Its a player problem

[GCfan]

Lots of posts above are saying it’s a culture problem.

Culture, or more importantly, applying the cultural values in daily work activities is every employee’s (coach, player and staff) responsibility and I would say that is shockingly absent.

however without doubt the cultural health of an organisation is the responsibility of the organisation’s leadership. The board, which sits at the apex of the organisational hierarchy with ultimate authority and accountability for the organisation, is part of the organisation’s leadership along with executive management, and therefore must have the ultimate role in forming and monitoring the culture.

Not happening here.

It's not changing either.

Not till there’s a complete board revamp unfortunately

Serious question Dazza, what effect on our players will changing the board have in your opinion? I read that comment from time to time on here and to be honest I don’t understand what people mean when they say it.

 

[tigerap]

Lots of posts above are saying it’s a culture problem.

Culture, or more importantly, applying the cultural values in daily work activities is every employee’s (coach, player and staff) responsibility and I would say that is shockingly absent.

however without doubt the cultural health of an organisation is the responsibility of the organisation’s leadership. The board, which sits at the apex of the organisational hierarchy with ultimate authority and accountability for the organisation, is part of the organisation’s leadership along with executive management, and therefore must have the ultimate role in forming and monitoring the culture.

Not happening here.

It's not changing either.

Not till there’s a complete board revamp unfortunately

Serious question Dazza, what effect on our players will changing the board have in your opinion? I read that comment from time to time on here and to be honest I don’t understand what people mean when they say it.

It’s another way of saying N*I…..we need to recruit players who are prepared to spill blood for this club….we seem to recruit “soft” players who have no heart….had high hopes for Ken Mamulo, he showed me last night why the warriors didn’t want him….no urgency in every touch…plenty here said glad we didn’t get DWZ, watch him run the ball back….100 miles an hour, that’s the sort of player we need, but can’t seem to get

 

[innsaneink]

Lots of posts above are saying it’s a culture problem.

Culture, or more importantly, applying the cultural values in daily work activities is every employee’s (coach, player and staff) responsibility and I would say that is shockingly absent.

however without doubt the cultural health of an organisation is the responsibility of the organisation’s leadership. The board, which sits at the apex of the organisational hierarchy with ultimate authority and accountability for the organisation, is part of the organisation’s leadership along with executive management, and therefore must have the ultimate role in forming and monitoring the culture.

Not happening here.

Privatisation?

Nothing's changed for a decade

Some accountability externally?
NRL?
We're an important ent part in their business that side of things is humming $$$

Private ownership?

 

[GCfan]

Lots of posts above are saying it’s a culture problem.

Culture, or more importantly, applying the cultural values in daily work activities is every employee’s (coach, player and staff) responsibility and I would say that is shockingly absent.

however without doubt the cultural health of an organisation is the responsibility of the organisation’s leadership. The board, which sits at the apex of the organisational hierarchy with ultimate authority and accountability for the organisation, is part of the organisation’s leadership along with executive management, and therefore must have the ultimate role in forming and monitoring the culture.

Not happening here.

It's not changing either.

Not till there’s a complete board revamp unfortunately

Serious question Dazza, what effect on our players will changing the board have in your opinion? I read that comment from time to time on here and to be honest I don’t understand what people mean when they say it.

It’s another way of saying N*I…..we need to recruit players who are prepared to spill blood for this club….we seem to recruit “soft” players who have no heart….had high hopes for Ken Mamulo, he showed me last night why the warriors didn’t want him….no urgency in every touch

I think we’re not going to buy any players from other clubs that are prepared to spill blood for our club (or at least not enough of them anyway). I think the development path and the years it will take is the only way to achieve that mentality as the kids come through together, have that brotherhood and fight to the death for each other attitude. Sadly that takes years to develop and then you still need to keep the right ones.

 

[dazza65]

Lots of posts above are saying it’s a culture problem.

