Ben Elias warns critics of Wests Tigers five-eighth Mitch Moses the laughs will be on them

[Doc_Tiger]

Elias is doing Moses no favours…I wish he would just shut his mouth and move to Perth full-time never to be heard from again...

Don't do that to us.

 

[Russell]

After watching the game last Friday, what i saw from Moses was a player who knows he's under pressure (rightly or wrongly) and is trying soooo hard to make it go away. But It just isn't happening ATM. For one reason or the other he just can't have that breakout game.

I think he just needs that one very good game (like the bulldogs 2014 game) and then he can build off that.

It will come sooner or later and when it does I suspect a lot of people will have egg on their face.

If it doesn't though, will the people who are talking him up have egg on their faces?

We won't GNR - don't worry about us.
The Yoke will be on the Haters.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

After watching the game last Friday, what i saw from Moses was a player who knows he's under pressure (rightly or wrongly) and is trying soooo hard to make it go away. But It just isn't happening ATM. For one reason or the other he just can't have that breakout game.

I think he just needs that one very good game (like the bulldogs 2014 game) and then he can build off that.

It will come sooner or later and when it does I suspect a lot of people will have egg on their face.

If it doesn't though, will the people who are talking him up have egg on their faces?

We won't GNR - don't worry about us.
The Yoke will be on the Haters.

What if it isn't?

 

[cunno]

Glad to read that Siro acknowledges his need to improve, he could really put in this week ??

 

[foreveratiger]

After watching the game last Friday, what i saw from Moses was a player who knows he's under pressure (rightly or wrongly) and is trying soooo hard to make it go away. But It just isn't happening ATM. For one reason or the other he just can't have that breakout game.

I think he just needs that one very good game (like the bulldogs 2014 game) and then he can build off that.

It will come sooner or later and when it does I suspect a lot of people will have egg on their face.

If it doesn't though, will the people who are talking him up have egg on their faces?

We won't GNR - don't worry about us.
The Yoke will be on the Haters.

Russell nothing to do with hating the kid , it's more opinions on whether he will be as good as the Hype-rs suggest .
I truly hope he becomes the best 5/8th this Club has produced , we wait in hope.

 

[851]

I don't agree with everything Benny says but i'm 100% confident he is right about Mitchell. It won't be long before we are talking about his attack and not his defence. Has he even played 20 games yet? He is a rookie in a very inexperienced team.

If we don't cut even in possession we are in trouble. If we give up repeat sets close to the line it is almost impossible for a guy who isn't fully develop strength wise and is 80kg to consistently stop dead someone 100kg + running at full pace. He is not shirking the task like Marshall and Prince used to.

Lockyer, Barba etc. were all being hidden at 1 at a similar stage, DCE was playing QLD state cup, Cooper Cronk wasn't heard of, JT was shipped off to NQ for being too small. Terry Lamb would of been playing 3rd grade.

Terry Lamb was basically kicked out of the dogs at 18 because he was too little.
He went to wests and after 7 games went straight into 1st grade at 18,played 4 straight years didn't miss a game,played origin and won the dally M player of the year before the dogs bought him back.
So he was nothing like Moses at all,he went to 1st grade at 18 and starred straight away.

 

[goldcoast_tiger]

I don't think he has been bad at all but I think its too early to state that he is going to be a star. I do think that he will be a good player but its guesswork at the moment.

I don't think it's too early.

Mitchell is going to be a star.

Doesn't seem to be too early for some on here to say he's a dud.

Why not the reverse?

Just because someone says that they doubt all the superstar hype that's been written about him , doesn't mean they necessarily think that he will be a dud.
I can only speak for myself and I don't know either way , but I believe that whatever level he eventually reaches, will be harder to reach because the club has rushed him into the team, before he is ready. I also hope that he doesn't suffer any setbacks to his career because of the same thing.
I'm sick of hearing the old" if he's good enough , then he's old enough"
In this age of professionalism , most clubs have more sense than that.

 

[goldcoast_tiger]

After watching the game last Friday, what i saw from Moses was a player who knows he's under pressure (rightly or wrongly) and is trying soooo hard to make it go away. But It just isn't happening ATM. For one reason or the other he just can't have that breakout game.

I think he just needs that one very good game (like the bulldogs 2014 game) and then he can build off that.

It will come sooner or later and when it does I suspect a lot of people will have egg on their face.

If it doesn't though, will the people who are talking him up have egg on their faces?

We won't GNR - don't worry about us.
The Yoke will be on the Haters.

What if it isn't?

We just wait another two or three years for another "next big thing". Lol.
Isn't it funny now , that if you don't agree with the cheer squad, then you must hate someone, some people hate differing opinions….oops lol

 

[Geo]

I can't see where anyone said they hate Moses….

 

[happy_tiger]

I can't see where anyone said they hate Moses….

