Politics Super Thread - keep it all in here

[stryker]

haha yeah Yoss and if you stepped back and saw that the current problems are mainly the fault of Rudd's weakening of Border protection policies you may realise that while not ideal, the Howard government did stem the tide of boat arrivals.

This 'solution' is nothing but a knee jerk and wont stop the boats at all. Its a waste of money at best…a human rights violation at worst. No-one, including Malaysias oppostition party and Labors bed fellows the greens are on side with this.

Sure a few will be caught and sent away but what happens when the quota is filled? Thats when we will see a massive increase in arrivals.

What do you really think this will end up costing? $1Billion will be a drop in the ocean....

I dont bash for the sake of it but this mob are pathetic - just ask the majority of Australians. Actually ask them tomorrow after they have had time to digest what may well be the worst budget handed down in decades...

 

[Yossarian]

haha yeah Yoss and if you stepped back and saw that the current problems are mainly the fault of Rudd's weakening of Border protection policies you may realise that while not ideal, the Howard government did stem the tide of boat arrivals.

This 'solution' is nothing but a knee jerk and wont stop the boats at all. Its a waste of money at best…a human rights violation at worst. No-one, including Malaysias oppostition party and Labors bed fellows the greens are on side with this.

Sure a few will be caught and sent away but what happens when the quota is filled? Thats when we will see a massive increase in arrivals.

What do you really think this will end up costing? $1Billion will be a drop in the ocean....

I dont bash for the sake of it but this mob are pathetic - just ask the majority of Australians. Actually ask them tomorrow after they have had time to digest what may well be the worst budget handed down in decades...

This is a knee jerk response? You reckon the "Pacific Solution" was well thought out? All it did was move the processing arm off shore so that despots like the President of Nauru could be propped up in power. Nobody was stopped from coming to Australia, I think all or almost all of those sent offshore were found to be genuine refugees. All it did was make us look like a bunch of yahoos and racists to the rest of the world.

You either didn't read my post or chose to ignore it… The whole point of the exercise is to discourage irregular arrivals. You do this so that the numbers fall to a more managable level. What happens when they reach 801? They get processed at Christmas Island like they would now. But the first 800 are on a hiding to nothing - they're looking at years in a Malaysian refugee camp - so what incentive do they have to make the trip?

Spare me the, I don't bash them for the sake of it line. You bag everything they do. Howard and Costello wasted far more on trying to win elections with xenophobic slogans and tax bribes. They wasted billions and billions of mining boom dollars on tax cuts instead of spending money on infrastructure. They had a foreign affairs minister who struggled to impose his 'gravitas' on the Pacific Forum - even they thought he was a joke.

Finally, Consider this:

The Keating government introduced mandatory detention.
Before the current government, boat arrivals peaked under Howard.
The up trend in boat arrivals has more to do with current geopolitical events, the war in Iraq, the end of the civil war in Sri Lanka, the worsening situation in Afghanistan.

 

[stryker]

You cant seriously accuse a government of being xenophobic mate. If there was a hatred, it was more aimed at the illegals who burned all their documents and then tried to sneak into the country. This is a view shared by millions of Australians. How were we to know who was legitimate and who was a terrorist or any other type of undesirable?

I'll give Labor props for trying to come up with a solution but this solution is seriously flawed and is most definitely knee jerk in relation to current events at detention centres. Again, this problem was created by Rudd and co who threw out a system that whilst not perfect, was working. They replaced it with….nothing. Your distorting facts by claiming the arrivals peaked under Howard. We've gone from a handful of boats when he lost power to hundreds a year currently. That is a peak.

I dont bash everything that they do at all. I applaud Gillard for getting tough on welfare and dole cheats. They have also come up with some good policies...Insulation and BER were good ideas.

My problem with the governments of Rudd and Gillard is that they have no idea how to implement said schemes. They take no advice from any experts, even though they are career politions who have never worked in the real world, they are arrogantly stubborn and all their schemes, ideas turn into rorts. They've just announced what will become another one with this stupid set top box initiative for pensioners. Just like the rest it'll go unchecked, unregulated and cost us triple what it should. You cant seriously compare the waste of this governments spending to that of the previous....surely?

I'm going to leave your comment about tax bribes alone because I know your smart enough to realise that both parties are as guilty as each other in this area. They're called pollititions and staying in power is all any of them care about.