Culture, or more importantly, applying the cultural values in daily work activities is every employee’s (coach, player and staff) responsibility and I would say that is shockingly absent.

however without doubt the cultural health of an organisation is the responsibility of the organisation’s leadership. The board, which sits at the apex of the organisational hierarchy with ultimate authority and accountability for the organisation, is part of the organisation’s leadership along with executive management, and therefore must have the ultimate role in forming and monitoring the culture.

Not happening here.

It's not changing either.

Not till there’s a complete board revamp unfortunately

Serious question Dazza, what effect on our players will changing the board have in your opinion? I read that comment from time to time on here and to be honest I don’t understand what people mean when they say it.

Unfortunately, In the short term not much effect at all ?

Unfortunately cultural change takes some time. But it has to be lead by the Board. This has been seriously missing for a long time, if we even had it in the first place, I’m sure the initial and ongoing boards mostly have been leagues clubs cronies and hangers on who want the prestige and board room lunches etc.

It’s like weight loss. So much easier and enjoyable to put on weight (and quicker) than it is to lose weight. That’s hard work and usually takes longer.

It’s all about creating an environment for all employees to excel. we talk about the players not caring and them being here for the pay check- that’s indicative of a poor work environment. Good employees won’t go or stay at a poor workplace - poor or non committed ones do, because it’s easy.

In general, some of the main tenets in changing a culture are:

Clearly Define the expected culture.
Clear, succinct and constant communication with all employees around their team and individual expectations
Leadership Example - from the top dog.
Relentless Follow-up and correction (kind of like a no dickheads policy)
Most importantly, create conditions that align with the desired culture AND Accountability

All of these take time and require a Board with the required knowledge, experience and ability to undertake this; in my opinion, this board falls seriously short in all of these areas.

 

[Tigerbuck63]

We have never been successful buying other clubs players. We have only done well when we developed and bought through our own. Look who we have bought over the last few years - most have been poor and taken up large amount of our cap. We need to stop looking for blokes like tpj bj jtj and develop our own kids. More of the Alex Seyfarths and the like. Our jersey Flagg side and Reggie’s are going well - let’s keep the good ones from these teams and develop them through. Sheensy can’t come quick enough.

look at cini...cult hero one week, rough game the next then dropped....now mamaulo is here what is cini to think or do?

he should've had a longer run in the team imo

Interesting observation - Madge signed mamaulo rushed him into the team without knowing any of the plays or players. It must be disheartening for players waiting in the wings to be trumpted by a newbie.

I actually don't understand wht we signed him???

 

[Tigerbuck63]

Lots of posts above are saying it’s a culture problem.

Culture, or more importantly, applying the cultural values in daily work activities is every employee’s (coach, player and staff) responsibility and I would say that is shockingly absent.

however without doubt the cultural health of an organisation is the responsibility of the organisation’s leadership. The board, which sits at the apex of the organisational hierarchy with ultimate authority and accountability for the organisation, is part of the organisation’s leadership along with executive management, and therefore must have the ultimate role in forming and monitoring the culture.

Not happening here.

It's not changing either.

Not till there’s a complete board revamp unfortunately

Serious question Dazza, what effect on our players will changing the board have in your opinion? I read that comment from time to time on here and to be honest I don’t understand what people mean when they say it.

Unfortunately, In the short term not much effect at all ?

Unfortunately cultural change takes some time. But it has to be lead by the Board. This has been seriously missing for a long time, if we even had it in the first place, I’m sure the initial and ongoing boards mostly have been leagues clubs cronies and hangers on who want the prestige and board room lunches etc.

It’s like weight loss. So much easier and enjoyable to put on weight (and quicker) than it is to lose weight. That’s hard work and usually takes longer.

It’s all about creating an environment for all employees to excel. we talk about the players not caring and them being here for the pay check- that’s indicative of a poor work environment. Good employees won’t go or stay at a poor workplace - poor or non committed ones do, because it’s easy.

