestinians or of Zionism and it’s corruption of Judaism and bang, you’re anti-Semitic. Just like the same ‘conspiracy theorist’ derogatory label they use to steer people from the truth. Don’t let cognitive dissonance takeover whats truly taking place, put aside any pre concieved notions or beliefs, your worldview perception on this topic has been shaped from the mainstream, the same mainstream that is completely controlled and lie to you every single day.
Discussing the derogatory term "Conspiracy Theorist" and claiming that Israel is controlled by "secret societies" in the same post is a pretty big flex actually. Almost impressed.

Disagreeing with the policies of another nation does not make you anti-Semitic.

Disagreeing with the Israeli treatment of Palestinians does not make you anti-Semitic.

Disagreeing with the hundreds of millions of lives lost in the name of Political Zionism through genocide, wars, financial manipulation and government corruption does not make you anti-Semitic.
One simple question for you.......does Israel have a right to exist?


This is about HUMANITY as one, all ethnicities, races, religious beliefs, sexual preferences, financial positions, political views, don’t allow these fault lines of division to distract you, do not be fooled by the hidden hand that your awake to for one Agenda, but asleep to for another. This is merely division tactics from the same hidden hand in control.
If only there was a country in the middle east that accepts all ethnicities, races, religious beliefs, sexual preferences and political views. If only that single country in the Middle East existed. What would you call that one country if it existed and would you defend its right to exist?
 
Disclaimer: I DO NOT support or condone Hamas. Nor do I support or condone the actions of Israeli forces. Hamas doesn’t represent innocent Palestinians. Hamas is an Israeli creation designed to give the illusion there is an equal sided conflict. The reality is, Israel is a military powerhouse backed by big governments and secret societies, with one of the most sophisticated intelligence agencies in the world (Mossad).

What is happening in Palestine is settler colonialism, military occupation, land theft and ethnic cleansing. A conflict means there is equal footing, which is not the case. There is an active oppressor (Israel) and an oppressed (Palestine). A colonizer (Israel) and a colonized (Palestine).

This is not a conflict, it’s only a conflict when you fall for the mainstream media narrative.

Say anything they don’t want said about Israel and its treatment of Palestinians or of Zionism and it’s corruption of Judaism and bang, you’re anti-Semitic. Just like the same ‘conspiracy theorist’ derogatory label they use to steer people from the truth. Don’t let cognitive dissonance takeover whats truly taking place, put aside any pre concieved notions or beliefs, your worldview perception on this topic has been shaped from the mainstream, the same mainstream that is completely controlled and lie to you every single day.

Disagreeing with the policies of another nation does not make you anti-Semitic.

Disagreeing with the Israeli treatment of Palestinians does not make you anti-Semitic.

Disagreeing with the hundreds of millions of lives lost in the name of Political Zionism through genocide, wars, financial manipulation and government corruption does not make you anti-Semitic.

This is about HUMANITY as one, all ethnicities, races, religious beliefs, sexual preferences, financial positions, political views, don’t allow these fault lines of division to distract you, do not be fooled by the hidden hand that your awake to for one Agenda, but asleep to for another. This is merely division tactics from the same hidden hand in control.

Hamas started this war and are now bitching because the ramifications are coming home.
Hezbollah has now joined and are recieving missile strikes of their own.
 
IMHO, Iran and many other Arab countries use Palestinians for their proxy war against Israel and perhaps the USA. Many of those countries would not accept any piece with Israel.
One theory is that HAMAS attacked Israel to delay/disrupt piece agreement between Saudi Arabia and Israel.

Anyhow, we are "lucky" to live, as per that Chinese curse “May he live in interesting times.”
100%.

And conversely the U.S uses Israel as a proxy for its interests.

The U.S has illegally interfered with practically every middle eastern nation since WW2. The junta in Egypt, the illegal invasion of Iraq the coup in Iran 1953, the current illegal occupation of parts of Syria.
 
