America - Gun Control

[tiger05premier]

Just one question I've always wanted to ask.

Where are all these gun loving yanks that buy their guns for protection when some halfwit starts shooting everyone in site.

I don't know anything about their laws on guns but just once i would love to see a story where this loving family man out with his family stopped a massacre by shooting the nutter.

Happens more than you would think …

http://www.breitbart.com/2nd-amendment/2016/12/29/20-times-bad-guys-guns-stopped-armed-citizens-2016/

Cheers Abraham

 

[Abraham]

Does anybody else wonder whether this incident was actually as reported…

i.e. a retired accountant in his mid-60's, extremely wealthy, and with literally zero criminal record, would just decide to purchase 20 + weapons and shoot out of his hotel window in vegas, then kill himself before police could get to him?

Skepticism is probably a healthy position to take in alot of these instances.

 

[Geo]

No problem with the right to bear Arms..

Big problem with nut cases able to purchase them with the morning cornflakes…

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Does anybody else wonder whether this incident was actually as reported…

i.e. a retired accountant in his mid-60's, extremely wealthy, and with literally zero criminal record, would just decide to purchase 20 + weapons and shoot out of his hotel window in vegas, then kill himself before police could get to him?

Skepticism is probably a healthy position to take in alot of these instances.

Scepticism is fair enough, some of these ridiculous conspiracy theories floating around are just nonsense though.

Just because the bloke is rich and hasn't committed crime before it does not mean he is immune to snapping and wiping a whole bunch of people out. Could have easily had unresolved mental health problems as many don't seek help.

Elliot Rodger grew up affluent and never committed a crime before going on a rampage. Only after his mental health issues sprung to light.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

Just one question I've always wanted to ask.

Where are all these gun loving yanks that buy their guns for protection when some halfwit starts shooting everyone in site.

I don't know anything about their laws on guns but just once i would love to see a story where this loving family man out with his family stopped a massacre by shooting the nutter.

Happens more than you would think …

http://www.breitbart.com/2nd-amendment/2016/12/29/20-times-bad-guys-guns-stopped-armed-citizens-2016/

I doubt there is a less credible news source outside of north korea than the one you are quoting.

Fox Noise goes close.

 

[Abraham]

Does anybody else wonder whether this incident was actually as reported…

i.e. a retired accountant in his mid-60's, extremely wealthy, and with literally zero criminal record, would just decide to purchase 20 + weapons and shoot out of his hotel window in vegas, then kill himself before police could get to him?

Skepticism is probably a healthy position to take in alot of these instances.

Scepticism is fair enough, some of these ridiculous conspiracy theories floating around are just nonsense though.

Just because the bloke is rich and hasn't committed crime before it does not mean he is immune to snapping and wiping a whole bunch of people out. Could have easily had unresolved mental health problems as many don't seek help.

Elliot Rodger grew up affluent and never committed a crime before going on a rampage. Only after his mental health issues sprung to light.

I'm not citing Alex Jones and his Bolshevik theories here… just some inconsistencies with the official version of events, and some coincidences that make me think this bloke was the perfect fall guy.

- I have seen videos of gun fire coming from the 4th floor of the hotel. Could be something other than gun fire, but it is in perfect synch with the sound of the gun fire.
- People staying at other hotels reporting seeing simultaneous shooting incidents at those hotels, which have gained no media coverage and suggest involvement of multiple shooters. Again, not believing them without evidence, but definitely strange.
- I was sent pictures of the crime scene, and the now dead gunman is laying next to a magnum handgun he supposedly used to shoot himself with. Now a magnum would have practically exploded his head, but this guy's head was perfectly intact except for some blood. So how was he shot, since it couldn't have been with the handgun laying next to him?

Just some observations that make me quietly skeptical in the absence of definitive proof one way or the other.

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Does anybody else wonder whether this incident was actually as reported…

i.e. a retired accountant in his mid-60's, extremely wealthy, and with literally zero criminal record, would just decide to purchase 20 + weapons and shoot out of his hotel window in vegas, then kill himself before police could get to him?

Skepticism is probably a healthy position to take in alot of these instances.

Scepticism is fair enough, some of these ridiculous conspiracy theories floating around are just nonsense though.

