Jackson Topine takes Bulldogs to NSW Supreme Court

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BAGNF05 said:
Ever watched the Tour de France. Athletes torturing themselves. Sport is not life, it is extreme. Players choose it. As long as the bloke had the right to walk away, nothing to see here.
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One of the allegations is deprivation of liberty. This means he wasn't able to walk away. And forced to roll with 34 blokes. That's not voluntarily pushing your self to extremes. Pretty baffling comparison mate
 
Tiger_Yoshi said:
I seriously hope Gus and Smug face Ciraldo are hammered by this court case….
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The very best rugby league players are the ones who are most willing to repeatedly put themselves in harms way. We celebrate this every origin series. No way he wins this case.
 
Lestronge said:
What does outdated denial of water, which is literally 80s mentality , have to do wrestling drills specifically designed to get you to a point of exhaustion and still excelling under that fatigue ?
They’re two separate issues ! The Titmus case was ridiculous and archaic , and I don’t really understand how that happened as denial of water ie. heat exhaustion and heat stroke has been talked about in say , elite defense training programs for years . Ao it would obviously be in most elite sporting programs .
But I don’t see the correlation ? Outside of a very thin connection that they’re related because they’re extreme training program techniques .
One is a HSE issue and a massive let down and failure on the training path for o not understand the data they’re supposed to monitoring , and the players affects in ridiculous heat .
it’s a very simple concept IMO . And really only 2 questions need be asked .
1. Is this type of training effective , and conducive to creating an elite football team ?
2. Did the player know that this was the type of level , intensity , mental strain , emotional strain , that was required of him ? And if not why not ?
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The main correlation is that in BOTH cases fellow players allegedly recognised the physical distress of their team-mate and raised it with the trainer who ignored their concerns and ordered then to continue...

The next time a player dies on a club's watch without heeding the findings and recommendations of the Coroner in this case will likely be referred to the DPP for charges in regards to providing a safe workplace!

This Inquest only concluded last month - so the Topine incident occurred before its findings - but after the Titmuss death...

Answers to your questions

1. Is OVER-TRAINING as corporal punishment conducive to elite athletic performance and development - NO!!! Any idiot can tell you that!

2. YES - he had been with the club and training at an elite level for years
 
There is a very big difference between punishment and humiliation. What the dogs did is very much in the latter.

It actually could have been a bonding opportunity if that douchebag trainer didn't tell the teammates to not rally around him after it.

I mean, why even do it? What outcome were they hoping for? Is this the best way to achieve it? NO! It's not only negligent, but it's a bloody dumb approach.

Our method was solid this year. Peroxide hair, probably coupled with extra training. Api still wears the reminder... and our 1 player who didn't meet the standards went through a smooth release.

Anasta is now going off about it being a can of worms. What happens if the kid kills himself? Same reply?
 
Snidest 0 said:
The main correlation is that in BOTH cases fellow players allegedly recognised the physical distress of their team-mate and raised it with the trainer who ignored their concerns and ordered then to continue...

The next time a player dies on a club's watch without heeding the findings and recommendations of the Coroner in this case will likely be referred to the DPP for charges in regards to providing a safe workplace!

This Inquest only concluded last month - so the Topine incident occurred before its findings - but after the Titmuss death...

Answers to your questions

1. Is OVER-TRAINING as corporal punishment conducive to elite athletic performance and development - NO!!! Any idiot can tell you that!

