Coronavirus Outbreak

[jadtiger]

I note that the UK has added some of their previously unaccounted for deaths to their totals today, which takes them to the third worst number of lives lost and likely to surpass Italy very soon as well.

Whilst I expect that the true numbers from China would be up around the top, those numbers, like those of the US, the UK's are also terrible considering they both had the huge advantage of being able observe and act on the knowledge of others on the list around them that were hit by the virus earlier. Boris Johnson is probably lucky to have caught the virus for the sympathy it brings, plus the birth of his child at this time, else he would be copping plenty from both the public and press already, with worse to come as their deaths continue in coming weeks.

The UK has nearly been as much as a failure as the USA but that is hardly suprising looking at the 2 leaders.We will never get anything close to accurate figures from countries with totalitarian governments (China Russia North Korea)just to name a few.
Governments of all political persuasions hate to admit they get it wrong but are quick to give themselves praise if they fluke getting it right

 

[twentyforty]

I note that the UK has added some of their previously unaccounted for deaths to their totals today, which takes them to the third worst number of lives lost and likely to surpass Italy very soon as well.

Whilst I expect that the true numbers from China would be up around the top, those numbers, like those of the US, the UK's are also terrible considering they both had the huge advantage of being able observe and act on the knowledge of others on the list around them that were hit by the virus earlier. Boris Johnson is probably lucky to have caught the virus for the sympathy it brings, plus the birth of his child at this time, else he would be copping plenty from both the public and press already, with worse to come as their deaths continue in coming weeks.

The UK has nearly been as much as a failure as the USA but that is hardly suprising looking at the 2 leaders.We will never get anything close to accurate figures from countries with totalitarian governments (China Russia North Korea)just to name a few.
Governments of all political persuasions hate to admit they get it wrong but are quick to give themselves praise if they fluke getting it right

I guess it depends on the way you look at each country’s situation but on deaths per million of population, the UK is not fairing well at all. And New Zealand is not doing as well as Australia.

 

[happy_tiger]

I note that the UK has added some of their previously unaccounted for deaths to their totals today, which takes them to the third worst number of lives lost and likely to surpass Italy very soon as well.

Whilst I expect that the true numbers from China would be up around the top, those numbers, like those of the US, the UK's are also terrible considering they both had the huge advantage of being able observe and act on the knowledge of others on the list around them that were hit by the virus earlier. Boris Johnson is probably lucky to have caught the virus for the sympathy it brings, plus the birth of his child at this time, else he would be copping plenty from both the public and press already, with worse to come as their deaths continue in coming weeks.

The UK has nearly been as much as a failure as the USA but that is hardly suprising looking at the 2 leaders.We will never get anything close to accurate figures from countries with totalitarian governments (China Russia North Korea)just to name a few.
Governments of all political persuasions hate to admit they get it wrong but are quick to give themselves praise if they fluke getting it right

I guess it depends on the way you look at each country’s situation but on deaths per million of population, the UK is not fairing well at all. And New Zealand is not doing as well as Australia.

England seemed to preoccupied with Brexit to be honest

 

[Deleted member 3518]

What do the conspiracy theorists actually think the government is going to do to you if you download the app?

It’s not conspiracy theories mate . Do some research on it , and you will see , much like conspiracy theories of yesterday past like , Wiki leaks , Mk-ultra , this is actually true . There was a whole inquiry into Facebook last year , where amongst other things , they admitted to the nefarious use of data , and on selling to allow a foreign power to influence an election . From Huawei being caught putting spyware , I their systems (they are a huge telco systems provider worldwide ) even to wiki leaks themselves . There’s multiple easily accessed podcasts from people like Sam Harris to Jordan Peterson , to Joe Rogan , interviewing security Experts and former CIA, Facebook , Google employees , all basically saying the same thing . Your data is being sold , and on sold and sometimes to people you don’t want to have it . You can take the “well they already know everything about you stance “ which is fine , but if you dont want to give it , that’s the end .
As for examples of ways your data can be misused , I already gave that a few posts ago.

 

[cochise]

What do the conspiracy theorists actually think the government is going to do to you if you download the app?

My concern isn't really with the app, why should our government be storing data that they collect on us on server in another country that can not be protected by our legal system? This is not just the data from this app, this would be the data on things like mygov etc.

Then take the privacy issue out of it for a moment, at this point in time while our economy is falling, why would we send a contract like this overseas instead of supporting our own businesses?

 

[happy_tiger]

But they have your info the minute you log in and do anything

What you think it is coincidence that you look at buying a new car and get info all the sudden you start having car ads on your screen , or you look at Suncorp Stadium for seating and you get ads for broncos membership , Brisbane Roar membership .....