In general, some of the main tenets in changing a culture are:

Clearly Define the expected culture.
Clear, succinct and constant communication with all employees around their team and individual expectations
Leadership Example - from the top dog.
Relentless Follow-up and correction (kind of like a no dickheads policy)
Most importantly, create conditions that align with the desired culture AND Accountability

All of these take time and require a Board with the required knowledge, experience and ability to undertake this; in my opinion, this board falls seriously short in all of these areas.

Agree completly however add that its now just only the board, include the chairman, CEO, Coach and senior players.
When the chairman steps in and signs Nofo for 4 more years i don't see the value in that. they say his is a great club man but wow his defense is a major libility and when you have Mybe and Roberts on the same side that's where we started getting carved up last night.

 

[innsaneink]

We have never been successful buying other clubs players. We have only done well when we developed and bought through our own. Look who we have bought over the last few years - most have been poor and taken up large amount of our cap. We need to stop looking for blokes like tpj bj jtj and develop our own kids. More of the Alex Seyfarths and the like. Our jersey Flagg side and Reggie’s are going well - let’s keep the good ones from these teams and develop them through. Sheensy can’t come quick enough.

look at cini...cult hero one week, rough game the next then dropped....now mamaulo is here what is cini to think or do?

he should've had a longer run in the team imo

Interesting observation - Madge signed mamaulo rushed him into the team without knowing any of the plays or players. It must be disheartening for players waiting in the wings to be trumpted by a newbie.

I actually don't understand wht we signed him???

He's an international level player... Saw a couple of glimpses last night

 

[BAGNF05]

If we have reached a point where there is alot of finger pointing within the ranks, we are in trouble.

I understand what you mean but I also get the shits seeing players keep making stupid errors and team mates going over to give them a cuddle. Teams with a winning culture and set standards can afford to do that but for us I think we need to strip things back and drive some standards about what is accepted and what isn’t. We don’t need to pull apart but there should be enough buy in from players to understand when you stuff up repeatedly it’s not acceptable.

Defensive effort is not as clear cut as ball handling. You can deny a lack of defensive effort whereas u can’t deny a handling error. I feel the finger pointing would be more around defense.

 

[GCfan]

Lots of posts above are saying it’s a culture problem.

Culture, or more importantly, applying the cultural values in daily work activities is every employee’s (coach, player and staff) responsibility and I would say that is shockingly absent.

however without doubt the cultural health of an organisation is the responsibility of the organisation’s leadership. The board, which sits at the apex of the organisational hierarchy with ultimate authority and accountability for the organisation, is part of the organisation’s leadership along with executive management, and therefore must have the ultimate role in forming and monitoring the culture.

Not happening here.

It's not changing either.

Not till there’s a complete board revamp unfortunately

Serious question Dazza, what effect on our players will changing the board have in your opinion? I read that comment from time to time on here and to be honest I don’t understand what people mean when they say it.

Unfortunately, In the short term not much effect at all ?

Unfortunately cultural change takes some time. But it has to be lead by the Board. This has been seriously missing for a long time, if we even had it in the first place, I’m sure the initial and ongoing boards mostly have been leagues clubs cronies and hangers on who want the prestige and board room lunches etc.

It’s like weight loss. So much easier and enjoyable to put on weight (and quicker) than it is to lose weight. That’s hard work and usually takes longer.

It’s all about creating an environment for all employees to excel. we talk about the players not caring and them being here for the pay check- that’s indicative of a poor work environment. Good employees won’t go or stay at a poor workplace - poor or non committed ones do, because it’s easy.

In general, some of the main tenets in changing a culture are:

Clearly Define the expected culture.
Clear, succinct and constant communication with all employees around their team and individual expectations
Leadership Example - from the top dog.
Relentless Follow-up and correction (kind of like a no dickheads policy)
Most importantly, create conditions that align with the desired culture AND Accountability

All of these take time and require a Board with the required knowledge, experience and ability to undertake this; in my opinion, this board falls seriously short in all of these areas.