Just because the bloke is rich and hasn't committed crime before it does not mean he is immune to snapping and wiping a whole bunch of people out. Could have easily had unresolved mental health problems as many don't seek help.

Elliot Rodger grew up affluent and never committed a crime before going on a rampage. Only after his mental health issues sprung to light.

I'm not citing Alex Jones and his Bolshevik theories here… just some inconsistencies with the official version of events, and some coincidences that make me think this bloke was the perfect fall guy.

- I have seen videos of gun fire coming from the 4th floor of the hotel. Could be something other than gun fire, but it is in perfect synch with the sound of the gun fire.
- People staying at other hotels reporting seeing simultaneous shooting incidents at those hotels, which have gained no media coverage and suggest involvement of multiple shooters. Again, not believing them without evidence, but definitely strange.
- I was sent pictures of the crime scene, and the now dead gunman is laying next to a magnum handgun he supposedly used to shoot himself with. Now a magnum would have practically exploded his head, but this guy's head was perfectly intact except for some blood. So how was he shot, since it couldn't have been with the handgun laying next to him?

Just some observations that make me quietly skeptical in the absence of definitive proof one way or the other.

Yeah well given they're only still piecing it together so it may take time for the dots to join. A bit early to be calling BS on the events when they haven't been fully determined.

 

[Abraham]

I'm not citing Alex Jones and his Bolshevik theories here… just some inconsistencies with the official version of events, and some coincidences that make me think this bloke was the perfect fall guy.

- I have seen videos of gun fire coming from the 4th floor of the hotel. Could be something other than gun fire, but it is in perfect synch with the sound of the gun fire.
- People staying at other hotels reporting seeing simultaneous shooting incidents at those hotels, which have gained no media coverage and suggest involvement of multiple shooters. Again, not believing them without evidence, but definitely strange.
- I was sent pictures of the crime scene, and the now dead gunman is laying next to a magnum handgun he supposedly used to shoot himself with. Now a magnum would have practically exploded his head, but this guy's head was perfectly intact except for some blood. So how was he shot, since it couldn't have been with the handgun laying next to him?

Just some observations that make me quietly skeptical in the absence of definitive proof one way or the other.

Yeah well given they're only still piecing it together so it may take time for the dots to join. A bit early to be calling BS on the events when they haven't been fully determined.

Not calling BS … just skeptical at this stage.

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Fair enough.

 

[innsaneink]

Looks like enclosed windows from ground floor to the top…was there a broken window on the 4th floor?
Ive seen the vids, I really see nothing other than someones imagination

As for it sounding like some shots are closer than others, I think the fact he shot from two windows, one at a different angle (around a almost 90' corner) might have something to do with the acoustics

 

[Spartan117]

We have a good thing here in Aus,

In general I wouldn't want to bring up a family anywhere else.

 

[tsjonathan]

I'm not citing Alex Jones and his Bolshevik theories here… just some inconsistencies with the official version of events, and some coincidences that make me think this bloke was the perfect fall guy.

- I have seen videos of gun fire coming from the 4th floor of the hotel. Could be something other than gun fire, but it is in perfect synch with the sound of the gun fire.
- People staying at other hotels reporting seeing simultaneous shooting incidents at those hotels, which have gained no media coverage and suggest involvement of multiple shooters. Again, not believing them without evidence, but definitely strange.
- I was sent pictures of the crime scene, and the now dead gunman is laying next to a magnum handgun he supposedly used to shoot himself with. Now a magnum would have practically exploded his head, but this guy's head was perfectly intact except for some blood. So how was he shot, since it couldn't have been with the handgun laying next to him?

Just some observations that make me quietly skeptical in the absence of definitive proof one way or the other.

Yeah well given they're only still piecing it together so it may take time for the dots to join. A bit early to be calling BS on the events when they haven't been fully determined.

Not calling BS … just skeptical at this stage.

im quite convinced sandy hook was a fake

 

[voice_of_reason]

A very thought provoking post. You could extrapolate the basis of most gun control arguments to cover off what we'd counter an alcohol ban with. I will say though that there's one significant underlying difference and that is comparing alcohol to an implement which it's express intent is to kill and maim.