 

[Nelson]

What do the conspiracy theorists actually think the government is going to do to you if you download the app?

My concern isn't really with the app, why should our government be storing data that they collect on us on server in another country that can not be protected by our legal system? This is not just the data from this app, this would be the data on things like mygov etc.

Then take the privacy issue out of it for a moment, at this point in time while our economy is falling, why would we send a contract like this overseas instead of supporting our own businesses?

Probably because they are relying on market forces in circumstances where physical borders don't have any significance. This isn't offline storage. It is necessarily online so that it can be accessed and used. That means it can accessed from anywhere in the world. Local companies may not offer the same levels of security as overseas companies. Presumably the best counter-intrusion experts either work for governments or for the biggest companies in the world, which are not likely to include Australian companies in this field. So they go with the best (wherever they are) in the expectation that the best will, motivated by market forces, protect their data in order to protect their reputation and profitability.

 

[Tiger5150]

I note that the UK has added some of their previously unaccounted for deaths to their totals today, which takes them to the third worst number of lives lost and likely to surpass Italy very soon as well.

Whilst I expect that the true numbers from China would be up around the top, those numbers, like those of the US, the UK's are also terrible considering they both had the huge advantage of being able observe and act on the knowledge of others on the list around them that were hit by the virus earlier. Boris Johnson is probably lucky to have caught the virus for the sympathy it brings, plus the birth of his child at this time, else he would be copping plenty from both the public and press already, with worse to come as their deaths continue in coming weeks.

The UK took the wrong step by initially considering the Swedish herd immunity approach before abandoning that quickly to revert to lockdowns.

Having said that, Im not sure its entirely fair or valuable comparing different nations on case or death rates. A country like UK with incredibly dense population centres is always going to cop it worse than a Sweden or similar ( or us). Another consideration, particularly in the early days which is when the damage was actually done is that nations like the US & UK are MAJOR hubs for tourism & commerce with thousands of flights in every day, compared again to the rest of the world.

 

[Tiger5150]

I note that the UK has added some of their previously unaccounted for deaths to their totals today, which takes them to the third worst number of lives lost and likely to surpass Italy very soon as well.

Whilst I expect that the true numbers from China would be up around the top, those numbers, like those of the US, the UK's are also terrible considering they both had the huge advantage of being able observe and act on the knowledge of others on the list around them that were hit by the virus earlier. Boris Johnson is probably lucky to have caught the virus for the sympathy it brings, plus the birth of his child at this time, else he would be copping plenty from both the public and press already, with worse to come as their deaths continue in coming weeks.

The UK has nearly been as much as a failure as the USA but that is hardly suprising looking at the 2 leaders.We will never get anything close to accurate figures from countries with totalitarian governments (China Russia North Korea)just to name a few.
Governments of all political persuasions hate to admit they get it wrong but are quick to give themselves praise if they fluke getting it right

UK nearly as much as a failure as the US? The US has half the deaths per capita that the UK does.

 

[cochise]

But they have your info the minute you log in and do anything

What you think it is coincidence that you look at buying a new car and get info all the sudden you start having car ads on your screen , or you look at Suncorp Stadium for seating and you get ads for broncos membership , Brisbane Roar membership .....

I understand that completely, but that is a separate issue to our government storing the data they are collecting outside of Australia.

 

[cochise]

What do the conspiracy theorists actually think the government is going to do to you if you download the app?

My concern isn't really with the app, why should our government be storing data that they collect on us on server in another country that can not be protected by our legal system? This is not just the data from this app, this would be the data on things like mygov etc.

Then take the privacy issue out of it for a moment, at this point in time while our economy is falling, why would we send a contract like this overseas instead of supporting our own businesses?

Probably because they are relying on market forces in circumstances where physical borders don't have any significance. This isn't offline storage. It is necessarily online so that it can be accessed and used. That means it can accessed from anywhere in the world. Local companies may not offer the same levels of security as overseas companies. Presumably the best counter-intrusion experts either work for governments or for the biggest companies in the world, which are not likely to include Australian companies in this field. So they go with the best (wherever they are) in the expectation that the best will, motivated by market forces, protect their data in order to protect their reputation and profitability.

They can't protect that data from the laws of the country they are stored in.

 

[Nelson]

What do the conspiracy theorists actually think the government is going to do to you if you download the app?

My concern isn't really with the app, why should our government be storing data that they collect on us on server in another country that can not be protected by our legal system? This is not just the data from this app, this would be the data on things like mygov etc.