Last edited:

Interestingly, Egypt has disclosed that it had warned Israel about an impending large-scale attack by Hamas but the latter failed to act on it. To be sure, there is going to be stocktaking within Israel at some point. Prime Minister Netanyahu will be hard-pressed to explain. On the other hand, typically, he will try to cover up and whip up xenophobia with war cries to distract attention.

I recall also the Iran warned Australian authorities about the Linde Cafe terrorist but were brushed off.
 
Now we are getting to the meat of it. What are these secret societies that you are referring to?


A few questions. In this story of "settler colonialism", when do you start the clock and what were the boundaries of this "Palestine" that you speak of that Israel colonised?


Some fall for "mainstream narrative", a great many others fall for activist narrative. Both are looking for an easy to understand, pre digested simple way to look at the world and neither are correct. Unfortunately the number of people that actually take time to look at a wider view of history to try to understand how we came to this.



Discussing the derogatory term "Conspiracy Theorist" and claiming that Israel is controlled by "secret societies" in the same post is a pretty big flex actually. Almost impressed.


One simple question for you.......does Israel have a right to exist?



If only there was a country in the middle east that accepts all ethnicities, races, religious beliefs, sexual preferences and political views. If only that single country in the Middle East existed. What would you call that one country if it existed and would you defend its right to exist?
Spot on - particularly the point about when the clock starts ticking.
 
I DO NOT support or condone Hamas. Nor do I support or condone the actions of Israeli forces. Hamas doesn’t represent innocent Palestinians. Hamas is an Israeli creation designed to give the illusion there is an equal sided conflict. The reality is, Israel is a military powerhouse backed by big governments and secret societies, with one of the most sophisticated intelligence agencies in the world (Mossad).

Good post however I have to ask some questions.

Do you really think Hamas is an Israeli creation ? Alternatively did you mean by this that Israel's actions towards Palestine have caused the formation of Hamas.
What secret societies are you talking about ?

This conversation is really difficult because Hamas are terrorists who kill innocent civilians brutally and they don't appear to want peace. At the same time Israel as you stated are basically oppressing the people of Palestine and have been for years. To add to that plenty of countries outside of these two countries appear to be all in on this conflict.
 
I think the original Planet of the apes series during late 70s that some of us kids collected cards for and watched played on this theme.

Thinking that with a multipolar world which is increasingly coming into being, it gives a measure of protection against AI and the like for the average guy.

AI controlled by one hegemon would be a scary concept. At least with competing superpowers they all must to a degree battle for influence giving us a measure of value.

I agree with Musk that we need alternative civilisations in order to have a mirror on our own.

Hard to know if we are doing well if there is no alternative.
Yes, to some extent, but they figured a whole species would act together. Rather, the most powerful of Homo sapiens is splitting from the rest of us (they are already largely tax exempt) so they can progress more quickly, and that will widen the gap.

The world is multipolar now. There's been a process of splitting for a while but Russia & China's behaviour suggests a new consolidation in the future. I think that Xi or Putin, armed with AI designed to control people, would make life intolerable, like living in a straitjacket.

I doubt that we are doing well or badly. The planet and its physics have lead humanity by the nose right from the start, but we like to think that what we do is our idea, rather than reacting to what's thrown, or not thrown, at us.
 
You only read one side don’t you?

Hamas routinely disguises their own militants amongst its own civilians to ENSURE civilian deaths and create the narrative that Israel is an oppressive state.

I don’t agree with everything Israel has done, but your example here can be refuted by multiple other accounts of the same event. The use of live ammunition was not towards innocent peaceful protesters. Did peaceful protesters die as a result - yes. But, there was actual violence and attacks on the border wall - the “protesters” called it the great march of return. The objective was to infiltrate under the guise of protest, when in reality, they were marching on the city.

They admit themselves they were trying to “reclaim their homeland”.