That all makes sense if we were a normal commercial organisation. But it looks like there’s a real difficulty in applying accountability at board level in a sporting organisation which appears to operate in two distinct halves. My understanding is that the board generally manages the commercial side of the organisation and whilst they would have oversight and probably ultimate approval in football operations appointments like Pascoe, Hartigan and Madge, I would have thought they’d have little say in day to day standards within the playing group. With a contract HR structure, unless theres performance clauses built into contracts it really hard to hold people to account through getting rid of players. The second option of demoting players for poor performance works if the club has adequate depth which probably doesn’t have right now either. I think that a high performance culture needs to be created by the Football department driven by Hartigan and Madge (and maybe Sheens). The challenge is holding each other to account. How do we do it when there’s few levers to pull.
Maybe Fox should have done a docco on the Storm ……

 

[mike]

If we have reached a point where there is alot of finger pointing within the ranks, we are in trouble.

I understand what you mean but I also get the shits seeing players keep making stupid errors and team mates going over to give them a cuddle. Teams with a winning culture and set standards can afford to do that but for us I think we need to strip things back and drive some standards about what is accepted and what isn’t. We don’t need to pull apart but there should be enough buy in from players to understand when you stuff up repeatedly it’s not acceptable.

Defensive effort is not as clear cut as ball handling. You can deny a lack of defensive effort whereas u can’t deny a handling error. I feel the finger pointing would be more around defense.

Keeping possession is part of your defence. Not giving away easy balls, dropping passes, stepping into touch, sloppy play the balls. It's all part of the same problem. It's on the players.

 

[dazza65]

Lots of posts above are saying it’s a culture problem.

Culture, or more importantly, applying the cultural values in daily work activities is every employee’s (coach, player and staff) responsibility and I would say that is shockingly absent.

however without doubt the cultural health of an organisation is the responsibility of the organisation’s leadership. The board, which sits at the apex of the organisational hierarchy with ultimate authority and accountability for the organisation, is part of the organisation’s leadership along with executive management, and therefore must have the ultimate role in forming and monitoring the culture.

Not happening here.

Privatisation?

Nothing's changed for a decade

Some accountability externally?
NRL?
We're an important ent part in their business that side of things is humming $$$

Private ownership?

Yes nothing’s changed in 12 years. I’m not saying it is Wests but maybe that’s not the right model.

Privatisation is possible (look at the Bronco’s with Porky and prior to listing on the exchange) but generally football clubs I a market the size of Australia is not a great investment which is why Harry has never bitten the bullet.

We do make a lot of money both within the organisation and for the NRL and I have mentioned elsewhere that the people responsible have done a great job there, but money is a means to an end, not the destination. They have failed miserably in creating a top 4 winning team.

Is it in the interest of the NRL to have 16 top4 teams or are they happy to have the elite and the also fans so long as us suckers keep dreaming and pumping money into our clubs?

If it was in their interest we would see major changes in player management like drafts, performance based salaries etc etc

All I know is that I have started and run three different companies /organisations over my working life and from what I see, admittedly from the outer and obviously not privy to all of the internal politics and alliances, I wouldn’t be running the football club in the same way.

 

[BAGNF05]

If we have reached a point where there is alot of finger pointing within the ranks, we are in trouble.

I understand what you mean but I also get the shits seeing players keep making stupid errors and team mates going over to give them a cuddle. Teams with a winning culture and set standards can afford to do that but for us I think we need to strip things back and drive some standards about what is accepted and what isn’t. We don’t need to pull apart but there should be enough buy in from players to understand when you stuff up repeatedly it’s not acceptable.

Defensive effort is not as clear cut as ball handling. You can deny a lack of defensive effort whereas u can’t deny a handling error. I feel the finger pointing would be more around defense.


Keeping possession is part of your defence. Not giving away easy balls, dropping passes, stepping into touch, sloppy play the balls. It's all part of the same problem. It's on the players.

Ordinarily I would agree with you but to start both halves last night our defense was that bad our offense didn’t even get a sniff.

 

[Merlot]

I'm not a mod lads..
But, profanity is not permitted.