 

[cunno]

"They're called pollititions and staying in power is all any of them care about." Sadly that just about sums up politics in this country IMO. The days of people going into politics wanting to do their best for the country have long gone and I don't see either of the major parties having much of a clue. In some ways the country may be better of with a popularist dictator who is supported by the people to get the country back on track and they are given a time limit in office to do it. They could attend to things like, creating real employment, rebuilding infrastructure, buying back the large slabs of our land that has been bought by foreigners not to mention properties as well, give our young people the opportunity to buy a home in the city of their choice at an affordable cost, do something about electricity and the cost of living rises, plan for future generations wellbeing instead of short term fixes and the list could go on and on and on. In essence, we need a person or group of persons to focus more on the needs of the country and its people and less on power and themselves.

 

[system]

Nice to see we are pledging billions on mental health infrastructure which both sides of politics took turns at wiping out at at State and Federal levels over the last two decades.

All governance in this nation is reactive. There is no forward thinking and it is driven by the need to be elected by an uninformed, self absorbed populace

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

That's the result of a politically apathetic electorate Smeg.
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[alien]

i have a simple solution. send them back to where they came from. u know it makes sense

 

[Spartan117]

More Waste of our hard earned Cash.

Public service jobs on the rise. 200 more in the Gi_Lard office alone.

And Wayne Swan describing the BER program as value for money?

4.8Billion in foreign aid…. We could use some foreign aid here in OZ to ensure there are no homeless people freezing tonight here in the Sydney CBD or making sure old people on the pension have a decent meal every night.

Add to that we have become the softy of the region, were if you can get anywhere close to Aus you will eventually get a visa and welfare $$$$ for life.

It Kills me,

How did anyone vote for this mob.

 

[Yossarian]

i have a simple solution. send them back to where they came from. u know it makes sense

If you read about the kind of stuff that goes on in the places these people are from you'd be less likely to say that. Say what you will about where they should go or how they got here, but many of these people have led truly awful lifes where people are killed for being from a different tribe or religion.

 

[happy_tiger]

More Waste of our hard earned Cash.

Public service jobs on the rise. 200 more in the Gi_Lard office alone.

And Wayne Swan describing the BER program as value for money?

4.8Billion in foreign aid…. We could use some foreign aid here in OZ to ensure there are no homeless people freezing tonight here in the Sydney CBD or making sure old people on the pension have a decent meal every night.

Add to that we have become the softy of the region, were if you can get anywhere close to Aus you will eventually get a visa and welfare $$$$ for life.

It Kills me,

How did anyone vote for this mob.

Just as worried for pensioners having heat turned on tonight . read a story that at least 3 out of ten pensioners will have the heat turned all nights during winter . This is wrong . Not so bad up here but down south you would need it every night . Our Govt of the people is totally out of touch with the people and will find out at the next election that the people will touch the govt up by not voting for it . Good luck Julia , your going to need it

 

[hammertime]

Clap, clap, clap for Swan…. absolutely can tell the bloke has an Art's degree. He is
- Still spending. Majorly promoting inflation - therefore raising the cost of living further
- Pushing more people onto the Public Health system through reducing the Private health rebate.
- Spending $400 per pensioner on a set-top box when for that money, they could get a new digital TV installed by Harvey Norman. 1 remote, not 2.
- Blames his over-optimistic forecasts last budget (which at the time, were slammed by economists) as a 'unexpected' downturn in revenue from the lingering GFC. Rubbish.
- Hits small businesses like tradies where their car is their life blood of their business
- Revenue forecasts are again over-optimistic with a 4.5% unemployment rate expected.
- During the mining boom, when they are crying out for employees, is sucking out people to build Halls, fit installation, build infrastructure and build a NBN! Lead to massive wage inflation and higher costs of living. You only spend money to increase government employment when you have spare capacity!! Otherwise you just create inflation and increase costs/debt for everyone.
- Malaysian scheme is idiotic and one sided. $50k per refugee and $100k the other way!! Could easily spiral out of control
- Still paying $4.5billion in international aid after we have had our own natural disasters to look after.

There was nothing big picture, it's all fluff and politically motivated. Typical Labor. It's a shame that the Liberals have Hockey because he has nothing either. Get Turnbull in now. We need someone who knows money, economics and won't be influenced by polling.

 

[Spartan117]

If Turnbul gets anywhere near the top of the ticket then the country is gone for sure.

He wants a Carbon Tax as well. OK for him he can afford it.

Some of us cant afford things now even if we earn 6 figures Plus…

 

[hammertime]

If Turnbul gets anywhere near the top of the ticket then the country is gone for sure.

He wants a Carbon Tax as well. OK for him he can afford it.

Some of us cant afford things now even if we earn 6 figures Plus…

Well, that's probably for his ex Goldmans buddies to make some money from. But we do need a Carbon Tax and I'm glad Labor is pushing for that. Turnbull at least is showing his colors there that he will go with what's right and not spinning it along party lines. It's the bloke we need to get this country efficient and prepared for the future.