What does that look like exactly? Hundreds of thousands of Palestinians flowing into Israel to “reclaim their homeland”? Would they just live on the street or buy land? Or more likely start descending upon the homes of Israelis in an attempt to “reclaim” their land?

I want to know where these people all lived? What are their addresses? Is that what they are trying to reclaim?

No different from an aboriginal family turning up at your doorstep and saying, righto whitey, this was my land. Off you go.

How would you even manage such a thing fairly?

Who bears the burden of proof?

What about Cyprus? Should everyone in Cyprus just walk into the Turkish controlled part and displace the people living there for 50 years? I’m sure they’d like to, but it’s done and gone, despite no other country recognising the Turkish part as a legitimate state. Israel is recognised.

These matters are far more complicated than how one “feels” about things. Often there are 2 sides that feel 100% right and justified in their actions. You will not find a solution that sees both sides 100% happy.

But please, do not forget. The eradication of the Jews is in much Islamic doctrine - particularly radical groups. As long as the Jews and radical Muslims exist, you will see these attacks. You will also see Israel defend against them. Some will be justified, some will be paranoia, but when the enemy states their reason for existing is to eradicate you at all costs, you would be a little paranoid too.

Try to broaden your reading. Don’t just stump up one article from 2019 as the basis for your whole opinion on a complicated matter.
 
If anyone is interested in sources of information outside of our mainstream media I.e ABC news, channel 9 or US news that haven’t been influenced by “israel/ Zionist lobby”here are some good sauces 😉:










Sauces are from both sides 😊
 



I think all these sauces are contributing to the Israel Lobby losing its pro Israeli influence and misinformation on US and western media
 
I hope people realize that world war 3 was predicated to start in the Middle East and spread from there.
no. There won't ever be a WW3.

There are many factors in the modern international political world different to post WW2. The main one being Nuclear weapons and 'MAD'. Thanks to Jack Kennedy and RFK during the CMC that sort of situation won't ever happen again.

Other issues that come to mind are:

  • Golden straitjacket Jacket
  • Rodrick's Trilemma
  • Weaponised interdependence
  • SWIFT messaging sanctions - the pain was real when i was in Tajikistan and Iran...having to carry wads of US dollar bills and not being able to use an ATM

But yeah that's unfort led to proxy and smaller scale wars... israel (USA) etc etc
 
Last edited:
no. There won't ever be a WW3.

There are many factors in the modern international political world different to post WW2. The main one being Nuclear weapons and 'MAD'. Thanks to Jack Kennedy and RFK during the CMC that sort of situation won't ever happen again.

Other issues that come to mind are:

  • Golden Straight Jacket
  • Rodrick's Trilemma
  • Weaponised interdependence
  • SWIFT messaging sanctions - the pain was real when i was in Tajikistan and Iran...having to carry wads of US dollar bills and not being able to use an ATM

But yeah that's unfort led to proxy and smaller scale wars... israel (USA) etc etc
You would understand these issues better than me and Im sure all of those situations above are valid, but what I think is equally valid is that if Israels existence is ever seriously threatened, if Hamas, Hezbollah & Iran attacked them in a serious and coordinated fashion and make serious inroads into Israel itself, all those theories and philosophies go out the window. Israel will not go quietly in the night, they will unleash.
 
You would understand these issues better than me and Im sure all of those situations above are valid, but what I think is equally valid is that if Israels existence is ever seriously threatened, if Hamas, Hezbollah & Iran attacked them in a serious and coordinated fashion and make serious inroads into Israel itself, all those theories and philosophies go out the window. Israel will not go quietly in the night, they will unleash.
I tihnk they've been attacking each other in a serious coordinated fashion for a long time (more so Israel imo) but yeah....like umm..

operation pillar of defense, operation protective edge and the worst one cast lead...still doesn't mean it will lead to WW3 brother...more proxy wars like Vietnam and Ukraine...
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Staff online

Back
Top