To those who are blaming Cleary

[Telltails]

Keep in mind it was only a couple weeks ago he said he still did not know his best 17…

Hard to rate players in a team like ours when they are all average at best. Their best games are often more to do with effort than skill and that can change from week to week - so thats how I interpret that.

 

[TIGERPOWER]

I’m not blaming Ivan, apart from that forgettable second half yesterday, he has improved our defense beyond my expectations.

Our error rate is the annoying part.

We won’t win another game unless we stop the schoolboy errors.

My view on the topic too. We are a dumb team at times which is beyond frustrating.

Souths last year were one of the most mistake riddled no structure rabbles in the competition but with the inclusion of one marquee recruit and a good coach he has turned them into the team to beat this year…hes even got blokes like sutton playing out of his skin.....what have you done cleary, we were a soft mistake riddled dumb team before you arrived...ive seen absolutely no improvement in those areas under your watch

You are joking aren’t you. Have you seen the south’s team on paper compared to ours. One marque player lol, so what about Sam Burgess , Greg Inglis , the burgess twins, Reynolds…. this is for same Souths team that won a Comp a few years ago.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

Mac, I’m not saying we should hang the guy, but he cannot be immune from criticism atm.

Just give me, any of you, any indication of what he should have done that he hasn't?

Pick a hooker for starters.

And he did multiple times. Godinet according to you wasnt first grade material so he was dropped. You kept calling for KILLA to be picked **and he showed us yesterday why he isn’t being picked**. Liddle keeps getting injured. With the squad we have , the last thing we can afford is injuries to key players in key positions . Unfortunately we’ve had no luck there with liddle, nofa, Reynolds, Marshall, packer…..

When was that? When he drew an offside penalty that put us on the front foot, or when he laid on the pass that put Rowdy under the posts??

 

[TigerSJ]

Just wait a minute guys…....
In every interview I have seen with Cleary (and there has been plenty of them), when asked about how well the team have started or lately "whether the wheels fallen off" etc, Ivan has been very clear to dampen down expectations and explain that they are trying to re-build a whole new attitude, a new and better culture at this club. He has spoken about bringing in players that were the right guys "at the moment" or for this part of their journey. People need to listen to his interviews - he freely admits that they will have some dark times and it will seem like they are taking two steps forward and one back etc etc. He also never judges their progress by where they are on the ladder but by if they keep being a competitive team for the full 80 minutes and whether they keep improving each week. Ivan has said that they are working on improving the roster at all times and that this is an ongoing mission.
On this basis (and up until this last game)he has done exactly what he said and is still doing it. He said that it will take 3 years and I say we let him have that time because he has definitely turned things around and put us on a far better course so far. Any fan who can't see that is not looking past this season!

 

[TIGERPOWER]

Just give me, any of you, any indication of what he should have done that he hasn't?

Pick a hooker for starters.

And he did multiple times. Godinet according to you wasnt first grade material so he was dropped. You kept calling for KILLA to be picked **and he showed us yesterday why he isn’t being picked**. Liddle keeps getting injured. With the squad we have , the last thing we can afford is injuries to key players in key positions . Unfortunately we’ve had no luck there with liddle, nofa, Reynolds, Marshall, packer…..

When was that? When he drew an offside penalty that put us on the front foot, or when he laid on the pass that put Rowdy under the posts??

No when he let papali straight through 2 metres out from our tryline. He can’t defend, and that’s why he isn’t picked and shouldn’t be picked again. And your kidding yourself if your crediting Lawrence’s try to mcwillricks pass, that’s hilarious lol.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

Pick a hooker for starters.

And he did multiple times. Godinet according to you wasnt first grade material so he was dropped. You kept calling for KILLA to be picked **and he showed us yesterday why he isn’t being picked**. Liddle keeps getting injured. With the squad we have , the last thing we can afford is injuries to key players in key positions . Unfortunately we’ve had no luck there with liddle, nofa, Reynolds, Marshall, packer…..

When was that? When he drew an offside penalty that put us on the front foot, or when he laid on the pass that put Rowdy under the posts??

No when he let papali straight through 2 metres out from our tryline. He can’t defend, and that’s why he isn’t picked and shouldn’t be picked again.

So him failing to stop a rampaging Josh Papali off a great ball from Josh Hodgson justifies why he hasn't been picked?

Clutching

 

[jirskyr]

Dont know where i said all the issues would be fixed but Ok im convinced next year will be better….ps Cleary extended Chee Kam..

Why should we just accept it year after year ...one thing i am rapt with Cleary up until yesterday our defense and fight has improved he had our mob of no hopers playing well early on i just question where that went....build forward on the good start not fall in a heap that falls on a he coach and the players...