Here's a friendly reminder,
We're all on the same team.

I don't want ANYONE banned over petty squabbles, profanity, or any thing like that.

I'd suggest stop quoting the post with profanity.

And if @hobbo1 , @happy_tiger or myself were mods, this would've been tidied up already.

Let's keep this place clean.


Where are the mods?
That post has been there for an hour.

thats out there,it would be fun ,

 

[hobbo1]

If we have reached a point where there is alot of finger pointing within the ranks, we are in trouble.

I understand what you mean but I also get the shits seeing players keep making stupid errors and team mates going over to give them a cuddle. Teams with a winning culture and set standards can afford to do that but for us I think we need to strip things back and drive some standards about what is accepted and what isn’t. We don’t need to pull apart but there should be enough buy in from players to understand when you stuff up repeatedly it’s not acceptable.

Defensive effort is not as clear cut as ball handling. You can deny a lack of defensive effort whereas u can’t deny a handling error. I feel the finger pointing would be more around defense.


Keeping possession is part of your defence. Not giving away easy balls, dropping passes, stepping into touch, sloppy play the balls. It's all part of the same problem. It's on the players.

Ordinarily I would agree with you but to start both halves last night our defense was that bad our offense didn’t even get a sniff.

Because the errors we make snowballs
40-0 at halftime...
Yeah lads let’s rip in ?

 

[Merlot]

player prob's only stem from lack of management

 

[mike]

If we have reached a point where there is alot of finger pointing within the ranks, we are in trouble.

I understand what you mean but I also get the shits seeing players keep making stupid errors and team mates going over to give them a cuddle. Teams with a winning culture and set standards can afford to do that but for us I think we need to strip things back and drive some standards about what is accepted and what isn’t. We don’t need to pull apart but there should be enough buy in from players to understand when you stuff up repeatedly it’s not acceptable.

Defensive effort is not as clear cut as ball handling. You can deny a lack of defensive effort whereas u can’t deny a handling error. I feel the finger pointing would be more around defense.


Keeping possession is part of your defence. Not giving away easy balls, dropping passes, stepping into touch, sloppy play the balls. It's all part of the same problem. It's on the players.

Ordinarily I would agree with you but to start both halves last night our defense was that bad our offense didn’t even get a sniff.

We were under the pump from the get go for sure but the poor handling in the first 20 minutes allowed the onslaught to continue. There were at least 3 incidents in that period where we had a chance for possession but just handed it back to the Storm meekly, so they could score more trys.

 

[hobbo1]

If we have reached a point where there is alot of finger pointing within the ranks, we are in trouble.

I understand what you mean but I also get the shits seeing players keep making stupid errors and team mates going over to give them a cuddle. Teams with a winning culture and set standards can afford to do that but for us I think we need to strip things back and drive some standards about what is accepted and what isn’t. We don’t need to pull apart but there should be enough buy in from players to understand when you stuff up repeatedly it’s not acceptable.

Defensive effort is not as clear cut as ball handling. You can deny a lack of defensive effort whereas u can’t deny a handling error. I feel the finger pointing would be more around defense.


Keeping possession is part of your defence. Not giving away easy balls, dropping passes, stepping into touch, sloppy play the balls. It's all part of the same problem. It's on the players.

Ordinarily I would agree with you but to start both halves last night our defense was that bad our offense didn’t even get a sniff.

We were under the pump from the get go for sure but the poor handling in the first 20 minutes allowed the onslaught to continue. There were at least 3 incidents in that period where we had a chance for possession but just handed it back to the Storm meekly, so they could score more trys.

Talau’s knock on being the worst
That kid must spend all his pay on therapy ?

 

[BAGNF05]

player prob's only stem from lack of management

Management can’t go to luciano’s house and make sure he’s on the treadmill and not smashing KFC

 

[Merlot]

player prob's only stem from lack of management

Management can’t go to luciano’s house and make sure he’s on the treadmill and not smashing KFC

if its the same kfc that he eating out of the drive in,send in the drug testers.lol