We have some large future challenges with the inter-generational issue. Howard and Costello were preparing us for them, buy covering the prior govt's off balance sheet liabilities, paying existing debt, creating future funds and sparking population growth but Labor has taken us backwards. I think Turnbull is a strong enough character to make the hard decisions that the public won't realize he is making.

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Does the fringe benefits tax hit people who have car allowances? I'm a total dunce when it comes to the tax system.

 

[Kul]

Just thought i'd comment on the framing of all the poll questions on all the media sites this morning

They all ask: "are you better off under this budget" which most people can probably respond "no" to as it's a harsh budget… wow, we knew this.

Whilst not a supporter of the government, I feel for them in situations like this as once again the media will set the agenda of the debate in the wrong direction AGAIN.
The question should be "Is this budget appropriate considering all the circumstances" - that kind of question still leaves the government and it's budget open to criticism but allows for a much more mature debate to take place in areas such as, say, oh... Policy?

But no, the media and Negative Abbott will drag it through the dirt without touching on the real issues in order to get the cheap headline in tomorrow's paper.

meh, Lindasy Tanner on Q&A the other night was spot on. In saying that, it's the government's responsibility to sell this budget and as we have already seen they couldn't sell food to an Ethiopian

 

[hammertime]

Just thought i'd comment on the framing of all the poll questions on all the media sites this morning

They all ask: "are you better off under this budget" which most people can probably respond "no" to as it's a harsh budget… wow, we knew this.

Whilst not a supporter of the government, I feel for them in situations like this as once again the media will set the agenda of the debate in the wrong direction AGAIN.
The question should be "Is this budget appropriate considering all the circumstances" - that kind of question still leaves the government and it's budget open to criticism but allows for a much more mature debate to take place in areas such as, say, oh... Policy?

But no, the media and Negative Abbott will drag it through the dirt without touching on the real issues in order to get the cheap headline in tomorrow's paper.

meh, Lindasy Tanner on Q&A the other night was spot on. In saying that, it's the government's responsibility to sell this budget and as we have already seen they couldn't sell food to an Ethiopian

Completely agree Kul.

The liberals are being idiots. The problem is that the average voter doesn't understand the economic flaws of Swans budget, like how he is driving inflation and interest rates, so they are left using phrases like 'built on a house of cards'. It's pure sound bite politics.

I hope to god they decide to become the bigger and better party soon and start pointing out real flaws rather than a blanket negative. They are quickly become the party with little economic credibility.

 

[hammertime]

Does the fringe benefits tax hit people who have car allowances? I'm a total dunce when it comes to the tax system.

Depends if your employer charges you for your car use CB, and also how you use your car.

Basically the govt are trying to not encourage people to travel long distances. So the FTB tax is now a flat rate, rather than declining by your distance traveled (why people would go on long trips on June 30th..)

It will hurt blokes like tradies, salesmen, builders etc that are driving long distances out of necessity rather than clocking up mileage purely to hit the lower FBT rate by June 30.

So, if you drive it a short distance, you should be fine. If you use it extensively, your employer might have higher charges and then pass that on to you.

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Does the fringe benefits tax hit people who have car allowances? I'm a total dunce when it comes to the tax system.

Depends if your employer charges you for your car use CB, and also how you use your car.

Basically the govt are trying to not encourage people to travel long distances. So the FTB tax is now a flat rate, rather than declining by your distance traveled (why people would go on long trips on June 30th..)

It will hurt blokes like tradies, salesmen, builders etc that are driving long distances out of necessity rather than clocking up mileage purely to hit the lower FBT rate by June 30.

So, if you drive it a short distance, you should be fine. If you use it extensively, your employer might have higher charges and then pass that on to you.

I have a set allowance built into my salary package.

 

[hammertime]

Does the fringe benefits tax hit people who have car allowances? I'm a total dunce when it comes to the tax system.

Depends if your employer charges you for your car use CB, and also how you use your car.

Basically the govt are trying to not encourage people to travel long distances. So the FTB tax is now a flat rate, rather than declining by your distance traveled (why people would go on long trips on June 30th..)

It will hurt blokes like tradies, salesmen, builders etc that are driving long distances out of necessity rather than clocking up mileage purely to hit the lower FBT rate by June 30.

So, if you drive it a short distance, you should be fine. If you use it extensively, your employer might have higher charges and then pass that on to you.

I have a set allowance built into my salary package.

It might increase or decrease mate, depends on your employer and if they ask you to drive it a certain amount of kms per year.

 

[Gary_Bakerloo]

The liberals are being idiots. The problem is that the average voter doesn't understand the economic flaws of Swans budget, like how he is driving inflation and interest rates,

Budget is projected to move from $50b deficit to $22b. To me that reads as contractionary as do the markets. No?