Agreed. Of course it wasn't meant to compare guns and alcohol as equivalent, more so to relate how ingrained culture can make seemingly rational decisions difficult or impossible.
As you say, the arguments would be nearly identical "You can't take our alcohol, it's been part of our culture since the first fleet!"
America is a strange place - god fearing, scared and paranoid people who can buy a military weapon at the local department store. What could possibly go wrong?

 

[tsjonathan]

A very thought provoking post. You could extrapolate the basis of most gun control arguments to cover off what we'd counter an alcohol ban with. I will say though that there's one significant underlying difference and that is comparing alcohol to an implement which it's express intent is to kill and maim.

Agreed. Of course it wasn't meant to compare guns and alcohol as equivalent, more so to relate how ingrained culture can make seemingly rational decisions difficult or impossible.
As you say, the arguments would be nearly identical "You can't take our alcohol, it's been part of our culture since the first fleet!"
America is a strange place - god fearing, scared and paranoid people who can buy a military weapon at the local department store. What could possibly go wrong?

we're lucky generally all Australians think along the same lines.

American's are not God fearing though. My other side of the family won't shut the hell up about Jesus.

 

[voice_of_reason]

we're lucky generally all Australians think along the same lines.
American's are not God fearing though. My other side of the family won't shut the hell up about Jesus.

Actually, that's what God fearing is - devoutly religious.

 

[sheer64]

Does anybody else wonder whether this incident was actually as reported…

i.e. a retired accountant in his mid-60's, extremely wealthy, and with literally zero criminal record, would just decide to purchase 20 + weapons and shoot out of his hotel window in vegas, then kill himself before police could get to him?

Skepticism is probably a healthy position to take in alot of these instances.

Not skeptical of how reported and it could simply be mental illness. Just got to look at the dollar figure being spent around the world as countries arm themselves to realise this problem in the USA is a significant portion of their economy. The growth has been steady no matter who has been in the Whitehouse.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

Does anybody else wonder whether this incident was actually as reported…

i.e. a retired accountant in his mid-60's, extremely wealthy, and with literally zero criminal record, would just decide to purchase 20 + weapons and shoot out of his hotel window in vegas, then kill himself before police could get to him?

Skepticism is probably a healthy position to take in alot of these instances.

I'm pretty open minded with conspiracy theories, unless they are totally idiotic like the Sandy Hook and Pizzagate conspiracies. People like Alex Jones should be locked up for promting theories that incite idiots to take the law into their own hands. As a result of those 2 conspiracies being given oxygen, one guy went and shot up the pizza place, and a woman was charged for harrassing one of the parents whose child died in the Sandy Hook massacre. Its sick, but i digress. Not saying i believe the theories about there being more shooters here, but its interesting given where people claim to have seen and heard the shots. Plus the shooters background. There are similarties here with the JFK assassination in regards to where the shots came from and how many shooters there were. Makes for interesting discussion at the very least.

 

[tsjonathan]

we're lucky generally all Australians think along the same lines.
American's are not God fearing though. My other side of the family won't shut the hell up about Jesus.

Actually, that's what God fearing is - devoutly religious.

i learnt something today!

 

[Love_the_WestsTigers]

What control ? they are out of control sadly

 

[Marshall_magic]

Until enough Americans decide enough is enough and want to change something these massacres will continue to happen. They have their regular excuses, terrorism, thugs, mental illness, and they will use these to justify what happens. Their solution to the problem is more guns.

Try reading some of the YouTube comments on videos of the footage. Someone outside the US will commemt and say how ridiculous the gun laws are, amd how the death toll is lower in their country, and all Americans getting fired up in response. One reply was "Thanks for the advice, I'll keep sleeping with my piece next to me. To paraphrase Jim Jeffries, what kind of neighbourhood are you living in, to feel the need to sleep with a gun. I've been sleeping without a gun for 30 years and I've always been safe. The moral is, never question an American about their gun. They don't don't take too kindly to it.

Piers Morgan basically got driven off TV over there on the subject, it;s ridiculous. I've never had a moment in my life where I have wished I had a gun on me, the whole gun culture will forever be a mystery to me.