You said you expected more. My post was to ask you what more you expected, or why more. The team came 14th last year, so you are saying 10th with 9 matches remaining isn't good enough?

Why should we accept it year after year? Well because if you don't accept it, you might as well stop supporting the Tigers, because there's mostly lean years to be had. It's not great, and on an official level it's not acceptable, but as a fan what choice do you have? Walk away after bad years? That would have culled most of the Tigers fans decades ago.

The team does appear on the up, regardless of the Canberra result. Usually we'd have several Canberra-type outcomes every year and this is our first for 2018\. Understandably everyone got upset and it appears magnified because we were hoping these types of performances were starting to be behind us.

I just try to frame realistic expectations, e.g. do better than last year. We came 14th last year, so in the space of 10-13th on the ladder isn't much better, but it is an improvement. 8th would be great, but that means we have to end up better than half the sides in the comp - is that a realistic assessment of the team we currently have?

 

[magpiecol]

Low expectations Wests Tigers fan motto circa 2006..

soon to be followed by the 'next year' posts as we re build onwards and upwards..

We have had good years between 2006 and now.

If you expected Cleary to do better than he has with what he was given then you had irrational expectations in my view.

Cleary recruited or re-signed more than 75% of the current starting 17..Yes I expected him to do better

Yeah but he recruited / re-signed them in the space of, what, 6 months Apr-Oct/17 (not including Mbye)?

One recruitment drive and all issues are fixed, Top 8 here we come? Just because the one coach did the recruitment for that period?

I could have expected Cleary to do better if he'd recruited top-quality players, or a few tactical signings into what was already a pretty good roster. He could not do either in his first season, we went after blokes like Widdop and RTS and they said no, used us to up their current deals.

Most of Ivan's signings were good - Reynolds has not delivered yet, Packer been better than average, Mats a bit average, Rochow was a value signings anyway, Thommo great, Fonua great, Milne self-destructed, Godinet another bargain-bin buy, Benji worked out well so far, Mbye is a pretty good one pending play…

Brooks, Lawrence all clearly improved since Cleary became coach. Marsters given a run and now one of our better players.

Overall I reckon pretty good effort in one-round of signings. Not Cleary's fault either that Tedesco left.

But he's still encumbered with teh rest of the squad. Perhaps yes he recruited 75% of the current 17, it makes sense he'd play the blokes he recruited, but what about the other 13? Aloiai, Sue, McQueen, Grant, Felise, MCK etc. all fairly average FGers

Not even "fairly average "

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Pick a hooker for starters.

And he did multiple times. Godinet according to you wasnt first grade material so he was dropped. You kept calling for KILLA to be picked **and he showed us yesterday why he isn’t being picked**. Liddle keeps getting injured. With the squad we have , the last thing we can afford is injuries to key players in key positions . Unfortunately we’ve had no luck there with liddle, nofa, Reynolds, Marshall, packer…..

When was that? When he drew an offside penalty that put us on the front foot, or when he laid on the pass that put Rowdy under the posts??

No when he let papali straight through 2 metres out from our tryline. He can’t defend, and that’s why he isn’t picked and shouldn’t be picked again. And your kidding yourself if your crediting Lawrence’s try to mcwillricks pass, that’s hilarious lol.

To be fair it was the only tackle he missed, made 17 others OK, and he limped off with an ankle injury a minute or so later, not sure whether he got busted prior to that try or not though… I think he's only missed three tackles for the year from four games. Godinet has missed 31 tackles in nine games so he's no superstar defender either.

All I know is that the wheels fell off after he went off. We looked OK when he was out there. ET got out there and started lobbing passes everywhere but at the chest.

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Dont know where i said all the issues would be fixed but Ok im convinced next year will be better….ps Cleary extended Chee Kam..

Why should we just accept it year after year ...one thing i am rapt with Cleary up until yesterday our defense and fight has improved he had our mob of no hopers playing well early on i just question where that went....build forward on the good start not fall in a heap that falls on a he coach and the players...

You said you expected more. My post was to ask you what more you expected, or why more. The team came 14th last year, so you are saying 10th with 9 matches remaining isn't good enough?

**Why should we accept it year after year? Well because if you don't accept it, you might as well stop supporting the Tigers, because there's mostly lean years to be had. It's not great, and on an official level it's not acceptable, but as a fan what choice do you have? Walk away after bad years? That would have culled most of the Tigers fans decades ago.**
The team does appear on the up, regardless of the Canberra result. Usually we'd have several Canberra-type outcomes every year and this is our first for 2018\. Understandably everyone got upset and it appears magnified because we were hoping these types of performances were starting to be behind us.