Hobbo does ,detests him

 

[goldcoast_tiger]

I don't agree with everything Benny says but i'm 100% confident he is right about Mitchell. It won't be long before we are talking about his attack and not his defence. Has he even played 20 games yet? He is a rookie in a very inexperienced team.

If we don't cut even in possession we are in trouble. If we give up repeat sets close to the line it is almost impossible for a guy who isn't fully develop strength wise and is 80kg to consistently stop dead someone 100kg + running at full pace. He is not shirking the task like Marshall and Prince used to.

Lockyer, Barba etc. were all being hidden at 1 at a similar stage, DCE was playing QLD state cup, Cooper Cronk wasn't heard of, JT was shipped off to NQ for being too small. Terry Lamb would of been playing 3rd grade.

Terry Lamb was basically kicked out of the dogs at 18 because he was too little.
He went to wests and after 7 games went straight into 1st grade at 18,played 4 straight years didn't miss a game,played origin and won the dally M player of the year before the dogs bought him back.
So he was nothing like Moses at all,he went to 1st grade at 18 and starred straight away.[/

Do you seriously believe that Moses is as good as Lamb was when he came into 1st grade???
I can't understand why so many want to pile so much pressure on him .
Lower grade form doesn't always transform into First grade form, and all this talk about Stars and Origin Playersmay be okay after he's managed to hold a first grade position for a season or two , but at the moment, I'd be happy if he can string a few good games together

 

[GNR4LIFE]

We just wait another two or three years for another "next big thing". Lol.
Isn't it funny now , that if you don't agree with the cheer squad, then you must hate someone, some people hate differing opinions….oops lol

And the even more desperate ones try and turn it into a Wests v Balmain thing.

 

[Russell]

I don't agree with everything Benny says but i'm 100% confident he is right about Mitchell. It won't be long before we are talking about his attack and not his defence. Has he even played 20 games yet? He is a rookie in a very inexperienced team.

If we don't cut even in possession we are in trouble. If we give up repeat sets close to the line it is almost impossible for a guy who isn't fully develop strength wise and is 80kg to consistently stop dead someone 100kg + running at full pace. He is not shirking the task like Marshall and Prince used to.

Lockyer, Barba etc. were all being hidden at 1 at a similar stage, DCE was playing QLD state cup, Cooper Cronk wasn't heard of, JT was shipped off to NQ for being too small. Terry Lamb would of been playing 3rd grade.

Terry Lamb was basically kicked out of the dogs at 18 because he was too little.
He went to wests and after 7 games went straight into 1st grade at 18,played 4 straight years didn't miss a game,played origin and won the dally M player of the year before the dogs bought him back.
So he was nothing like Moses at all,he went to 1st grade at 18 and starred straight away.[/

Do you seriously believe that Moses is as good as Lamb was when he came into 1st grade???
I can't understand why so many want to pile so much pressure on him .
Lower grade form doesn't always transform into First grade form, and all this talk about Stars and Origin Playersmay be okay after he's managed to hold a first grade position for a season or two , but at the moment, I'd be happy if he can string a few good games together

Haters was a turn of phrase to encompass "Don't think he'll make it", "Don't see what everyone sees in him", "He's only there because of who he is related to" etc. etc.

I don't get the expectations put on him at the moment either. He is not Terry Lamb (Thank God - but that was another era), he's not a Lockyer or anyone else. He is Mitchell Moses with all his attributes and all his faults. He is doing his best for us and I for one think he is delivering in his limited capacity at the moment.

Some people are expecting miracles - Taylor has him on a tight leash ( he will let him go when he is ready, not when we are ready). He is working on his defence and I think he is doing well, seeing he is not getting too much help from the backrowers.

He just needed Elias to shoot his mouth off at the moment - He would've been better off trying to make Balmain solvent again ( make up for what he did) rather than put more pressure on Mitchell.

As for putting back in the NSW cup - forget it. You do that if you don't want him anymore. He is so far in front of all the halves in that comp. they wouldn't hit him with a cannon. So it would not do his confidence any good, he would not learn anything from inferior players or coaches - what would be the point?

He will only learn to play to NRL standard if he plays NRL. We have to put up with some deficiencies whilst he gains the experience - it is long term. I'm in are you?

 

[Tony33]

After watching the game last Friday, what i saw from Moses was a player who knows he's under pressure (rightly or wrongly) and is trying soooo hard to make it go away. But It just isn't happening ATM. For one reason or the other he just can't have that breakout game.

I think he just needs that one very good game (like the bulldogs 2014 game) and then he can build off that.

It will come sooner or later and when it does I suspect a lot of people will have egg on their face.

If it doesn't though, will the people who are talking him up have egg on their faces?

Fair question and I'd be inclined to say yes.