Then take the privacy issue out of it for a moment, at this point in time while our economy is falling, why would we send a contract like this overseas instead of supporting our own businesses?

Probably because they are relying on market forces in circumstances where physical borders don't have any significance. This isn't offline storage. It is necessarily online so that it can be accessed and used. That means it can accessed from anywhere in the world. Local companies may not offer the same levels of security as overseas companies. Presumably the best counter-intrusion experts either work for governments or for the biggest companies in the world, which are not likely to include Australian companies in this field. So they go with the best (wherever they are) in the expectation that the best will, motivated by market forces, protect their data in order to protect their reputation and profitability.

They can't protect that data from the laws of the country they are stored in.

I imagine that the companies take that into account in determining where they warehouse the data, and that the government decision makers correspondingly take that into account.

 

[Nelson]

I note that the UK has added some of their previously unaccounted for deaths to their totals today, which takes them to the third worst number of lives lost and likely to surpass Italy very soon as well.

Whilst I expect that the true numbers from China would be up around the top, those numbers, like those of the US, the UK's are also terrible considering they both had the huge advantage of being able observe and act on the knowledge of others on the list around them that were hit by the virus earlier. Boris Johnson is probably lucky to have caught the virus for the sympathy it brings, plus the birth of his child at this time, else he would be copping plenty from both the public and press already, with worse to come as their deaths continue in coming weeks.

The UK has nearly been as much as a failure as the USA but that is hardly suprising looking at the 2 leaders.We will never get anything close to accurate figures from countries with totalitarian governments (China Russia North Korea)just to name a few.
Governments of all political persuasions hate to admit they get it wrong but are quick to give themselves praise if they fluke getting it right


UK nearly as much as a failure as the US? The US has half the deaths per capita that the UK does.

UK population density: 281 people per km2
US population density: 36 people per km2

~7.8 times the population density...

 

[cochise]

What do the conspiracy theorists actually think the government is going to do to you if you download the app?

My concern isn't really with the app, why should our government be storing data that they collect on us on server in another country that can not be protected by our legal system? This is not just the data from this app, this would be the data on things like mygov etc.

Then take the privacy issue out of it for a moment, at this point in time while our economy is falling, why would we send a contract like this overseas instead of supporting our own businesses?

Probably because they are relying on market forces in circumstances where physical borders don't have any significance. This isn't offline storage. It is necessarily online so that it can be accessed and used. That means it can accessed from anywhere in the world. Local companies may not offer the same levels of security as overseas companies. Presumably the best counter-intrusion experts either work for governments or for the biggest companies in the world, which are not likely to include Australian companies in this field. So they go with the best (wherever they are) in the expectation that the best will, motivated by market forces, protect their data in order to protect their reputation and profitability.

They can't protect that data from the laws of the country they are stored in.

I imagine that the companies take that into account in determining where they warehouse the data, and that the government decision makers correspondingly take that into account.

And what happens if in a time of crisis the country where we are storing that data changes it's laws to gain access?

 

[Nelson]

What do the conspiracy theorists actually think the government is going to do to you if you download the app?

My concern isn't really with the app, why should our government be storing data that they collect on us on server in another country that can not be protected by our legal system? This is not just the data from this app, this would be the data on things like mygov etc.

Then take the privacy issue out of it for a moment, at this point in time while our economy is falling, why would we send a contract like this overseas instead of supporting our own businesses?

Probably because they are relying on market forces in circumstances where physical borders don't have any significance. This isn't offline storage. It is necessarily online so that it can be accessed and used. That means it can accessed from anywhere in the world. Local companies may not offer the same levels of security as overseas companies. Presumably the best counter-intrusion experts either work for governments or for the biggest companies in the world, which are not likely to include Australian companies in this field. So they go with the best (wherever they are) in the expectation that the best will, motivated by market forces, protect their data in order to protect their reputation and profitability.

They can't protect that data from the laws of the country they are stored in.

I imagine that the companies take that into account in determining where they warehouse the data, and that the government decision makers correspondingly take that into account.

And what happens if in a time of crisis the country where we are storing that data changes it's laws to gain access?

Why? What is this crisis that causes countries that want to attract foreign business to suddenly decide to bomb their prospects of future foreign investment by enacting capricious laws to raid foreign data? What are they going to do with it that could be worth the price they'd pay? Seems a remote possibility to me and not something I would give much weight to in the decision making process.

 

[Geo]

What do the conspiracy theorists actually think the government is going to do to you if you download the app?

My concern isn't really with the app, why should our government be storing data that they collect on us on server in another country that can not be protected by our legal system? This is not just the data from this app, this would be the data on things like mygov etc.