I just try to frame realistic expectations, e.g. do better than last year. We came 14th last year, so in the space of 10-13th on the ladder isn't much better, but it is an improvement. 8th would be great, but that means we have to end up better than half the sides in the comp - is that a realistic assessment of the team we currently have?

You just go and follow Souths or Melbourne.

 

[Geo]

Dont know where i said all the issues would be fixed but Ok im convinced next year will be better….ps Cleary extended Chee Kam..

Why should we just accept it year after year ...one thing i am rapt with Cleary up until yesterday our defense and fight has improved he had our mob of no hopers playing well early on i just question where that went....build forward on the good start not fall in a heap that falls on a he coach and the players...

You said you expected more. My post was to ask you what more you expected, or why more. The team came 14th last year, so you are saying 10th with 9 matches remaining isn't good enough?

Why should we accept it year after year? Well because if you don't accept it, you might as well stop supporting the Tigers, because there's mostly lean years to be had. It's not great, and on an official level it's not acceptable, but as a fan what choice do you have? Walk away after bad years? That would have culled most of the Tigers fans decades ago.

The team does appear on the up, regardless of the Canberra result. Usually we'd have several Canberra-type outcomes every year and this is our first for 2018\. Understandably everyone got upset and it appears magnified because we were hoping these types of performances were starting to be behind us.

I just try to frame realistic expectations, e.g. do better than last year. We came 14th last year, so in the space of 10-13th on the ladder isn't much better, but it is an improvement. 8th would be great, but that means we have to end up better than half the sides in the comp - is that a realistic assessment of the team we currently have?

Umm I'll never stop supporting Wests Tigers…Cleary had them playing like a Top 8 side....

 

[Love_the_WestsTigers]

Even i can tell you MCK adds more value than Grant

Hope Cleary eventually sees that

 

[Tigrr]

Just wait a minute guys…....
In every interview I have seen with Cleary (and there has been plenty of them), when asked about how well the team have started or lately "whether the wheels fallen off" etc, Ivan has been very clear to dampen down expectations and explain that they are trying to re-build a whole new attitude, a new and better culture at this club. He has spoken about bringing in players that were the right guys "at the moment" or for this part of their journey. People need to listen to his interviews - he freely admits that they will have some dark times and it will seem like they are taking two steps forward and one back etc etc. He also never judges their progress by where they are on the ladder but by if they keep being a competitive team for the full 80 minutes and whether they keep improving each week. Ivan has said that they are working on improving the roster at all times and that this is an ongoing mission.
On this basis (and up until this last game)he has done exactly what he said and is still doing it. He said that it will take 3 years and I say we let him have that time because he has definitely turned things around and put us on a far better course so far. Any fan who can't see that is not looking past this season!

x2

 

[Harvey]

Just wait a minute guys…....
In every interview I have seen with Cleary (and there has been plenty of them), when asked about how well the team have started or lately "whether the wheels fallen off" etc, Ivan has been very clear to dampen down expectations and explain that they are trying to re-build a whole new attitude, a new and better culture at this club. He has spoken about bringing in players that were the right guys "at the moment" or for this part of their journey. People need to listen to his interviews - he freely admits that they will have some dark times and it will seem like they are taking two steps forward and one back etc etc. He also never judges their progress by where they are on the ladder but by if they keep being a competitive team for the full 80 minutes and whether they keep improving each week. Ivan has said that they are working on improving the roster at all times and that this is an ongoing mission.
On this basis (and up until this last game)he has done exactly what he said and is still doing it. He said that it will take 3 years and I say we let him have that time because he has definitely turned things around and put us on a far better course so far. Any fan who can't see that is not looking past this season!

x2

What a co-incidence. Will take as long as he is contracted for. JT should have set similar expectations of mediocrity, and then people would have been satisfied what him delivering that.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

So let me get this straight. We were in a quagmire with our cap as far back as 2014\. We knew it was going to take a few years to fix it. We all saw 2018 as a beacon, because we knew that was when we could even out the books once and all. That’s been done and now we have to wait another 3 years? 🤔

 

[GNR4LIFE]

And he did multiple times. Godinet according to you wasnt first grade material so he was dropped. You kept calling for KILLA to be picked **and he showed us yesterday why he isn’t being picked**. Liddle keeps getting injured. With the squad we have , the last thing we can afford is injuries to key players in key positions . Unfortunately we’ve had no luck there with liddle, nofa, Reynolds, Marshall, packer…..

When was that? When he drew an offside penalty that put us on the front foot, or when he laid on the pass that put Rowdy under the posts??

No when he let papali straight through 2 metres out from our tryline. He can’t defend, and that’s why he isn’t picked and shouldn’t be picked again. And your kidding yourself if your crediting Lawrence’s try to mcwillricks pass, that’s hilarious lol.