2. YES - he had been with the club and training at an elite level for years
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I never asked that question . You’re making stories up to suit your narrative . I asked was the training methods provided by a 3 time premiership winning trainer and a 2 time premiership winning assistant coach , the correct training to win premierships . And that’s absolute horseshit that you would have any idea whether or not it is . Unless you have the data and have done the studies off private data provided by elite nrl programs .
Once again 1 situation is he was wrestled into a stand still . And to have trained yourself soo hard under extreme conditions that you can’t move … many of us have been there and done that .
And the other which has no relevance what so ever outside an absolute drawing of the longest bow by you , is a lack of hydration and fluids , and a complete lack of duty of care re. The players .
I normally agree with you on most things , but you’re clearly too emotionally attached to this to see the Forrest through the trees.
For me , if a 3 time premiership winning trainer wanted me to crawl through a river of shit , and he thought that was how you gain an advantage and what forged a winning team culture , that’s exactly how I’d train.
Once again I’ll say it cause you’re clearly not reading what I’m actually saying , the REAL issue isn’t the training IMO , but the mental and physical load putting the player under .
And for you to say “he’s an nrl player , he knows what the correct training is “ , we literally had a winger quit on us this year because of the intensity of training , and the expectations put around standards .
So not all teams are training to these levels . It’s such a horseshit argument to make yourself seem right .
If he wasn’t expecting those standards , then there is malpractice in regards to the passage of information. If he was and the rewards for not meeting standards re. Being late to training , we’re clearly defined , I mean IMHO , then there’s a question to be asked about whether this is the job for him .
If it later comes out that these types of “rewards” and training methods are barbaric , and antiquated , not industry standard , then I’ll happily recant on everything I’ve said … but I honestly don’t think they arnt . Which means you are projecting your own morality on something that just isn’t applicable .
 
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Pascoes_barber said:
Well there's ~34 team mates that will be called as witnesses.

Don't think he'll be awarded $4 million but suspect (and hope) he'll get a confidential settlement offer of 25%-35% of that amount.
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Those standards looked pretty effective v Knights. I don’t think you’d see the Bulldogs improving if players were being mistreated by staff.
 
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Lestronge said:
I never asked that question . You’re making stories up to suit your narrative . I asked was the training methods provided by a 3 time premiership winning trainer and a 2 time premiership winning assistant coach , the correct training to win premierships . And that’s absolute horseshit that you would have any idea whether or not it is . Unless you have the data and have done the studies off private data provided by elite nrl programs .
Once again 1 situation is he was wrestled into a stand still . And to have trained yourself soo hard under extreme conditions that you can’t move … many of us have been there and done that .
And the other which has no relevance what so ever outside an absolute drawing of the longest bow by you , is a lack of hydration and fluids , and a complete lack of duty of care re. The players .
I normally agree with you on most things , but you’re clearly too emotionally attached to this to see the Forrest through the trees.
For me , if a 3 time premiership winning trainer wanted me to crawl through a river of shit , and he thought that was how you gain an advantage and what forged a winning team culture , that’s exactly how I’d train.
Once again I’ll say it cause you’re clearly not reading what I’m actually saying , the REAL issue isn’t the training IMO , but the mental and physical load putting the player under .
And for you to say “he’s an nrl player , he knows what the correct training is “ , we literally had a winger quit on us this year because of the intensity of training , and the expectations put around standards .
So not all teams are training to these levels . It’s such a horseshit argument to make yourself seem right .
If he wasn’t expecting those standards , then there is malpractice in regards to the passage of information. If he was and the rewards for not meeting standards re. Being late to training , we’re clearly defined , I mean IMHO , then there’s a question to be asked about whether this is the job for him .
If it later comes out that these types of “rewards” and training methods are barbaric , and antiquated , not industry standard , then I’ll happily recant on everything I’ve said … but I honestly don’t think they arnt . Which means you are projecting your own morality on something that just isn’t applicable .
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Allegations will be tested in court - thankfully a civil Court and not the Coroner's Court this time...
 
Spartan117 said:
4 million dollars,

Is he kidding!
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It is called an ambit claim - and undoubtedly has an aggravated damages component...

That means it is an entirely typical legal fishing expedition - but the court will make any ruling on liability or quantum of the damages

People can make ill informed pre-judgements based on their predisposition - but that is moot and out of the hands of the NRL to "PR manage" now...despite what Braith and Kenty want!

That is all!
 
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