I'm not talking him up I'm just choosing to believe in his ability and give him the time that the experts (Gus, Joey, JT) believe he deserves.

I don't think he is playing 'that' badly, I just haven't seen the translation of his game from lower grades to the NRL. That doesn't mean it won't come..

When experts like Gus, Joey Johns, Sterlo and his very own coach (who also happened to be a pretty decent half in his day) make a point of stating that he will be a great player when the time is right, I tend to want to believe it.

It's not as if he can't kick, pass or run because I've seen him execute all those skills to perfection in lower grades, it will come in the NRL when he feels comfortable and isn't playing under pressure every week.

Form is temporary but class is permanent and believe me this kid is class.

Patience is a virtue and i really don't think the expectations being placed on our 20 year old halves is fair because its not their fault that they find themselves in this situation. Blame the club for blooding them at the same time in an already extraordinarily young squad and making them the generals of a team who is made up of players who are also finding their feet.

Believe me, both our halves will be great. Not this year, maybe not even next but by 2017 i seriously think they will be pushing for origin selection.

I know people are sick of waiting, but if they do end up the players i think they will then I'm more then willing to wait another 12 months.

Go Tigers :sign:

 

[goldcoast_tiger]

I don't agree with everything Benny says but i'm 100% confident he is right about Mitchell. It won't be long before we are talking about his attack and not his defence. Has he even played 20 games yet? He is a rookie in a very inexperienced team.

If we don't cut even in possession we are in trouble. If we give up repeat sets close to the line it is almost impossible for a guy who isn't fully develop strength wise and is 80kg to consistently stop dead someone 100kg + running at full pace. He is not shirking the task like Marshall and Prince used to.

Lockyer, Barba etc. were all being hidden at 1 at a similar stage, DCE was playing QLD state cup, Cooper Cronk wasn't heard of, JT was shipped off to NQ for being too small. Terry Lamb would of been playing 3rd grade.

Terry Lamb was basically kicked out of the dogs at 18 because he was too little.
He went to wests and after 7 games went straight into 1st grade at 18,played 4 straight years didn't miss a game,played origin and won the dally M player of the year before the dogs bought him back.
So he was nothing like Moses at all,he went to 1st grade at 18 and starred straight away.[/

Do you seriously believe that Moses is as good as Lamb was when he came into 1st grade???
I can't understand why so many want to pile so much pressure on him .
Lower grade form doesn't always transform into First grade form, and all this talk about Stars and Origin Playersmay be okay after he's managed to hold a first grade position for a season or two , but at the moment, I'd be happy if he can string a few good games together

Haters was a turn of phrase to encompass "Don't think he'll make it", "Don't see what everyone sees in him", "He's only there because of who he is related to" etc. etc.

I don't get the expectations put on him at the moment either. He is not Terry Lamb (Thank God - but that was another era), he's not a Lockyer or anyone else. He is Mitchell Moses with all his attributes and all his faults. He is doing his best for us and I for one think he is delivering in his limited capacity at the moment.

Some people are expecting miracles - Taylor has him on a tight leash ( he will let him go when he is ready, not when we are ready). He is working on his defence and I think he is doing well, seeing he is not getting too much help from the backrowers.

He just needed Elias to shoot his mouth off at the moment - He would've been better off trying to make Balmain solvent again ( make up for what he did) rather than put more pressure on Mitchell.

As for putting back in the NSW cup - forget it. You do that if you don't want him anymore. He is so far in front of all the halves in that comp. they wouldn't hit him with a cannon. So it would not do his confidence any good, he would not learn anything from inferior players or coaches - what would be the point?

He will only learn to play to NRL standard if he plays NRL. We have to put up with some deficiencies whilst he gains the experience - it is long term. I'm in are you?

I'm not in or out of anything.
Plenty of , if not most good players have had a spell in reserve grade and have not suffered from it, it's not a case of not wanting him at all. It's about bringing him up at the right time for him( not because we are desperate for a 5/8)
If he doesn't make it he won't have been the first kid to fall by the wayside , because he was promoted too soon.
If we were a stronger team ((like the Roosters for example) they may get away with trying to turn two kids into first grade halves at the same time. But I don't see us as that sort of team.
There's a hell of a difference between first grade and reserve grade. And being a star in first grade can mean nothing when you hit first grade.
And all I'm going on is his form now, nowhere else. And whether he willmake it or not, no one knows yet. And I assume that all supporters want that to happen. But to blindly believe that because he has starred in lower grades , he is going to do the same in first grade is nieve , to say the least .
My problem with Moses isn't a personal thing with him.
It's about the way the club has rushed him into first grade, so we'll just have to differ on that one
Cheers

 

[Geo]

Little confused here GCT…in this weeks team thread you posted that Reserve Graders often play better in FG cause they are playing with better players when given the chance.....Now Moses who has proved he can play well in that grade last year needs to go back...?