To be fair it was the only tackle he missed, made 17 others OK, and he limped off with an ankle injury a minute or so later, not sure whether he got busted prior to that try or not though… I think he's only missed three tackles for the year from four games. Godinet has missed 31 tackles in nine games so he's no superstar defender either.

All I know is that the wheels fell off after he went off. We looked OK when he was out there. ET got out there and started lobbing passes everywhere but at the chest.

I said yesterday both sides number 9’s had a big affect on the game. McIlwrick made a big difference to our attack early, with the penalty he drew and his role in Rowdy’s try. Then he got injured and Hodgson came on and the tide turned.

 

[jirskyr]

Dont know where i said all the issues would be fixed but Ok im convinced next year will be better….ps Cleary extended Chee Kam..

Why should we just accept it year after year ...one thing i am rapt with Cleary up until yesterday our defense and fight has improved he had our mob of no hopers playing well early on i just question where that went....build forward on the good start not fall in a heap that falls on a he coach and the players...

You said you expected more. My post was to ask you what more you expected, or why more. The team came 14th last year, so you are saying 10th with 9 matches remaining isn't good enough?

Why should we accept it year after year? Well because if you don't accept it, you might as well stop supporting the Tigers, because there's mostly lean years to be had. It's not great, and on an official level it's not acceptable, but as a fan what choice do you have? Walk away after bad years? That would have culled most of the Tigers fans decades ago.

The team does appear on the up, regardless of the Canberra result. Usually we'd have several Canberra-type outcomes every year and this is our first for 2018\. Understandably everyone got upset and it appears magnified because we were hoping these types of performances were starting to be behind us.

I just try to frame realistic expectations, e.g. do better than last year. We came 14th last year, so in the space of 10-13th on the ladder isn't much better, but it is an improvement. 8th would be great, but that means we have to end up better than half the sides in the comp - is that a realistic assessment of the team we currently have?

Umm I'll never stop supporting Wests Tigers…Cleary had them playing like a Top 8 side....

Well there you go. I'm looking forward to them playing like a Top 8 side again - definitely possible.

 

[Geo]

Dont know where i said all the issues would be fixed but Ok im convinced next year will be better….ps Cleary extended Chee Kam..

Why should we just accept it year after year ...one thing i am rapt with Cleary up until yesterday our defense and fight has improved he had our mob of no hopers playing well early on i just question where that went....build forward on the good start not fall in a heap that falls on a he coach and the players...

You said you expected more. My post was to ask you what more you expected, or why more. The team came 14th last year, so you are saying 10th with 9 matches remaining isn't good enough?

Why should we accept it year after year? Well because if you don't accept it, you might as well stop supporting the Tigers, because there's mostly lean years to be had. It's not great, and on an official level it's not acceptable, but as a fan what choice do you have? Walk away after bad years? That would have culled most of the Tigers fans decades ago.

The team does appear on the up, regardless of the Canberra result. Usually we'd have several Canberra-type outcomes every year and this is our first for 2018\. Understandably everyone got upset and it appears magnified because we were hoping these types of performances were starting to be behind us.

I just try to frame realistic expectations, e.g. do better than last year. We came 14th last year, so in the space of 10-13th on the ladder isn't much better, but it is an improvement. 8th would be great, but that means we have to end up better than half the sides in the comp - is that a realistic assessment of the team we currently have?

Umm I'll never stop supporting Wests Tigers…Cleary had them playing like a Top 8 side....

Well there you go. I'm looking forward to them playing like a Top 8 side again - definitely possible.

yep that's what i expect..this year..

 

[TIGERPOWER]

So let me get this straight. We were in a quagmire with our cap as far back as 2014\. We knew it was going to take a few years to fix it. We all saw 2018 as a beacon, because we knew that was when we could even out the books once and all. That’s been done and now we have to wait another 3 years? 🤔

Still defending the JT years of rubbish. Anybody who thought 2018 was going to be a breakout year has absolutely no idea about footy and should start following another sport. You were still supporting JT after 3 years of rubbish, yet your carrying on about Cleary after half a season, hypocritical to say the least.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

So let me get this straight. We were in a quagmire with our cap as far back as 2014\. We knew it was going to take a few years to fix it. We all saw 2018 as a beacon, because we knew that was when we could even out the books once and all. That’s been done and now we have to wait another 3 years? ?

Still defending the JT years of rubbish. Anybody who thought 2018 was going to be a breakout year has absolutely no idea about footy and should start following another sport. You were still supporting JT after 3 years of rubbish, yet your carrying on about Cleary after half a season, hypocritical to say the least.

And you are still following me around. Sad.