Then take the privacy issue out of it for a moment, at this point in time while our economy is falling, why would we send a contract like this overseas instead of supporting our own businesses?

Probably because they are relying on market forces in circumstances where physical borders don't have any significance. This isn't offline storage. It is necessarily online so that it can be accessed and used. That means it can accessed from anywhere in the world. Local companies may not offer the same levels of security as overseas companies. Presumably the best counter-intrusion experts either work for governments or for the biggest companies in the world, which are not likely to include Australian companies in this field. So they go with the best (wherever they are) in the expectation that the best will, motivated by market forces, protect their data in order to protect their reputation and profitability.

They can't protect that data from the laws of the country they are stored in.

I imagine that the companies take that into account in determining where they warehouse the data, and that the government decision makers correspondingly take that into account.

And what happens if in a time of crisis the country where we are storing that data changes it's laws to gain access?

Don't know...What does happen...?

 

[innsaneink]

But they have your info the minute you log in and do anything

What you think it is coincidence that you look at buying a new car and get info all the sudden you start having car ads on your screen , or you look at Suncorp Stadium for seating and you get ads for broncos membership , Brisbane Roar membership .....

Is this it for the average law abiding Joe?
What else should I be worried about because I use Facebook and ingram?
My really only concern is online banking which I was basically forced to accept to receive a home loan

 

[TillLindemann]

What do the conspiracy theorists actually think the government is going to do to you if you download the app?

My concern isn't really with the app, why should our government be storing data that they collect on us on server in another country that can not be protected by our legal system? This is not just the data from this app, this would be the data on things like mygov etc.

Then take the privacy issue out of it for a moment, at this point in time while our economy is falling, why would we send a contract like this overseas instead of supporting our own businesses?

Probably because they are relying on market forces in circumstances where physical borders don't have any significance. This isn't offline storage. It is necessarily online so that it can be accessed and used. That means it can accessed from anywhere in the world. Local companies may not offer the same levels of security as overseas companies. Presumably the best counter-intrusion experts either work for governments or for the biggest companies in the world, which are not likely to include Australian companies in this field. So they go with the best (wherever they are) in the expectation that the best will, motivated by market forces, protect their data in order to protect their reputation and profitability.

They can't protect that data from the laws of the country they are stored in.

I imagine that the companies take that into account in determining where they warehouse the data, and that the government decision makers correspondingly take that into account.

And what happens if in a time of crisis the country where we are storing that data changes it's laws to gain access?

Why? What is this crisis that causes countries that want to attract foreign business to suddenly decide to bomb their prospects of future foreign investment by enacting capricious laws to raid foreign data? What are they going to do with it that could be worth the price they'd pay? Seems a remote possibility to me and not something I would give much weight to in the decision making process.

Well Australia has already tried to do it - we tried to mandate backdoors in encryption. Tech companies were furious. Not sure what has become of that, if the government is still trying to implement it or not.

Dutton was a cheerleader for it.

 

[Cairnstigers]

I note that the UK has added some of their previously unaccounted for deaths to their totals today, which takes them to the third worst number of lives lost and likely to surpass Italy very soon as well.

Whilst I expect that the true numbers from China would be up around the top, those numbers, like those of the US, the UK's are also terrible considering they both had the huge advantage of being able observe and act on the knowledge of others on the list around them that were hit by the virus earlier. Boris Johnson is probably lucky to have caught the virus for the sympathy it brings, plus the birth of his child at this time, else he would be copping plenty from both the public and press already, with worse to come as their deaths continue in coming weeks.

The UK has nearly been as much as a failure as the USA but that is hardly suprising looking at the 2 leaders.We will never get anything close to accurate figures from countries with totalitarian governments (China Russia North Korea)just to name a few.
Governments of all political persuasions hate to admit they get it wrong but are quick to give themselves praise if they fluke getting it right

I guess it depends on the way you look at each country’s situation but on deaths per million of population, the UK is not fairing well at all. And New Zealand is not doing as well as Australia.

England seemed to preoccupied with Brexit to be honest

Let's hope covid doesn't last as long

 

[Cairnstigers]

But they have your info the minute you log in and do anything

What you think it is coincidence that you look at buying a new car and get info all the sudden you start having car ads on your screen , or you look at Suncorp Stadium for seating and you get ads for broncos membership , Brisbane Roar membership .....

Is this it for the average law abiding Joe?
What else should I be worried about because I use Facebook and ingram?
My really only concern is online banking which I was basically forced to accept to receive a home loan

What's Ingram
I don't have that one either