 

[goldcoast_tiger]

After watching the game last Friday, what i saw from Moses was a player who knows he's under pressure (rightly or wrongly) and is trying soooo hard to make it go away. But It just isn't happening ATM. For one reason or the other he just can't have that breakout game.

I think he just needs that one very good game (like the bulldogs 2014 game) and then he can build off that.

It will come sooner or later and when it does I suspect a lot of people will have egg on their face.

If it doesn't though, will the people who are talking him up have egg on their faces?

Fair question and I'd be inclined to say yes.

I'm not talking him up I'm just choosing to believe in his ability and give him the time that the experts (Gus, Joey, JT) believe he deserves.

I don't think he is playing 'that' badly, I just haven't seen the translation of his game from lower grades to the NRL. That doesn't mean it won't come..

When experts like Gus, Joey Johns, Sterlo and his very own coach (who also happened to be a pretty decent half in his day) make a point of stating that he will be a great player when the time is right, I tend to want to believe it.

It's not as if he can't kick, pass or run because I've seen him execute all those skills to perfection in lower grades, it will come in the NRL when he feels comfortable and isn't playing under pressure every week.

Form is temporary but class is permanent and believe me this kid is class.

Patience is a virtue and i really don't think the expectations being placed on our 20 year old halves is fair because its not their fault that they find themselves in this situation. Blame the club for blooding them at the same time in an already extraordinarily young squad and making them the generals of a team who is made up of players who are also finding their feet.

Believe me, both our halves will be great. Not this year, maybe not even next but by 2017 i seriously think they will be pushing for origin selection.

I know people are sick of waiting, but if they do end up the players i think they will then I'm more then willing to wait another 12 months.

Go Tigers :sign:

t
I agree entirely with part of your post. The pressure being piled on him by the cheer squad who are hyping him up as a SOO player of future,and as a StarPlayer Is ridiculous.
On that we agree
And if you read my post in the same thread , you will see that I have never blamed Mitchell for anything, but have agreed completely with that the club is to blame for putting him in this team in particular, too soon and expecting him and Brookesto set the world alight

 

[goldcoast_tiger]

Sorry.I have no idea where that link has come from and no idea how to get rid of it, my apologies

 

[Geo]

Sorry.I have no idea where that link has come from and no idea how to get rid of it, my apologies

Fixed it…

 

[Tony33]

After watching the game last Friday, what i saw from Moses was a player who knows he's under pressure (rightly or wrongly) and is trying soooo hard to make it go away. But It just isn't happening ATM. For one reason or the other he just can't have that breakout game.

I think he just needs that one very good game (like the bulldogs 2014 game) and then he can build off that.

It will come sooner or later and when it does I suspect a lot of people will have egg on their face.

If it doesn't though, will the people who are talking him up have egg on their faces?

Fair question and I'd be inclined to say yes.

I'm not talking him up I'm just choosing to believe in his ability and give him the time that the experts (Gus, Joey, JT) believe he deserves.

I don't think he is playing 'that' badly, I just haven't seen the translation of his game from lower grades to the NRL. That doesn't mean it won't come..

When experts like Gus, Joey Johns, Sterlo and his very own coach (who also happened to be a pretty decent half in his day) make a point of stating that he will be a great player when the time is right, I tend to want to believe it.

It's not as if he can't kick, pass or run because I've seen him execute all those skills to perfection in lower grades, it will come in the NRL when he feels comfortable and isn't playing under pressure every week.

Form is temporary but class is permanent and believe me this kid is class.

Patience is a virtue and i really don't think the expectations being placed on our 20 year old halves is fair because its not their fault that they find themselves in this situation. Blame the club for blooding them at the same time in an already extraordinarily young squad and making them the generals of a team who is made up of players who are also finding their feet.

Believe me, both our halves will be great. Not this year, maybe not even next but by 2017 i seriously think they will be pushing for origin selection.

I know people are sick of waiting, but if they do end up the players i think they will then I'm more then willing to wait another 12 months.

Go Tigers :sign:

t
I agree entirely with part of your post. The pressure being piled on him by the cheer squad who are hyping him up as a SOO player of future,and as a StarPlayer Is ridiculous.
On that we agree
And if you read my post in the same thread , you will see that I have never blamed Mitchell for anything, but have agreed completely with that the club is to blame for putting him in this team in particular, too soon and expecting him and Brookesto set the world alight

The club blooded them both to soon and at the same time. There at fault for that.

BUT they are not to blame for expecting to much. If you listen to JT he keeps sending the same message. He is happy with where they are at this stage of their development and they just want them to keep building and learning their structures.

That clearly shows that the pressure isn't coming from the club. JT has even mentioned it in his last press conference saying anyone who is blaming them "clearly doesn't know football".